> 2533274920070188;14:
> Still, 343 should be able to find out something is wrong when people lose or do not finish exactly 10 games in a row and the start winning all of a sudden.
> <snip>
Just a friendly heads-up that calling out individuals isn’t allowed on Waypoint, so you should remove the link if you want your post to remain.
> 2533274862181038;15:
> > 2533274920070188;14:
> > > 2533274826414432;4:
> > > > 2533274920070188;1:
> > > > I know where and how to report on Xbox, but I have no clue where to report them tot 343. Anyone has any idea?
> > >
> > > Smurfs accounts are not technically a violation of any rule as far as I know of, so I don’t think there is anywhere to report them. I cannot stand them and do not understand why any player who thinks they are good feel they need to create a new account to play against lesser competition. If someone is posting in forums with an alternate account that is not used for playing though there is a way to report the multiple accounts and get them banned from the forums.
> >
> > Still, 343 should be able to find out something is wrong when people lose or do not finish exactly 10 games in a row and the start winning all of a sudden.
> >
> > Here a dude I played against: CENSORED. He is ranked a bronze player, but somehow manages to get 25 kills and 3 deaths in a game against 4 gold players.
> >
> > Check his game stats. Loses or DNF 10 games in a row for Doubles, Slayer and HaloWC preview. After that he starts winning EVERYTHING. I send him a message asking why he needs to ruin other peoples games. All he sends me back is heart icons. What a -Yoink-.
> >
> > Anyway, the dude starts out as a bronze player and is now having dozens and dozens of easy games, ruining other peoples experience. He’s now silver in all 3 categories, but is probably a diamond or higher player.
> >
> > Easy solution: if someone wins or DNF 10 games in a row for a certain gamemode and starts winning, lets say 3 games in a row right after that, 343 should be able to block that profile right away instead of letting this person work his way up through countless of matches against bronze, silver, gold etc. players.
>
> Just a friendly heads-up that calling out individuals isn’t allowed on Waypoint, so you should remove the link if you want your post to remain.
Thanks. I can’t edit your post, so the link is still there. Can you edit your post? 
> 2533274920070188;16:
> Thanks. I can’t edit your post, so the link is still there. Can you edit your post?
Good call.
Additionally, try sending a private message to ZaedynFel, who is in charge of matchmaking, etc. He’s busy but tries to be helpful.
At this point, smurfs are the least of our problems in gaming.
> 2535427113648813;18:
> At this point, smurfs are the least of our problems in gaming.
I wouldn’t say the least… :S
To answer your question. 343 won’t do anything. The only people who can or will are Microsoft. You’ll have to report them via. Xbox Live. I will also note that the only violation of rules that can be accounted for, is the constant creation of new accounts to abuse the free xbox live gold. Another potential violation is that new accounts for good players are generally created by modders or trolls because they’ve already been banned. But without evidence (even with) the MS termination unit are pretty useless.
> 2533275018127719;6:
> > 2533274826414432;4:
> > > 2533274920070188;1:
> > > I know where and how to report on Xbox, but I have no clue where to report them tot 343. Anyone has any idea?
> >
> > Smurfs accounts are not technically a violation of any rule as far as I know of, so I don’t think there is anywhere to report them. I cannot stand them and do not understand why any player who thinks they are good feel they need to create a new account to play against lesser competition. If someone is posting in forums with an alternate account that is not used for playing though there is a way to report the multiple accounts and get them banned from the forums.
>
> While it’s true that you have your nub stompers, people create smurfs to,
> -Find matches easier. On main accounts it takes a good amount of time to find matches, and that’s if you do.
> -Play with their lesser skilled friends
It’s mostly the 1st one. The Hidden MMR changes pretty much made searching impossible for higher ranked players.
> 2533274863544717;10:
> How do you differentiate the two? There really is now way. Even if it’s not against the rules per se it is an unsporting thing to do, and that is one of the reportable things on Xbox.
