What is this classic "Halo gameplay"?

Games Other Halo
1

Everyone keeps throwing this term around about how Halo 4 has drastically changed since 3. While I do admit it changed, I don’t agree with their definition. Everyone uses MLG’s setting as classic settings such as BR starts only. That is not the classic Halo gametype I know and it is not as fun as the ranked match settings that were present in Halo 3. Remember how everyone started with the AR and everyone went to go look for the BR and Carbine because it gave you an advantage against the AR starters? Remember BRs giving you the AR as well and not them cheap pistols? I found the Assault rifle only starts and BR w/assault rifle starts classic more fun than the dull MLG starts. Don’t get me wrong, I do enjoy MLG settings every now and then, but do I miss it? No, I do miss starting off with the AR only.

But Halo 4 did had some improvements that I like. I know a lot of people don’t like the create a class feature (camo and PR being the culprits), but I as well as a significant portion of the Halo 4 players liked the fact that we had options of picking different precision rifles and AR’s. You guys could guess what was my first loadout option when i first popped in Halo 4 during launch, it was AR w/ BR firepower, ammo, and Hologram and frag grenades because I wanted to get the classic feel of Halo 3 and to be honest I sort of did. I never gave Reach a chance because Armor lock and bloom ruined it for me. but after Halo 4 came out, It seem the series was back on track.

Now a lot of people don’t like the Infinity settings and opt to vote for the pro settings. But I can’t stand Halo 4’s ‘pro’ settings. There alright at best, but seem dull to me. I enjoy infinity slayer because I actually think it is more ‘fun’. But is pro more competive? It sure is somewhat. But honestly i sometimes take a break from Halo 4 and go play Team Throwdown and Team Snipers because It reminds me alot of Halo 3. I was a massive SWAT player in Halo 3 but I wish the maps were smaller in Halo 4 but I still enjoy it. BR is a beast. I think the pro playlist that was available at launch were more competitive and fun then these “pro” and even “AGL” settings that are presently available. Why? well these “pro” settings don’t even feel like the classic Halo 3 gameplay, they feel like Halo 4 is trying to be competitive. I don’t want that. I hate how i can’t start with the AR in pro.

Now lets talk about ordnance. When I first used my first ordnance, I heard the announcer exclaim “Request confirm” and i fell in love with it because I had a killing frenzy. I was like Sweet. Not once did i thought Halo 4 was copying Call of duty killstreaks. I thought this was an awesome idea. Until ordnance got really old to the point that it is like watever to me now.

Now you might not think I am a Halo purist, but I am. I really like Snipers and Team throwdown because they kinda feel like Halo 3 for me, but I also like infinity gametypes. It’s like 2 games in one. I been waiting to renew my gold membership and play again, im so eager. Even for the weapon buffs to. But I admit, I was skeptical about 343’s decisions:

  1. I think starting with plasma grenades was a bad idea, until I noticed the Grenade danger indicator.
  2. The grenade indicator makes dodging frag grenades a lot easy. I was like “343 had to copy Call of duty”. As a halo 3 purist, I was mad because now Frag grenades seem Underpowered but you still can learn how to use them.
  3. Plasma pistol was a bad idea, but no more noob combo at least right? Plasma grenades and plasma pistols don’t really bother me, I learned to adapt and become a better warthog driver.

So I have to ask the Waypoint visitors, is MLG/AGL settings the classic gameplay we want? or is the classic gameplay the old everyone starts with AR and have the precision rifles available to be picked up in the maps? I think the later is the classic and original I want and maybe the solution.

2

IMO, “classic Halo gameplay” refers to the idea that when I see an enemy player, I know it’s just my accuracy and strategy that will determine who dies. There is no random ordnance, no armor abilities, and no “perks.”

343 decided to borrow a lot of elements from CoD, and that was a bad idea because even though they are the same genre, they have completely opposite gameplay styles.

3

Even starts.

4

It’s basically just you, your BR/DMR/AR and your grenades. No AA’s, No Personal Loadouts, and No Personal Ordnance.

5

https://forums.halowaypoint.com/yaf_postst209755_Halo-3-MM-veterans-will-you.aspx

This is thread that should answer your questions.

6

> Even starts.

The term is symmetrical starts.
Beyond team skill, we do have even starts in Halo4, unless a player purposely chooses to limit themselves.

> IMO, “classic Halo gameplay” refers to the idea that when I see an enemy player, I know it’s just my accuracy and strategy that will determine who dies. There is no random ordnance, no armor abilities, and no “perks.”

