Your Opinion, Should Duel Wielding Return?

Should it? I think it should, regardless if people complain. I have no issues with it, but people will -Yoink- either way because it’s not balanced. Well honestly add it in and allow us, the players to give feedback on how to adjust it, and not simply throw out a feature that could add variety to gameplay.

I’m sorry if I dont want Halo to become a generic FPS like every other one out there, I’d rather have it be unique, like it use to be. So I say add it back, in every mode.

It depends because the weapons that you could dual wield were weak and you needed to dual wield or else these weapons were not as effective. (EX. In H3 the pistol had to be dual wielded or else it was useless.) So they would have to fix this problem before putting this mechanic in H5 or beyond.

Nope.

Dual-Wielding pretty much butchered the sandbox in both Halo 2 and 3. In essence, it not only resulted in individual weapons having to be much weaker and useless on their own, but it also resulted in many weapons that were unique and diverse in Combat Evolved being turned into generic bullet hoses.

Luckily, Dual-Wielding has been confirmed to not return in Halo 5.

It’d be nice for customs, but that’d be it. Then again anything and everything would be great for customs.

Dual Wielding, as it was previously stated, takes balance and the sandbox and ruins it.
The worst offending combinations, however, were:
-The Dual Magnums. If you had the accuracy to pull this off you could pull 3 shot kills much faster than the BR could, which is certainly saying something for H2 and H3.

-The Noob Combo. One charged Plasma Pistol shot, one pistol shot to the head. 2 shots that could end up hitting you within milliseconds.

-Twin Needlers. In Halo 3 it wasn’t as bad but in Halo 2, anyone with dual Needlers would usually kill whatever two to three people stepped in their way.

-Twin Maulers. In Halo 3, the Mauler was a cute pocket shotgun. However, dual wielding them turned them into an actual shotgun, and it was usually much easier to find two of them than one shotgun. Plus there was the quick melee you could pull off to kill someone.

As you may have noticed it basically turned sidearms used for backup or niche situations into cheap power weapons that you could sometimes get within a few seconds of spawning.

Unfortunately, 343 confirmed this wasn’t in Halo 5. But I’ll say what i said on another post: I feel people’s biggest mistake is to think of dual wieldable weapons as normal weapons. You never spawned with them, there was a reason you found them on the map. Dual wield weapons are power weapons! You could say ‘it’s so hard to balance the rocket launcher because you can one hit kill, so OP!’. I’ve NEVER seen that complaint, so why does dual wielding get so much hate? If a guy finds an smg and then survives long enough to get a plasma rifle then more power to them. Last I checked, Halo was about finding strong weapons to give you an edge, was it not? They also weren’t even used with the frequency people make out, i never felt they ever created an unjust situation in either Halo 2 or 3. I can already tell I’m gonna get sick of seeing bloody two handed weapons. Rifle this, rifle that, no variety. I’m surprised no one else has pointed this out.

It should return of Campaign, Firefight, Spartan Ops, Forge and Customs.

I agree that duel wielding causes balancing issues in Multiplayer. But surely it would cause any harm if it was just disabled for the multiplayer?

> Unfortunately, 343 confirmed this wasn’t in Halo 5. But I’ll say what i said on another post: I feel people’s biggest mistake is to think of dual wieldable weapons as normal weapons. You never spawned with them, there was a reason you found them on the map. Dual wield weapons are power weapons! You could say ‘it’s so hard to balance the rocket launcher because you can one hit kill, so OP!’. I’ve NEVER seen that complaint, so why does dual wielding get so much hate? If a guy finds an smg and then survives long enough to get a plasma rifle then more power to them. Last I checked, Halo was about finding strong weapons to give you an edge, was it not? They also weren’t even used with the frequency people make out, i never felt they ever created an unjust situation in either Halo 2 or 3. I can already tell I’m gonna get sick of seeing bloody two handed weapons. Rifle this, rifle that, no variety. I’m surprised no one else has pointed this out.

Well, if you have no problem with getting more powerful every time you survive enough to grab two weapons in your hands (which counts as power weapons as you say)
then why is there a problem with ordnance drops? If you think about it, it’s exactly the same thing! You survive long enough and kill some people and then you become even more powerful…it shouldn’t work this way. That’s why I don’t want ordnance drops nor dual wielding in Halo 5 multiplayer.

