What will a T rated flood look like? (W evidence)

Games Halo Infinite
1

I think most people on here are preparing themselves for Halo Infinite to be T rated. Evidence for this is the Microsoft store listing (although this could be placeholder), cartoony and Mega Bloks/roblox style graphics. Also cheesy toned down dialogue missing the grit of the older games. “raggedy a** fleet”, “wipe those b**t*rds off the deck”, missing blood splats. etc. - since Halo 5 all this has been omitted from the games.

Perhaps the most chilling evidence for Halo Infinite being T rated comes from this former 343 employee, Will M, in response to a fan tweeting about wanting the M rating back:

Most chilling quotes from Will M:

  • *"*being rated T rated game actually does make it easier for people under 17 to get the game" - because it’s so hard for little kids to get their hands on CoD/GTA?
  • "what do you really miss from it being an M game versus a T one?" - notice the inclusion of “really”, trying to plant seeds of doubt in the fans mind
  • “Halo 1-3 were never that gritty” - The flood, design choices, blood splats etc.
  • “Halo always felt cartoony to me.” -EDIT: Someone in the comments has made us aware of a comment from Aaron Greenberg (Marketing manager at Xbox) surrounding Halo 5’s T rating:
  • “I do expect the T rating will help game sales,” he said. "Core Halo fans are going to buy the game no matter what the rating is, and I think we’ve seen that. A lot of people were surprised that previous Halo games were M-rated sort of given the style of the game and the lack of real graphic violence and things like that. We’re pleased with the rating."It’s worth nothing that Halo 5 is actually the worse selling mainline Halo game in the series in terms of copies. So yea, great job Aaron.

We can see these opinions reflected in the Infinite game demo we saw recently. People have complained about the cartoony/Mega Bloks graphics and it is concerning that a 343 employee and Aaron Greenberg from Xbox do not understand the light grittiness Halo once had. This is why the comic relief through Sergeant Johnson etc. worked so well in the original games, because it played off of those gritty undertones. Especially the flood. They epitomise everything that has been missing from Halo recently.

So based on the comments from this former 343 employee, it could have rather concerning ramifications for Halo Infinite’s development. But if we take the T rating as a fact, rather than a possibility, what could this mean for the flood, should they indeed return in the confirmed 10 year lifespan of Halo Infinite as a platform?

  • Firstly, I believe that one of the core differences will be the infection forms’ interaction with live/dead bodies. I don’t think it will be nearly as grim as in the older games. I think the way they will do it is when the infection form does take over the body then you won’t be able to see what life form the host actually was. Whereas in the Halos with the flood previously you could see a human skull, a brute head, arms etc. I don’t think we will see this in Infinite should they return.
  • Secondly, I think the death animations/sounds will be heavily muted. Expect toned down infection noises, no loud human screaming from the previous games. I don’t think we will see the fear in the marines like we saw in Halo 3’s Floodgate mission.
  • Thirdly, we could have missions where we fight the flood but don’t actually see them taking over any bodies. Like Halo 3’s Cortana mission. Everything is pre-infected, if you like.
  • Finally, and perhaps the biggest thing here, I don’t think that the flood will feature in the main campaign shipped in the original game. The reasoning for this is quite simple, and I hope people see the logic here. So they omit the flood from the main campaign, make sure everything looks safe for a T rating, secure a T rating, then the game is released. On store shelves, on Amazon etc. and in the Microsoft store it will say T. This makes 343 people like Will M quoted earlier happy. Then they go, “well the fans want the flood, the game is out now” and decide to include it as DLC. For example, a “Palace of Pain” dlc where the flood is released and wrecks havok. All the T for Teen crowd have the game already, so they don’t have to worry about parents not buying the game due to the M rating. (Again, worth noting the amount of little kids whose parents buy them GTA and CoD every year.) It makes fans who want the flood satisfied because we will finally see them in a main Halo game after 13 years. It seems to please everyone except those who wanted them in the launch version of the game in the first place. Plus, as DLC there might not be the same creative restrictions (see points 1-3) that may inhibit what the flood look like/how they act in order to secure the T rating, as the game has already shipped.What do people here think about the Flood in Halo Infinite? And what do you make of Will M’s comments about M rating, as a former 343 employee? As well as Aaron Greenberg?
2

