im more likely to believe that the monarch coating while predominantly purple does have a number of areas that are another colour (albiet they are small and few) and is whats makes it the monarch coating and not that it is the purple armor coating, though that does bring in the issues that we might be paying for even less with these coatings. in terms of what quality the armor will be (common, uncommon, rare, epic, legendary etc) i’d put in down as common and maybe with other coatings we’ve seen either the same but probably in the uncommon catagory. obviously with the quality of coatings and other cosmetics in the game coupled with this pricing we have seen on the items ($5) its wouldnt be a strentch to imagine that higher quality items will cost more. For all we know base coatings might already be given to us when we get the game and would take the common quality rating. i do think this coating system will having some pretty cool coatings and maybe even allow us to look even more like our favourite spartans (i tried to make Vale in halo 5 but the tec suit and armor patterns didnt match up so i was stuck with the right colours but not the right design) though i would be hard pressed to figure out a pricing point for this as ingame spartans dont have any wild or flashy armor sets, perhaps these kinds of coatings would be better suited for achievements rewards but then again doesnt mix well with a the current microtransactions design philosophy (insert bundle deals to look like your favourite spartan).
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> > 2533274843634673;519:
> > > 2592250499819446;508:
> > > > 2533274843634673;507:
> > > > > 2592250499819446;492:
> > > > > > 2533274843634673;483:
> > > > > > If we assume that Infinite uses the same REQ pack system as H5 does, then a $5 average retail value could simply mean that it’s unlockable from gold packs – which are easily obtained via in-game currency.
> > > > >
> > > > > Why would you assume that ?
> > > > >
> > > > > 343i have already stated that Halo Infinite will not have paid loot crates, they also added that there would be no loot crates available with an in game currency that could be purchased with real money. From what I’ve read the purchase of cosmetcs is not really the issue.
> > > > >
> > > > > We all expected micro transactions, but not at the cost of our current colour system. I’ve yet to see one compelling reason why we cannot have the new armour coatings and our current colour system, and they could easily have promotional coats that cannot be changed.
> > > >
> > > > As for why we can’t have both armor coatings and the old color system, it’s been said that the reason is simply that that’s not how the game was built. They opted for the coating system to give the developers an easier way to produce a wider variety of skin options. Implementing two different systems into the game to achieve effectively the same thing is a waste of time and resources. I think we’ll find that the coating system isn’t as bad as people think it is right now.
> > > >
> > > > Theoretically, they could release coatings that cover the entire spectrum of color combinations available in the current games - which would solve everything.
> > > >
> > > > Check out the thread on how coatings are planned to work here: https://twitter.com/Unyshek/status/1319827586088747008 That thread should answer some of the questions you brought up.
> > >
> > > 1) They designed it that way to monetise it imo, still not a compelling reason not to have the existing system. I’m sure they could still have the base colour system in conjunction with it. If anything removing base colours is less options.
> > >
> > > 2) Theoretically why go to all that trouble when we could use the existing system ? Nothing to solve that way.
> > >
> > > 3) No, it leaves as many questions as answers.
> >
> > 1. You’re ignoring the fact that it has been explicitly stated that they chose this path because it gives their developers more options to make more and better armor color variants.
> >
> > 2. See the answer above: It makes things easier for them.
> >
> > 3. The thread literally answered some of your questions, including what I wrote in the first answer here.
> >
> > I get that it’s “cool” to be cynical and hate on anything new 343 does, but you’re freaking out over something we don’t even know much about. Once it releases, I guarantee it’s not going to be as bad as you think. This happens literally every single time 343 does anything.
