Wierd question about Headsets

Community General Discussion
1

So, I’ve been looking from some good headset for some time that I can use with my 360, One, PC and TV. And after some research I found that instead of buying overpriced Xbox headsets (like Turtle Beach’s), I can buy PC headsets (which usually cost less, while providing the same, if not more, quality) and connect it to my TV instead of my Xbox.

So the question is: is there a difference in the sound quality between connecting the headset to the Xbox and TV (while playing on Xbox)? I’d really like to know before buying a +100$ Headset.

2

I’m looking for a headset myself, under $100, can use with my XBOX One and an adapter or something so I can use a voice changer for multiplayer shenanigans

3

Well I have the Turtle Beach PX22 and it’s AMAZING! When I got it, it cost $80, but may be less now. The biggest selling point to me was it is a UNIVERSAL headset, so it worked with my TV, 360, PC, Phone, Tablet… anything with a 3.5mm jack. The headset also unplugs from the mixer and is then just a nice pair of headphones to take anywhere. My favorite feature is an auxiliary-in on the mixer which allows you to listen to music while gaming and even has an option to switch chat to that input so if you have your phone plugged in, you can take a call while gaming (you still hear the game audio and the call is piped in like game chat). Then after you’re done talking, flip the switch back to game chat. Has a lot of sound adjusters too for bass, treble, chat, hearing yourself (so you don’t scream lol), etc.

It comes with connectors for analog audio which will work either plugged in to something or, because they are also a pass-through, something plugged into them (for example, if you have your 360 hooked up with component and plug the red and white audio into the plugs that came with the Turtle Beaches, then into the TV, it works…or just plug the red and white plugs into an audio out and it works, or plug the 3.5 jack into a headphone port and it works). If you need optical audio, I suggest picking up a Turtle Beach Earforce DSS (either the original or the second model) which can be had pretty cheap on eBay which makes the surround sound full Dolby Digital 5.1/7.1 or ProLogic II). If you get the headset adapter for the Xbox One it’ll work there too for chat and has already been shown to be PS4 compatible. Love this thing… oh and it’s an MLG headset as well if that kind of thing matters to you guys. You can get the whole package, a new PX22 and the DSS via eBay for under the $100 mark and you have PLENTY of connectivity options.

4

The sound quality depends on the quality of the circuitry that converts the sound from digital to analog, and potentially amplifies it to an appropriate level. Because of the way headphones connect to the Xbox One via the apparently digital interface on the controller, it seems the quality of conversion is up to the manufacturer of the headphones. If you take the sound through your TV, the quality of the conversion is up to the manufacturer of the TV.

Generally t’s hard to say how good the converter in your TV is. It’s probably not fantastic, but it’s probably fine. It’s probably a better idea buying something with a 3.5mm jack that connects to the TV. It’s less of a hassle if you want to use it on multiple devices.

But I suppose you aren’t planning to use a mic if you’re considering routing the audio through your TV? If that’s the case, I’d recommend ditching headsets in general because even on PC, gaming headsets generally don’t have great value. There are a lot of headphones out there from professional manufacturers that generally have better audio quality than any gaming headset. The only downside to those is that they don’t have a mic like a headset does, mind you, there are solutions for that. But if you don’t need a mic, you should definitely avoid gaming headsets.

5

> 2533274815981582;3:
> Well I have the Turtle Beach PX22 and it’s AMAZING! When I got it, it cost $80, but may be less now. The biggest selling point to me was it is a UNIVERSAL headset, so it worked with my TV, 360, PC, Phone, Tablet… anything with a 3.5mm jack. The headset also unplugs from the mixer and is then just a nice pair of headphones to take anywhere. My favorite feature is an auxiliary-in on the mixer which allows you to listen to music while gaming and even has an option to switch chat to that input so if you have your phone plugged in, you can take a call while gaming (you still hear the game audio and the call is piped in like game chat). Then after you’re done talking, flip the switch back to game chat. Has a lot of sound adjusters too for bass, treble, chat, hearing yourself (so you don’t scream lol), etc.
>
> It comes with connectors for analog audio which will work either plugged in to something or, because they are also a pass-through, something plugged into them (for example, if you have your 360 hooked up with component and plug the red and white audio into the plugs that came with the Turtle Beaches, then into the TV, it works…or just plug the red and white plugs into an audio out and it works, or plug the 3.5 jack into a headphone port and it works). If you need optical audio, I suggest picking up a Turtle Beach Earforce DSS (either the original or the second model) which can be had pretty cheap on eBay which makes the surround sound full Dolby Digital 5.1/7.1 or ProLogic II). If you get the headset adapter for the Xbox One it’ll work there too for chat and has already been shown to be PS4 compatible. Love this thing… oh and it’s an MLG headset as well if that kind of thing matters to you guys. You can get the whole package, a new PX22 and the DSS via eBay for under the $100 mark and you have PLENTY of connectivity options.

