You are allowed to say you don't like things

Games Other Halo
1

Every time there’s new gameplay, there are new threads where people highlight parts of the game that they don’t like, or would like to see changed. In every thread, there’s a comment like “stop complaining” or “my only problem with Halo 4 is people whining.”

Constructive criticism has its place, and this is the last time we’ll get to give meaningful feedback for a very long time. Soon, everything will be locked down - change is possible at the moment, but not for much longer.

Making feedback constructive and polite is important: We have to remember that a lot of people put blood, sweat and tears into this game. There’s no use getting hysterical or personal if you don’t like something: explain why

Most of us haven’t played the game: Blanket statements like “support packages and tactical upgrades are unbalanced” just don’t hold any water if you haven’t played Halo 4. You can express concerns, but there’s no point going on a crusade about something you haven’t experienced that might turn out to be fine.

Some things don’t need gameplay to stick out: The over-abundance of medal announcements and text popups in the middle of the screen is something you don’t need to play the game to have an opinion on. I really don’t like these changes - I’m not pointing this out because I’m whining, complaining or hating. I’m worried they’ll negatively impact the game in a big way.

Please don’t interpret every piece of feedback as an attack against 343i, or Halo 4 or the direction of the franchise. We all want to love Halo 4, and thoughtful opinions are always necessary (even if you don’t agree, try pointing out why).

In summary, feedback matters, and the voice of the community is important to 343i. Use it, but use it politely, use it selectively, and try to remind yourself that there are some things we just can’t know until we play. For everything else, be respectful.

If you see somebody offering constructive criticism, don’t accuse them of being a hater or unfaithful to the franchise. Everybody is coming from a place where we want to enjoy Halo 4 as much as possible, and if we all remember that this forum will be a nicer place to be in the lead up to release.

TL;DR: we all need to be nice to one another, we need to not go on crusades against features we haven’t experienced, we need to be vocal and respectful when giving feedback leading up to release.

2

I wish that there were more souls out there that shared your demeanor when it comes to constructive criticism and civility.

3

If it’s politics I’ll curse like a sailor, but come on. It’s Halo. Everybody loves Halo. We should remember that

4

> Some things don’t need gameplay to stick out: The over-abundance of medal announcements and text popups in the middle of the screen is something you don’t need to play the game to have an opinion on. I really don’t like these changes - I’m not pointing this out because I’m whining, complaining or hating. I’m worried they’ll negatively impact the game in a big way.

I disagree. Like the text after getting a headshot, will you really be focusing in that exact spot when trying to kill someone? No. You will be focusing almost entirely on the cursor itself and trying to line it up with the enemy to get a shot.

Maybe you will get annoyed by it, maybe you will be able to completely ignore it. And quite honestly, I never even noticed it really, even from watching someone else play. I was never looking there, it would be different if it were directly on the cursor.

So who knows maybe it could annoy someone from watching a video, maybe they can ignore it completely as if it were never there when actually playing.

5

> > Some things don’t need gameplay to stick out: The over-abundance of medal announcements and text popups in the middle of the screen is something you don’t need to play the game to have an opinion on. I really don’t like these changes - I’m not pointing this out because I’m whining, complaining or hating. I’m worried they’ll negatively impact the game in a big way.
>
> I disagree. Like the text after getting a headshot, will you really be focusing in that exact spot when trying to kill someone? No. You will be focusing almost entirely on the cursor itself and trying to line it up with the enemy to get a shot.
>
> Maybe you will get annoyed by it, maybe you will be able to completely ignore it. And quite honestly, I never even noticed it really, even from watching someone else play. I was never looking there, it would be different if it were directly on the cursor.
>
> So who knows maybe it could annoy someone from watching a video, maybe they can ignore it completely as if it were never there when actually playing.

See, that’s what I’m talking about! You disagreed with me without insinuating that my mom did nasty things!

Ideally, I’d like two toggles: one to toggle pop-up text on or off, one to toggle announcements on or off. It might be a pipe dream, but it’d mean people who want that stuff can experience it and those that don’t can disable it.