> I think the biggest thing that 343 can/will do right now is just to make sure that the system ranks them in the right category within a few games. But then they just make another one so the cycle just continues.
> I usually report and report every one that I find that I believe to be a Smurf. Check their profile low gamerscore, games played, and number of friends. I have run into some that play really well with low SR’s, and immediately thought it was a Smurf. Then after looking at their profile the high gamerscore showed I was wrong. I also try to determine who they are playing with, because a lot of the time they are playing with legit friends. I report them all with a note attached. If it is important to you this is what needs to be done to draw attention to the problem.
> The worst example of team Smurfs I have come across was a team of three who all deliberately were dying throughout the game. After looking at their history it was obvious they were doing this every so often to keep their MMR and CSR low. Apparently this is a known issue and something that they are working on to fix. I did post about this particular group in the matchmaking thread. It was so frustrating since I was matched with them a couple of times.
Well it’s frustrating as hell on our end that it takes 5+ minutes to find a match, but you don’t see us complaining as much about it, now do you?
Most of us moved on to different games. Stuff like this is what killed H5 to begin with.
“I usually report and report every one that I find that I believe to be a Smurf.”
The “everyone who’s new and better than me is a smurf” stigma is completely ridiculous. You can’t just assume that everyone who’s good is a smurf based on such factors. What if they just had a good game, but just so happened to be new to halo 5?
Just because Prec says it doesn’t mean it’s accurate.
" I also try to determine who they are playing with, because a lot of the time they are playing with legit friends. I report them all with a note attached. If it is important to you this is what needs to be done to draw attention to the problem."
What the hell… so I can’t create a smurf account to play with friends of lesser skill for fun? Christ, you are so god dam self centered about your H5 experience that it’s unbelievable.
“If it’s important” yeah right. More like “It fits my agenda of HCS so please report people I disagree with. Halo 5 should be 100% competitive”
“The worst example of team Smurfs I have come across was a team of three who all deliberately were dying throughout the game. After looking at their history it was obvious they were doing this every so often to keep their MMR and CSR low. Apparently this is a known issue and something that they are working on to fix. I did post about this particular group in the matchmaking thread. It was so frustrating since I was matched with them a couple of times.”
While I don’t agree with them doing this, i’m defending it, but with good reason. MMR should have never been implemented in the first place. It’s a bad concept of matchmaking that kills games and divides the population, as proven by Advanced Warfare. Removing MMR would stop this problem completely, as you would no longer benefit from it.
I have faced too much smurf accounts, that i refuse to believe they would stop.
The multiple accounts has to stop
> 2535442303795050;21:
> > 2533275018127719;6:
> > > 2533274826414432;4:
> > > > 2533274920070188;1:
> > > > I know where and how to report on Xbox, but I have no clue where to report them tot 343. Anyone has any idea?
>
>
>
> > 2533274863544717;10:
> >
>
> What the hell… so I can’t create a smurf account to play with friends of lesser skill for fun? Christ, you are so god dam self centered about your H5 experience that it’s unbelievable.
And you aren’t? C’mon. Everyone is selfish about their video game experience because they only experience it from their perspective. You can’t play the altruist card and then later defend smurfing or complain about the MMR because it makes it harder for the upper tier to find games quickly. The reasons you hate MMR is because you’re in that upper tier and have a smaller percentage of people to match within an acceptable skill range. But removing MMR would negatively impact far more than it would benefit. You and other high skilled players would be able to find matches easier, but average and below-average players would suffer from increased unbalanced games and blowouts. It would solve your problem but introduce more for the majority. Sounds self-centered, doesn’t it?
> 2533274817408735;23:
> > 2535442303795050;21:
> > > 2533275018127719;6:
> > > > 2533274826414432;4:
> > > > > 2533274920070188;1:
> > > > > I know where and how to report on Xbox, but I have no clue where to report them tot 343. Anyone has any idea?
> >
> >
> >
> > > 2533274863544717;10:
> > >
> >
> > What the hell… so I can’t create a smurf account to play with friends of lesser skill for fun? Christ, you are so god dam self centered about your H5 experience that it’s unbelievable.
