Is it possible that I’m the only person to have noticed the thumbstick deadzones in the MCC? They are RIDICULOUSLY large. I thought at first that maybe my controller was going bad but the result is the same on a different machine with another controller as well.
I’m not sure exactly what to do here. I’ve never experienced playing Halo with such loosey goosey controls.
Update: It’s not a deadzone issue. It’s the way that 343 has implemented nontraditional thumbstick layouts (i.e. Legacy and Legacy Southpaw). Both of these thumbstick layouts are broken and essentially unusable as their lack of fine control doesn’t allow for any kind of precision or nuance in regards to movement or aiming.This has been tested against both XB1 and 360 controllers**.**
Update 2: You can use a Cronusmax adapter to alleviate the issues with nontraditional layouts when playing Halo, but there are significant caveats to doing so. Please see the detailed information on page 2 outlining the limitations of doing this.
Explain in more detail please. Are you noticing this when you peak or corner??? Because the increase in Frames will make you think you’re not moving as fast but in fact you’re just experiencing everything thing twice as responsive. Same thing about people saying they don’t seem to be as “floaty” in HALO MCC as they were before.
Because of the increase in frames from 30 to 60
This also applies to aiming and overall gameplay and movement. The more frames the more you actually experience and see while in the game world.
So you could think you’re hitting deadzones when in fact everything is just more responsive, hence why you think the controls are lose.
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> Explain in more detail please. Are you noticing this when you peak or corner??? Because the increase in Frames will make you think you’re not moving as fast but in fact you’re just experiencing everything thing twice as responsive. Same thing about people saying they don’t seem to be as “floaty” in HALO MCC as they were before.
>
> Because of the increase in frames from 30 to 60
>
> This also applies to aiming and overall gameplay and movement. The more frames the more you actually experience and see while in the game world.
>
> So you could think you’re hitting deadzones when in fact everything is just more responsive, hence why you think the controls are lose.
I sat down and spent some time analyzing the problem and I’ve kind of figured it out. It’s not a mind thing, it’s definitely there…but I’ve realized it’s also not something that’s going to be encountered by the majority of players.
I’m going to explain this poorly, but here goes anyway. Playing with the default thumbstick controls seems to be fine. Unfortunately I play Halo with the old school legacy thumbstick layout, and this has been implemented badly. It’s not a deadzone problem as I originally thought. Basically, when using this configuration and pressing a diagonal direction it doesn’t actually register the input until you cross a certain threshold in the thumbstick’s orbit. It makes the the controls impossibly jerky and basically unusable.
Since a picture is worth a thousand words I just took a quick video demonstrating what I’m talking about.
Given the small percentage of players that this will impact and the serious problems that are otherwise plaguing the MCC I am under no illusions that this will be addressed. It is what it is, but it sucks. I’ve been looking forward to this game since it was announced and never thought that the controls were going to be a hindrance to me.
Ive found the soame thing but with the xbox one contoller in general. since i first got my hands on it i noticed the huge deadzone espicially when i hook it up to my pc, compared to other controllers its the worst analog deadzone Ive experienced on first party hardware
> 2765826735446236;4:
> > 2533274796324000;2:
> > Explain in more detail please. Are you noticing this when you peak or corner??? Because the increase in Frames will make you think you’re not moving as fast but in fact you’re just experiencing everything thing twice as responsive. Same thing about people saying they don’t seem to be as “floaty” in HALO MCC as they were before.
> >
> > Because of the increase in frames from 30 to 60
> >
> > This also applies to aiming and overall gameplay and movement. The more frames the more you actually experience and see while in the game world.
> >
> > So you could think you’re hitting deadzones when in fact everything is just more responsive, hence why you think the controls are lose.
>
>
> I sat down and spent some time analyzing the problem and I’ve kind of figured it out. It’s not a mind thing, it’s definitely there…but I’ve realized it’s also not something that’s going to be encountered by the majority of players.
>
> I’m going to explain this poorly, but here goes anyway. Playing with the default thumbstick controls seems to be fine. Unfortunately I play Halo with the old school legacy thumbstick layout, and this has been implemented badly. It’s not a deadzone problem as I originally thought. Basically, when using this configuration and pressing a diagonal direction it doesn’t actually register the input until you cross a certain threshold in the thumbstick’s orbit. It makes the the controls impossibly jerky and basically unusable.
>
> Since a picture is worth a thousand words I just took a quick video demonstrating what I’m talking about.
>
> Master Chief Collection legacy thumbstick layout unusable. - YouTube
>
> Given the small percentage of players that this will impact and the serious problems that are otherwise plaguing the MCC I am under no illusions that this will be addressed. It is what it is, but it sucks. I’ve been looking forward to this game since it was announced and never thought that the controls were going to be a hindrance to me.
That sucks, man. Good video to demonstrate because I would have had no idea what you meant otherwise. I hope they get you squared away. Good luck!
