Weapon layouts in btb could use an overhaul

Games Halo Infinite
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When I think of good btb maps, I almost always default to either Halo 2 or more often Halo 3. There are lots of reasons, but one of the major ones is how precise and thought out the weapons and vehicles were when designing the maps.

The Majority of issues in btb are created or solved by this concept. Too many snipers on an open map and you have an annoying map with no flow and stilted map movement while you duck behind cover for most of the match. Too few anti vehicle weapons and suddenly that wasp which is already overpowered becomes an unstoppable killing machine. That sort of thing.

When I think of the perfect map layout I think of Standoff. It’s not my favorite map of all time, but it’s without a doubt the most balanced and well thought out btb map for both competitive and social play in maybe any Halo game. Let me explain a little why.

Firstly, each side gets a limited power weapon and power up selection from the start. You have a shotgun, a warthog, a rocket launcher with two shots, Camo, a brute shot, a turret, A power drain, and a myriad of small arms in and around the base. Then in the center of the map is a laser that is the focal point of map control.

This is brilliant for many reasons, but the main one Is that it encourages a lot of movement. You HAVE to control your rocks and theirs in the center of the map to keep them from pushing up and spawn killing you or picking up laser respawn. Sitting at the base all game gets you decimated. YET, if you are pushed back the map has weapons you can make use of to regain composure and push back, if you’re smart and have a good teamshot.

This is missing from infinite completely. The bases mostly have random weapons with little to no thought put into how they will be used and where, other than the occasional smart sniper placement. The randomness of what weapon will spawn each game ruins any semblance of controlled placement, and things are just extremely frustrating because of that. You might have a sentinel beam and heatwave to help fight vehicles one match, and a needler and bulldog which are useless the next. The power weapons are even randomized.

I shouldn’t have to explain that a sniper rifle and a skewer shouldn’t even be compared in any way right? That’s obvious to everyone else surely…

So to fix it we need forge to show what it COULD BE, but I think they need to rework the maps to include more focused weapon placement. Maybe put a rocket launcher with two shots in it at each base that has a long respawn timer. Maybe for sure don’t have a sniper AND a shock rifle AND a stalker rifle on both sides on an open map. Maybe make the game BR starts finally. Maybe the Hydra should spawn closer to the base so the ghosts and warthogs and wasps aren’t so overpowered feeling. Maybe more disruptor pistols should be on maps.

Little things make big differences.

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The first, and best solution is to get all the random out of maps. That applies to all maps but means way more for BtB.

Weapon racks are randomized at the start of the match between two possible weapons per pad. Including power weapon pads.

Drop pods are random both in location and in contents.

Vehicle drops are random and don’t even always drop the same vehicle, or class of vehicle on both sides.

And on Fragmentation the loot caves are random too.

The weapons and vehicles that can appear on a map often gave the map an identity. But in Infinite the entire sandbox could appear on any given map depending on RnG. The only launch map that felt like it stood out a bit was the one with two Wasps, and that was because it was the only map with a unique respawning vehicle that was always there. The new BtB map also stands out a bit, because there are fewer power weapons in general on it and it feels like what will and won’t appear on it is a bit more focussed. It’s nice having a map with a non-UNSC respawning vehicle on it too, since the Ghost is on it.

But look at maps like Valhalla, which was ruled by the Banshee so long as your team maintained control of the single laser. While the snipers duelled from one base to mid.

Look at Hemmorhage, where keeping the enemy Wraith down so that your team’s vehicles could surround the enemy base in flag was key to scoring consistent caps.

Look at Containment, where the entire upper side of the map became something of a no man’s land once one tank asserted dominance over the other. Forcing infantry to scurry along the trench in hopes of snagging an overshield.

Standoff was extremely unique. Instead of featuring any Snipers, or heavy/airborne vehicles, it had two Rockets, two Warthogs, and one Laser in one of the most dangerous power weapon spawns since CE’s Hang em High. That means the Warthogs could comfortably dominate the map, without needing to worry about the looming death of a Laser most of the time, since it would usually take a team a long time into the match to get their hands on it. Instead the best defense was the less than ideal Rocket Launchers, but definitely more viable if you pair them with the Camp that spawned nearby, some well placed tripmines could also do the trick, or even less ideally there was a backup Brute Shot you could use to flip it over. There’s no experience in any Halo game quite like the beginning of a match on this map, as both teams chuck all their Frags over mid in an attempt to disrupt the Warthogs. It was kind of like getting shelled.