>
> And you aren’t? C’mon. Everyone is selfish about their video game experience because they only experience it from their perspective. You can’t play the altruist card and then later defend smurfing or complain about the MMR because it makes it harder for the upper tier to find games quickly. The reasons you hate MMR is because you’re in that upper tier and have a smaller percentage of people to match within an acceptable skill range. But removing MMR would negatively impact far more than it would benefit. You and other high skilled players would be able to find matches easier, but average and below-average players would suffer from increased unbalanced games and blowouts. It would solve your problem but introduce more for the majority. Sounds self-centered, doesn’t it?
__“And you aren’t? C’mon. Everyone is selfish about their video game experience because they only experience it from their perspective. You can’t play the altruist card and then later defend smurfing or complain about the MMR because it makes it harder for the upper tier to find games quickly.”__Except when the game radically changes shape, I can change my opinion, similar to how I did with the opinion of the banshee’s balance. Back then MMR didn’t make much of an impact for smurfs, which meant that people who were doing it were most likely doing it with malicious intent in ranked. Now with these MMR changes, some players can’t even play together or find anyone without using smurfs. So essentially I would be punished for playing with friends of similar skill level by not being able to find a match, simply because nobody of my skill level is in the party on the opposite team.
You can’t say it’s me being selfish when it’s just people wanting to be able to play the dam game in the first place. That’s why smurfs are needed now more than ever.
__"The reasons you hate MMR is because you’re in that upper tier and have a smaller percentage of people to match within an acceptable skill range. "__And as I said, this ties into the problem of being able to find a match. Why do we need MMR on everything, including casual playlists, when all it does is just punish people who are better at the game compared to the average Joe? Are we supposed to INTENTIONALLY suck at the game to be able to find a match?
I can understand ranked, but not casual. Definitely isn’t needed for the social modes.
"But removing MMR would negatively impact far more than it would benefit. You and other high skilled players would be able to find matches easier, but average and below-average players would suffer from increased unbalanced games and blowouts."Um… no.That statement just simply isn’t true… The game is perfectly capable of matching players of similar skill levels. You could easily match 2 higher skilled players together with 10 lesser skilled players in WZ on both teams. Same with social, you could easily match 5 ok players with 1 high skilled player and 4 newbies. If it can match 6 noobs/lesser skilled players (whatever you prefer to call them) and 6 semi-decent WZ players against each other on both teams, then there shouldn’t be a problem with releasing the tight grip on MMR search restrictions.
**“It would solve your problem but introduce more for the majority. Sounds self-centered, doesn’t it?”**So basically your argument is “The more dedicated halo fans who grinded in the game, got better over time, and invested playtime into this game should be punished for playing the game by having longer search times (and in some cases, not being able to match at all) and less of an ability to play with friends?”
And you’re saying we, the hardcore veterans and people who kept investing time into this game, are the “self centered players” because we just want to be able to play the game?
I honestly hope that you’re joking. I was expecting a better rebuttal when I saw the notification, only to be disappointed by something that’s just as comparable to EA’s PR stunt on reddit.
> 2535442303795050;24:
> > 2533274817408735;23:
> > > 2535442303795050;21:
> > > > 2533275018127719;6:
> > > > > 2533274826414432;4:
> > > > > > 2533274920070188;1:
> > > > > > I know where and how to report on Xbox, but I have no clue where to report them tot 343. Anyone has any idea?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > > 2533274863544717;10:
> > > >
>
> “And you aren’t? C’mon. Everyone is selfish about their video game experience because they only experience it from their perspective. You can’t play the altruist card and then later defend smurfing or complain about the MMR because it makes it harder for the upper tier to find games quickly.”
