So, one of my recent games, 2 silvers and 2 golds get matched against 2 onyx and 2 diamonds in ranked swat. It’s not even a game at that point. Why aren’t there checks and balances against this stuff? It’s super discouraging.
> 2533274875845267;1:
> So, one of my recent games, 2 silvers and 2 golds get matched against 2 onyx and 2 diamonds in ranked swat. It’s not even a game at that point. Why aren’t there checks and balances against this stuff? It’s super discouraging.
That sucks, but with the small population and the time you were playing the options probably were: the other team doesn’t get a match at all or it matches you.
That being said, the system expects you to lose so you won’t lose much (or any) MMR for losing.
> 2753763522162009;2:
> > 2533274875845267;1:
> > So, one of my recent games, 2 silvers and 2 golds get matched against 2 onyx and 2 diamonds in ranked swat. It’s not even a game at that point. Why aren’t there checks and balances against this stuff? It’s super discouraging.
>
> That sucks, but with the small population and the time you were playing the options probably were: the other team doesn’t get a match at all or it matches you.
>
> That being said, the system expects you to lose so you won’t lose much (or any) MMR for losing.
That’s for the reply. I have only being playing H5 for 6 months or so, and casually at that due to my age & work; your explanation helped and I researched the MMR, CSR to get a better understanding of how it works and why it works. Much appreciated.
> the other team doesn’t get a match at all or it matches you.
Ah yes, the classic logic of “well, in the interest of time, we are going to waste your time with a match you (most likely) would never win”. The do no harm option is to not have anyone’s time wasted with the match to begin with and just to say there are not enough people in the playlist.
> 2535435685526493;4:
> > the other team doesn’t get a match at all or it matches you.
>
> Ah yes, the classic logic of “well, in the interest of time, we are going to waste your time with a match you (most likely) would never win”. The do no harm option is to not have anyone’s time wasted with the match to begin with and just to say there are not enough people in the playlist.
I get what you’re saying, but their data shows this is the lesser of the two evils, from a player retention standpoint.
I mean, Halo 5 has been out for a quite a while now and, as mentioned, the player base has gotten smaller. So yeah, the matches may seem “unbalanced” but its either that or neither team in that case gets matched up at that time. Leading to longer wait times and possibly an even smaller player base due to frustrations of longer wait times.
> 2753763522162009;5:
> > 2535435685526493;4:
> > > the other team doesn’t get a match at all or it matches you.
> >
> > Ah yes, the classic logic of “well, in the interest of time, we are going to waste your time with a match you (most likely) would never win”. The do no harm option is to not have anyone’s time wasted with the match to begin with and just to say there are not enough people in the playlist.
>
> I get what you’re saying, but their data shows this is the lesser of the two evils, from a player retention standpoint.
Nah I agree with the other guy too though man. This crap is just too damn upsetting. I also absolutely HATE being put against people in a different country and lose EVERY match man…the players I face sometimes aren’t that good but the match feels so bad to play in for me…
On one hand…I’m in a match where I might as well set my controller down cause I’ll never beat a team of champs(when MM pulls lopsided matches for the sake of finding a match) …on the other I might as well set my controller down because the other team feels like they’re up 2 shots before I can even react.(being at such a disadvantage due to facing foreign players )
I just get on when I can to have fun…but at certain times of the day it seems I only waste my time. I’m completely with the other dude…give me that message on screen and I’ll turn my xbox off. Many people Uninstall the game simply because they can’t deal with the stupidity that goes on in the match making sometimes…they’d have retained players if they had never got on those days that upset them so much they ended up Uninstalling the game.
> Nah I agree with the other guy too though man. This crap is just too damn upsetting. I also absolutely HATE being put against people in a different country and lose EVERY match man…the players I face sometimes aren’t that good but the match feels so bad to play in for me…On one hand…I’m in a match where I might as well set my controller down cause I’ll never beat a team of champs(when MM pulls lopsided matches for the sake of finding a match) …on the other I might as well set my controller down because the other team feels like they’re up 2 shots before I can even react.(being at such a disadvantage due to facing foreign players )I just get on when I can to have fun…but at certain times of the day it seems I only waste my time. I’m completely with the other dude…give me that message on screen and I’ll turn my xbox off. Many people Uninstall the game simply because they can’t deal with the stupidity that goes on in the match making sometimes…they’d have retained players if they had never got on those days that upset them so much they ended up Uninstalling the game.