Thanks for the help, man. I’m now considering buying an external sound card.

But, I must ask how can “The Ear Force DSS 7.1 channel Dolby surround sound processor transforms any stereo headset into full, immersive surround sound”? that’s what the description says. Shouldn’t headsets be capable of producing surround sound in the first place?

6

> 2533274825830455;4:
> The sound quality depends on the quality of the circuitry that converts the sound from digital to analog, and potentially amplifies it to an appropriate level. Because of the way headphones connect to the Xbox One via the apparently digital interface on the controller, it seems the quality of conversion is up to the manufacturer of the headphones. If you take the sound through your TV, the quality of the conversion is up to the manufacturer of the TV.
>
> Generally t’s hard to say how good the converter in your TV is. It’s probably not fantastic, but it’s probably fine. It’s probably a better idea buying something with a 3.5mm jack that connects to the TV. It’s less of a hassle if you want to use it on multiple devices.
>
> But I suppose you aren’t planning to use a mic if you’re considering routing the audio through your TV? If that’s the case, I’d recommend ditching headsets in general because even on PC, gaming headsets generally don’t have great value. There are a lot of headphones out there from professional manufacturers that generally have better audio quality than any gaming headset. The only downside to those is that they don’t have a mic like a headset does, mind you, there are solutions for that. But if you don’t need a mic, you should definitely avoid gaming headsets.

Really appreciate the info. Guess I’ll scrap the whole connecting to TV idea as I’m looking for the best quality possible.

Mic isn’t a problem with my Xbox. I can work this out. But as I said, I wanna use these with my PC, too, and I mostly play muliplayer games on PC so the mic is a must.

I actually considered getting an external sound card, so that I can connect it to either my Xbox or PC. Some soundcards are bundled with particular headsets.

Honestly, I’m at a loss as what to buy and would appreciate some recommendations. Something with a high quality sound, durable, 5.1 or better and preferably wireless.

7

> 2533274973373704;6:
> Really appreciate the info. Guess I’ll scrap the whole connecting to TV idea as I’m looking for the best quality possible.
>
> Mic isn’t a problem with my Xbox. I can work this out. But as I said, I wanna use these with my PC, too, and I mostly play muliplayer games on PC so the mic is a must.
>
> I actually considered getting an external sound card, so that I can connect it to either my Xbox or PC. Some soundcards are bundled with particular headsets.
>
> Honestly, I’m at a loss as what to buy and would appreciate some recommendations. Something with a high quality sound, durable, 5.1 or better and preferably wireless.

Considering you want good sound, and wireless, the choice actually becomes fairly obvious. I recommend you the Steel Series H Wireless. Steel Series is one of the few manufacturers of gaming headsets whose products actually have decent audio quality based on what I’ve heard. The H Wireless is also (well, obviously wireless) compatible with Xbox One, as well as any other platform. It comes at around 300$. That’s the price you have to pay for good wireless sound. Here’s a review of it so you have more than a word from someone who has never actually used that particular headset.

That’s the best bet I can recommend. The caveat is that I’m not that familiar with high end wireless audio, so if there are any equally good or better wireless solutions, I’m not aware of them.

Also, “the best possible” isn’t something I’d recommend anyone to pursue unless they happen to have too much money. From what I’ve seen, there seems to be no amount of money you can’t spend on audio equipment. Audio is the most expensive (and snake-oil filled) part of consumer electronics one can think of.

8

> 2533274973373704;5:
> But, I must ask how can “The Ear Force DSS 7.1 channel Dolby surround sound processor transforms any stereo headset into full, immersive surround sound”? that’s what the description says. Shouldn’t headsets be capable of producing surround sound in the first place?

There is a concept called “virtual surround sound”. The basic idea in an understandable form is: you have two ears, so all you need is two speakers. But I hate to say that because it’s a bit of a copout and doesn’t really explain anything. The gist of it, however, is that even proper stereo headphones can produce positional audio that is as good as any home theater setup, and you don’t actually need any kind of “surround” in headphones. That’s the short version.

