I’m not 100% sure on the details here, so correct me if i’m wrong. This is about actual weapons spawning on the map and not ordnance drops.
Basically, from what I can gather, at various points in the game a randomized weapon (typically a power weapon) will spawn at one of various points in the map, with the point the weapon will spawn at being, from what I can gather, randomly selected out of however many weapon spawn points there are. To help you find out where a weapon has spawned, there is a HUD indicator. All of this is apparently to help newer players, as 343 consider map knowledge to give an unfair advantage.
HUD indicators I can understand and have no problem with. But imagine you’re introducing a friend that has never played Halo before into H4 and helping them play. What’s easier to explain to them and for them to understand;
“Rocket launcher spawns here every 2 and a half minutes.”
OR
“A rocket launcher might spawn at here, here, here, here, here or here at some point during the game.”
Even if the weapons aren’t random and there is a pattern to the spawn locations, it is still going to be harder for newer players because they would have to learn more of the map to find out these locations, whereas with static weapon spawns they could remember where the weapon spawns with much more ease, aided greatly by HUD indicators.
Now I might have some of the details mixed up or this weapon spawning system might be exclusive to certain gametypes, but it honestly seems that this change is going to hinder the very players it is designed to help. There’s obviously the other stuff that is hindered like the concept of map control and such, too.
Am I missing something here? Is this change only for infinity slayer? Thoughts/opinions pl0x
Do note that at the start of the match, there will be power weapons in certain locations like in classic Halo. After that, the Infinity Ordnance drops will start falling in. These drops are specified into specific areas but cycle through randomly (think King of The Hill). The HUD elements will help players by literally pointing out where they will be and doubly so if they are using the Drop Recon Mod (earned from the Engineer Specialization) since they will know where the drops will be ahead of everyone else.
The second type of Ordnance drop is called Personal Ordnance. Here, your points will fill up a meter above your AA gauge (it has a distinct cube icon) and once this is filled up, you can select three options on the D-Pad. There is a mod from the Tracker Specialization that allows you to essentially pick new options from your or dance drops (think re-rolling care packages but with more choice involved).
I am not quite sure if the drops from the Infinity version have randomized contents or static drops (meaning it’s the same weapons every match). For the personal version, it’s randomized in what you get.
I personally like the idea of random weapon spawns, new players will adapt they nearly always do, it should encourage better game play, just think of hemorrahage and the camping for the sniper, it gets ridiculous.
^ I have to agree. This will make thing very interesting. I feel as if for new players it will just be being at the right place at the right time, but skilled players will realize the spawns and when time is near, be closer to it purposely.
> I’m not 100% sure on the details here, so correct me if i’m wrong. This is about actual weapons spawning on the map and not ordnance drops.
>
> Basically, from what I can gather, at various points in the game a randomized weapon (typically a power weapon) will spawn at one of various points in the map, with the point the weapon will spawn at being, from what I can gather, randomly selected out of however many weapon spawn points there are. To help you find out where a weapon has spawned, there is a HUD indicator. <mark>All of this is apparently to help newer players, as 343 consider map knowledge to give an unfair advantage.</mark>
>
> HUD indicators I can understand and have no problem with. But imagine you’re introducing a friend that has never played Halo before into H4 and helping them play. What’s easier to explain to them and for them to understand;
>
> “Rocket launcher spawns here every 2 and a half minutes.”
>
> OR
>
> “A rocket launcher might spawn at here, here, here, here, here or here at some point during the game.”
>
> Even if the weapons aren’t random and there is a pattern to the spawn locations, it is still going to be harder for newer players because they would have to learn more of the map to find out these locations, whereas with static weapon spawns they could remember where the weapon spawns with much more ease, aided greatly by HUD indicators.
>
> Now I might have some of the details mixed up or this weapon spawning system might be exclusive to certain gametypes, but it honestly seems that this change is going to hinder the very players it is designed to help. There’s obviously the other stuff that is hindered like the concept of map control and such, too.
>
> Am I missing something here? Is this change only for infinity slayer? Thoughts/opinions pl0x
That isn’t true. 343i has the new Ordinance system in place to encourage map movement. In past games every map (that’s not a BTB map) has had one or two points of major focus, typically sniper or rocket spawns. Most areas of the maps are an afterthought because no one cares. Now instead of holding one area of a map for an entire game, you and your team must work together to move from point to point and control the WHOLE map to gain the advantage with power weapons and not just one general area.
You explained it well, critical.
It’d seem to me that having power weapons spawning in the same place consistently and keeping the new system for everything else would work better. All I can picture is the other team getting a sniper spawn in their base and being able to easily turn a losing game around down to randomness and luck alone.
Maybe (hopefully) 343 have tuned it so that player locations and such are taken into account to prevent such situations happening, but when you consider how quickly and easily a game can be turned around with a power weapon, the idea that they’ll just spawn randomly on the map is very worrying.
> I personally like the idea of random weapon spawns, new players will adapt they nearly always do, it should encourage better game play, just think of hemorrahage and the camping for the sniper, it gets ridiculous.
I can certainly see how it’ll mix up maps more and create more of a changing playing field but i’d put the sniper issue you just described down to shoddy map design rather than a problem with static weapon spawns.