>
> Except when the game radically changes shape, I can. Back then MMR didn’t make much of an impact for smurfs, which meant that people who were doing it were most likely doing it with malicious intent in ranked. Now with these MMR changes, some players can’t even play together or find anyone without using smurfs. So essentially I would be punished for playing with friends of similar skill level by not being able to find a match, simply because nobody of my skill level is in the party on the opposite team.
>
> You can’t say it’s me being selfish when it’s just people wanting to be able to play the dam game in the first place. That’s why smurfs are needed now more than ever.
>
> "The reasons you hate MMR is because you’re in that upper tier and have a smaller percentage of people to match within an acceptable skill range. "
>
> And as I said, this ties into the problem of being able to find a match. Why do we need MMR on everything, including casual playlists, when all it does is just punish people who are better at the game compared to the average Joe? Are we supposed to INTENTIONALLY suck at the game to be able to find a match?
>
> I can understand ranked, but not casual. Definitely isn’t needed for the social modes.
>
> “But removing MMR would negatively impact far more than it would benefit. You and other high skilled players would be able to find matches easier, but average and below-average players would suffer from increased unbalanced games and blowouts.”
>
> Um… no.That statement just simply isn’t true… The game is perfectly capable of matching players of similar skill levels. You could easily match 2 higher skilled players together with 10 lesser skilled players in WZ on both teams. Same with social, you could easily match 5 ok players with 1 high skilled player and 4 newbies. If it can match 6 noobs and 6 semi-decent WZ players against each other on both teams, then there shouldn’t be a problem with releasing the tight grip on MMR search restrictions.
>
> “It would solve your problem but introduce more for the majority. Sounds self-centered, doesn’t it?”
>
> So basically your argument is “The more dedicated halo fans who grinded in the game, got better over time, and invested playtime into this game should be punished for playing the game by having longer search times (and in some cases, not being able to match at all) and less of an ability to play with friends?”
>
> And you’re saying we, the hardcore veterans and people who kept investing time into this game, are the “self centered players” because we just want to be able to play the dam game?
>
> I honestly hope that you’re joking. I was expecting a better rebuttal when I saw the notification, only to be disappointed by something that’s just as comparable to EA’s PR stunt on reddit.
The reason matchmaking was good early on in Halo 5 was due to population. That’s just how matchmaking works in general. Now, 2 years after Halo 5’s launch, the population is undoubtedly smaller than back then, which means in general matchmaking will be worse than it was in the beginning. But here’s the thing that you seem to misunderstand about the tweaks to Halo 5’s MM: the majority of the changes have been to make matchmaking less strict, not more strict. The matchmaking team knows that as a game ages it population dwindles, and they adjust matchmaking settings accordingly. Sometimes they may go to far and back it up a little, but most of the matchmaking changes to Halo 5 (especially recently) have been opening up matchmaking for the purpose of helping people find games faster, especially those at the high end of the skill curve. Of course, they still have to find the right balance: too much and it results in unbalanced matches being too prevalent, while too little won’t have the desired effect. Also, not everyone has the same definition of what a “social” playlist should be as you. “Social” does not mean no skill-based matchmaking. Players in any playlist expect close matches because close matches are what most people consider fun; the benefit of the social playlists is not having to worry about public ranks or stats while you play. Nobody enjoys getting totally dumped on, and many players don’t enjoy dumping on others all that much. Social modes already have looser matchmaking compared to most ranked lists, but turning off skill-based matchmaking completely is not the direction 343i wants to go in, and I agree with that.
You are taking skill-based matchmaking personally, like it was specifically designed to ruin the fun of you and people like you of high skill. That’s not the case. It’s a tried-and-true system that’s been in use since Halo 2. It’s not perfect and has some disadvantages that really show when populations dwindle, but it’s generally a consistent system. 343i isn’t trying to keep you from finding games; quite the contrary, that’s why they continue to collect data and make changes, to try and find the happiest medium they can.