The long version is that the way the ear processes sound direction is complicated. The perception of direction is mostly based on sounds arriving to different ears at different times because one ear is closer to the source than the other. The other part, to my knowledge, is based on different reverb effects caused by sounds coming from different directions to the ears.

The idea of binaural audio, is to record the sound with all these delays and reverb effects by using a proper microphone setup, so that if you listen to it with a pair of stereo headphones, your brain is fooled to think the sound is coming from some other direction than the sides of your head. It works on headphones, because the inside of the earcup is a very well controlled environment that has been meticulously designed by the audio engineers.

Binaural audio doesn’t scale up to loudspeaker setups because 1) it requires the head to be in a very specific position and 2) the reverbs produced by the walls and other objects in the room ruin the very delicate effect. That’s why movie theaters and home theater setups require multiple speakers to produce proper positional sound. That’s the only way to make it work at that scale.

The problem with this is that it has made many people think “Dolby 7.1 surround!” is the only way to produce positional audio, and why gaming headset manufacturers have so successfully marketed it to consumers to the point of actually sacrificing audio quality for “true surround”. (Tritton Pro actually had four speakers per ear to give “true surround”. The problem is that it’s not any better than virtual, and it required them to make the individual speakers smaller which actually degrades audio quality.)

The right way to go is to go with a good pair of open stereo headphones, and disable any virtual surround. As long as the sound is set up correctly (some games on PC even have a headphone mode for audio), the positional audio will trump any “true” or virtual surround (virtual surround, too, has a habit of degrading audio quality), while maintaining full audio quality.

9

> 2533274825830455;8:
> There is a concept called “virtual surround sound”. The basic idea in an understandable form is: you have two ears, so all you need is two speakers. But I hate to say that because it’s a bit of a copout and doesn’t really explain anything. The gist of it, however, is that even proper stereo headphones can produce positional audio that is as good as any home theater setup, and you don’t actually need any kind of “surround” in headphones. That’s the short version.
>
> The long version is that the way the ear processes sound direction is complicated. The perception of direction is mostly based on sounds arriving to different ears at different times because one ear is closer to the source than the other. The other part, to my knowledge, is based on different reverb effects caused by sounds coming from different directions to the ears.
>
> The idea of binaural audio, is to record the sound with all these delays and reverb effects by using a proper microphone setup, so that if you listen to it with a pair of stereo headphones, your brain is fooled to think the sound is coming from some other direction than the sides of your head. It works on headphones, because the inside of the earcup is a very well controlled environment that has been meticulously designed by the audio engineers.
>
> Binaural audio doesn’t scale up to loudspeaker setups because 1) it requires the head to be in a very specific position and 2) the reverbs produced by the walls and other objects in the room ruin the very delicate effect. That’s why movie theaters and home theater setups require multiple speakers to produce proper positional sound. That’s the only way to make it work at that scale.
>
> The problem with this is that it has made many people think “Dolby 7.1 surround!” is the only way to produce positional audio, and why gaming headset manufacturers have so successfully marketed it to consumers to the point of actually sacrificing audio quality for “true surround”. (Tritton Pro actually had four speakers per ear to give “true surround”. The problem is that it’s not any better than virtual, and it required them to make the individual speakers smaller which actually degrades audio quality.)
>
> The right way to go is to go with a good pair of open stereo headphones, and disable any virtual surround. As long as the sound is set up correctly (some games on PC even have a headphone mode for audio), the positional audio will trump any “true” or virtual surround (virtual surround, too, has a habit of degrading audio quality), while maintaining full audio quality.

Thanks again for taking time to reply to me and providing some very helpful info.

So, I’ve been doing some research for the past 2 days (considering my sound products-related knowledge is very limited), and I’ve come to some shocking conclusions on how audio accessories manufacturers advertise their “gaming” headsets.

Anyway, based on your replies and what I’ve learned so far, I’ve come to a conclusion that: high quality stereo headsets + external 7.1 soundcard, perform better and produce higher sound quality than “super pro hardcore gamer’s 7.1” headsets, right?

Also, Can any external 5.1/7.1 soundcard make stereo headsets surround? If so, does it come down to your soundcard’s capabilities?

Last question. Some people mentioned that wireless headsets have some latency? some kind of voice lag?