Unless it’s CTF and the enemy doesn’t know what PW I’m packing while carrying the flag.
Or it’s CE and I have an M6 and the enemy doesn’t have a sniper or rockets.
Or it’s H2 and the enemy isn’t using a BR with button combos but I am.
Or it’s H3 and I’m just lucky the BR is as accurate as it is in red reticle range because the rest of the non-PW’s are way to random and/or weak feeling.

Once we get in to Halo: Reach, now we’re starting to get into strategy and accuracy applying to much more of the sandbox because now you can feel a difference in weapon niche ranges. Not power levels due to BR/DMR versus sniper but AR vs DMR in varying ranges does start to influence the strategy of the game. As long as you have the accuracy, you can be rewarded more so with strategy.

When players say classic they really mean No Sprint, symmetrical starts and PW’s on the map.
… 2 out of 3 ain’t bad. Aside from the sprint function, which admittedly 343i can release a gametype with it disabled, symmetrical starts and PW’s can be had on the map.

For a classic experience we do not need every weapon used. We can spawn with either DMR’s, BR’s , LR’s, AR’s or SR’s as our primaries and either the Magnum, AR or SR as our secondary. But that’s all dependent on what you want, a true classic approach or a classic ideal approach. It’s either BR+Magnum or AR+Magnum for true classic starts but the DMR and LR can replace the BR depending on what your intent/map is. BR starts on most maps, LR starts for BTB map?
One could spawn with the AR but the SR is much more “classic” in mechanic use. Maybe not sound, looks or “reloading” but as far as how the gun works, it’s the CEAR massaged for more effectual use.

For weapons on the map, I’d like Shotguns, Needlers, Railguns, Incineration Cannons and a Beam… However the classic experience is Shotgun, Rockets and Sniper for “skilled” PW placement. You could choose to place Needlers on the map as the H4 Needler is a beast.

But I’d prefer a tuned ordinance system for varying gametypes much more than having classic settings applied across the board.
I’d like infinite ammo removed from SWAT and Snipers and allow players to call in ammo and/or upgrades. SWAT, call in a DMR, BR or Magnum for ammo/swap. In Snipers call in a SniRi for ammo, a BeRi for an upgrade or a damage boost. Or go get ammo of the dead.
I’d like Objective games to give less PW’s and more abilities/heavy weapons. Slayer could use a similar tuning…
Oh and at the very least, more themed tuning for the ordnance drops. Especially if we have Covenant maps coming. We have human and Forerunner themed maps for their themed drops but nothing to fight for a Covenant theme.

7

Its called competitive gameplay. You need to earn your kills.

8

If you have to ask, you’ll never know.

9

> Even starts.

^^^^^^^^^^^^ This ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Halo was all about starting evenly, the better players will naturally do well in game, they don’t need to be rewarded.

Also better vehicle play. No one uses vehicles much because they are weak and the maps aren’t suited for them. In halo 3 there were wide open spaces and they were worth entering (even the mongooses).

10

> Even starts.

This^

11

> If you have to ask, you’ll never know.

I like this too…

12

> Even starts.

“Even starts” does not mean the same thing as “same starts”. People should spawn about evenly in their ability to kill, I agree, but it doesn’t mean they have to have the same things. I’d say some one that starts with a BR has the same chance to kill some one as another player that has a Carbine.

13

The term “classic gameplay” basically means that - individual skill and teamwork aside - both teams start with the same chances to win; all players start with the same weapon(s), have the same vehicles available (if any), and so on. It basically means that random factors and good/bad luck are removed as much as possible, as well as removing things that might give one team an advantage.

For example, if there’s only one certain power-up like an overshield or rocket launcher on a map, it’s equally far away from both team’s initial spawn points. And if there are two of a kind, like two sniper rifles, each sniper rifle is equally far or close to each team’s respective starting location. This also means that - unless teams take turns in attacking/defending like in one-sided CTF - the maps have to be symmetrical.

14

As said, H2 and H3 1-Bomb or 1-Flag where the vehicle and weapon spawns are not equal.

Equal oppournity and symmetrical starts are not the same thing.

Even team slayer on asymmetrical maps is both popular and not “equal.” Equal oppourtunity, at least after some Forge tweaks sometimes, but not exact same.

15

> > Even starts.
>
> The term is symmetrical starts.
> Beyond team skill, we do have even starts in Halo4, unless a player purposely chooses to limit themselves.

Actually this isn’t true, what you can spawn with in any Infinity playlist is determined by your Spartan Rank, at Level 1 you only have one Primary Weapon, one Secondary and one Grenade type.

However, at Level 130, you have access to up to seven Primary Weapons, three Secondary Weapons, three Grenade types, eight Armour Abilities, nine Tactical Packages and eleven Support Upgrades. Additionally, players may choose Firepower as a Tactical Package, allowing them to wield two Primary Weapons off-the-bat.