> 2535406183268277;1:
> I think most people on here are preparing themselves for Halo Infinite to be T rated. Evidence for this is the Microsoft store listing (although this could be placeholder), cartoony and Mega Bloks/roblox style graphics. Also cheesy toned down dialogue missing the grit of the older games. “raggedy a** fleet”, “wipe those b**t*rds off the deck”, missing blood splats. etc. - since Halo 5 all this has been omitted from the games.
>
> Perhaps the most chilling evidence for Halo Infinite being T rated comes from this former 343 employee, Will M, in response to a fan tweeting about wanting the M rating back:
>
> https://twitter.com/InsetFrostbyte/status/1287843439376097280
>
> Most chilling quotes from Will M:
>
>
> - *"*being rated T rated game actually does make it easier for people under 17 to get the game" - because it’s so hard for little kids to get their hands on CoD/GTA? - "what do you really miss from it being an M game versus a T one?" - notice the inclusion of “really”, trying to plant seeds of doubt in the fans mind - “Halo 1-3 were never that gritty” - The flood, design choices, blood splats etc. - “Halo always felt cartoony to me.” -We can see these opinions reflected in the Infinite game demo we saw recently. People have complained about the cartoony/Mega Bloks graphics and it is concerning that a 343 employee does not understand the light grittiness Halo once had. This is why the comic relief through Sergeant Johnson etc. worked so well in the original games, because it played off of those gritty undertones. Especially the flood. They epitomise everything that has been missing from Halo recently.
>
> So based on the comments from this former 343 employee, it could have rather concerning ramifications for Halo Infinite’s development. But if we take the T rating as a fact, rather than a possibility, what could this mean for the flood, should they indeed return in the confirmed 10 year lifespan of Halo Infinite as a platform?
> - Firstly, I believe that one of the core differences will be the infection forms’ interaction with live/dead bodies. I don’t think it will be nearly as grim as in the older games. I think the way they will do it is when the infection form does take over the body then you won’t be able to see what life form the host actually was. Whereas in the Halos with the flood previously you could see a human skull, a brute head, arms etc. I don’t think we will see this in Infinite should they return. - Secondly, I think the death animations/sounds will be heavily muted. Expect toned down infection noises, no loud human screaming from the previous games. I don’t think we will see the fear in the marines like we saw in Halo 3’s Floodgate mission. - Thirdly, we could have missions where we fight the flood but don’t actually see them taking over any bodies. Like Halo 3’s Cortana mission. Everything is pre-infected, if you like. - Finally, and perhaps the biggest thing here, I don’t think that the flood will feature in the main campaign shipped in the original game. The reasoning for this is quite simple, and I hope people see the logic here. So they omit the flood from the main campaign, make sure everything looks safe for a T rating, secure a T rating, then the game is released. On store shelves, on Amazon etc. and in the Microsoft store it will say T. This makes 343 people like Will M quoted earlier happy. Then they go, “well the fans want the flood, the game is out now” and decide to include it as DLC. For example, a “Palace of Pain” dlc where the flood is released and wrecks havok. All the T for Teen crowd have the game already, so they don’t have to worry about parents not buying the game due to the M rating. It makes fans who want the flood satisfied because we will finally see them in a main Halo game after 13 years. It seems to please everyone except those who wanted them in the launch version of the game in the first place. Plus, as DLC there might not be the same creative restrictions (see points 1-3) that may inhibit what the flood look like/how they act in order to secure the T rating, as the game has already shipped.What do people here think about the Flood in Halo Infinite? And what do you make of Will M’s comments about M rating, as a former 343 employee?

Wow. Disappointed but not surprised by those 343 employee comments tbh.

As for the flood I mainly agree but I don’t think 343 would go as not seeing infections happen altogether. Your point on there not being any evidence of the host body seems interesting though.

On the DLC point I think you’re pretty spot on. Palace of pain DLC seems quite likely thinking about it, and we see have seen that building everyone assumes to be the palace in the gameplay demo - the first DLC expansion perhaps? There would be no way 343 can put the flood in a game without either M rating or killing what made the flood the flood.

3

On the idea that flood would be added as DLC:
If the game is rated T, then any story DLC would still have to be T. It’s not like they could make the base game T and any DLC M. They could get into legal hot water for something like that.
As for the implementation of Flood in a T rating: if the flood were to return and Infinite were rated T, I don’t think it would necessarily change how the flood work all that much. The esrb is not a stagnant organization; new members come in and old members leave, as in any company. And with new people come new interpretations on what is T and what is M. It could very well be that the current esrb would rate CE T if they rerated it today. We simply don’t know how strict 2020’s esrb is compared to 2001’s.
It’s also worth remembering that even though H5 got a T rating in US, in the rest of the world, H5 had the same international ratings as previous entries.

4

Flood would look like Play dough with how everything else looks right about now. Little jellybean Infection forms.

5

> 2533274817408735;3:
> On the idea that flood would be added as DLC:
> If the game is rated T, then any story DLC would still have to be T. It’s not like they could make the base game T and any DLC M. They could get into legal hot water for something like that.
> As for the implementation of Flood in a T rating: if the flood were to return and Infinite were rated T, I don’t think it would necessarily change how the flood work all that much. The esrb is not a stagnant organization; new members come in and old members leave, as in any company. And with new people come new interpretations on what is T and what is M. It could very well be that the current esrb would rate CE T if they rerated it today. We simply don’t know how strict 2020’s esrb is compared to 2001’s.
> It’s also worth remembering that even though H5 got a T rating in US, in the rest of the world, H5 had the same international ratings as previous entries.