6

Agreed.

I would also like to point out that 343i is trying to make money off Halo 4. They do this by making a game that is considered fun to play in the minds of as many people as possible. One of the many strategies used to figure out what is considered “fun” is to create a forum where anyone can voice their opinion about a game. In doing this, 343i gets to see whether or not things like bloom and armor lock are fun, or which ranking system or kill times are most enjoyable.

If people didn’t voice their opinions and complaints freely, then forums like these, which are designed in a large part to gather player feedback, would be pointless. People don’t always realize the “constructive” part of criticism.

7

> Most of us haven’t played the game: Blanket statements like “support packages and tactical upgrades are unbalanced” just don’t hold any water if you haven’t played Halo 4. You can express concerns, but there’s no point going on a crusade about something you haven’t experienced that might turn out to be fine.
>
> Some things don’t need gameplay to stick out: The over-abundance of medal announcements and text popups in the middle of the screen is something you don’t need to play the game to have an opinion on. I really don’t like these changes - I’m not pointing this out because I’m whining, complaining or hating. I’m worried they’ll negatively impact the game in a big way.

There is no clear line differentiating these from eachother. Some people can deduce things that other people can’t. In fact, I generally believe that resorting to saying “you haven’t played the game so you can’t know” when they are given a perfectly logical argument is wrong, no matter what the subject is. You either give a counter argument, or admit that they are right and there is indeed something wrong with that feature. Blanket statements never hold any water, even with gameplay. Logical arguments with reasoning behind them on the other hand can never be responded to with “you haven’t played the game”.

Edit: After further thought, I realized that resorting to any one-liner such as “you haven’t played the game yet”, is wrong, regardless of if you were given a blanket statement or not. A blanket statemnt to a blanket statement doesn’t help anyone. It’s always important to support everything you say with reasoning, regardless of are you giving positive or negative feedback, responding to a well though out argument or a blanket statement. If you are going to give your opinion, you should have reasoning behind it or everything you say is irrelevant.

8

> > > Some things don’t need gameplay to stick out: The over-abundance of medal announcements and text popups in the middle of the screen is something you don’t need to play the game to have an opinion on. I really don’t like these changes - I’m not pointing this out because I’m whining, complaining or hating. I’m worried they’ll negatively impact the game in a big way.
> >
> > I disagree. Like the text after getting a headshot, will you really be focusing in that exact spot when trying to kill someone? No. You will be focusing almost entirely on the cursor itself and trying to line it up with the enemy to get a shot.
> >
> > Maybe you will get annoyed by it, maybe you will be able to completely ignore it. And quite honestly, I never even noticed it really, even from watching someone else play. I was never looking there, it would be different if it were directly on the cursor.
> >
> > So who knows maybe it could annoy someone from watching a video, maybe they can ignore it completely as if it were never there when actually playing.
>
> See, that’s what I’m talking about! You disagreed with me without insinuating that my mom did nasty things!
>
> Ideally, I’d like two toggles: one to toggle pop-up text on or off, one to toggle announcements on or off. It might be a pipe dream, but it’d mean people who want that stuff can experience it and those that don’t can disable it.

That doesn’t sound too bad, I mean it does look like they are going a bit overboard with it. Like with the flag, I don’t think a text on the top of the screen telling you that you have the flag is necessary when you can clearly see the flag in your hands. I think even if this is the very 1st game someone started playing, it’s still pretty obvious that you’re holding a flag, or an oddball.