But, if you put it in campaign, spartan ops and firefight, then I am ok with it.

Sure, why not, I believe it can be balanced.

Unlike stated above, you couldn’t dual wield Needlers in Halo 3.

But you guys really had that many problems getting beat by people who were dual wielding? The only combination that IMO was extremely useful was Plasma Pistol and Magnum in Halo 2, and that actually took skill to use. It can basically be duplicated in Halo 2, 3, or 4 anyway by carrying a headshot rifle and a Plasy P (which you can do in your loadout in 4 anyway). Its effectiveness wold be greatly reduced with a PP that loses charge over time as introduced in H3.

In normal range, someone with a BR and a grenade should be able to beat anyone who is dual wielding any day. Close range you’ll lose to the combo of Maulers or Plasma Rifle and SMG/Spiker, but close range you also lose to an AR and a melee. Or a shotgun. Or a sword. Or a scattershot. Or a gravity hammer. Or a boltshot. Or a Halo 3 bruteshot. (Notice a pattern…?)

Dual wielding Maulers was actually counter productive anyway. If you didn’t get the kill with the first shot, you would have to throw the one to melee, and the other player would typically back up and grenade you. Sure, sometimes you could spam mauler and win, but it wasn’t very effective. It was far more intelligent to single wield a Mauler and use the bayonet feature to fire than melee.

I’m simply saying. If you spawn with a gun that isn’t dual wieldable, then it becomes more difficult to locate a useable combo. This was a little different in Halo 2, as most duals were OP then (they would probably be fixed for a new Halo), but in Halo 3 if you could beat me with dual Magnums, be my guest, my hat’s off to you. And the thing about using something like dual SMGs was, is there’s no such thing as sleight of hand. Sure, you can burn through 2/3 of your ammo and pick up a kill, but run into two guys and you’re simply dead, unlike if you had a grenade and a rifle.

Dual wielding could be partially seen as overpowered, but if you’re going to say that it’s game breaking, you’re either wrong or bad at Halo. I would like to see the option return, and I’m glad it will on the Xbox One in the MCC.

I voted yes and believe it can work, but not in the fashion it did in Halo 2 and 3.

Personally I feel only a small number of weapons should be able to be dual wielded, and only a weapon paired with another of the same. So that would be Pistol with a Pistol, SMG with a SMG, etc. The reason for this is that second gun would function as an upgrade to the sidearm, which are usually only a backup weapon, and bump it to the level of a Primary, or even a little more so, so a player could chose whether to ditch their sidearm for another gun, or hang onto it in case they come across another.

From a gameplay side, the weapons would still play like they were one gun, only needing the fire button to use both of them, similar to how the SMGs and Machine Pistols are used in Spartan Assault. Benefits would be things like increased fire rate for the damage you put out, increased ammo capacity even though you’ll also use it twice as fast as well, and also because they function as one weapon you could melee, use grenades, switch weapons and interact with vehicles without losing your paired weapon.

If Spartans are our only playable character, and loadouts still have a place in some gametypes, I think these weapons below could work. But I’m also thinking of weapons that could be complimentary if the only primary weapons were the DMR, BR, and AR.

  • Pistol: It could do a bit more power but fire a little slower than in Halo 4. When dual wielded that delay between shots pretty much disappears as the interchanging fire of the pistols compensate each other. However some accuracy is lost at long ranges when fired too quickly.

  • SMG: Still the bullet hose that it is and burst fire would do little for it at longer ranges because of it’s small size and rate of fire. When dual wielded it pumps out twice as many bullet and can be a literal “bullet hell” to enemies at mid to close range.

  • Sawed-off Shotgun: A close range selection for your complimentary range, something I thought of to round off these choices. A loadout, pocket shotgun that isn’t a one hit kill like the Boltshot, or you’d at least have to be right up someone’s backside for that kill. I imagine it being single shot before reloading and have about the Mauler’s power and range, so just about enough to weaken a shield for a melee. But it is only one shot so you can’t charge into a room of people with it. Dual wielding it essentially doubles the fire rate, allowing you to drop a player with both shots, or weaken and follow up with a melee on two people.

I know a lot of people probably won’t like the idea of the last one, especially after the bad impression the Boltshot left on players, but I’d like for my Spartan be able to dual wield shotguns and do the Terminator style reload, similar to how it was in Marathon, just with a slower rate of fire of course.