So, the next thing you talk about… that’s exactly what MMR is and what it tries to do. The reason the game knows to compensate team make up to maximize fairness is based on MMR. It already does things like find less-skilled players to put on a team of a high-skilled player when the enemy team is all average-skilled players. If you want specifics of just how strict or loose certain playlists are in terms of MMR, you should ask Josh Menke here as he can answer better than I. Ultimately, though, the answer comes down to finding the right balance of skill gap widening.
My argument was to help you see the irony of calling someone else selfish in what they want for Halo 5 when you yourself have your own selfish desires. I’m not saying wanting the game to work for you is wrong; it’s how everyone feels. I’m not saying that veterans/dedicated players/high skilled players/whatever you want to call them matter less than other players, but I’m also not saying they matter more. All players deserve to have a fun experience. Trouble is, there really isn’t a system that can guarantee that 100% of players have a 100% perfect time when playing. So, the best we can realistically hope for is a system that makes it so that most players have a good time playing. Yes, that means some players have a worse experience, but it’s a side effect. It’s not a directed attack. As time goes on and technology gets better and knowledge is gained, the systems will get better and further reduce the numbers of players who are affected by the side effects.
If my response disappoints you, then I can only surmise that you are disappointed with reality itself. Because that’s where I base my response: in realism. Turning off MMR is not the answer that solves the problem. You say it won’t cause additional problems but that’s simply not true; you’re looking at it from the standpoint of someone who only benefits from turning off MMR. Fact is, most players want fair games, and so that’s the priority 343i is going with for matchmaking.
> 2533274826414432;4:
> > 2533274920070188;1:
> > I know where and how to report on Xbox, but I have no clue where to report them tot 343. Anyone has any idea?
>
> Smurfs accounts are not technically a violation of any rule as far as I know of, so I don’t think there is anywhere to report them. I cannot stand them and do not understand why any player who thinks they are good feel they need to create a new account to play against lesser competition. If someone is posting in forums with an alternate account that is not used for playing though there is a way to report the multiple accounts and get them banned from the forums.
smurf account. have faster search time that why they smurf because
they dont to waste half their time searching for a match
> 2535443548700992;26:
> > 2533274826414432;4:
> > > 2533274920070188;1:
> > > I know where and how to report on Xbox, but I have no clue where to report them tot 343. Anyone has any idea?
> >
> > Smurfs accounts are not technically a violation of any rule as far as I know of, so I don’t think there is anywhere to report them. I cannot stand them and do not understand why any player who thinks they are good feel they need to create a new account to play against lesser competition. If someone is posting in forums with an alternate account that is not used for playing though there is a way to report the multiple accounts and get them banned from the forums.
>
> smurf account. have faster search time that why they smurf because
> they dont to waste half their time searching for a match
Yes that is the reason some players create smurf accounts, typically when they are top tier players who cannot find a match. When medium - medium high gold-platinum players do it their reasons are typically more because they do not like playing against others that are at their skill level and would rather beat up on players of a lower level to make them feel better about themselves.
> 2533274817408735;25:
> the benefit of the social playlists is not having to worry about public ranks or stats while you play.
That’s where 343 messed up. They tied ranked and social stats together and plastered your KDA from it in big font on the main stats screen. Similar with Warzone and your win/loss ratio. There are people who care about that and it can influence how they play.
> 2727626560040591;28:
> > 2533274817408735;25:
> > the benefit of the social playlists is not having to worry about public ranks or stats while you play.
>
> That’s where 343 messed up. They tied ranked and social stats together and plastered your KDA from it in big font on the main stats screen. Similar with Warzone and your win/loss ratio. There are people who care about that and it can influence how they play.
I’m inclined to agree. I think the “social” mentality would be better promoted if social stats were separately tracked. As you said, both ranked and social play contribute to the global K/D, which is the first stat one tends to see when looking up players. Of course, anyone can dig deeper to see what contributed to those stats, but it tends to be that people mostly care about what is immediately obvious. Hopefully the next installment sees separate stat tracking for ranked and social.
