Why 343 changed Halo, and why i'm ok with it

Games Halo 5: Guardians
1

Before I get into this, just know that this is my opinion and I don’t care if you disagree and proceed to call me a noob that doesn’t know what he’s talking about. So please spare me all the hate.

343 wanted to make Halo new again. What this means is adding more gameplay features to make it more fun. Old Halo is exactly that: Old. Let me make this perfectly clear. This isn’t a debate over what makes Halo good or bad.

What do you think sounds more fun to the gamers of today? Jogging at a brisk pace and shooting at someone or sprinting and jumping at a ledge, clambering up to it and assassinating a distracted player? Again, I ask, what’s more fun? Jogging up to someone and shooting them with a shotgun or sprinting at them, sliding to close the gap and then shooting them in the face with said shotgun? A LOT of people would argue that it’s more fun or at least sounds more fun to have abilities to use.

Lets take a look at a pro play in old Halo. Both teams are duking it out with the only gun in the game (besides power weapons), the Battle Rifle, and 1 guy on their team has a Sniper Rifle. The guy with the Sniper Rifle ends up headshotting multiple players in a row, thus creating time for his team to run into the enemy base and plant the bomb, winning the match. I’m not saying this takes no skill and isn’t exciting whatsoever, but it’s more exciting (to most people) to see someone Thruster pack out of harms way and then use a Ground Pound to kill someone while having no shields.

Halo 5 was clearly designed to be an e-sport game that people want to watch as much as they want to play. The intensity is kicked up about 10 notches with the new Spartan abilities. Instead of jogging to cover when I’m getting shot at, I can sprint to get there faster. Even if the end result is the same and I still die, that moment was way more fun than before. The weapons have more oomph to their sound, the Smart Scope makes sense and makes the game more immersive, clambering onto ledges makes me feel like a super soldier. I’m not here to talk about whether it ruins Halo or not. I’ve played ever since Halo CE and I love Halo 5.

If Halo was a movie, do you think that the Master Chief would only be able to run, jump and shoot? You can argue that games are not movies and that just because Spartans can sprint, it doesn’t automatically mean we should be able to in the game. But I can also argue that it’s a good thing. What makes these new abilities exciting is that 343 is getting closer and closer to blurring the line between what’s realistic for gameplay and what you can only see in a cutscene. Instead of just watching a cutscene where Chief snaps a Brute’s neck and then sprints and tackles a group of grunts, I can actually do that now.

The game is fun. I wrecked people in the beta and got wrecked as well. There is a skill gap. The game is balanced because everyone starts out the same. These are all the reasons why 343 changed Halo.

2

i totally agree with you, watching pros play classic Halo is just BR v BR. now you watch them play Halo 5 and they have BR, DMR, Assault Rifle, SMG, Sniper, Magnum. It is just so much more interesting. I played a few matches with Walshy and Ninja, and they said also that they were liking the changes in roughly the same way, yes they said it wasnt perfect but it was more fun.

3

> 2533274802469862;2:
> i totally agree with you, watching pros play classic Halo is just BR v BR. now you watch them play Halo 5 and they have BR, DMR, Assault Rifle, SMG, Sniper, Magnum. It is just so much more interesting. I played a few matches with Walshy and Ninja, and they said also that they were liking the changes in roughly the same way, yes they said it wasnt perfect but it was more fun.

One of my favorite things about the beta was the variety of viable weapons :slight_smile:

4

I guess I don’t understand this, this isn’t a debate, yet during the entire article you keep asking us questions on what’s more entertaining. I am not a fan of sprint, I would much rather watch two teams who are better at controlling the power weapons and choke points on the maps with amazing shots (not bullet magnetism) play against each other than people sliding on the ground, using automatic weapons with ads that take zero skill, clambering instead of skill jumps, grenades that have a huge blast radius (they added those for new players to feel relevant in games by getting some garbage kills), and the actual players making the call outs not the game. I personally just miss the skill it took to be successful at the previous Halos compared to Halo 4 and Halo 5 (based of the beta). It’s fine that you like that stuff I won’t rip you but the numbers don’t lie, Halo 4 was a gigantic failure and I just hope Halo 5 doesn’t go down that same path.

5

> 2743710844422774;4:
> I guess I don’t understand this, this isn’t a debate, yet during the entire article you keep asking us questions on what’s more entertaining. I am not a fan of sprint, I would much rather watch two teams who are better at controlling the power weapons and choke points on the maps with amazing shots (not bullet magnetism) play against each other than people sliding on the ground, using automatic weapons with ads that take zero skill, clambering instead of skill jumps, grenades that have a huge blast radius (they added those for new players to feel relevant in games by getting some garbage kills), and the actual players making the call outs not the game. I personally just miss the skill it took to be successful at the previous Halos compared to Halo 4 and Halo 5 (based of the beta). It’s fine that you like that stuff I won’t rip you but the numbers don’t lie, Halo 4 was a gigantic failure and I just hope Halo 5 doesn’t go down that same path.