10

> 2533274973373704;9:
> Thanks again for taking time to reply to me and providing some very helpful info.
>
> So, I’ve been doing some research for the past 2 days (considering my sound products-related knowledge is very limited), and I’ve come to some shocking conclusions on how audio accessories manufacturers advertise their “gaming” headsets.
>
> Anyway, based on your replies and what I’ve learned so far, I’ve come to a conclusion that: high quality stereo headsets + external 7.1 soundcard, perform better and produce higher sound quality than “super pro hardcore gamer’s 7.1” headsets, right?
>
> Also, Can any external 5.1/7.1 soundcard make stereo headsets surround? If so, does it come down to your soundcard’s capabilities?

For the best positional audio, it’s high quality headphones with open design + decent amp and DAC.

All sound cards advertised as 7.1 or 5.1 either A) mean that you can connect a surround sound system of multiple speakers to it or B) use virtual surround for headphones, i.e. they create the effect in software. As a headphone user, you really don’t benefit from anything advertised as 7.1 or 5.1 because you only have two channels, and all the positional effects should already be there in the source audio.

All the super pro hardcore 7.1 gaming headsets do the exact same tricks as these 7.1 sound cards. They use software tricks to get the surround effect. When it comes to headphones, good stereo sound really is better than virtual surround sound.

I actually have a short story related to this. You see, as I said, surround sound on headphones is only software tricks, you don’t need any special hardware for it. One free piece of software for creating virtual surround is Razer Surround.

I tried this software the first time it came out to see how it is. The surround effect was adequate, and I absentmindedly left it on. Later, I was listening to music and it sounded all garbled and muddy. I didn’t understand immediately what was going on, until I went and tried disabling Razer Surround. The sound quality went immediately to what it should be. I ditched Razer Surround immediately.

I had had a similar experience earlier when I wasn’t educated on audio, and bought my Turtle Beach X41s for the Xbox 360. The headset had two modes, stereo and surround. Back then I couldn’t quite put my finger on it, but whenever I shuffled between the modes, the stereo mode always sounded a bit better for some reason. But I didn’t know better back then, so I always used the surround mode. Now I know that the stereo mode was, indeed, better. It produced no loss in positional audio and had better sound quality than the surround mode.

That’s my experience with surround sound on headphones, and that plus all the things I’ve learned is the reason why I advise staying away from anything that says “surround” when it comes to headphones. Proper stereo sound is all you need.

> 2533274973373704;9:
> Last question. Some people mentioned that wireless headsets have some latency? some kind of voice lag?

Anything wireless has latency. Frankly, everything has latency, but wireless device by their nature tend to have more latency than their wired counter parts. To be honest, I’m not sure if that’s something to worry about. I don’t believe the amount of latency will impact the experience, but I don’t know what kind of effects it can have on performance. Competitive gamers tend to prefer low latency on everything, but for casual gamers, if dealing with wires is always a hassle, wireless is a good solution.

11

> 2533274825830455;10:
> for the best positional audio, it’s high quality headphones with open design + decent amp and DAC

I mostly play in a quite environment, So I guess open headphones are for me. I just hope the sound leak doesn’t cause any problems. And don’t most soundcards already have amplifiers and DACs (example)?

> 2533274825830455;10:
> they create the effect in software.

Is that software installed on the soundcard itself or the targeted platform (Xbox or PC)? Or doest depend on the headphone/soundcard?

> 2533274825830455;10:
> As a headphone user, you really don’t benefit from anything advertised as 7.1 or 5.1 because you only have two channels, and all the positional effects should already be there in the source audio.

But most high quality soundcards are advertised as 5.1/7.1 capable. Does that mean it’s better to set the soundcard on Stereo mode? Considering that it’s up to the source audio.

Sorry for taking too long to get this. I’ve spent the last few days doing research about the whole subject (Heck, I even installed Wikipedia’s app on my phone), as I don’t like wasting my money without knowing what I’m doing.

Also, do you know some decent sites for headsets reviews?

12

> 2533274973373704;11:
> I mostly play in a quite environment, So I guess open headphones are for me. I just hope the sound leak doesn’t cause any problems. And don’t most soundcards already have amplifiers and DACs (example)?

Well, sound cards are just an amp and a DAC in a single enclosure. I’m just speaking generally because there are amps and DACs sold separately, but of course a combo unit is always an option.

> 2533274973373704;11:
> Is that software installed on the soundcard itself or the targeted platform (Xbox or PC)? Or doest depend on the headphone/soundcard?

It depends. For instance, the Xbox doesn’t allow external programs so any Xbox headset that claims to do surround would have to convert the signal to stereo by itself. On PC it’s always in the software the sound card installs on the computer.