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> Ive found the soame thing but with the xbox one contoller in general. since i first got my hands on it i noticed the huge deadzone espicially when i hook it up to my pc, compared to other controllers its the worst analog deadzone Ive experienced on first party hardware
In an attempt to figure out if it’s the game or the controller I tried it with a second XB1 controller. The effect was the same.
So I took it a step further and tested the MCC with a 360 controller. Exactly the same issue, though the additional tension on the 360 controller thumbsticks makes it minimally but measurably easier to handle.
Personally I feel that the XB1 controller is inferior to other controllers (particularly the 360 and PS4 controllers) but in this instance it definitely isn’t the controller that’s causing the issue. It’s the MCC itself.
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> > 2765826735446236;4:
> > …
>
>
> That sucks, man. Good video to demonstrate because I would have had no idea what you meant otherwise. I hope they get you squared away. Good luck!
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> > 2533274798982407;5:
> > Ive found the soame thing but with the xbox one contoller in general. since i first got my hands on it i noticed the huge deadzone espicially when i hook it up to my pc, compared to other controllers its the worst analog deadzone Ive experienced on first party hardware
>
>
> In an attempt to figure out if it’s the game or the controller I tried it with a second XB1 controller. The effect was the same.
>
> So I took it a step further and tested the MCC with a 360 controller. Exactly the same issue, though the additional tension on the 360 controller thumbsticks makes it minimally but measurably easier to handle.
>
> Personally I feel that the XB1 controller is inferior to other controllers (particularly the 360 and PS4 controllers) but in this instance it definitely isn’t the controller that’s causing the issue. It’s the MCC itself.
How do you use a 360 controller on xbox one? I’m an extremely curious to try this.
> 2533274796292609;10:
> > 2765826735446236;8:
> > > 2533274798982407;5:
> > > Ive found the soame thing but with the xbox one contoller in general. since i first got my hands on it i noticed the huge deadzone espicially when i hook it up to my pc, compared to other controllers its the worst analog deadzone Ive experienced on first party hardware
> >
> >
> >
> > In an attempt to figure out if it’s the game or the controller I tried it with a second XB1 controller. The effect was the same.
> >
> > So I took it a step further and tested the MCC with a 360 controller. Exactly the same issue, though the additional tension on the 360 controller thumbsticks makes it minimally but measurably easier to handle.
> >
> > Personally I feel that the XB1 controller is inferior to other controllers (particularly the 360 and PS4 controllers) but in this instance it definitely isn’t the controller that’s causing the issue. It’s the MCC itself.
>
>
> How do you use a 360 controller on xbox one? I’m an extremely curious to try this.
You can do this with a Cronusmax dongle. You can use a wired 360 controller, or alternatively a wireless one with the addition of the microsoft wireless adapter for windows.
I’m a big fan of these things as they allow you to use your preferred controller on alternate systems and it allows you to store profiles of remapped buttons/thumbsticks. I originally got one to use the legacy thumbstick layout in FPS games that don’t offer it as standard. At $60 USD (plus the wireless adapter) it’s not inexpensive, but you get what you pay for in terms of flexibility. You can pretty much use any controller with any system.
There are two caveats to using these:
The 360 controller is functionally the same as the XB1 controller as far as the Xbox is concerned, but you have to authenticate your controller every time you turn on the system. Basically this means that each time you turn on the machine you have to plug your XB1 controller into the Cronusmax before you can use your 360 controller. For the rest of that play session your XB1 controller is unusable as a second controller since it’s system ID is being used by the Cronusmax to validate the 360 controller.
It doesn’t do pass through for audio so you cannot use a headset that plugs into the controller for chat without significant workarounds (there’s a really convoluted method to accomplish this with two controllers but I don’t recommend it). You either use Kinect or go without.
I appreciate you tweeting the team with this! I was pretty confident that this would receive no attention, but I see that other people are having issues with various other layouts (melee using green thumb, etc.), so perhaps all of these control issues will actually be investigated once the dev’s get a handle on the matchmaking issues.
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> > https://twitter.com/Brav/status/532974045608677376
> >
> > Hopefully this gets fixed soon!
>
>
> I appreciate you tweeting the team with this! I was pretty confident that this would receive no attention, but I see that other people are having issues with various other layouts (melee using green thumb, etc.), so perhaps all of these control issues will actually be investigated once the dev’s get a handle on the matchmaking issues.
No problem. I hope it gets resolved. I was wondering why I was struggling so much to aim yesterday. This explains it. Thank you for demonstrating in a video!
Back in the 90’s when I was a big Battlefield fan boy, I was mapping out/programming my “joystick” so that I would be able to fly the choppers but I came across a similar issue…
I believe the technical term for the fix of this is called Binding, dead zones refers to the area where the sticks are moving but the game is not.
I like to be thorough, so I’ve been monkeying around with some ideas the last two nights and have learned a couple things, some of which were rather surprising.
I hooked up the XB1 controller to my PC and monitored coordinate values when moving the thumbsticks. The XB1 controller has NO dead zones whatsoever and the tiniest tap of a stick will register a coordinate value in every direction. Any dead zones that are implemented on the XB1 are being done via software, not hardware.