You don’t really see these big unique map interactions that much in Infinite. Sure you might be able to pin a lane down with the Tank on Fragmentation one game. But you won’t see another tank the next several times you play it, or it might only spawn on the enemy side, or too late in the match to do anything. Or only once, and be immediately set upon by a Skewer.

Also I agree with you completely about the Sniper and Skewer. The Shock Rifle is the real Banished Sniper equivalent. The Skewer is more comparable to a Spartan Laser. Honestly the Sniper should have it’s vehicle damage reduced. It was weird and unnecessary in Reach, and it’s still weird and unnecessary today.

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I don’t like the idea of giving each side a power up to start. With how they can be held now doesn’t make me excited about this idea.

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well almost all the btb maps already do

Its not right at the spawn base but its near enough to sprint to before any enemies can contest them. That’s actually my main strategy most games, to catch it on respawn and push their base with it.

Fragmentation is the only map in rotation that has a central power up spawn and not one near the bases.

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You are correct, little things do make a big difference. A little change like BR starts would be bad, but this isn’t the place for that argument. We’re here to talk about proper weapon and vehicle placement.

Default Standoff was mostly designed for regular team slayer and the weapon and vehicle placements show this. Inside each base is an AR, Plasma Pistol, Mauler, 2 Frag Grenades, 2 Plasma Grenades, Power Drain, 1 SMG and 1 Magnum with 2 BRs, a Shotgun, Brute Shot, 1 Warthog and 3 Mongooses on the immediate outside. The rock line has 2 Plasma Grenades on left side near Invis and a BR, 2 shot Rockets on left, center Spiker with 1 Frag and Plasma and then 1 BR on the right. Center line has a Needler at both silos with center Spartan Laser. That is literally all the weapons and vehicles available. The placement of all of these are perfect for basically anything you may want to do or need to do. The power weapons are extremely limited. It’s only 1 Laser, 2 Rockets that each only have 2 shots and a Shotgun at each base that’s really only useful at the base. The real dominating force is the 5 Plasmas available regularly allowing those that know how to throw grenades a supply of AoE and antivehicle damage. Default Standoff didn’t have a Sniper (heavies did), but had more than enough BRs for everyone to grab.

Standoff is a great example of a good symmetrical asymmetrical map that does more with less. It provides you with what you need, but you have to go get it and the enemy has the ability to take it for themselves. Sure you can still do this in Infinite, but the random pads make planing how to best control the map basically impossible until you know all the different weapons that are currently in use. And you don’t have consistent vehicle spawns to plan with. It’s just to much RNG nonsense. In a really casual environment this is fine, but if you see that your team is losing, maybe even losing hard and you want to do something about it then it’s even harder to find a way to try and claw your way to a victory.

We need consistent weapons and vehicles tailored to each map to help encourage the best play style for each map. Let’s create an example using Highpower shall we?

Highpower, each base needs 2 BRs, 2 Commando, 1 AR, Heatwave, Mangler, Hammer and a Ravager. It also needs 2 Plasma and Frag available both on 15 second respawn, 1 Warthog, 2-3 Mongooses, 1 Ghost, 1 Wasp, 1 Repulsor and 1 Thruster. Front line beyond the base should have 2 BRs, 1 Pulse Carbine, 1 Plasma Pistol, 1 Disruptor, 2 Dynamo Grenades on a 30 second or 1 minute timer, 2 Frag, Stalker Rifle, Cindershot and Overshield or Invis. Center should have 1 Skewer, 1 Rockethog, 2 BR, 1 Needler, 2 Sentinel Beams, 1 Disruptor, 2 Plasma Grenades and 1 Drop Wall.

This would allow for good map control without having anything that is capable of reaching from one side of the map to the other and given the two sided nature of the map this works as everything is effective inside one half of the map. This allows players to hold at base and defend with the capabilities to stop vehicles, but not destroy them immediately and can push forward to center with more range weapons and try to advance on the enemy team.

Just by having these set weapons I can already start planning what I’m going to do from spawn or what I might need to do if the enemy team is pushing or vehicles are coming in and so on and so forth.

I should add that I was an avid forger in Halo 3, Reach and 4. I spent more than enough time making maps and studying the ones made by the developers to be able to understand proper weapon placement, map flow and player movement tendencies. I’m not saying that I can’t be wrong or that any other placement is wrong, but I think this is a pretty good layout to start with. As always it would need proper testing to ensure that current placements and allotment of weapons are appropriate. Sadly though we still don’t have Forge right now so we can’t do this and actually see how well it would work.

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Part off the wasp problem also lies with the base designs on that map, just big block assets with no real internal features to provide meaningful cover.
Kids in Minecraft can design & build better bases.

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