>
> - I can almost guarantee that’s marketing speak, because they can’t say “Look you idiots, we took this away so you could give us money because we like money” - I understand that it makes it easier for them, but if the system wasn’t shoddily coded and designed, then we could still have free color customization without having to accept only the designs 343 gives us. - Unyshek’s thread doesn’t answer the critical question of how much customization is paywall locked and how much isn’t paywall locked. Unyshek’s thread raises a lot of questions as to how this system works in practice and how we’re going to get these skins. He should be providing substantially more information on this system.If 343 did something that wasn’t this, we wouldn’t be upset at it. If they gave us any more information than the bare minimum because they knew they were tossing a live grenade into the open, the response may not have been so vitriolic. But when you restrict player freedoms that have been in place for at least 16 years, that’s a serious problem. When you attempt to lie about it and say “Well, the system just can’t accept player customization” when we know that even games with messes of engines and code can make it work (PAYDAY 2’s engine is a nightmare, and it can support what 343 claims is impossible), that’s when we start to take umbrage with the system.
>
> If 343’s Infinite Dev Team were just a little bit more transparent about this stuff, the response may not have been as aggressive as it was. As it stands, bar the death threats because the people sending those are Grade-A Lunatics, the response has been what 343 deserves. They don’t deserve our faith in their products because they have yet to put one out that doesn’t have some problem, and they don’t deserve the benefit of the doubt because of how bad Halo 5’s REQs were. Even worse was the response then, when anyone with legitimate complaints against the system were depicted as childish buffoons that should have stayed quiet because “the grown-ups are talking”
I won’t blame Unyshek, as I feel like he was thrown under the bus & forced to stomp out the fire. However I definitely feel like Unyshek’s thread raised more questions than answers. Honestly, every time the developers get something right, it comes at the cost of something else. “You’re going to have hundreds of armours to choose from” So they give us hundreds of armours to choose from, however they don’t tell you they’re locked into full body sets. “We’ve added new weapons into the game which you’re going to love” They give you a rocket launcher with replaces the SPNKR. “We’re going to add Spartan Ops which is an online coop mode with new missions added regularly to keep the experience fresh” They remove firefight & replace it with linear copy & paste generic missions. “We’re going to add warzone which is a massive 12 v 12 large scale, vehicle based warfare” Pretty much made the casual big team battle irrelevant & made vehicles pay to win through Req packs. And now here we stand with “coatings” You’re going to be able to have an intricate & more detailed way to customise your spartan’s colours. You’re going to be able to edit 7 layers of shaders giving your spartan different textures which says so much about your personality” Yeah but just like Halo 5’s armours, you’re stuck with what they give you. In this case, colours.
They’ve almost lost all credibility with their fans through these claims…
343i is using a Game as a service model. Basics are in the wiki article:Games as a service - Wikipedia
Unfortunately when 343i said multiplayer is free they did not mention the “Microtransactions represent low-cost purchases, compared to the cost of a full game or a large expansion pack, that provide some form of additional content to the purchaser.” Wiki article. 343i is monetizing parts of the game that used to be free. The “game is free” should be followed by "we are using Microtransactions to offer additional items and then explained the business plan and how this was good for the Players and 343i and especially for HALO Infinite. GaaS allows a 10 year planning window for additional content because there is a way to pay for it.
Currently the whole community is excited and additional information is almost like throwing gasoline on a fire. If we as take a step back from our strong emotions and be open to 343i communicating a complete picture. We then can have a shared sense between Halo community and the studio are going in the right direction.
The financial impact for studios is significant “A study by DFC Intelligence in 2018 found Electronic Arts’ value rose from US $4 billion to $33 billion since 2012, while Activision Blizzard saw its value rise from $20 billion to $60 billion in the same period, with both increases attributed in part to the use of the GaaS model in their games catalog. Electronic Arts had earned $2 billion from GaaS transactions in 2018.”.
I don’t think anyone is saying 343 can’t look for additional revenue streams. However, colors for your Spartan was a joke not even a few months ago as a worst case prospect and now that’s real. 343 stresses this is so they can provide fans more creative choices for customization, but I think one question needs to be answered by them:
Why are developer created color combinations a better option than fans selecting colors themselves?
I know Ascend Hyperion made a video recently showing how relatively few colors are used by players despite Halo’s color options, but if perhaps the reasoning is that this will make players experiment more, is that so? Or will they find a coating that most closely matches their go to scheme from previous games and stick with that? And why should 343 concern themselves with how we customize our Spartans?