This part was totally unexpected and shocked me quite a bit…this is NOT a new issue for Halo. I wanted to compare the MCC versions of the Halo games against the original versions in order to revisit the differences in controls. This issue is present in EVERY Halo game I tested against (all of them except Halo CE since I can’t find my disc for that one). Having said that, the problem is masked somewhat better in the original games with the old controllers and thus not as noticeable or objectionable. Basically, it is there to an extent in the old versions, but it wasn’t an insurmountable problem (which should be obvious, since those of us who use legacy or legacy southpaw have been doing so adequately in Halo for years). The XB1 controller makes this much more difficult to compensate for, to the point of being an unnecessary burden.
This part has me rather confused. As an experiment I turned off one axis of the thumbsticks while leaving the other active. When doing so the problem disappears completely. For example, in the video I recorded the other day I showed what happens when you press the right thumbstick all the way to the left or right (x value) and wiggle the thumbstick up and down (y value). The result is that the game registers no y value until you cross a certain threshold and then jumps, leading to jerky movements rather than smooth pans. If, on the other hand, I completely disable the x axis and move the thumbstick all the way to the left or right and wiggle the thumbstick up and down the game immediately registers the movement in both directions and works entirely as expected. I’m not sure exactly what to make of this yet.
Despite the fact that I’ve been playing FPS’s with this layout pretty much forever without issue, I was curious if this behaviour is apparent in other games that allow for a legacy configuration and I just haven’t noticed it. I put in probably 20 FPS games I have laying around from a variety of franchises and no other game besides Halo exhibit this whatsoever. Call of Duty (in all it’s many variations) is fine. Battlefield is fine. Borderlands is fine. Portal is fine. Basically, no other game treats nontraditional thumbstick layouts the way Halo does.
Not that any of this makes a bit of difference in the end other than to satisfy my own curiosity. The bottom line is that the legacy and legacy southpaw layouts are simply wonky practically to the point of uselessness as they are now. The only thing to be done is to hope for a fix from 343.
As an aside, for grins I switched to the default layout and tried playing this way last night. Hilarity ensued…though I’m not so sure my teammates were nearly as amused by my performance (or total lack thereof, to be more precise). While it was entertaining, I think I’m going to abandon that experiment. I anticipate the amusement factor of doing this will wear off rather quickly.
> 2765826735446236;18:
> I like to be thorough, so I’ve been monkeying around with some ideas the last two nights and have learned a couple things, some of which were rather surprising.
>
> 1. I hooked up the XB1 controller to my PC and monitored coordinate values when moving the thumbsticks. The XB1 controller has NO dead zones whatsoever and the tiniest tap of a stick will register a coordinate value in every direction. Any dead zones that are implemented on the XB1 are being done via software, not hardware.
>
> As an aside, for grins I switched to the default layout and tried playing this way last night. Hilarity ensued…though I’m not so sure my teammates were nearly as amused by my performance (or total lack thereof, to be more precise). While it was entertaining, I think I’m going to abandon that experiment. I anticipate the amusement factor of doing this will wear off rather quickly.
Thanks for taking the time to do this.
Hopefully, this issue gets resolved soon.
I tried switching to default and it was a disaster as well. It is hard to break a 10 year setup for shooters. Hopefully others speak up as well!
> 2533274805342761;19:
> > 2765826735446236;18:
> > I like to be thorough, so I’ve been monkeying around with some ideas the last two nights and have learned a couple things, some of which were rather surprising.
> >
> > 1. I hooked up the XB1 controller to my PC and monitored coordinate values when moving the thumbsticks. The XB1 controller has NO dead zones whatsoever and the tiniest tap of a stick will register a coordinate value in every direction. Any dead zones that are implemented on the XB1 are being done via software, not hardware.
> >
> > As an aside, for grins I switched to the default layout and tried playing this way last night. Hilarity ensued…though I’m not so sure my teammates were nearly as amused by my performance (or total lack thereof, to be more precise). While it was entertaining, I think I’m going to abandon that experiment. I anticipate the amusement factor of doing this will wear off rather quickly.
>
>
> Thanks for taking the time to do this.
>
> Hopefully, this issue gets resolved soon.
>
> I tried switching to default and it was a disaster as well. It is hard to break a 10 year setup for shooters. Hopefully others speak up as well!
No problem. It’s a frustrating problem but it’s been interesting educating myself on how Halo’s control systems work. I don’t expect this will be fixed in a timely fashion…based on past experience, it can take a long time to get a developer to fix broken control schemes or patch in those that are missing (there is precedent for this happening though in a few other games).
I’m starting to attack this from a hardware perspective and writing a script that remaps the sensitivity of the thumbsticks on the fly. It’s really a band aid fix and not really practical (since it requires additional hardware that the majority of people don’t have access to) but it’s really meant more as a proof of concept than anything. I’ve only had partial success so far…it’s not even remotely ready for prime time but I’m slowly making progress. If I’m lucky I might have something viable in a few days.