The quickest way to lose a player is to waste their time. I’ve uninstalled the game thrice, and I only started playing Halo around this time last year. It leaves a bad taste in my mouth when I lose a match, have a massive CSR drop, and see that the lobby was insanely unbalanced. Mid Plat and below should not be able to play with or against Diamonds and above - they are vastly different in terms of “play potential”. The skill gap in this game is high enough to where a schism occurs between Gold and Diamond, and on either side of that schism the game is fundamentally different.
343 claims “the data shows this or that”, but there isn’t a data set in the world that shows a player’s map knowledge or movement. They need to apply some hard skill cut offs, and just let players know “hey, we’re sorry there aren’t enough players to play. Here are the peak play times”.
> I mean, Halo 5 has been out for a quite a while now and, as mentioned, the player base has gotten smaller
CS:GO has been around for years. I can boot up my PS3, pop in MW2, and still find a balanced lobby (even amidst the hacking). This is not a valid excuse in any way, shape, or format. The player base has gotten smaller due to their continual mismanagement of the series, but the players foot the bill as per usual with these bums.The first two years of the game were farcical, and I say that as someone who watched from a distance. If it wasn’t for Shyway and Shottzy Vods, I would never have picked up this game last year.
> I get what you’re saying, but their data shows this is the lesser of the two evils, from a player retention standpoint.
Let’s say that 343 is a restaurant that servers Hamburgers. You drive up and ask for a burger, and in a reasonable amount of time, they bring one out to you. You take a bite, and spit it out, wondering “WTF kind of burger is this?”. You take the burger apart and realise that one half of the burger is a pork substitute. You walk up to the counter and ask “What gives?”.
> “Well, we didn’t have enough ingredients (players in the playlist) to make the burger all the way for you, so we added in the pork for you. That way you still get the burger you asked for”
>
> “This isn’t the burger I asked for, I asked for a beef burger” (points to menu).
>
> “yeah we know, but we didn’t have the ingredients so we gave you this one”
>
> " Why didn’t you tell me and ask to substitute the pork in?"
>
> “Welllll, the data shows that from a customer retention point of view…”
(Let’s remember that a good amount of people don’t like the taste of pork, or don’t eat it at all for X reasons.)
At that point, there is a group of customers that will walk out of the door and never walk back in, full stop. (Those people know the restaurant doesn’t care about the product or the customer, just the customer’s money/time). Some customers will throw out the burger because they view it as inedible, some customers will sit down to finish it, and some will say they will just come back another night. But each successive time that occurs, the customer count goes down due to people inevitably not getting the burger they ask for.
Throw in some other factors, such as time/energy spent getting to the restaurant. Customer A spent all day working, and then drove across town with the little free time they have after work for that sweet, sweet burger. Customer A gets the substitute without being told… and you can guess how that goes from there. Customer B does not like pork to the point where they will not eat it, so when they get the substitute they tell the restaurant to kick rocks and never comes back. Customer C has just enough money (time) for 1 burger, so when they take a bite they are inevitably disappointed because that is all they can get and have spent all their available “money” on it.
They all have a bad taste in their mouth due to the handling of the situation, and the burger (some to greater degrees than others).
Now let’s imagine a restaurant that cares about the customer (as much as a restaurant could or should care).
> “Hey can I have a number 1 please”
>
> “Sure, that will be X amount of money”
>
> The cashier turns back and yells to the kitchen "May I have a number one "
>
> Kitchen yells back “We don’t have enough beef tonight”
>
> “Hey man, sorry, we actually don’t have enough beef tonight to make another Number 1. We do have these other options available, would you like to go with one of those? We could also do a substitute meat instead, but we will discount you in that situation”
In this scenario, the customer has been given a choice, and sure they may be pissed a bit, but they appreciate the gesture. They also would be more understanding because life happens, and you can’t always be in stock. If it’s late night, they probably understand quite well and may be used it to a degree.