I get your point but having watched the demo and seen those comments by that 343 employee it seems like 343 are deliberately making the game targeting a T rating. I don’t know whether that is a choice by 343 or Microsoft, but I think it is the latter based on this comments by Aaron Greenberg of Microsoft surrounding Halo 5’s T rating.

“I do expect the T rating will help game sales,” he said. “Core Halo fans are going to buy the game no matter what the rating is, and I think we’ve seen that. A lot of people were surprised that previous Halo games were M-rated sort of given the style of the game and the lack of real graphic violence and things like that. We’re pleased with the rating.”

Based on that it’s likely a push by Microsoft rather than 343’s own decision. Aaron Greenberg also acted surprised upon hearing the reception to Infinite’s graphics. Maybe he and others surrounding him don’t understand what people want from Halo?

6

> 2533274817408735;3:
> As for the implementation of Flood in a T rating: if the flood were to return and Infinite were rated T, I don’t think it would necessarily change how the flood work all that much.

To add on to what you said about this. I don’t think most people realized Halo Wars 2: Awakening the Nightmare was also rated T. And that DLC re-introduced the flood since Halo 3. Granted you could argue it was an RTS and what have you, but I do believe that the flood alone isn’t the reason why past Halo’s had a mature rating.

7

> 2533274832360281;6:
> > 2533274817408735;3:
> > As for the implementation of Flood in a T rating: if the flood were to return and Infinite were rated T, I don’t think it would necessarily change how the flood work all that much.
>
> To add on to what you said about this. I don’t think most people realized Halo Wars 2: Awakening the Nightmare was also rated T. And that DLC re-introduced the flood since Halo 3. Granted you could argue it was an RTS and what have you, but I do believe that the flood alone isn’t the reason why past Halo’s had a mature rating.

Hmm fair observation but I don’t think we actually saw an infection form take over a host. The brutes entered high charity, it cut to outside with the other brutes, then the infection forms came rushing out. Even then I didn’t see any bodily takeovers in the cutscenes themselves. Too graphic for the rating?

8

> 2535407766571185;7:
> > 2533274832360281;6:
> > > 2533274817408735;3:
> > > As for the implementation of Flood in a T rating: if the flood were to return and Infinite were rated T, I don’t think it would necessarily change how the flood work all that much.
> >
> > To add on to what you said about this. I don’t think most people realized Halo Wars 2: Awakening the Nightmare was also rated T. And that DLC re-introduced the flood since Halo 3. Granted you could argue it was an RTS and what have you, but I do believe that the flood alone isn’t the reason why past Halo’s had a mature rating.
>
> Hmm fair observation but I don’t think we actually saw an infection form take over a host. The brutes entered high charity, it cut to outside with the other brutes, then the infection forms came rushing out. Even then I didn’t see any bodily takeovers in the cutscenes themselves. Too graphic for the rating?

Well, I don’t know anything about ESRB and how they rate game… I have my own opinion on those subjects.

But, that brings up a good point. Physically seeing a body being taken over by a flood form could cause a “Mature” rating. Granted an easy way to fix that is don’t show it on screen. Besides the scene from Halo 3 mission floodgate were the marine got attacked by flood popcorn, there wasn’t really a lot of on screen takeovers, like the OP stated. Unless you really looked for them in the missions.

9

> 2535407766571185;7:
> > 2533274832360281;6:
> > > 2533274817408735;3:
> > > As for the implementation of Flood in a T rating: if the flood were to return and Infinite were rated T, I don’t think it would necessarily change how the flood work all that much.
> >
> > To add on to what you said about this. I don’t think most people realized Halo Wars 2: Awakening the Nightmare was also rated T. And that DLC re-introduced the flood since Halo 3. Granted you could argue it was an RTS and what have you, but I do believe that the flood alone isn’t the reason why past Halo’s had a mature rating.
>
> Hmm fair observation but I don’t think we actually saw an infection form take over a host. The brutes entered high charity, it cut to outside with the other brutes, then the infection forms came rushing out. Even then I didn’t see any bodily takeovers in the cutscenes themselves. Too graphic for the rating?

Don’t know how ESRB rates the flood, but for me, seeing that cutscene was horrific. The most disgusting (and best) looking flood to date. If that isn’t graphic for an M rating, I dont know what is.