Honestly, if there’s any change to the handguns, I’d prefer that the magnum just be buffed to be usable as a primary. 5SK, decrease RoF a bit, decrease bloom a bit. So it kills in the same time as 5.5 shots of the current Magnum, but is more accurate. I would get more enjoyment out of that than having the ability to dual-wield.

If dual-wielding ever comes back, I would prefer it to come back as sword + handgun of your choice. Don’t bring it back allowing 2 ranged weapons - that’s been done and there was much angst (and now nostalgia) about it. Bring it back differently.

Personally, I think sword + handgun makes more sense anyway, and it’s harder to argue that is an OP combination. Your tradeoff for the 1-hit kill melee capability is a ranged weapon with only 1 kill in each clip.

Duel Wielding was pretty much a completely new class of power weapons when it was introduced in Halo 2.

I won’t understand why people say it’s OP, aren’t power weapons supposed to be so? Besides a dual pair of SMGs is nothing in comparison to a weapon such as the Fuel Rod Gun. Dual Wielded, you lose your ability to throw grenades and are otherwise left vulnerable the moment you melee.

It should return, it’ll only enhance gameplay. There are other ways to balance a playing field rather than to completely remove a beloved feature.

> Nope.
>
> Dual-Wielding pretty much butchered the sandbox in both Halo 2 and 3. In essence, it not only resulted in individual weapons having to be much weaker and useless on their own, but it also resulted in many weapons that were unique and diverse in Combat Evolved being turned into generic bullet hoses.
>
> <mark>Luckily, Dual-Wielding has been confirmed to not return in Halo 5.</mark>

Interesting, do you have a source for this information? Maybe I missed something.

> Unlike stated above, you couldn’t dual wield Needlers in Halo 3.
>
> But you guys really had that many problems getting beat by people who were dual wielding? The only combination that IMO was extremely useful was Plasma Pistol and Magnum in Halo 2, and that actually took skill to use. It can basically be duplicated in Halo 2, 3, or 4 anyway by carrying a headshot rifle and a Plasy P (which you can do in your loadout in 4 anyway). Its effectiveness wold be greatly reduced with a PP that loses charge over time as introduced in H3.
>
> In normal range, someone with a BR and a grenade should be able to beat anyone who is dual wielding any day. Close range you’ll lose to the combo of Maulers or Plasma Rifle and SMG/Spiker, but close range you also lose to an AR and a melee. Or a shotgun. Or a sword. Or a scattershot. Or a gravity hammer. Or a boltshot. Or a Halo 3 bruteshot. (Notice a pattern…?)
>
> Dual wielding Maulers was actually counter productive anyway. If you didn’t get the kill with the first shot, you would have to throw the one to melee, and the other player would typically back up and grenade you. Sure, sometimes you could spam mauler and win, but it wasn’t very effective. It was far more intelligent to single wield a Mauler and use the bayonet feature to fire than melee.
>
> I’m simply saying. If you spawn with a gun that isn’t dual wieldable, then it becomes more difficult to locate a useable combo. This was a little different in Halo 2, as most duals were OP then (they would probably be fixed for a new Halo), but in Halo 3 if you could beat me with dual Magnums, be my guest, my hat’s off to you. And the thing about using something like dual SMGs was, is there’s no such thing as sleight of hand. Sure, you can burn through 2/3 of your ammo and pick up a kill, but run into two guys and you’re simply dead, unlike if you had a grenade and a rifle.
>
> Dual wielding could be partially seen as overpowered, but if you’re going to say that it’s game breaking, you’re either wrong or bad at Halo. I would like to see the option return, and I’m glad it will on the Xbox One in the MCC.

All very good points, I second this :slight_smile:

> Nope.
> Luckily, Dual-Wielding has been confirmed to not return in Halo 5.

Really? I missed this… it’s great news! It offered too many complications to be really worth the effort!

I would say yes. It would take some serious weapon re-balancing, but I think it could work. The big this is to make sure weapons are effective in both single and dual wielding. The best way to do this, in my opinion, is to ensure the weapons have advantages and disadvantages when being single and dual wielded.

For example, the pistol: When single wielding, it would get the scope and higher accuracy. When dual-wielded, no scope and maybe a 5%-10% bloom increase.