9

> > Most of us haven’t played the game: Blanket statements like “support packages and tactical upgrades are unbalanced” just don’t hold any water if you haven’t played Halo 4. You can express concerns, but there’s no point going on a crusade about something you haven’t experienced that might turn out to be fine.
> >
> > Some things don’t need gameplay to stick out: The over-abundance of medal announcements and text popups in the middle of the screen is something you don’t need to play the game to have an opinion on. I really don’t like these changes - I’m not pointing this out because I’m whining, complaining or hating. I’m worried they’ll negatively impact the game in a big way.
>
> There is no clear line differentiating these from eachother. Some people can deduce things that other people can’t. In fact, I generally believe that resorting to saying “you haven’t played the game so you can’t know” when they are given a perfectly logical argument is wrong, no matter what the subject is. You either give a counter argument, or admit that they are right and there is indeed something wrong with that feature. Blanket statements never hold any water, even with gameplay. Logical arguments with reasoning behind them on the other hand can never be responded to with “you haven’t played the game”.

That’s a good point, but as you say there are shades of grey to this and any generalisation is going to have flaws. Just as me saying “you haven’t played the game” is untrue, so is somebody with the opinion of “I’ve watched a video, therefore x is terrible”

10

> > > Most of us haven’t played the game: Blanket statements like “support packages and tactical upgrades are unbalanced” just don’t hold any water if you haven’t played Halo 4. You can express concerns, but there’s no point going on a crusade about something you haven’t experienced that might turn out to be fine.
> > >
> > > Some things don’t need gameplay to stick out: The over-abundance of medal announcements and text popups in the middle of the screen is something you don’t need to play the game to have an opinion on. I really don’t like these changes - I’m not pointing this out because I’m whining, complaining or hating. I’m worried they’ll negatively impact the game in a big way.
> >
> > There is no clear line differentiating these from eachother. Some people can deduce things that other people can’t. In fact, I generally believe that resorting to saying “you haven’t played the game so you can’t know” when they are given a perfectly logical argument is wrong, no matter what the subject is. You either give a counter argument, or admit that they are right and there is indeed something wrong with that feature. Blanket statements never hold any water, even with gameplay. Logical arguments with reasoning behind them on the other hand can never be responded to with “you haven’t played the game”.
>
> That’s a good point, but as you say there are shades of grey to this and any generalisation is going to have flaws. Just as me saying “you haven’t played the game” is untrue, so is somebody with the opinion of “I’ve watched a video, therefore x is terrible”

As I added to my post, every opinion needs reasoning behind it. “I’ve watched a video, threfore X is terrible” is still not an argument. However, “I watched a video in which X clearly did Y which most certainly impacts gameplay negatively because [good reasoning], therefore X impacts gameplay negatively” on the other hand, most certainly is enough regardless of have you played the game yet. It all comes down to the amount of reasoning you give to support what you say.

11

> Every time there’s new gameplay, there are new threads where people highlight parts of the game that they don’t like, or would like to see changed. In every thread, there’s a comment like “stop complaining” or “my only problem with Halo 4 is people whining.”

People, by nature are pessimistic. People see the negative sides of things and remember them for years to come. I’d be surprised if these forums didn’t reflect that.

> Constructive criticism has its place, and this is the last time we’ll get to give meaningful feedback for a very long time. Soon, everything will be locked down - change is possible at the moment, but not for much longer.

I disagree. Things change all the time and nothing is ever “locked down” besides the common sense topics of: politics and religion. Beyond that, everything can be changed and altered. If you want it to be changed, make the topic and see how far it goes.

> Making feedback constructive and polite is important: We have to remember that a lot of people put blood, sweat and tears into this game. There’s no use getting hysterical or personal if you don’t like something: explain why

Always a good idea to keep this in mind.

> Most of us haven’t played the game: Blanket statements like “support packages and tactical upgrades are unbalanced” just don’t hold any water if you haven’t played Halo 4. You can express concerns, but there’s no point going on a crusade about something you haven’t experienced that might turn out to be fine.

Ehhhh, you can imagine how this affect gameplay and still see the design flaw issues if your good at realizing how the system can reward and punish certain gameplay styles with the addition of something. You just have to be polite or above reproach if your going with that argument though.

> Some things don’t need gameplay to stick out: The over-abundance of medal announcements and text popups in the middle of the screen is something you don’t need to play the game to have an opinion on. I really don’t like these changes - I’m not pointing this out because I’m whining, complaining or hating. I’m worried they’ll negatively impact the game in a big way.

