When Bungi made Halo: Everyone had fun

Games Halo 5: Guardians
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> > > > > To those complaining that 343 is catering to the “try hard” crowd…
> > > > >
> > > > > With all due respect, they tried to cater to casuals for Halo 4 and Bungie tried it with Reach. It didn’t work. Casuals will always pick CoD over Halo. 343 is smart enough to count their losses and try a different route.
> > > > >
> > > > > eSports are MASSIVE right now (league of legends) and 343 wanted to create the console version of that. A highly respectable goal I would say.
> > > > >
> > > > > Casuals have Warzone and are getting Firefight (which I hope is half as awesome as it sounds). It’s not like they are being left behind.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > *unless they want to play a social playlist that’s unranked.
> > > >
> > > > I don’t disagree with the embrace of HCS. It’s great for Halo. But I would be a bit remiss to be so dismissive as to call CoD casual, or say that’s where all the casuals go. I think that’s a really unfair generalization.
> > > >
> > > > I would say that the problem is balance. There seems to be no middle road. You’re either competitive or social. I think these labels and their use are the very root of the problem, as they are so easily applied to anyone who shares a different opinion. I don’t think things are that binary or black and white.
> > >
> > >
> > > They’re still not getting left behind though. Yes, they really should have a true social playlist, but until then, Warzone seems pretty social to me. I might be in the minority with that opinion though.
> >
> >
> > I hear you, but it’s still a bit dismissive to say “go play Warzone”. And there is still a fair amount of competitive play in Warzone. It’s not every match, but it does occur. Some matches are really close, others not so much.
> >
> > I think it’s a tough balance. Some additional play list options would certainly help. The choices are pretty anemic. If you are a social player, you kind of have to go into ranked playlists for certain options. Or play Warzone. And if Warzone is not your thing, then what?
> >
> > On the other side of the argument, keeping the options limited does alleviate matchmaking times and ensure quick matchmaking. The side effect is what we’re seeing now. People get stomped, will lose interest, and leave. We need to be a bit more inclusive, which is quite the challenge for such a diverse player base.
>
>
> Absolutely, I would never tell some to “just go play Warzone and stop crying” but I would suggest Warzone as a temporary solution for a Halo fan who wants to play Halo and have fun, until a true social playlist exists of course.
>
> Now to the line I bolded. I hate saying this, and I know its harsh, but I don’t know how else to word it; if Warzone isn’t your thing, then there’s really nothing anyone can do. If you don’t enjoy any of the gamemodes that a game has to offer you, maybe you should try a different game (The royal “you” not you, sarcasmbully). I hate to see people leave the game of course, but if the game doesn’t have anything to offer them, what else can be done?
>
> Of course, I understand you’re saying that as the reason to why 343 needs to add true social, but if they don’t…

Therein lies the rub. I agree. It’s a shame too. I think there has been a fair amount of attrition due to that as well. There are far too many options these days to stick with any one thing if it doesn’t grab you. It’s great for gamers to have all these different options.

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Bungle for lyfe.

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> > > > > > To those complaining that 343 is catering to the “try hard” crowd…
> > > > > >
> > > > > > With all due respect, they tried to cater to casuals for Halo 4 and Bungie tried it with Reach. It didn’t work. Casuals will always pick CoD over Halo. 343 is smart enough to count their losses and try a different route.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > eSports are MASSIVE right now (league of legends) and 343 wanted to create the console version of that. A highly respectable goal I would say.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Casuals have Warzone and are getting Firefight (which I hope is half as awesome as it sounds). It’s not like they are being left behind.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > *unless they want to play a social playlist that’s unranked.
> > > > >
> > > > > I don’t disagree with the embrace of HCS. It’s great for Halo. But I would be a bit remiss to be so dismissive as to call CoD casual, or say that’s where all the casuals go. I think that’s a really unfair generalization.
> > > > >
> > > > > I would say that the problem is balance. There seems to be no middle road. You’re either competitive or social. I think these labels and their use are the very root of the problem, as they are so easily applied to anyone who shares a different opinion. I don’t think things are that binary or black and white.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > They’re still not getting left behind though. Yes, they really should have a true social playlist, but until then, Warzone seems pretty social to me. I might be in the minority with that opinion though.
> > >
> > >
> > > I hear you, but it’s still a bit dismissive to say “go play Warzone”. And there is still a fair amount of competitive play in Warzone. It’s not every match, but it does occur. Some matches are really close, others not so much.
> > >
> > > I think it’s a tough balance. Some additional play list options would certainly help. The choices are pretty anemic. If you are a social player, you kind of have to go into ranked playlists for certain options. Or play Warzone. And if Warzone is not your thing, then what?
> > >
> > > On the other side of the argument, keeping the options limited does alleviate matchmaking times and ensure quick matchmaking. The side effect is what we’re seeing now. People get stomped, will lose interest, and leave. We need to be a bit more inclusive, which is quite the challenge for such a diverse player base.
> >
> >
> > Absolutely, I would never tell some to “just go play Warzone and stop crying” but I would suggest Warzone as a temporary solution for a Halo fan who wants to play Halo and have fun, until a true social playlist exists of course.
> >
> > Now to the line I bolded. I hate saying this, and I know its harsh, but I don’t know how else to word it; if Warzone isn’t your thing, then there’s really nothing anyone can do. If you don’t enjoy any of the gamemodes that a game has to offer you, maybe you should try a different game (The royal “you” not you, sarcasmbully). I hate to see people leave the game of course, but if the game doesn’t have anything to offer them, what else can be done?
> >
> > Of course, I understand you’re saying that as the reason to why 343 needs to add true social, but if they don’t…
>
>
> Therein lies the rub. I agree. It’s a shame too. I think there has been a fair amount of attrition due to that as well. There are far too many options these days to stick with any one thing if it doesn’t grab you. It’s great for gamers to have all these different options.