It’s not a debate whether old Halo is better than new Halo. Just pointing out why the new features were added and why I believe the new changes make the game more fun.

6

> 2533274833600810;1:
> What do you think sounds more fun to the gamers of today? Jogging at a brisk pace and shooting at someone or sprinting and jumping at a ledge, clambering up to it and assassinating a distracted player? Again, I ask, what’s more fun? Jogging up to someone and shooting them with a shotgun or sprinting at them, sliding to close the gap and then shooting them in the face with said shotgun? A LOT of people would argue that it’s more fun or at least sounds more fun to have abilities to use.

Let’s make these questions less loaded. Which sounds more fun: running and shooting at someone, or sprinting, slowing down and then shooting someone? Or: running to someone and shooting them with a shotgun, or sprinting to someone, and then shooting them with a shotgun?

You see, the problem with how posed the question is that for the classic mechanics, you gave a very mundane encounter, while for the novel mechanics you came up with a much more complex encounter. When you actually compare equivalent encounters, as I did with my modified questions, you find that the novel mechanics don’t really sound awfully lot more exciting than the traditional mechanics.

The truth is, the simple mechanics can offer at least as interesting gameplay as all these extra abilities. The problem is that simple mechanics are more difficult to market because they’re not flashy; understanding them takes effort. Flashy mechanics like jetpacks, sliding, and vaulting are easier to sell because they offer more instant gratification to less experienced players.

7

> 2533274825830455;6:
> > 2533274833600810;1:
> > What do you think sounds more fun to the gamers of today? Jogging at a brisk pace and shooting at someone or sprinting and jumping at a ledge, clambering up to it and assassinating a distracted player? Again, I ask, what’s more fun? Jogging up to someone and shooting them with a shotgun or sprinting at them, sliding to close the gap and then shooting them in the face with said shotgun? A LOT of people would argue that it’s more fun or at least sounds more fun to have abilities to use.
>
>
> Let’s make these questions less loaded. Which sounds more fun: running and shooting at someone, or sprinting, slowing down and then shooting someone? Or: running to someone and shooting them with a shotgun, or sprinting to someone, and then shooting them with a shotgun?
>
> You see, the problem with how posed the question is that for the classic mechanics, you gave a very mundane encounter, while for the novel mechanics you came up with a much more complex encounter. When you actually compare equivalent encounters, as I did with my modified questions, you find that the novel mechanics don’t really sound awfully lot more exciting than the traditional mechanics.
>
> The truth is, the simple mechanics can offer at least as interesting gameplay as all these extra abilities. The problem is that simple mechanics are more difficult to market because they’re not flashy; understanding them takes effort. Flashy mechanics like jetpacks, sliding, and vaulting are easier to sell because they offer more instant gratification to less experienced players.

I do think that the same encounters are more exciting with the new mechanics though. BR strafe battles have more depth with the addition of Thruster, getting into close range with 1-shot kill weapons is more of a rush, clambering up a ledge to get an assassination feels badass.

Of course it isn’t all that different from simply making a crouch jump to higher places, etc. But I feel like it ramps up all these moments and makes them more flashy and fun. There’s nothing wrong with old Halo and it’s simple mechanics. There is still depth to Halo 5, I don’t believe it’s all flashy stuff with no substance.

8

> 2533274833600810;1:
> What makes these new abilities exciting is that 343 is getting closer and closer to blurring the line between what’s realistic for gameplay and what you can only see in a cutscene. Instead of just watching a cutscene where Chief snaps a Brute’s neck and then sprints and tackles a group of grunts, I can actually do that now.

This is what I was thinking, too. I remember reading about all of the amazing things that Spartans can do in the Halo novels, and when I played through H2A I’d often think “I should be able to do a lot more than just jogging and shooting.”

9

I think there is a huge disconnect between casuals, competitives, and people fascinated by the Canon. Everyone leans heavily towards one if these areas, and you can’t please them all. I am rooted in the Canon and a reasonably talented casual player, and thusly I am loving H5Gs direction.

10

i agree

11

What’s more fun.

Moving at top speed at all times. Jumping around all over objects and the world while shooting and moving in all directions.

