Worried about Warzone

Games Halo 5: Guardians
1

The following is a discussion about the possible pitfalls of Warzone and a ton of new ideas to help improve the mode. Discussion more than welcome. Apologies for the messy presentation, but the ideas are all there.

It has been mentioned on this forum that the scoring system seems a little off right now - 200 points for getting the last bullet into a boss seems a bit much.

I think that problem is easily fixed and really pales in comparison to a bigger problem I see with Warzone, that the AI is too dumb and bullet-spongey.

Watching the gameplay the AI units miss most of their shots and seem to have a simple %damage and health buff. Not to mention the fact that they just kind of sit there or fly around a defined route and wait to die. Seems very lame to me, what’s the point of giving them all whacky names if they’re all just bullet sponges?

Would be fantastic if the Warzone AI difficulty scaled with the average level of player skill in the game, and if they attacked a base or at least defended themselves a little more intelligently. The base marines shouldn’t just stand in a room waiting for someone to come through either, would be fantastic if they manned turrets, sat in the doorways taking pot shots, etc.

I can see a situation where good players start to look at Warzone as the “noob” or “casual” mode because when they play it the bullet sponge AI are resources to be harvested rather than fought, making the mode much less interesting than it would be at a more casual level. So yeah the AI should scale, definitely, and provide more than just a static map resource that weakly fights back.

Ideas
One idea I had to stop the “point race” style of gameplay which can be quite ultimately unsatisfying is this - You reach 1,000 points but you don’t immediately win, it just means that your enemies core is exposed and unable to be sealed again.

Warzone also could really benefit from a constantly updating mini-map of sorts. It would be unfeasible to put one in everyone’s HUD, but having one accessible via the menu would be VERY handy for players. Another great way to implement this would be to have a “war room” or “battle screen” in the home base (or any base you capture) that shows a holographic table or at least a big screen view of the map, with each team’s currently controlled bases highlighted in their respective colours, it could also show the position of your teammates and which vehicles they’re currently driving, it could also show the location of enemy AI camps in purple or orange for covenant/promethian. This would really help new players orientate themselves in the War Zone and it would provide valuable information for players who want to know where their help is most needed on the frontlines.

ALSO (sorry hahah) - has anyone ever played Unreal’s “Onslaught” mode, seriously one of the best massive multiplayer modes I’ve ever played. It had cores like Warzone does and bases like warzone does, the difference being that each base had a mini-core that had to be destroyed before you could start to capture the base for your team and spawn vehicles etc.The latest iteration in Unreal Tournament III featured an “orb” for each side, which was basically a carried item that could instantly capture a neutral or enemy base, and provided a shield to a friendly base if the carrier was close enough (shield also prevented instant-capture). Some kind of “orb” or “flag” in warzone would be an AWESOME addition to certain Warzone maps, I feel, and it would add another layer of chaos and strategy to Warzone. If you could plant some kind of halo themed UNSC power core or flag in a slot in a base and instantly capture it, or unlock extra defences… and each team having one… that would be cool! What do you guys think?

A moba style UNSC vs Covenant map with lanes and AI troops going at each other from each base etc would be amazing but that’s wishful thinking at this stage!

I’d love a warzone map that featured a UNSC Frigate vs a Covenant Cruiser that have crashed into each other but whose hangars are still operation so you can fly snub-fighters around in the void or assault the enemy ship on foot through the entangled decks, etc.

2

I hate it when these kind of posts get ignored even though they contribute so much to actually important stuff.

> One idea I had to stop the “point race” style of gameplay which can be quite ultimately unsatisfying is this - You reach 1,000 points but you don’t immediately win, it just means that your enemies core is exposed and unable to be sealed again.

That was probably the best suggestion I’ve read about the topic. There should be some kind of “aftermath” of the battle. Winning by just being the lucky one to get the last legendary boss at the last second really seems a little too unfair for a match that is supposed to be about strategy.

> I’d love a warzone map that featured a UNSC Frigate vs a Covenant Cruiser that have crashed into each other but whose hangars are still operation so you can fly snub-fighters around in the void or assault the enemy ship on foot through the entangled decks, etc.