Yea, the options are nice, but it is unfortunate for games like this. Hell, when Halo 3 was out I was sure that they weren’t going to make as many as they have. Its cool that they’ve kept making them because I enjoy them, but its no surprise that after an IP has been around long enough to have “veterans” people start falling off the wagon.

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This is crazy. I am just thinking of stuff from older Halo titles that can be put in H5 like the H1 H2(FAV) and H3 shotgun…and forge items like the old fusion coils teleporters blockades and those big green boxes from H2…and the Halo 2 bench from Ivory Tower…I keep checking out old blocks from past halo games and forge blocks and how I want them in H5…But chances are if you you are in Warzone just screwing around or “playing for fun” or not being a “tryhard” then the chances of the people on your team who want to win losing is pretty high…I mean being on a team that doesn’t really care sucks especially when you get on a team and then all of the base get taken then the core is exposed that happened to me like 3 out of the first games I played post launch…If anything I expect chaotic exiting gameplay a lot of explosions ragdoll etc…Enemies dying and coming back at your neck twice as hard because they weren’t trying to die in the first place…It’s a two way street…A lot of people talk about try hards…But the whole point is that you are going to have to try hard to KILL the ENEMY team…Even though you can just walk around and look at the scenery in the map jump all over the place or look at the ground and ponder about your life there are people who want to kill the enemy team and you while you examine the floor textures then T BAG you keep in mind that every game mode has objectives killing and getting kills are involved in almost every playlist until they put up a timed parkour map playlist or a race playlist etc…All of these statements just keep me brainstorming about what really needs to be done to the game because it is really fun to play with the new abilities and mechanics…

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I don’t hate Halo 5, but I do agree that it is not fun. I have decided that Halo 5 is my last Halo because of this. As soon as I learned that you couldn’t hit a rocket back at a player using the Gravity Hammer, I said, “I’m out! this is too much change!” This is just one example of why Halo 5 is just not enjoyable. I may get Halo Wars 2 because 343 is not making it, but that’s it. I’ve been going all out in this game as if were my senior year in ball (Best for Last).

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>Adolescent Tryhards (Because giving up is such a mature trait)
>CoD being more for the tryhard players.
>Halo is dead because some people choose to play as a team, the way it was meant to be played.
>“I COULD WIN IF I WANT TO, I JUST DON’T WANT TO”.

Seventeen people took this post seriously? Just…vigorously shaking my head right now.

I mean yeah, the game needs more social content. That doesn’t mean people who are actually halfway decent at it are the reason its dying.

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> >Adolescent Tryhards (Because giving up is such a mature trait)
> >CoD being more for the tryhard players.
> >Halo is dead because some people choose to play as a team, the way it was meant to be played.
> >“I COULD WIN IF I WANT TO, I JUST DON’T WANT TO”.
>
> Seventeen people took this post seriously? Just…vigorously shaking my head right now.
>
> I mean yeah, the game needs more social content. That doesn’t mean people who are actually halfway decent at it are the reason its dying.

