It seems like we are all in a little cycle here as the Halo community with 343.
Halo 4-
-343 adds a whole wack of “modern” mechanics(perks, loutdouts, killstreaks, hit markers, etc)
-“Purist” section of the community dislikes the changes and explain why these types of changes are both unnecessary and harmful to Halo MP.
-343 and the 343 defense force(both on waypoint and abroad) counter saying these “modern” mechanics are %100 needed and that any game that doesn’t have them wiil be stale, forgotten, dated and generally obsolete.
-Game releases. MP totally bombs. MM is a ghost town.
-343 realises that “purists” were correct and remove perks,loudouts, killstreaks, etc.
Halo 5
-343 adds a whole wack of “modern” mechanics(mantling, unlimited sprint, ADS, ground pound, slide, etc)
-“Purist” section of the community dislikes the changes and explain why these types of changes are both unnecessary and harmful to Halo MP.
-343 and the 343 defense force(both on waypoint and abroad) counter saying these “modern” mechanics are %100 needed and that any game that doesn’t have them wiil be stale, forgotten, dated and generally obsolete.(in many cases these are the EXACT same people. Some will reply to this very thread).
-Game releases…?
First off, let’s get something straight. Halo 4’s matchmaking didn’t bomb because of mechanics alone. I want you to go back and look at what other game came out a week later. Black Ops 2 came out a week later and was the biggest CoD before its decline. The market influences population swings. People are gonna leave Halo 5 for black ops 3, people from black ops 3 will go to battlefront and so on. It’s mostly about the market.
Well, keep in mind that the situation with halo 5 is very different from halo 4.
With halo 4, the MP wasn’t all that great while we already know that the Halo 5 MP is a vast improvement.
On top of that, halo 4’s level system was horrible, stopping people st leveling up once they got to 70. This system will most likely not return to halo 5.
And then, like all of us know, halo 4 fell victim to the release of BO2. But now, BO3 is teleasing, and the call of duty community us even more torn on that than it was with AW.
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> First off, let’s get something straight. Halo 4’s matchmaking didn’t bomb because of mechanics alone. I want you to go back and look at what other game came out a week later. Black Ops 2 came out a week later and was the biggest CoD before its decline. The market influences population swings. People are gonna leave Halo 5 for black ops 3, people from black ops 3 will go to battlefront and so on. It’s mostly about the market.
This, but also this is what the detractors are saying, have been saying (myself included) since before Halo 4. If you make a Halo game for COD players, it will fail. Make Halo for the people who don’t play COD.
> 2533274889350043;2:
> First off, let’s get something straight. Halo 4’s matchmaking didn’t bomb because of mechanics alone. I want you to go back and look at what other game came out a week later. Black Ops 2 came out a week later and was the biggest CoD before its decline. The market influences population swings. People are gonna leave Halo 5 for black ops 3, people from black ops 3 will go to battlefront and so on. It’s mostly about the market.
H4 fell out of the XBL top 10.
TEN
TEN
TEN
why didn’t these factors influence the other 10 games above H4 in the same manner it did H4?
You can make as many excuses as you want. If H4 MP had ANY kind of mass market appeal it would not have fell that low. Especially considering H4 had an install base of 10 million people. Some of the games above it did not even sell 1 million copies on 360. The fact that games that sold 1/10th as much as H4 had more people playing their MP is staggering. There is NOTHING to blame other than H4’s MP itself.
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> > 2533274889350043;2:
> > First off, let’s get something straight. Halo 4’s matchmaking didn’t bomb because of mechanics alone. I want you to go back and look at what other game came out a week later. Black Ops 2 came out a week later and was the biggest CoD before its decline. The market influences population swings. People are gonna leave Halo 5 for black ops 3, people from black ops 3 will go to battlefront and so on. It’s mostly about the market.
>
>
> This, but also this is what the detractors are saying, have been saying (myself included) since before Halo 4. If you make a Halo game for COD players, it will fail. Make Halo for the people who don’t play COD.
I don’t play COD and I loved Halo 4’s MP. Does that make me an exception to the rule?
