WHAT DOES HALO 4 NEED TO BRING BACK THE COMPETITIVENES ?

Games Other Halo
1

Halo 2 was a competitive game, it was strategical. All MM maps were unbelievable in the sense that they were all in a way meant for strategy. (If you rushed you were almost certaintly a dead man walking). Teams had to battle for sniper rifles, energy swords and rocket launchers. Supremecy and victory was given to those that had the best strategy (weather that be starving the opposition sniper of the rifle by camping up in the rocks of the map relic and picking off those who dare walk into no mans land).

There has been alot of changes since Halo 2 and its MM, Halo 3 wasnt so bad but it seemed to have lost that edge, and Halo reach just ruined it for me ! Sprint ? Jet packs ? Armour abilities ? There was no stratgey left, all you had to do was choose your load out jet pack into the sky and shoot.

My question is, how does 343i change all the wrong doings of bungie ? (Dont get me wrong bungie hats off to you, but you messed up big time after Halo 2)

So what do they do ?

  • Get rid of armour abilities
  • Enhance map sizes
  • Take better choice of where they are placing weapons on maps
  • Get rid of Load outs

All im saying is bring back the strategy of the game ! Bring back the fun !

2
  1. An effective ranking system that differentiates between social and competitive. Be it a visible 1-50 or whatever, but ensure it gives rise to even games.
  2. No AA’s or Equipment in these Ranked playlists. Especially not sprint (it destroys tactical gameplay)
  3. Balanced maps that aren’t too big, unless its Big Team.
  4. Consistent weaponry (no bloom or random spread - Halo 2 had terrible weapon spread btw).
  5. A larger difference between average and ideal kill times and a slight decrease in ideal kill times.
  6. Faster base movement and faster strafe movement.

Enjoy
:smiley:

3

> 1) An effective ranking system that differentiates between social and competitive. Be it a visible 1-50 or whatever, but ensure it gives rise to even games.
> 2) No AA’s or Equipment in these Ranked playlists. Especially not sprint (it destroys tactical gameplay)
> 3) Balanced maps that aren’t too big, unless its Big Team.
> 4) Consistent weaponry (no bloom or random spread - Halo 2 had terrible weapon spread btw).
> 5) A larger difference between average and ideal kill times and a slight decrease in ideal kill times.
> 6) Faster base movement and faster strafe movement.
>
> Enjoy
> :smiley:

I think you mean Halo 3 had terrible weapon spread, unless you’re talking about automatic weapons. The BR in Halo 2 had no spread.

4

I’m going to be honest the BR/Sniper in 3 was a lot harder to use than in 2. Halo 2 was hit-scan, 3 you were forced to lead your target at distance, that created a huge player skill gap. 2 was just easier than 3, in a lot of respects. Halo 2 had the BxR, BYYR, etc and if you knew it you got kills you didn’t really deserve (I used it all the time.) 3 wasn’t as cheap.

5

1-50!!!

6

> - Enhance map sizes

Outside of BTB Halo’s always played best on relatively small maps. So what’s your theory here?

Here are my main points that a competitive Halo title needs:

* Plenty of Good Asymmetrical Maps
Contrary to popular belief asymmetrical maps play the best outside of asymmetrical objective gametypes. Yes, I’m saying asymmetrical maps work better for team deathmatch than symmetrical ones. Symmetrical maps, due to their symmetry, only halve the possible tactics a player or team could use. Partly due to this they’re boring to play on, but perhaps the biggest factor that makes them boring is the fact that they’re too balanced. By now you must be wondering whether or not I’m sane. I assure you, I am. A completely balanced map equates to gameplay that only involves pushing. How do you win a game of Team Slayer on The Pit? You keep pushing with your team. That’s the only tactic you ever need on any symmetrical map and it’s boring!
Asymmetrical maps are far more fun not only to play, but to watch too (a bonus for tourny holders). This is because there’s always an active defence and offence role being filled by each team. Good asymmetrical maps always revolve around a purposeful imbalance in the design where one team “defends” and the other team “attacks”. The team that exploits the imbalance the best wins, but why is an imbalance in the map good? It’s good because it turns the boring, static push, push, push gameplay found on symmetrical maps into a dynamic attack/defend style of gameplay. If you still have doubts just play a game on Lockout and then one on The Pit.

* Zero Randomness Inherent
Having random elements like Halo 3’s BR spread and Reach’s bloom only leads to you fighting the game itself and no player genuinely wants that. You should be fighting your opponents, not the game. Your opponents should be frustrating you, not the game. Thus the player should be the only random element within the game.