Or

Moving at top speed only while moving forwards. Then switching to shooting mode where you can no longer move fast enough to effectively traverse the map, strafe, or really do anything other than fire weapons and melee.

Hmm

12

> 2533274833600810;7:
> > 2533274825830455;6:
> > > 2533274833600810;1:
> > > What do you think sounds more fun to the gamers of today? Jogging at a brisk pace and shooting at someone or sprinting and jumping at a ledge, clambering up to it and assassinating a distracted player? Again, I ask, what’s more fun? Jogging up to someone and shooting them with a shotgun or sprinting at them, sliding to close the gap and then shooting them in the face with said shotgun? A LOT of people would argue that it’s more fun or at least sounds more fun to have abilities to use.
> >
> >
> >
> > Let’s make these questions less loaded. Which sounds more fun: running and shooting at someone, or sprinting, slowing down and then shooting someone? Or: running to someone and shooting them with a shotgun, or sprinting to someone, and then shooting them with a shotgun?
> >
> > You see, the problem with how posed the question is that for the classic mechanics, you gave a very mundane encounter, while for the novel mechanics you came up with a much more complex encounter. When you actually compare equivalent encounters, as I did with my modified questions, you find that the novel mechanics don’t really sound awfully lot more exciting than the traditional mechanics.
> >
> > The truth is, the simple mechanics can offer at least as interesting gameplay as all these extra abilities. The problem is that simple mechanics are more difficult to market because they’re not flashy; understanding them takes effort. Flashy mechanics like jetpacks, sliding, and vaulting are easier to sell because they offer more instant gratification to less experienced players.
>
>
> I do think that the same encounters are more exciting with the new mechanics though. BR strafe battles have more depth with the addition of Thruster, getting into close range with 1-shot kill weapons is more of a rush, clambering up a ledge to get an assassination feels badass.

That could be true. If you could shoot while thrusting. As it stands now though thruster’s most effective use is defensive in nature because you can’t shoot while using it. Which inherently makes the game less exciting to play and watch.

13

> 2535440955887524;11:
> What’s more fun.
>
> Moving at top speed at all times. Jumping around all over objects and the world while shooting and moving in all directions.
>
> Or
>
> Moving at top speed only while moving forwards. Then switching to shooting mode where you can no longer move fast enough to effectively traverse the map, strafe, or really do anything other than fire weapons and melee.
>
> Hmm

That was the most biast question lmao. You filled your paragraph with negative.

truth is chaining together a sprint jump mid air trust to a far ledge feels better than any couch jump ever did. In the fun factor way(not arguing “skill”). They increased base speed and strafe speed so Dont know how it feels right now but it was too slow in the beta.

strafing and well timed thrusting forcing someons to miss a 4shot will feel amazing if strafe speed is right

14

> 2533274835305187;13:
> > 2535440955887524;11:
> > What’s more fun.
> >
> > Moving at top speed at all times. Jumping around all over objects and the world while shooting and moving in all directions.
> >
> > Or
> >
> > Moving at top speed only while moving forwards. Then switching to shooting mode where you can no longer move fast enough to effectively traverse the map, strafe, or really do anything other than fire weapons and melee.
> >
> > Hmm
>
>
> That was the most biast question lmao. You filled your paragraph with negative.
>
> truth is chaining together a sprint jump mid air trust to a far ledge feels better than any couch jump ever did. In the fun factor way(not arguing “skill”). They increase base speed and strafe speed so we have to feel of how it works now but it was too slow in the beta.
>
> strafind and well times thrusting forcing someons to miss a 4shot we feel amazing if strafe speed is right

Don’t argue with him, I’m still having a debate with him on a different post because he thinks Midship is the best map in Halo and should be remade to death.

Also, look at his service record.

He doesn’t have one for any Halo game.

15

> 2533274835305187;13:
> > 2535440955887524;11:
> > What’s more fun.
> >
> > Moving at top speed at all times. Jumping around all over objects and the world while shooting and moving in all directions.
> >
> > Or
> >
> > Moving at top speed only while moving forwards. Then switching to shooting mode where you can no longer move fast enough to effectively traverse the map, strafe, or really do anything other than fire weapons and melee.
> >
> > Hmm
>
>
> That was the most biast question lmao. You filled your paragraph with negative.
>
> truth is chaining together a sprint jump mid air trust to a far ledge feels better than any couch jump ever did. In the fun factor way(not arguing “skill”). They increased base speed and strafe speed so Dont know how it feels right now but it was too slow in the beta.
>
> strafing and well timed thrusting forcing someons to miss a 4shot will feel amazing if strafe speed is right

Except for the fact that without sprint you could, you know, shoot people while performing those jumps. Which is fairly important considering this is a first person SHOOTER lol.