That said, to me the issue wasn’t the abilities that were added, it was the way they were added… Not everyone had the same access to them. That seems to have been resolved in Halo 5
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> > 2533274889350043;2:
> > First off, let’s get something straight. Halo 4’s matchmaking didn’t bomb because of mechanics alone. I want you to go back and look at what other game came out a week later. Black Ops 2 came out a week later and was the biggest CoD before its decline. The market influences population swings. People are gonna leave Halo 5 for black ops 3, people from black ops 3 will go to battlefront and so on. It’s mostly about the market.
>
>
> This, but also this is what the detractors are saying, have been saying (myself included) since before Halo 4. If you make a Halo game for COD players, it will fail. Make Halo for the people who don’t play COD.
ding ding ding
There is your problem right there. When you share base mechanics with so many other games it is very easy for gamers to jump ship from your game. Halo 4 and H5 share too much in common with other FPS games on the market. Instead of having a unique appeal(HCE, H2, H3) that can foster a playerbase you have a shared appeal with several other games and a shared playerbase with said other games.
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> > 2547348539238747;5:
> > > 2533274889350043;2:
> > > First off, let’s get something straight. Halo 4’s matchmaking didn’t bomb because of mechanics alone. I want you to go back and look at what other game came out a week later. Black Ops 2 came out a week later and was the biggest CoD before its decline. The market influences population swings. People are gonna leave Halo 5 for black ops 3, people from black ops 3 will go to battlefront and so on. It’s mostly about the market.
> >
> >
> > This, but also this is what the detractors are saying, have been saying (myself included) since before Halo 4. If you make a Halo game for COD players, it will fail. Make Halo for the people who don’t play COD.
>
>
> I don’t play COD and I loved Halo 4’s MP. Does that make me an exception to the rule?
>
> That said, to me the issue wasn’t the abilities that were added, it was the way they were added… Not everyone had the same access to them. That seems to have been resolved in Halo 5
There are always exceptions, unfortunately for Halo 4 there was only about 20,000 max exceptions.
If anything you (and I) help prove that Halo players don’t play COD, that’s why we play Halo. If we wanted COD, we’d play COD, just as the millions of players do.
The question now is, is it the level system and abilities that put people off about COD or is it that plus the twitch style of play.
I like it, so I’ll still play it regardless. 20,000 people or not, as long as there’s still a lot of people to play with, I’ll keep playing. I have an unconditional love for Halo, and nothing will sway that.
> 2533274933749851;10:
> I like it, so I’ll still play it regardless. 20,000 people or not, as long as there’s still a lot of people to play with, I’ll keep playing. I have an unconditional love for Halo, and nothing will sway that.
It doesn’t bother you at all that millions of your fellow Halo fans are being turned off the games because of 343’s decisions to try and cater Halo games to other people?
I think it’s headed down that road as of right now. Maybe 343 has some secrets that will make it amazing and the changes they have made to the beta, if they actually make the changes they have said, is a step in the right direction. People saying it’s other games are ignorant, Halo 3 survived COD in its prime as well as Gears of War, and Halo Reach. If a game is unbelievable the population will maintain for a year minimum. Halo 4 lost 87% of its population 6 months after release, Halo 3 didn’t lose that population until FOUR YEARS after release. The reason I believe is that it was just like every other fps on the market with a larger skill gap than any other fps out there killing both the casual community (don’t like how difficult compared to COD, BF, etc) and the hard core community (hated the mechanics and perks, and everything else new player friendly) in one shot. This can’t happen again.
> 2533274889350043;2:
> First off, let’s get something straight. Halo 4’s matchmaking didn’t bomb because of mechanics alone. I want you to go back and look at what other game came out a week later. Black Ops 2 came out a week later and was the biggest CoD before its decline. The market influences population swings. People are gonna leave Halo 5 for black ops 3, people from black ops 3 will go to battlefront and so on. It’s mostly about the market.
Very true, the market is saturated with FPS now, its not like when Halo 2 or 3 came out when there was little to no competition. That being said the 343 games are not like the old Halos, and its what turned a lot of people off. I personally respect 343 for making changes BUT there are some changes that they have made to the series that have strayed too far away from the original series
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> > 2533274889350043;2:
> > First off, let’s get something straight. Halo 4’s matchmaking didn’t bomb because of mechanics alone. I want you to go back and look at what other game came out a week later. Black Ops 2 came out a week later and was the biggest CoD before its decline. The market influences population swings. People are gonna leave Halo 5 for black ops 3, people from black ops 3 will go to battlefront and so on. It’s mostly about the market.