Like Battlefront style? It could work well, but there aren’t Elites playable. Even though, Spartans could train in both sides of the battle. The blue tam infiltrates the UNSC Frigate and plants a bomb, whilst the red team sabotages the Covenant Corvette and destroys its core. Perfection.

3

> 2533274875903884;2:
> > I’d love a warzone map that featured a UNSC Frigate vs a Covenant Cruiser that have crashed into each other but whose hangars are still operation so you can fly snub-fighters around in the void or assault the enemy ship on foot through the entangled decks, etc.
>
>
> Like Battlefront style? It could work well, but there aren’t Elites playable. Even though, Spartans could train in both sides of the battle. The blue tam infiltrates the UNSC Frigate and plants a bomb, whilst the red team sabotages the Covenant Corvette and destroys its core. Perfection.

I like this idea, and yeah, Elites were a pipe-dream but I’d love a space map regardless.

4

> 2533274875903884;2:
> > One idea I had to stop the “point race” style of gameplay which can be quite ultimately unsatisfying is this - You reach 1,000 points but you don’t immediately win, it just means that your enemies core is exposed and unable to be sealed again.
>
>
> That was probably the best suggestion I’ve read about the topic. There should be some kind of “aftermath” of the battle. Winning by just being the lucky one to get the last legendary boss at the last second really seems a little too unfair for a match that is supposed to be about strategy.

Or maybe different game modes for War Zone. Just a few so we could try different variations and decide which works best .

5

The AI does definitely need to be made smarter and more intimidating. It is the only way they could really be worthy of their names. They should be more powerful than legendary difficulty if they will be worth 200 frigging points. seriously 200 whole points for shooting some dumb elite who just stands and stares back killing a spartan is harder by fifteen times

6

In the spirit of Breakout, what if you lose the ability to respawn once the enemy hits 1000 points?

7

Ive seen a ton of Warzone videos, i cant think of anything i would change at this point. I need to get my hands on the full version first.

8

> 2535469530912033;5:
> The AI does definitely need to be made smarter and more intimidating. It is the only way they could really be worthy of their names. They should be more powerful than legendary difficulty if they will be worth 200 frigging points. seriously 200 whole points for shooting some dumb elite who just stands and stares back killing a spartan is harder by fifteen times

The Points are going to be adjust for E3 etc we know the game awarded more points than it probably will at launch to speed the games for the shows etc to get more people to play. Plus AI balancing is difficult because although a lot of us probably find the AI easy on this forum a lot of new and old players won’t not everyone is god like at Halo it is a casual game mode so we can’t just push the casual players away.

9

There are 2 things that make me the most nervous about Warzone.

  1. There was not a public beta at all which means it has not properly been stress tested online.
  2. On top of that this next quote from the recent blog has me even more nervous because again, it has not been tested online.

From the recent 7/7/15 blog.

Play Warzone
Very few Halo fans have had the chance to play Warzone, the new massive-scale multiplayer mode coming to Halo 5: Guardians. Luckily, we’re bringing Warzone with us to SDCC, which means that it will be the first public appearance of the mode. Warzone will be playable at the Xbox Booth (Booth #100) on the SDCC show floor – be sure to arrive early and beat the line!