10

> 2535406183268277;1:
> I think most people on here are preparing themselves for Halo Infinite to be T rated. Evidence for this is the Microsoft store listing (although this could be placeholder), cartoony and Mega Bloks/roblox style graphics. Also cheesy toned down dialogue missing the grit of the older games. “raggedy a** fleet”, “wipe those b**t*rds off the deck”, missing blood splats. etc. - since Halo 5 all this has been omitted from the games.
>
> Perhaps the most chilling evidence for Halo Infinite being T rated comes from this former 343 employee, Will M, in response to a fan tweeting about wanting the M rating back:
>
> https://twitter.com/InsetFrostbyte/status/1287843439376097280
>
> Most chilling quotes from Will M:
>
>
> - *"*being rated T rated game actually does make it easier for people under 17 to get the game" - because it’s so hard for little kids to get their hands on CoD/GTA? - "what do you really miss from it being an M game versus a T one?" - notice the inclusion of “really”, trying to plant seeds of doubt in the fans mind - “Halo 1-3 were never that gritty” - The flood, design choices, blood splats etc. - “Halo always felt cartoony to me.” -EDIT: Someone in the comments has made us aware of a comment from Aaron Greenberg (Marketing manager at Xbox) surrounding Halo 5’s T rating:
>
> Halo 5's Teen Rating Will Improve Sales, Xbox Exec Says - GameSpot
>
>
> - “I do expect the T rating will help game sales,” he said. "Core Halo fans are going to buy the game no matter what the rating is, and I think we’ve seen that. A lot of people were surprised that previous Halo games were M-rated sort of given the style of the game and the lack of real graphic violence and things like that. We’re pleased with the rating."It’s worth nothing that Halo 5 is actually the worse selling mainline Halo game in the series in terms of copies. So yea, great job Aaron.
>
> We can see these opinions reflected in the Infinite game demo we saw recently. People have complained about the cartoony/Mega Bloks graphics and it is concerning that a 343 employee and Aaron Greenberg from Xbox do not understand the light grittiness Halo once had. This is why the comic relief through Sergeant Johnson etc. worked so well in the original games, because it played off of those gritty undertones. Especially the flood. They epitomise everything that has been missing from Halo recently.
>
> So based on the comments from this former 343 employee, it could have rather concerning ramifications for Halo Infinite’s development. But if we take the T rating as a fact, rather than a possibility, what could this mean for the flood, should they indeed return in the confirmed 10 year lifespan of Halo Infinite as a platform?
> - Firstly, I believe that one of the core differences will be the infection forms’ interaction with live/dead bodies. I don’t think it will be nearly as grim as in the older games. I think the way they will do it is when the infection form does take over the body then you won’t be able to see what life form the host actually was. Whereas in the Halos with the flood previously you could see a human skull, a brute head, arms etc. I don’t think we will see this in Infinite should they return. - Secondly, I think the death animations/sounds will be heavily muted. Expect toned down infection noises, no loud human screaming from the previous games. I don’t think we will see the fear in the marines like we saw in Halo 3’s Floodgate mission. - Thirdly, we could have missions where we fight the flood but don’t actually see them taking over any bodies. Like Halo 3’s Cortana mission. Everything is pre-infected, if you like. - Finally, and perhaps the biggest thing here, I don’t think that the flood will feature in the main campaign shipped in the original game. The reasoning for this is quite simple, and I hope people see the logic here. So they omit the flood from the main campaign, make sure everything looks safe for a T rating, secure a T rating, then the game is released. On store shelves, on Amazon etc. and in the Microsoft store it will say T. This makes 343 people like Will M quoted earlier happy. Then they go, “well the fans want the flood, the game is out now” and decide to include it as DLC. For example, a “Palace of Pain” dlc where the flood is released and wrecks havok. All the T for Teen crowd have the game already, so they don’t have to worry about parents not buying the game due to the M rating. (Again, worth noting the amount of little kids whose parents buy them GTA and CoD every year.) It makes fans who want the flood satisfied because we will finally see them in a main Halo game after 13 years. It seems to please everyone except those who wanted them in the launch version of the game in the first place. Plus, as DLC there might not be the same creative restrictions (see points 1-3) that may inhibit what the flood look like/how they act in order to secure the T rating, as the game has already shipped.What do people here think about the Flood in Halo Infinite? And what do you make of Will M’s comments about M rating, as a former 343 employee? As well as Aaron Greenberg?

I’m still highly doubtful that the Flood will be in the game at all with a T rating. This isn’t Halo Wars 2 where you’re viewing everything from a floating camera way above the action, it’s first person where you would be right up close to the enemies and seeing a lot more detail. I’m still on the side of Prometheans being our secondary enemy rather than the Flood because of this, and if the Flood are in the game, I’m nervous as to whether they can be done justice with the content restrictions. You can say the original Halo games are cartoony if you want, but going through 343 Guilty Spark on CE and Floodgate on 3 are pretty terrifying (when you’re immersed and not just speedrunning it to complete a challenge on MCC, of course).