* A Good Weapon Sandbox
Notice how I didn’t say “a balanced sandbox”? That’s because a balanced sandbox is boring. A balanced sandbox infers that every weapon is an equal, but if every weapon is an equal what’s the point of having more weapons? Besides aesthetic reasons there isn’t. What a competitive Halo needs as an unbalanced sandbox where every weapon has a function. CE was the closest out of the trilogy in achieving this and consequently it was praised as the most competitive.

* The Possibility of Fast Gameplay
A competitive game doesn’t naturally have fast gameplay: the speed of the game is attached to the player’s skill. If you’re good with a weapon you should be able to kill fast with that weapon, if you’re bad with it kill times should increase, dramatically. In other words the maximum and minimum kill time for each weapon should have a large spread.

* Predictability
Grenades shouldn’t just serve as weapons, they should also be movement deterrents. A competitive game needs to be a game where you can predict your opponents’ actions accurately for the sole reason that randomness can not be mastered whilst predictability can. A good tool to give to players so that they have the ability to accurately predict their opponents movement are grenades, lots of 'em. A player should be able to deny access to a route via grenade spam, which means giving players more than two nades of each type. Let’s go back to four.

That’s all I can think of at the moment…

7

Bloom is not exactly random it has more variables. compared to zero bloom (which is only limited by the curvature of the planet) it has a Higher skill ceiling because there are simply More elements to master. you can still strafe with bloom its just harder. in a way the BR did have a bigger skill gap but a smaller overall curve of skill. it now feels like there are many skill gaps not just one big one. Now you have to Aim and have rhythm. (I got the rhythm licked but my aim is off)

When I go back to the BR it now feels inelegant in comparison to the DMRs’ more complex and subtle mechanics. The BR is easier to use and easier to master and much easier to pwn noobs with. This is not the definition of competitiveness. So what if you have to swap killtacs for triple kills? its not as if suddenly less skilled players are winning against better players.

So in answer to the op I say this Reach is competitive just not as you know it. Every game has got harder, The utility weapon Refined with each game so excelling is harder the skill curve has been stretched not squashed. Maybe stretched to far? it has left a lot of people upset and frankly spouting nonsense about low skill which is understandable but totally untrue

8

-No AA’s in multiplayer at all
-1-50 ranking system
-No credits
-Some may hate me saying it but, the BR should make a return
-No bloom
-Bring back maps like Standoff, The Pit, Turf, Midship, Guardian, and some larger maps for BTB and invasion if they include it.

9

> it has a Higher skill ceiling because there are simply More elements to master

You can’t master randomness. On top of that strafing is not harder, it’s less effective thanks to bloom. As the reticule blooms the area of possible impact increase; a strafe that would dodge a static reticle may no longer do so because the dynamic reticule grows. Let’s not even forget the bullet magnetism in Reach, further increasing the chance of a misguided shot to land. If you don’t understand what I’m saying just look at this picture. With a static reticle and no randomness in play (I’m looking at you Halo 3 BR) that would be a clean miss, but thanks to bloom and its ability to make the area of possible impact grow it’s possible that it’ll be a hit, as depicted in the picture.

10

I remember playing with a good, well skilled player when Reach MLG kicked off my friend consistently had one of the better KDs in the games I did ok. after a few games I heard him talking to himself. I am good at this game, I am good at this Game he started repeating over and over after a few more games with no overkills and killing frenzy’s he gave up. Even though he was still clearly winning it was not enough for the boy spoiled by years of BR abuse he could not get his head round games not being one sided any more.

I think he had a mini br######, there are of people that define themselves by their “skill” in Halo and when Bungie made the game harder. it started a chain reaction of wrong thinking for years people had been brought up on the fact skill or the need for skill was a good thing in Halo and it is but when a once great player is presented with a weapon that is to skilful, complex and subtle for them Denial sets in.

11

sprint.

12

Random factors are the ultimate test of skill in sports why is halo different? its not it cant be

When you teach a skill you break that skill down into smaller skills practise in a non random environment once the skill is learned you throw in random factors, once the skill can be preformed under these conditions it moves from being merely learned to being mastered.

Consistency alone is not the ultimate test of skill performing with consistency under random and stressed conditions is.

Like the dmr or hate it whatever but this random argument is wrong who ever came up with it really needs to look at other sports and activities and have a good think

This a repeat post but yes you can practise for random factors. its what champions do that others do not.