10

Seems okay…

11

> 2533274805962294;1:
> The following is a discussion about the possible pitfalls of Warzone and a ton of new ideas to help improve the mode. Discussion more than welcome. Apologies for the messy presentation, but the ideas are all there.
>
> It has been mentioned on this forum that the scoring system seems a little off right now - 200 points for getting the last bullet into a boss seems a bit much.
>
> I think that problem is easily fixed and really pales in comparison to a bigger problem I see with Warzone, that the AI is too dumb and bullet-spongey.
>
> Watching the gameplay the AI units miss most of their shots and seem to have a simple %damage and health buff. Not to mention the fact that they just kind of sit there or fly around a defined route and wait to die. Seems very lame to me, what’s the point of giving them all whacky names if they’re all just bullet sponges?
>
> Would be fantastic if the Warzone AI difficulty scaled with the average level of player skill in the game, and if they attacked a base or at least defended themselves a little more intelligently. The base marines shouldn’t just stand in a room waiting for someone to come through either, would be fantastic if they manned turrets, sat in the doorways taking pot shots, etc.
>
> I can see a situation where good players start to look at Warzone as the “noob” or “casual” mode because when they play it the bullet sponge AI are resources to be harvested rather than fought, making the mode much less interesting than it would be at a more casual level. So yeah the AI should scale, definitely, and provide more than just a static map resource that weakly fights back.
>
> Ideas
> One idea I had to stop the “point race” style of gameplay which can be quite ultimately unsatisfying is this - You reach 1,000 points but you don’t immediately win, it just means that your enemies core is exposed and unable to be sealed again.
>
> Warzone also could really benefit from a constantly updating mini-map of sorts. It would be unfeasible to put one in everyone’s HUD, but having one accessible via the menu would be VERY handy for players. Another great way to implement this would be to have a “war room” or “battle screen” in the home base (or any base you capture) that shows a holographic table or at least a big screen view of the map, with each team’s currently controlled bases highlighted in their respective colours, it could also show the position of your teammates and which vehicles they’re currently driving, it could also show the location of enemy AI camps in purple or orange for covenant/promethian. This would really help new players orientate themselves in the War Zone and it would provide valuable information for players who want to know where their help is most needed on the frontlines.
>
> ALSO (sorry hahah) - has anyone ever played Unreal’s “Onslaught” mode, seriously one of the best massive multiplayer modes I’ve ever played. It had cores like Warzone does and bases like warzone does, the difference being that each base had a mini-core that had to be destroyed before you could start to capture the base for your team and spawn vehicles etc.The latest iteration in Unreal Tournament III featured an “orb” for each side, which was basically a carried item that could instantly capture a neutral or enemy base, and provided a shield to a friendly base if the carrier was close enough (shield also prevented instant-capture). Some kind of “orb” or “flag” in warzone would be an AWESOME addition to certain Warzone maps, I feel, and it would add another layer of chaos and strategy to Warzone. If you could plant some kind of halo themed UNSC power core or flag in a slot in a base and instantly capture it, or unlock extra defences… and each team having one… that would be cool! What do you guys think?
>
> A moba style UNSC vs Covenant map with lanes and AI troops going at each other from each base etc would be amazing but that’s wishful thinking at this stage!
>
> I’d love a warzone map that featured a UNSC Frigate vs a Covenant Cruiser that have crashed into each other but whose hangars are still operation so you can fly snub-fighters around in the void or assault the enemy ship on foot through the entangled decks, etc.

it’s fine the way it is. Battlefield has a similar point system and it makes for a great multiplayer game.

> 2787272447958470;9:
> There are 2 things that make me the most nervous about Warzone.
> 1. There was not a public beta at all which means it has not properly been stress tested online.
> 2. On top of that this next quote from the recent blog has me even more nervous because again, it has not been tested online.
>
> From the recent 7/7/15 blog.
>
> Play Warzone
> Very few Halo fans have had the chance to play Warzone, the new massive-scale multiplayer mode coming to Halo 5: Guardians. Luckily, we’re bringing Warzone with us to SDCC, which means that it will be the first public appearance of the mode. Warzone will be playable at the Xbox Booth (Booth #100) on the SDCC show floor – be sure to arrive early and beat the line!

They have hired external companies and have been stress testing with people all around the world including Press and Fans. NDAs prohibit people from talking but they’ve been running a beta non stop since January. I know this because I have friends in it.

12

I’m just hoping that BTB has 24 players.

This Warzone mode could be alright but despite the explanations it appears as though its a pay to win gametype made to accommodate a microtransaction model.

13

The AI is clearly inspired by MOBAs. They shouldn’t wonder around the map because then there would be too much randomness of them trolling a specific team. In MOBAs, the bosses are a bonus but aren’t hard. The challenge comes from dealing with enemies while dealing with the boss and trying to get the last shot. That makes the encounter challenging and sophisticated AI wouldn’t enhance the experience.

They are a bullet sponge because they area designed to be taken out with multiple people. You should coordinate to get 4 people or so to take it down quickly; taking it on alone is a huge waste of time.