Only an idiot would use thrust for anything but getting away. When you thrust mid battle you lower your opponent’s chance of hitting you but you also lower your chance to hit him to 0%.

16

> 2533274915643658;14:
> > 2533274835305187;13:
> > > 2535440955887524;11:
> > > What’s more fun.
> > >
> > > Moving at top speed at all times. Jumping around all over objects and the world while shooting and moving in all directions.
> > >
> > > Or
> > >
> > > Moving at top speed only while moving forwards. Then switching to shooting mode where you can no longer move fast enough to effectively traverse the map, strafe, or really do anything other than fire weapons and melee.
> > >
> > > Hmm
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > That was the most biast question lmao. You filled your paragraph with negative.
> >
> > truth is chaining together a sprint jump mid air trust to a far ledge feels better than any couch jump ever did. In the fun factor way(not arguing “skill”). They increase base speed and strafe speed so we have to feel of how it works now but it was too slow in the beta.
> >
> > strafind and well times thrusting forcing someons to miss a 4shot we feel amazing if strafe speed is right
>
>
>
> Don’t argue with him, I’m still having a debate with him on a different post because he thinks Midship is the best map in Halo and should be remade to death.
>
> Also, look at his service record.
> He doesn’t have one for any Halo game.

Yes, because thinking midship should be remade in H2A is definitely grounds for alienation.

You are also allowed to not link your stats to your profile if you want to.

You are reported sir.

17

> 2535440955887524;12:
> > 2533274833600810;7:
> > > 2533274825830455;6:
> > > > 2533274833600810;1:
> > > > What do you think sounds more fun to the gamers of today? Jogging at a brisk pace and shooting at someone or sprinting and jumping at a ledge, clambering up to it and assassinating a distracted player? Again, I ask, what’s more fun? Jogging up to someone and shooting them with a shotgun or sprinting at them, sliding to close the gap and then shooting them in the face with said shotgun? A LOT of people would argue that it’s more fun or at least sounds more fun to have abilities to use.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Let’s make these questions less loaded. Which sounds more fun: running and shooting at someone, or sprinting, slowing down and then shooting someone? Or: running to someone and shooting them with a shotgun, or sprinting to someone, and then shooting them with a shotgun?
> > >
> > > You see, the problem with how posed the question is that for the classic mechanics, you gave a very mundane encounter, while for the novel mechanics you came up with a much more complex encounter. When you actually compare equivalent encounters, as I did with my modified questions, you find that the novel mechanics don’t really sound awfully lot more exciting than the traditional mechanics.
> > >
> > > The truth is, the simple mechanics can offer at least as interesting gameplay as all these extra abilities. The problem is that simple mechanics are more difficult to market because they’re not flashy; understanding them takes effort. Flashy mechanics like jetpacks, sliding, and vaulting are easier to sell because they offer more instant gratification to less experienced players.
> >
> >
> >
> > I do think that the same encounters are more exciting with the new mechanics though. BR strafe battles have more depth with the addition of Thruster, getting into close range with 1-shot kill weapons is more of a rush, clambering up a ledge to get an assassination feels badass.
>
>
> That could be true. If you could shoot while thrusting. As it stands now though thruster’s most effective use is defensive in nature because you can’t shoot while using it. Which inherently makes the game less exciting to play and watch.

That’s not true. As I read in a blog on Waypoint by a developer, a player on a match was able to kill the developer by jumping into the air, thrusting backward over the developer, land and assassinate the developer. If that is not offensive gameplay, then I don’t know what is.

This is the link:https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/community/blog-posts/how-fans-helped-shape-the-multiplayer-of-halo-5-guardians. Go to the paragraph where they talk about Spartan abilities.

18

> 2535440955887524;16:
> > 2533274915643658;14:
> > > 2533274835305187;13:
> > > > 2535440955887524;11:
> > > > What’s more fun.
> > > >
> > > > Moving at top speed at all times. Jumping around all over objects and the world while shooting and moving in all directions.
> > > >
> > > > Or
> > > >
> > > > Moving at top speed only while moving forwards. Then switching to shooting mode where you can no longer move fast enough to effectively traverse the map, strafe, or really do anything other than fire weapons and melee.
> > > >
> > > > Hmm
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > That was the most biast question lmao. You filled your paragraph with negative.
> > >
> > > truth is chaining together a sprint jump mid air trust to a far ledge feels better than any couch jump ever did. In the fun factor way(not arguing “skill”). They increase base speed and strafe speed so we have to feel of how it works now but it was too slow in the beta.
> > >
> > > strafind and well times thrusting forcing someons to miss a 4shot we feel amazing if strafe speed is right
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Don’t argue with him, I’m still having a debate with him on a different post because he thinks Midship is the best map in Halo and should be remade to death.
> >
> > Also, look at his service record.
> > He doesn’t have one for any Halo game.
>
>
> Yes, because thinking midship should be remade in H2A is definitely grounds for alienation.
>
> You are also allowed to not link your stats to your profile if you want to.
>
> You are reported sir.