> 2533274973373704;11:
> But most high quality soundcards are advertised as 5.1/7.1 capable. Does that mean it’s better to set the soundcard on Stereo mode? Considering that it’s up to the source audio.

A lot of sound cards that advertise themselves as 5.1 or 7.1 aren’t necessarily high quality. For instance, the one you linked as an example, I can’t really know how good it is, but despite its cost, I wouldn’t trust something from Turtle Beach. There’s really no good indication in what’s good, and only a whole lot of research helps to make good choices.

If you’re using headphones, it may be a good idea to use stereo mode. The surround effect doesn’t bring anything worthwile on the table.

> 2533274973373704;11:
> Sorry for taking too long to get this. I’ve spent the last few days doing research about the whole subject (Heck, I even installed Wikipedia’s app on my phone), as I don’t like wasting my money without knowing what I’m doing.
>
> Also, do you know some decent sites for headsets reviews?

It’s all good. I’m happy to help because I’ve made choices in the past that weren’t so good in retrospect. It’s important to make choices you’ll be happy with down the road. But there’s a lot stuff to audio.

But if you want to learn about something, a way I’ve noticed effective in the past is to find a forum related to the subject and just lurk and read the discussions, and try to find something related to what you’re looking for. Maybe even ask for advice. That’s how I learned about the semiconductor industry.

I suggest you check out head-fi.org. It’s a site that has everything about audio products such as reviews on headphones, amps, and DACs and of course forums for audio related discussion. It’s definitely a site that should help in finding the right audio setup. Of course it comes with its own set of caveats like any community that it might be biased and there are people who believe absurd things. If you just keep a critical mind, it’s still a place with lots of information on audio products.

13

> 2533274825830455;12:
> > 2533274973373704;11:
> > I mostly play in a quite environment, So I guess open headphones are for me. I just hope the sound leak doesn’t cause any problems. And don’t most soundcards already have amplifiers and DACs (example)?
>
>
>
> Well, sound cards are just an amp and a DAC in a single enclosure. I’m just speaking generally because there are amps and DACs sold separately, but of course a combo unit is always an option.
>
>
>
> > 2533274973373704;11:
> > Is that software installed on the soundcard itself or the targeted platform (Xbox or PC)? Or doest depend on the headphone/soundcard?
>
>
>
> It depends. For instance, the Xbox doesn’t allow external programs so any Xbox headset that claims to do surround would have to convert the signal to stereo by itself. On PC it’s always in the software the sound card installs on the computer.
>
>
>
> > 2533274973373704;11:
> > But most high quality soundcards are advertised as 5.1/7.1 capable. Does that mean it’s better to set the soundcard on Stereo mode? Considering that it’s up to the source audio.
>
>
>
> A lot of sound cards that advertise themselves as 5.1 or 7.1 aren’t necessarily high quality. For instance, the one you linked as an example, I can’t really know how good it is, but despite its cost, I wouldn’t trust something from Turtle Beach. There’s really no good indication in what’s good, and only a whole lot of research helps to make good choices.
>
> If you’re using headphones, it may be a good idea to use stereo mode. The surround effect doesn’t bring anything worthwile on the table.
>
>
>
> > 2533274973373704;11:
> > Sorry for taking too long to get this. I’ve spent the last few days doing research about the whole subject (Heck, I even installed Wikipedia’s app on my phone), as I don’t like wasting my money without knowing what I’m doing.
> >
> > Also, do you know some decent sites for headsets reviews?
>
>
> It’s all good. I’m happy to help because I’ve made choices in the past that weren’t so good in retrospect. It’s important to make choices you’ll be happy with down the road. But there’s a lot stuff to audio.
>
> But if you want to learn about something, a way I’ve noticed effective in the past is to find a forum related to the subject and just lurk and read the discussions, and try to find something related to what you’re looking for. Maybe even ask for advice. That’s how I learned about the semiconductor industry.
>
> I suggest you check out head-fi.org. It’s a site that has everything about audio products such as reviews on headphones, amps, and DACs and of course forums for audio related discussion. It’s definitely a site that should help in finding the right audio setup. Of course it comes with its own set of caveats like any community that it might be biased and there are people who believe absurd things. If you just keep a critical mind, it’s still a place with lots of information on audio products.

Thanks again. This site is really helpful and seems like a good start point for my sound equipment seeking journey, but I’ll eventually reach the point where I have to make a choice and buy something.