13

Agreed cheese good picture good point their is an new element of luck to it. as with a great many things in life and sports the more you practise the luckier you get. if he had totally missed all the luck in the world would not have registered a hit. sorry for drifting off point OP

14

First and foremost, the game play settings need to support a ranked environment. The TU in Reach made Reach very suitable as bloom actually does well to represent recoil and no bloom makes the game a fast paced, skill-centric shooter. Reach before the update was awful in this department, and they’ve really done well to fix this.

Allowing for consistency in gameplay along with this will make way for a competitive player’s will. Coupled that with playlists which are designed for ranked accompanied by a ranking system (1-50) and the game will be a raving success.

15

> I remember playing with a good, well skilled player when Reach MLG kicked off my friend consistently had one of the better KDs in the games I did ok. after a few games I heard him talking to himself. I am good at this game, I am good at this Game he started repeating over and over after a few more games with no overkills and killing frenzy’s he gave up. Even though he was still clearly winning it was not enough for the boy spoiled by years of BR abuse he could not get his head round games not being one sided any more.
>
> I think he had a mini breakdown, there are of people that define themselves by their “skill” in Halo and when Bungie made the game harder. it started a chain reaction of wrong thinking for years people had been brought up on the fact skill or the need for skill was a good thing in Halo and it is but when a once great player is presented with a weapon that is to skilful, complex and subtle for them Denial sets in.

You really have no idea what you’re talking about. Let me break this down to you. When you go from a games of chess, where strategy and thought are paramount to victory, and are then stuck with a roll of the dice, of course frustration will set in. This randomness makes the game harder in the sense that you have little control over the outcome, but this does not make it more skillful. Complexity doesn’t always add skill. Skillful additions add skill.

There is also no such thing as BR abuse. Nobody mentioned this during Halo 3. This was a new thing to say now that Reach is around in order to feel better about why other players disliked the original reach gameplay.

16

Symmetrical arena style maps.
Ranked and Social.
Proper matching. Full Team vs Full Team and Randoms vs Randoms
Hitscan.
Tons of aim assisting.

Some of you might be thinking. WTF! How can tons of aim assisting make the game more competitive? The answer is quite simple actually. The more assisting the better chance that the skill gap is smaller. Theirfor more games that end 50-48 rather than 50-14. And the more people enjoying the game in general. 343 needs to realize that Halo 2 was succesful for multiple reasons but with a secret underlying factor that it was fast paced and EASY which made it one of the funnest games to play for many many people.

I see so many people begging for the aim assist to be reduced… I 100% guarentee that if 343 lowered the aim assist even a teeeeny tiny bit more fans would be lost than gained. The game isn’t all about proving your dominance in the world of video games. It’s about bringing people together for a fun frantic experience.

17

> * Zero Randomness Inherent
> Having random elements like Halo 3’s BR spread and Reach’s bloom only leads to you fighting the game itself and no player genuinely wants that. You should be fighting your opponents, not the game. Your opponents should be frustrating you, not the game. Thus the player should be the only random element within the game.

halo 3’s BR spread wasn’t random, it was the same in every situation. that’s how some people were able to pretty much master it. once you learned where you needed to aim the BR according to the distance and movement of your target, you would become a skilled opponent. bloom is completely random, and thus impossible to master, it is basically removing any skill gap.

> * * Predictability
> Grenades shouldn’t just serve as weapons, they should also be movement deterrents. A competitive game needs to be a game where you can predict your opponents’ actions accurately for the sole reason that randomness can not be mastered whilst predictability can. A good tool to give to players so that they have the ability to accurately predict their opponents movement are grenades, lots of 'em. A player should be able to deny access to a route via grenade spam, which means giving players more than two nades of each type. Let’s go back to four. *

in Halo 3, people used grenades mainly as a tool to pop your shields and then line up the BR headshot for a very fast kill. For example, when you know somebody is in one of the upper lift areas on complex, you try grenade them and rush in for the headshot

and on the subject of maps, The Pit (symmetrical) > Everything else

18

I am sorry thems the facts. bloom takes skill a, different kind you may not like it and thats your right but please dont get drawn into this mass delusion.

You dont need to justify not liking reach by falling back on the skill and randomness argument. This is clearly a case of little life or sport experience outside of halo. variables in sport; wind, sun, rain, Injury’s, home support ect and yes luck. these are all normal things apart from in the strange world occupied by some members of the community. there was a great game in reach but some could not see the wood for the trees. What a narrow little box people have created for them self

19

The BR spread limited its effective range, making it function like a dmr with hit scan and such would limit map movement and turn BTB into the campfest it was in reach.

20

This…