Just wanna make sure OP got this, but Personal Ordinance is only on certain game types like infinity slayer.
> You explained it well, critical.
>
> It’d seem to me that having power weapons spawning in the same place consistently and keeping the new system for everything else would work better. All I can picture is the other team getting a sniper spawn in their base and being able to easily turn a losing game around down to randomness and luck alone.
>
> Maybe (hopefully) 343 have tuned it so that player locations and such are taken into account to prevent such situations happening, but when you consider how quickly and easily a game can be turned around with a power weapon, the idea that they’ll just spawn randomly on the map is very worrying.
>
>
>
> > I personally like the idea of random weapon spawns, new players will adapt they nearly always do, it should encourage better game play, just think of hemorrahage and the camping for the sniper, it gets ridiculous.
>
> I can certainly see how it’ll mix up maps more and create more of a changing playing field but i’d put the sniper issue you just described down to shoddy map design rather than a problem with static weapon spawns.
I agree, I used that one as it’s possibly the worst one and being the worst immediately comes to mind, I don’t know why it was never updated to spawn more in the open instead of behind that wall on either base, back to Halo 4, I think the addition of the drops will add to the map movement too, personally I’m getting a little impatient for Halo 4.
Want it now lol.
> That isn’t true. 343i has the new Ordinance system in place to encourage map movement. In past games every map (that’s not a BTB map) has had one or two points of major focus, typically sniper or rocket spawns. Most areas of the maps are an afterthought because no one cares. Now instead of holding one area of a map for an entire game, you and your team must work together to move from point to point and control the WHOLE map to gain the advantage with power weapons and not just one general area.
I was mainly going by the quote from the old game informer stuff back in april, namely;
“This gives the matches other focal points, and it also helps alleviate the advantage longtime players always used to have over newer recruits; the best weapons are not always going to be found at the same spawn locations.”
Whilst it will definitely encourage more map movement, it comes across to me as primarily being about getting rid of the advantage players have by knowing the maps better, part of the theme of making Halo more accessible to the ‘generation of people that have never played Halo before’.
Which brings me back to the point that this seems to be something that will make learning maps and weapon locations harder than before for newer players. I’d have thought HUD indicators alone would have done the job perfectly.
> You explained it well, critical.
>
> It’d seem to me that having power weapons spawning in the same place consistently and keeping the new system for everything else would work better. All I can picture is the other team getting a sniper spawn in their base and being able to easily turn a losing game around down to randomness and luck alone.
>
> Maybe (hopefully) 343 have tuned it so that player locations and such are taken into account to prevent such situations happening, but when you consider how quickly and easily a game can be turned around with a power weapon, the idea that they’ll just spawn randomly on the map is very worrying.
It’s not that the drops will just pop up in your face without prior warning (and there will be signs before they drop) and giving you a free Incinerator Cannon or a SAW. Of course, if you can set up/outplay and earn these drops then i think players earned them regardless if players can see them or not. You are not alone in your concerns as i too share them. I do hope that 343 took notice of proper spawn placement for these drops.
All we can do is wait, speculate, and see what unfolds.
> It’s not that the drops will just pop up in your face without prior warning (and there will be signs before they drop) and giving you a free Incinerator Cannon or a SAW. Of course, if you can set up/outplay and earn these drops then i think players earned them regardless if players can see them or not. You are not alone in your concerns as i too share them. I do hope that 343 took notice of proper spawn placement for these drops.
>
> All we can do is wait, speculate, and see what unfolds.
Fortunately it is basically a gametype option so if it does turn out to be incredibly unpopular it might tweaked after launch. I definitely want to give it a try and I hope it is successful, but i’m just really finding it hard to see how this change will work well.
Maybe it’s just because the majority of the gameplay we have seen so far has been from people with very little experience with the game, so they are just wandering around a map they don’t know and etc. It’d be nice if 343 could release some gameplay from actual employees who have been working on the game so we can see how the matches play out from players with more of an idea of what they’re doing.
> > It’s not that the drops will just pop up in your face without prior warning (and there will be signs before they drop) and giving you a free Incinerator Cannon or a SAW. Of course, if you can set up/outplay and earn these drops then i think players earned them regardless if players can see them or not. You are not alone in your concerns as i too share them. I do hope that 343 took notice of proper spawn placement for these drops.
> >
> > All we can do is wait, speculate, and see what unfolds.
>
> Fortunately it is basically a gametype option so if it does turn out to be incredibly unpopular it might tweaked after launch. I definitely want to give it a try and I hope it is successful, but i’m just really finding it hard to see how this change will work well.
>
> Maybe it’s just because the majority of the gameplay we have seen so far has been from people with very little experience with the game, so they are just wandering around a map they don’t know and etc. It’d be nice if 343 could release some gameplay from actual employees who have been working on the game so we can see how the matches play out from players with more of an idea of what they’re doing.
It is rather difficult to sit down with a game that’s either not even finished or you’re allowed an hour or so with it. Not enough time to get down and dirty into the sandbox :P.
I think just like with the new Infinity CTF (my name for it) it’s something you have to try out first before you decide to praise it or burn it at the cross. I think several times Frank/343 mentioned that these new ideas sounded bad on paper but the execution leads to a different conclusion.