For the SMG: Single wielding would result in a more accurate killing machine. Dual wielding would result in a bloom/spread increase of 25%-50%. Inaccurate, but capable of mowing down enemies.

And so on and so forth. At the very least, I’d love a toggle-able feature for custom games.

I think that since 343 is STILL pushing the idea of Palmer dual-wielding pistols, maybe we will only be allowed to dual-wield pistols. :stuck_out_tongue:

Seriously though it would be difficult to please everyone when it comes to dual-wielding. Some people want it for the cool factor and others don’t want it because it makes unbalanced gameplay.

I say that we should wait until the H5 beta is released and then we can decide on what should be added or taken out.

> It’d be nice for customs, but that’d be it. Then again anything and everything would be great for customs.
>
> Dual Wielding, as it was previously stated, takes balance and the sandbox and ruins it.
> The worst offending combinations, however, were:
> -The Dual Magnums. If you had the accuracy to pull this off you could pull 3 shot kills much faster than the BR could, which is certainly saying something for H2 and H3.
>
> -The Noob Combo. One charged Plasma Pistol shot, one pistol shot to the head. 2 shots that could end up hitting you within milliseconds.
>
> -Twin Needlers. In Halo 3 it wasn’t as bad but in Halo 2, anyone with dual Needlers would usually kill whatever two to three people stepped in their way.
>
> -Twin Maulers. In Halo 3, the Mauler was a cute pocket shotgun. However, dual wielding them turned them into an actual shotgun, and it was usually much easier to find two of them than one shotgun. Plus there was the quick melee you could pull off to kill someone.
>
> As you may have noticed it basically turned sidearms used for backup or niche situations into cheap power weapons that you could sometimes get within a few seconds of spawning.

Dual Magnums - This literally was rarely used and like you said it was a CHALLENGE to pull it off.

Noob Combo - people act like you still can’t do this with a BR. It has nothing to do with Dual wielding, it has to do with the structure of the plasma pistol. That’s why bungie reduced the accuracy of it in Halo 3 and it worked much better.

Needler - for starters, the needler in Halo 3 was NOT dual wieldable. The Halo 2 needler was really only useful in situations involving 2 needlers. I’m more indifferent about this one because I enjoyed the Halo 3 needler so much. Perhaps Dual wielding needlers reduces the amount the needles follow their target.

Twin Maulers - You act like Bungie would place two of these right next to each other. The fact that you had to run across the map to pick up another mauler is what made Dual wielding so fun.

Basically, I enjoy Dual wielding and want it to return. There is no such thing as a side-arm weapon in Halo and that’s the beauty of it. Every weapon and combination allows for some unique gameplay and dual wielding is no exception. People say dual wielding weapons are overpowered. But in reality, THAT’S THE POINT! Having 2 guns is supposed to give you an advantage over another player. However, it has it’s drawbacks in that dual wielded weapons are all close-range weapons and you can’t throw grenades. From a distance, a BR destroys dual wields.

People saying it makes the sandbox too “complicated” let me ask you why do you want a simple sandbox? Do you want the game to become more boring??? Having a simpler sandbox reduces the different combinations that can affect gameplay and I personally like to keep gameplay fresh. And people act like dual wielding made people immortal. But these weapons were still not nearly as significant as true power weapons like rocket launchers.

Plus people complaining these weapons respawned too soon, so do all other non-dualwieldable weapons! In Halo reach, a needle rifle is going to have many more respawns in a game than a sniper. Only true power weapons deserve longer respawns because it allows for people to fight over and control power weapons.

Overall, it’s not about “what’s fair”. It’s about what’s fun. Holding two weapons is badass and makes the game unique and makes the gameplay more interesting.

> Overall, <mark>it’s not about “what’s fair”</mark>. It’s about what’s fun. Holding two weapons is badass and makes the game unique and makes the gameplay more interesting.

Shots fired!
Tread lightly, sir.

How about we simply have a dual-wield power weapon?

Pretty sure Unreal Tournament has something similar, where Dual-wielding’s not a feature, but there is a weapon that exclusively comes in a pair.
EDIT: Seems I got that half right. You have to find a second Enforcer - the name of the weapon in question - but dual-wielding is exclusive to it alone.

But, yeah, I think that would be a reasonable solution. With dual-wielding no longer a standard feature, finally getting your hands on such a weapon would feel extremely satisfying.