Then this magical moment can occur:
> “So when do you think would be a good time to come by and grab a number 1?”
>
> “So our ingredients are usually in stock during these hours, and we usually run out around these times.”
Player retention is in the nuance. When you use the “data” and act like 343, you end up with the current debacle we all are experiencing.
The phrase, was, is, and always will be “it is the last straw that breaks the camel’s back”.
I think the core issue is that not playing at all is probably the fastest way to lose players, versus having unbalanced matches. You can debate it, but I think most people will side with 343 on that, long restaurant metaphor aside. Your Xbox has lots of games. If Halo can’t find me a slayer match at all, I’m just going to play a different games, and if it happens two or three times in a row, I’m just going to delete it since it’s a waste of disk space.
As far as population, you can argue various reasons why it’s gotten so low. I actually think for the most part H5’s multiplayer has been really good. I don’t agree with some weapon tweaks, and a lot of map feature decisions I find inscrutable, but those are normal things to expect players to occasionally disagree with, and it’s all generally been well handled.
That being said, it has become pretty unplayable unless you queue with a team. It’s becoming more common, depending on the night, to have mid-platinums and onyx or even champions in games together when they queue solo, and it’s simply not much fun for anyone involved. I’ve uninstalled, and will probably sit it out until Infinite comes out–regardless of how you or anyone else feels, H5 is not a priority and we’re not expecting adjustments unless something critical breaks. The matchmaking is trying its best, but the players just don’t seem to be there to create good matches, at least when I’m on.
SWAT has looser rank matching than other playlists.
> 2533274875845267;1:
> So, one of my recent games, 2 silvers and 2 golds get matched against 2 onyx and 2 diamonds in ranked swat. It’s not even a game at that point. Why aren’t there checks and balances against this stuff? It’s super discouraging.
That doesn’t make sense, if it was ranked you should have been paired with others that were the same rank as you
> 2753763522162009;2:
> > 2533274875845267;1:
> > So, one of my recent games, 2 silvers and 2 golds get matched against 2 onyx and 2 diamonds in ranked swat. It’s not even a game at that point. Why aren’t there checks and balances against this stuff? It’s super discouraging.
>
> That sucks, but with the small population and the time you were playing the options probably were: the other team doesn’t get a match at all or it matches you.
>
> That being said, the system expects you to lose so you won’t lose much (or any) MMR for losing.
Man I swear they throw in a gold so nobody gets csr it happens every game. Been stuxk at 1620 because every loss costs me 10csr and every gain is 1csr.
> 2753763522162009;5:
> > 2535435685526493;4:
> > > the other team doesn’t get a match at all or it matches you.
> >
> > Ah yes, the classic logic of “well, in the interest of time, we are going to waste your time with a match you (most likely) would never win”. The do no harm option is to not have anyone’s time wasted with the match to begin with and just to say there are not enough people in the playlist.
>
> I get what you’re saying, but their data shows this is the lesser of the two evils, from a player retention standpoint.
While they sit with a population lower than ever. Guiz but the data says! Well your data was wrong and now nobody plays. But the data!
> 2533274825726490;13:
> > 2753763522162009;5:
> > > 2535435685526493;4:
> > > > the other team doesn’t get a match at all or it matches you.
> > >
> > > Ah yes, the classic logic of “well, in the interest of time, we are going to waste your time with a match you (most likely) would never win”. The do no harm option is to not have anyone’s time wasted with the match to begin with and just to say there are not enough people in the playlist.
> >
> > I get what you’re saying, but their data shows this is the lesser of the two evils, from a player retention standpoint.
>
> While they sit with a population lower than ever. Guiz but the data says! Well your data was wrong and now nobody plays. But the data!
Yes…they could see that players markedly stopped playing more with slower matching time. Just because that doesn’t jive with the sentiment in this thread doesn’t mean it’s incorrect for the playerbase as a whole.