Ok so majority of the arguments I’m seeing here are against smurfing. But I can assure you some people see a low SR person and say “they’re playing on a smurf to feel good about themselves”. In reality though, there’s more to it. Playing on high ranked account, one, has really long search times, and second, you mostly need a team to win. So what if my friends aren’t online but I wanna play H5, but dont want to ruin my rank on my main? I could create an ALT ACCOUNT and try my best on that while soloing. Alt accounts and smurfs are completely different things. Smurfs PURPOSELY rank themselves low, while alt’s try their best. For example, my alt account, is in fact, having a higher overall rank than my main. I play on that account when I wanna practice solo. Thats it. Not playing against low ranks.
> 2535438193399052;30:
> Ok so majority of the arguments I’m seeing here are against smurfing. But I can assure you some people see a low SR person and say “they’re playing on a smurf to feel good about themselves”. In reality though, there’s more to it. Playing on high ranked account, one, has really long search times, and second, you mostly need a team to win. So what if my friends aren’t online but I wanna play H5, but dont want to ruin my rank on my main? I could create an ALT ACCOUNT and try my best on that while soloing. Alt accounts and smurfs are completely different things. Smurfs PURPOSELY rank themselves low, while alt’s try their best. For example, my alt account, is in fact, having a higher overall rank than my main. I play on that account when I wanna practice solo. Thats it. Not playing against low ranks.
Well, what you describe is indeed not smurfing. What I see as smurfing is:
If you create 1 alt account for solo playing, I don’t see that as smurfing.
> 2533274920070188;31:
> > 2535438193399052;30:
> > Ok so majority of the arguments I’m seeing here are against smurfing. But I can assure you some people see a low SR person and say “they’re playing on a smurf to feel good about themselves”. In reality though, there’s more to it. Playing on high ranked account, one, has really long search times, and second, you mostly need a team to win. So what if my friends aren’t online but I wanna play H5, but dont want to ruin my rank on my main? I could create an ALT ACCOUNT and try my best on that while soloing. Alt accounts and smurfs are completely different things. Smurfs PURPOSELY rank themselves low, while alt’s try their best. For example, my alt account, is in fact, having a higher overall rank than my main. I play on that account when I wanna practice solo. Thats it. Not playing against low ranks.
>
> Well, what you describe is indeed not smurfing. What I see as smurfing is:
> - Lose or DNF 10 games in a row on either your main account or an alt account. The game thinks you’re bronze tier player and it will match you for games on end to bronze, then silver, then gold, etc.
> - Creating alt account after alt account so the game doesn’t recognize you, so you get matched against low tier players.
>
> If you create 1 alt account for solo playing, I don’t see that as smurfing.
yeah I just wanted to point that out because many were just reporting people with low SR and gamerscore for beating them badly in a ranked game. It could’ve been a alt account playing his first few games, because it’ll give him easy opponents no matter what.
Yeah I had no idea what a smurf account was before I read this thread. Wow. I am ranked at 145 and have been having a hard time getting matches. I thought it was because hardly anyone was playing anymore since COD WWII came out and folks were all about that. I have my search set to FOCUSED if I change that to fun will that help to get matches? I guess I should try that. I dunno I can see how creating another profile would get you into more matches faster. It does seem unfair though to be sandbagging people like that. I don’t really see a solution for it though. Seems like just one more annoyance we have to put up with to play.
> 2533274810903993;33:
> Yeah I had no idea what a smurf account was before I read this thread. Wow. I am ranked at 145 and have been having a hard time getting matches. I thought it was because hardly anyone was playing anymore since COD WWII came out and folks were all about that. I have my search set to FOCUSED if I change that to fun will that help to get matches? I guess I should try that. I dunno I can see how creating another profile would get you into more matches faster. It does seem unfair though to be sandbagging people like that. I don’t really see a solution for it though. Seems like just one more annoyance we have to put up with to play.
Yeah, I mean your SR doesn’t really have a lot to do with your MMR. It is the Onyx and Champ ranked players that this impacts because they are only matched against equally skilled players, for ones at middle ranks issues finding matches would most likely be population based.