You have no idea how stupid some people are…I think this thread is an example of that

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> 343 only wants tryhards to have fun.
>
> if you are stuck against a bunch of adolescent tryhards, you cant quit because they will ban you for habitual quitting. Well i did quit and it has been a while since i played halo, not for being banned but for not having fun. look Im not going to keep playing with these people and it is not that I can’t win. it is the fact that i have more desire to be entertained than to be a tyhard.
>
> Bungi had a special design that allowed gamers of all types (casuals, tryhards, immatures) to enjoy the game but 343 don’t seem to fully understand that concept. Im not sure what type of game design previous halos had but I can tell you that everyone had fun on the same battlefield in halo. Now, it seems to be fitting for those who wants to farm by spawn trapping or work in tryhard fire teams. This halo game is slowly being destroyed.
>
> in the past gamers would play halo instead of CoD for this exact reason, COD being more for the tryhard players while halo was designed to entertain everyone. but gamers in this day and age cant seem to distinguish the major differences between the two games, why? because 343 turned halo into a COD copy-cat imo. and most of the gamers that think halo and cod is the same haven’t been around long enough to remember when both games first came out. COD was on every game system, therefor it was acceptable to attract only tryhard fan base gamers from pc,ps and xbox . On the other hand, Halo5 is only on the XBOX so it is detrimental to attract only a tryhard fan base by shaming other loyal casual fans with asinine “Ban Hammer” and allowing all game modes to be ruined by tryhard mentality. At this rate I don’t see a bright future for halo.
>
> I would not be surprised if 343 stopped making content because lack of financial support. Because, the tryhard farmers that you tailor your game to are not going to buy your REQ packs with real money, very smart 343 for giving them the keys to the game, while banning others that quit and refuse to play with those tryhard players. Im sure Bungi would $ee things differently.
>
> Im not saying Bungi hit a home run with Destiny, but they sure had bases loaded with Halo.
>
> again, I can “WIN” if i wanted but to me it is not all about that; I just wanted casual fun with halo but its just not there anymore.

I agree. When Bungie made it, the tryhards could be tryhards. Casual gamers (like me) who just wanted to have fun and play splitscreen with a friend could do that.

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Gameplay-wise, the decline started with Halo 2, but Halo 2 added online multiplayer which more than made up for the game’s lower skill ceiling. Halo 3 didn’t really come with any big improvements over 2 and had some major failed ideas (BR spread, equipment), but those weren’t egregious enough to really kill the game (plus, it concluded the story). Reach on the other hand took those failed ideas and made them twenty times worse. Its online population dropped like a rock once people got sick of it for it not being Halo. Bungie had already had a major talent shakeup between Halo 3 and Reach. Jason Jones, Paul Bertone, Tyson Green, Jaime Griesemer, Dan Orzulak, and John Howard (who ironically left to work on Shadowrun) all left their design roles between Halo 2 and 3. Sage Merrill, the guy was responsible for the 2007 Shadowrun FPS (which had many of the terrible features that were added to Reach: sprint, AAs, reticle bloom, loadouts) came on as a lead designer in Reach. When Bungie pulled out while Reach was on its last legs (around the time of the second DLC, when the game was pulling an online population of about 16,000 total), pretty much all of Bungie’s remaining original talent left. 343i had I think only two or three people left who had worked on the original, and at least one of them was a PR guy rather than a dev. From that point onward everything about the series: the aesthetics, the story, the gameplay, even the developer-player interaction felt like Blizzard’s work rather than Bungie 2.0’s. It’s now a series with no identity that has to compete with multiplatform games like CoD and Overwatch.

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Fun is very subjective and it’s impossible to create a service product that provides fun for every single consumer.

The biggest error of your post, is your title. I can ensure you, that not everyone had fun with the Halos Bungie created. I know many who hated CE, H2, H3, and Reach. I hated, despised, insert all synonyms of hate, in regards to Reach’s multiplayer. See, +1 to not having fun with a Bungie created Halo. Just disproved your whole thread, just relating my perspective to your title.

Now, lets dive deeper into your opinion. You make it seem like people who play Halo to try and win the game, such a negative person. Also, why does this person you are describing an adolescent. I am far from an adolescent, and yet, after reading your post, in your eyes, I would be under this so called “tryhard” category.

Is your memory being completely blocked by nostalgia? Do you remember H2? Halo 2 was far more competitive than H5 currently is and will be in the future. The social features in that game were minuscule compared to H5. H3, had a balance of social and ranked playlists, but it was not perfect. I feel that people forget how bad the social playlists were plagued with 4-5 man general (aka level 50s) teams. I guess if you consider that fun, sure H3 was fun for some, but as mentioned previously, it was not fun for everyone. I actually did not enjoy H3 as much as H:CE and H2, and quit playing Halo, which I did not do for the previous games.

Trust me, I completely agree that 343 failed in the social 4v4 category for H5. There needs to be more playlists that are unranked, so people from all ranks can play together without worrying about going down in a rank. But, to sit here and state everyone had fun with the Bungie Halo titles, is completely false.
Many people are having fun with H5, I’m sorry you are not one of those people.