>
>
> Very true, the market is saturated with FPS now, its not like when Halo 2 or 3 came out when there was little to no competition
People are absolutely going to leave Halo 5 for BlackOps 3, the question is will they come back?
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> > 2533274889350043;2:
> > First off, let’s get something straight. Halo 4’s matchmaking didn’t bomb because of mechanics alone. I want you to go back and look at what other game came out a week later. Black Ops 2 came out a week later and was the biggest CoD before its decline. The market influences population swings. People are gonna leave Halo 5 for black ops 3, people from black ops 3 will go to battlefront and so on. It’s mostly about the market.
>
>
> Very true, the market is saturated with FPS now, its not like when Halo 2 or 3 came out when there was little to no competition.
Where do people get this BS from? H3 had waaayyy stiffer competition than H4 did. Go back and look at what came out in 07 and 08. It was stacked beyond belief.
H2 competed against star Wars BF. The game who’s sequel is set to crush H5 into a fine pulp.
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> > 2533274891747470;13:
> > > 2533274889350043;2:
> > > First off, let’s get something straight. Halo 4’s matchmaking didn’t bomb because of mechanics alone. I want you to go back and look at what other game came out a week later. Black Ops 2 came out a week later and was the biggest CoD before its decline. The market influences population swings. People are gonna leave Halo 5 for black ops 3, people from black ops 3 will go to battlefront and so on. It’s mostly about the market.
> >
> >
> > Very true, the market is saturated with FPS now, its not like when Halo 2 or 3 came out when there was little to no competition.
>
>
> Where do people get this BS from? H3 had waaayyy stiffer competition than H4 did. Go back and look at what came out in 07 and 08. It was stacked beyond belief.
>
> H2 competed against star Wars BF. The game who’s sequel is set to crush H5 into a fine pulp.
You heard him 343, your game is going to get crushed. Best not bother then
How are you considering this “whole wack of modern mechanics” modern? Does modern mean departure from the old stuff? Does it mean things that exist in other games already? define “Modern” for me. And yes its relevant
> 2533274889350043;2:
> First off, let’s get something straight. Halo 4’s matchmaking didn’t bomb because of mechanics alone. I want you to go back and look at what other game came out a week later. Black Ops 2 came out a week later and was the biggest CoD before its decline. The market influences population swings. People are gonna leave Halo 5 for black ops 3, people from black ops 3 will go to battlefront and so on. It’s mostly about the market.
COD 4, Mass Effect, BioShock, Gears of War (Nov. 06) all released around the same time as Halo 3 and all were huge games. Halo 3 didn’t lose the % of population Halo 4 did until four years after release that includes COD world at war, modern warfare 2, black ops 1, modern warefare 3, Gears of War 2 and 3, BioShock 2, and Mass Effect 2. Those are only the shooters that were on the Xbox during that time, you also have your assasians creed and all the PlayStation and nintendo games that people played. It’s not the market, if Halo 5 is amazing and as innovative as Halo 3 was for its time then the population will maintain, your argument is FALSE.
> 2535445935493284;15:
> > 2533274891747470;13:
> > > 2533274889350043;2:
> > > First off, let’s get something straight. Halo 4’s matchmaking didn’t bomb because of mechanics alone. I want you to go back and look at what other game came out a week later. Black Ops 2 came out a week later and was the biggest CoD before its decline. The market influences population swings. People are gonna leave Halo 5 for black ops 3, people from black ops 3 will go to battlefront and so on. It’s mostly about the market.
> >
> >
> > Very true, the market is saturated with FPS now, its not like when Halo 2 or 3 came out when there was little to no competition.
>
>
> Where do people get this BS from? H3 had waaayyy stiffer competition than H4 did. Go back and look at what came out in 07 and 08. It was stacked beyond belief.
>
> H2 competed against star Wars BF. The game who’s sequel is set to crush H5 into a fine pulp.
So you have seen the future and know star war battlefront will wipe the floor with halo 5? Even considering the fact people are already slightly sceptical of the new battlefront from it not sticking to the exact premises of the original? Kind of like Halo? but your logic is Battlefront is allowed to change do something new and different from before but Halo is not?