And then people say how they don’t have an issue with it. Just for the record, bad example. I’d recommend choosing something which all players can attach to, not something which a select group can be concerned or caring enough to comment to.

> Please don’t interpret every piece of feedback as an attack against 343i, or Halo 4 or the direction of the franchise. We all want to love Halo 4, and thoughtful opinions are always necessary (even if you don’t agree, try pointing out why).

That’s the issue. It’s not an idea or issue per say about the feedback (as long as its english, clearly written, and understandable to the common person) its the matter of constructing it in a manner which won’t come across offensively. For example, a thread made a while back examined female spartan models and in that thread, the original poster could have though of a different way to approach the topic, but instead, made a few rash statements for their opener and half the thread was dedicated to making sexually slurred comments because it wasn’t considered a serious or mature topic. This particular topic thankfully got locked and removed from the forums. The same result (locked and removed) occurred with a few other threads about the oddball being able to be thrown, the new map Exile designs, and the new vidoc. It’s all fine and dandy for people to make comments or inputs about what they dislike, but when you get down to it, its about being polite and respectful at the same time.

> In summary, feedback matters, and the voice of the community is important to 343i. Use it, but use it politely, use it selectively, and try to remind yourself that there are some things we just can’t know until we play. For everything else, be respectful.

Good summary., I agree.

> If you see somebody offering constructive criticism, don’t accuse them of being a hater or unfaithful to the franchise. Everybody is coming from a place where we want to enjoy Halo 4 as much as possible, and if we all remember that this forum will be a nicer place to be in the lead up to release

It’s all fine and dandy until someone loses their temper and starts raging…

12

> Some things don’t need gameplay to stick out: The over-abundance of medal announcements and text popups in the middle of the screen is something you don’t need to play the game to have an opinion on. I really don’t like these changes - I’m not pointing this out because I’m whining, complaining or hating. I’m worried they’ll negatively impact the game in a big way.

Unless you’re one of those special people that have the ability to notice everything going on around them even when you’re focused you are not going to notice them because normally when you’re focused on something, your mind will tend to ignore or block out everything else. Look it up if you don’t believe me, there’s even a show on science channel about it where they experiment with it.
Plus I’m all for constructive criticism, except lately it seems people aren’t being polite about it, they’re twisting fact and fiction, and if you disagree then they’ll try to shove it down your throat and try to make you agree with them, so just post it and be done with it and don’t hunt people down you disagree with you. :slight_smile:

13

This forum will almost definite turn out like the Reach forum (Over at bungie.net) after release there no doubt about that.

14

Well said OP! Well said!

15

> This forum will almost definite turn out like the Reach forum (Over at bungie.net) after release <mark>there no doubt about that</mark>.

I have my doubts :slight_smile:

There’s nothing wrong with complaining or having an opinion about anything we’ve seen so far. It’s not the opinion that gets people in trouble, but the way in which it’s conveyed. It’s not the opinion, it’s the manner in which it is conveyed. Try to be constructive. Give direct feedback. Be descriptive as possible. And, more than anything, keep an open mind. Realize that what you are presenting is based upon your perception and previous experience. What ever you are about to discuss, there is, by no doubt, some one that feels the very opposite.

We are all here for one reason. We all love Halo, and are passionate about it. It’s hard to keep that emotion in check sometimes. Over the coming weeks, our patience and tolerance will be tested. Consider it a test of character to weather these days of waiting, until we can finally get our hands on what we’ve been waiting for.

Just remember. We’re watching you. We’re always watching…

16

TL;DR its the internet. definitely not filled with sunshine and rainbows.

343s reasoning behind a lot of the ‘gimmicks’ is because theyre adding things fromother FPS to appealto the new and modern generation of gamers. You cant make the same game and attract the same 1 million players, when it makes 2 million to make the game. I hope you understood that.