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I have not spent one dime on REQ packs and I have all the fun in the world AND more importantly over a 1.00 K/D ratio which in my book is all that matters in terms of true efficiency. AND I am over 128 rank. AND I never play Arena. AND yes my losses are more than my wins but anyone that knows how this game works knows that buying REQ’s would not of changed it in the grand scheme.

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<mark>This post has been edited by a moderator. Please do not flame or attack other members. This includes stat-flaming.</mark>

I just want everyone to know the OP has a KD of .68, which means practice is the answer for winning games. Yes this game is harder than most, but just because you aren’t as good as other players doesn’t mean the game isn’t fun. If it wasn’t fun people wouldn’t care so much.

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To sum up what the OP is saying…
He’s bad and thinks that the game is getting ruined by “tryhards” (a dumb term if you ask me).
The game isn’t getting worse, but if I were to give a bad thing about it, the people that complain and hate the competitiveness are the ones ruining it.

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> > > > So you are mad because you are getting you butt kicked? Got it.
> > >
> > >
> > > unfortunatly, it will be years from now before you get it. get it?
> >
> >
> > You complain about “Try Hards” All thru out your rant. That immediately tells me that you not performing as well as you expected. I also looked at your record. Not to criticize, but its obvious you are not doing well. Its fulled expected for you not to enjoy the game if you are getting beat on 1 vs 1 as well as a team. You expect to go into a match and not try as still do well. Thats not going to happen with this game. It won’t happen with MCC either. Heck not shooters in general. Every shooter I have ever played people play to win. That is the very nature of a shooter game. Warzone and BTB are casual. But even in those people are going to play to win which means taking you out if you are the enemy. I free admit that when I first got the game I was not doing well. I even considered selling it and moving on to something else. However I instead decided to learn the game and how the maps are played. I have a job, a wife and child, So its not like I can play every night like the hardcore players. I typically only play on Saturday afternoons and a little on Sunday. Thats it maybe 6 to 8 hrs a week. With so little playing time, I still got better, now I enjoy the game. Given your stats, It apparent that your skills need work. I will offer some suggestions.
> >
> > 1. Your aim is off. this is based on your stats, nothing more. So I would guess you need to turn down the sensitivity on your controller. You are most likely over correcting while aiming, thus missing shots more often than landing them.
> > 2.Play with your teammates. That means following or partnering with them 2 vs 1 is always better than 1 vs 1.
> > 3. Focus on headshots. Don’t worry about evasion techniques until you still landing more shots.
> > 4, Pay attention to where your teammates are.
> > 5. In Warzone, Don’t get out in the open. Until you get better, focus on defending a single base.
> > 6, In Warzone, don’t rush an enemy base alone.
> > 7. When attacking an enemy base marines are a simple headshot. Bodyshots take way too long to kill marines.
> >
> > Now with all of that said, your complaint about lack of social gametypes is valid and is spoke of often on this forum. Nothing I can do about that other than it my understanding that more social gametypes are coming.
> >
> > Play Warzone exclusively for a while. I’m almost positive your sensitivity being too high is causing much of your grief.
>
>
> nope, like i said before im done, and unfortunately the future of halo is also done, thanks to you…
>
> stats? i dont care about mine or your stats
>
> question for you, how many req packs did you buy? oh, you are too good and win req points very often so you dont have to buy req packs, awh good for you. 343 is the ones lo$ing that match, not me lol.

Wow kid, you’re really salty right now, you come here claiming that 343 ruined Halo and that you’re done with it for good, at this point, your just here for attention.
You claimed you were a Halo Veteran, yet you sit here acting like a spoiled child because your not getting what you want.

Sucks that you keep losing, REQ packs are fun and it doesn’t mean its ruining Halo, if you hate Halo so much, just leave.

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I’m having fun, and I’m ok with that.

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Causal fun = wining… I don’t think there is a single player out there that haves fun by loosing, so if you can win you should I am certain you are going to have fun if you play to win…

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Look what bungie did to destiny … and try hards are not a problem you complaining about people beating you is the problem

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not 343i fault if you are bad buddy.
Halo is competitive and cod is for casuals.
Just look at your freaging stats hahahha i can understand that you are not having fun.

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I agree 100%. There’s just no fun anymore. I barely play one gametype and that’s griefball because I’m sick of having by buthole clenched under the pressure in slayer. Enough is enough, I want to relax playing Halo like I ALWAYS did before after a day of work, not being spawn trapped in a -Yoink- warzone game. It just stinks.

Man I used to excel at slayer as a lone wolf in previous Halo titles. In 5, I get my -Yoink- ended to me on a plate on a daily basis, even if I’m tryin’. Something is very wrong here. I think the real hardcore no-lifers have invaded Halo.

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> Im done with Halo for a while

Okay. Enjoy your new pursuits.