I have to say, the scales are, ever so slightly, tipped in favour of who’s been playing for longer.

Additionally, each side has RODs in all of the Infinity Playlists and even many of the non-Infinity Playlists, this means that one side could have one type of weapon drop, say, a Needler, while the other has another type of weapon drop, say, an Incineration Cannon. Not exactly fair is it?

Furthermore, some maps, Exile for example, allow one team to spawn with a weapon or vehicle over the other team, with Exile again as an example I’m talking about the Gauss Warthog.

And all this without me choosing to ‘limit’ myself.

16

In my book, classic Halo gameplay was that everyone started off on an even footing and basically the people with a better skill walked off winners…
Not noobs who get rockets every ordnance, while I only ever get Yoink!

It was the even start outs that made Halo great, Halo 5 needs to go back in that direction, maybe then it’ll be a popular series again…

17

> > > Even starts.
> >
> > The term is symmetrical starts.
> > Beyond team skill, we do have even starts in Halo4, unless a player purposely chooses to limit themselves.
>
> Actually this isn’t true, what you can spawn with in any Infinity playlist is determined by your Spartan Rank, at Level 1 you only have one Primary Weapon, one Secondary and one Grenade type.
>
> However, at Level 130, you have access to up to seven Primary Weapons, three Secondary Weapons, three Grenade types, eight Armour Abilities, nine Tactical Packages and eleven Support Upgrades. Additionally, players may choose Firepower as a Tactical Package, allowing them to wield two Primary Weapons off-the-bat.
>
> I have to say, the scales are, ever so slightly, tipped in favour of who’s been playing for longer.

I do admit the scales are tipped slightly in favour of a 130 over a 1.
However let’s say a 130 starts a new and dives right into MP. How limited is this player in combat once they unlock the DMR or BR at SR2? Is the difference between an SR50 and SR130 that great?
And I am willing to not talk about a “legit” SR130 taking on a player who’s playing their first ever game (and not choosing a map given loadout). It doesn’t matter what when it’s a seasoned player versus a first timer who doesn’t even pick the map loadout with the precision weapon they should use (but might not even know how to use).

> Additionally, each side has RODs in all of the Infinity Playlists and even many of the non-Infinity Playlists, this means that one side could have one type of weapon drop, say, a Needler, while the other has another type of weapon drop, say, an Incineration Cannon. Not exactly fair is it?

First, by limiting the ordinance to “power levels” instead of allowing the entire sandbox would allow for both diversity and a prevention of such imbalance.
Second, I am not finding too many random drops these days, are you sure they’re still active. I consistently find the same ordnance off of spawn, not random. And it definitely feels like I’m finding the same heavy and powerweapons in the same spots where ever I go.

> Furthermore, some maps, Exile for example, allow one team to spawn with a weapon or vehicle over the other team, with Exile again as an example I’m talking about the Gauss Warthog.

One word, two syllables: Headlong
Or how about: Relic
Or how about: Zanzibar

Watching the Vid-doc on Halo2 that players like to pop up and say “See that’s Halo.”, well it actually is Bungie not only stating how much they’re taking a risk by changing H:CE’s core gameplay of the triangle, they also boast about how they intend to make 1-sided maps and engagements and “randomise” things.

Edit: Yes I do believe Throwdown is a more refined way of having asymmetrical arena-gameplay. No I do not believe Infinity settings are 100% competitive arena-useable, at least not in their current form.

18

Halo used to be balanced and had even starts.

Now its not.

19

My definition of classic Halo gameplay would be:

No sprint, no loadouts, none of these “perks,” no armor abilities, no ordinance,none of that crap. Everyone starts off even, for example: everyone starts off with an Assault Rifle and Magnum. No extra tricks up his sleeve, simply the same as the Spartan to his left and to his right, and the Spartan he plans to kill. And you have to work to get map superiority and power weapon superiority. I remember the mad dash to the rocket launcher spawn on The Pit in Halo 3 was totally hectic. Sometimes I went that route to try and get right into the fight, others I would go right, grab a sniper, and provide long range support for my assaulting teammates, as well as eliminating the potential sniper at the other side of the map.

Long story short, my definition of classic Halo gameplay is all the same starts, no ordinance, and you actually have to work to get your tools of destruction and choose your engagements tactically, because with no sprint, you can’t run away with your tail between your legs. It’s either fight to survive the engagement or die trying. If, and only IF, you’re close to cover you can retreat to get the fire off of you and regain shield power to continue the battle.

20

> Halo used to be balanced and had even starts.
>
> Now its not.

It’s really the personal loadouts that bother me. Everyone should have the same starting weapons (BR, Pistol, & Frags). All other weapons should be placed on the map accordingly, especially the plasma pistol/nades.