Really? You’re gonna report me? You’re on -Yoink-.

19

> 2533274915643658;17:
> > 2535440955887524;12:
> > > 2533274833600810;7:
> > > > 2533274825830455;6:
> > > > > 2533274833600810;1:
> > > > > What do you think sounds more fun to the gamers of today? Jogging at a brisk pace and shooting at someone or sprinting and jumping at a ledge, clambering up to it and assassinating a distracted player? Again, I ask, what’s more fun? Jogging up to someone and shooting them with a shotgun or sprinting at them, sliding to close the gap and then shooting them in the face with said shotgun? A LOT of people would argue that it’s more fun or at least sounds more fun to have abilities to use.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Let’s make these questions less loaded. Which sounds more fun: running and shooting at someone, or sprinting, slowing down and then shooting someone? Or: running to someone and shooting them with a shotgun, or sprinting to someone, and then shooting them with a shotgun?
> > > >
> > > > You see, the problem with how posed the question is that for the classic mechanics, you gave a very mundane encounter, while for the novel mechanics you came up with a much more complex encounter. When you actually compare equivalent encounters, as I did with my modified questions, you find that the novel mechanics don’t really sound awfully lot more exciting than the traditional mechanics.
> > > >
> > > > The truth is, the simple mechanics can offer at least as interesting gameplay as all these extra abilities. The problem is that simple mechanics are more difficult to market because they’re not flashy; understanding them takes effort. Flashy mechanics like jetpacks, sliding, and vaulting are easier to sell because they offer more instant gratification to less experienced players.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > I do think that the same encounters are more exciting with the new mechanics though. BR strafe battles have more depth with the addition of Thruster, getting into close range with 1-shot kill weapons is more of a rush, clambering up a ledge to get an assassination feels badass.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > That could be true. If you could shoot while thrusting. As it stands now though thruster’s most effective use is defensive in nature because you can’t shoot while using it. Which inherently makes the game less exciting to play and watch.
>
>
>
> That’s not true. As I read in a blog on Waypoint by a developer, a player on a match was able to kill the developer by jumping into the air, thrusting backward over the developer, land and assassinate the developer. If that is not offensive gameplay, then I don’t know what is.
>
> This is the link:https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/community/blog-posts/how-fans-helped-shape-the-multiplayer-of-halo-5-guardians. Go to the paragraph where they talk about Spartan abilities.

Yes. Because that is totally something that is going to happen all the time.

Can you think of a reason you shouldn’t be able to shoot whilst thrusting?

20

> 2533274915643658;18:
> > 2535440955887524;16:
> > > 2533274915643658;14:
> > > > 2533274835305187;13:
> > > > > 2535440955887524;11:
> > > > > What’s more fun.
> > > > >
> > > > > Moving at top speed at all times. Jumping around all over objects and the world while shooting and moving in all directions.
> > > > >
> > > > > Or
> > > > >
> > > > > Moving at top speed only while moving forwards. Then switching to shooting mode where you can no longer move fast enough to effectively traverse the map, strafe, or really do anything other than fire weapons and melee.
> > > > >
> > > > > Hmm
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > That was the most biast question lmao. You filled your paragraph with negative.
> > > >
> > > > truth is chaining together a sprint jump mid air trust to a far ledge feels better than any couch jump ever did. In the fun factor way(not arguing “skill”). They increase base speed and strafe speed so we have to feel of how it works now but it was too slow in the beta.
> > > >
> > > > strafind and well times thrusting forcing someons to miss a 4shot we feel amazing if strafe speed is right
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Don’t argue with him, I’m still having a debate with him on a different post because he thinks Midship is the best map in Halo and should be remade to death.
> > >
> > > Also, look at his service record.
> > > He doesn’t have one for any Halo game.
> >
> >
> >
> > Yes, because thinking midship should be remade in H2A is definitely grounds for alienation.
> >
> > You are also allowed to not link your stats to your profile if you want to.
> >
> > You are reported sir.
>
>
> Really? You’re gonna report me? You’re on -Yoink-.

Um, ya. What you’re doing in this thread is trolling.