I thought Microsoft fired a bunch of people from Xbox several years ago for doing this sort of thing (nickel-and-diming, and generally bullying customers)?
> 2533274812652989;524:
> I’m skeptical of the claim it gives 343 more options to make new color combinations. Who asked for that, exactly? Was there a movement among fans to shift the burden of being creative with color combinations to the developers? Did we ask for options to be taken away and become more restrictive?
>
> I mean, yeah, if you look at Bungie’s shader system in Destiny they sure do pump out a bunch of options. But it also creates a glut of shaders you will never use that take up space in your shader inventory AND require using up in-game resources to get more. Again, Bungie has produced a lot of combos, but I can’t recall anyone ever saying they liked this system.
>
> At the end of the day, my creativity now depends on 343 and what they decide to offer.
Based on the aesthetic options we were given in 4 and 5 their offerings are going to look quite grim.
> 2533274836395701;530:
> > 2533274812652989;524:
> > I’m skeptical of the claim it gives 343 more options to make new color combinations. Who asked for that, exactly? Was there a movement among fans to shift the burden of being creative with color combinations to the developers? Did we ask for options to be taken away and become more restrictive?
> >
> > I mean, yeah, if you look at Bungie’s shader system in Destiny they sure do pump out a bunch of options. But it also creates a glut of shaders you will never use that take up space in your shader inventory AND require using up in-game resources to get more. Again, Bungie has produced a lot of combos, but I can’t recall anyone ever saying they liked this system.
> >
> > At the end of the day, my creativity now depends on 343 and what they decide to offer.
>
> Based on the aesthetic options we were given in 4 and 5 their offerings are going to look quite grim.
To be honest, Halo 4’s customisation was actually quite decent. Don’t get me wrong, the Spartan IV armour was awful. But you can’t deny that they gave us a lot to mix & match with, despite how horrible it looked. You can almost say it had more than Reach’s to a capacity if you exclude armour effects & attachments on helmets etc. Overall though, I agree with you. I believe it’s going to look grim. Coatings are a bad enough sign as it is.
> 2533274837143948;531:
> > 2533274836395701;530:
> > > 2533274812652989;524:
> > > I’m skeptical of the claim it gives 343 more options to make new color combinations. Who asked for that, exactly? Was there a movement among fans to shift the burden of being creative with color combinations to the developers? Did we ask for options to be taken away and become more restrictive?
> > >
> > > I mean, yeah, if you look at Bungie’s shader system in Destiny they sure do pump out a bunch of options. But it also creates a glut of shaders you will never use that take up space in your shader inventory AND require using up in-game resources to get more. Again, Bungie has produced a lot of combos, but I can’t recall anyone ever saying they liked this system.
> > >
> > > At the end of the day, my creativity now depends on 343 and what they decide to offer.
> >
> > Based on the aesthetic options we were given in 4 and 5 their offerings are going to look quite grim.
>
> To be honest, Halo 4’s customisation was actually quite decent. Don’t get me wrong, the Spartan IV armour was awful. But you can’t deny that they gave us a lot to mix & match with, despite how horrible it looked. You can almost say it had more than Reach’s to a capacity if you exclude armour effects & attachments on helmets etc. Overall though, I agree with you. I believe it’s going to look grim. Coatings are a bad enough sign as it is.
After Halo 4, Halo 5 was like being blindsided. I was shocked that they devolved customization so much after making it so great.
> 2533274843634673;519:
> > 2592250499819446;508:
> > > 2533274843634673;507:
> > > > 2592250499819446;492:
> > > > > 2533274843634673;483:
> > > > > If we assume that Infinite uses the same REQ pack system as H5 does, then a $5 average retail value could simply mean that it’s unlockable from gold packs – which are easily obtained via in-game currency.
> > > >
> > > > Why would you assume that ?
> > > >
> > > > 343i have already stated that Halo Infinite will not have paid loot crates, they also added that there would be no loot crates available with an in game currency that could be purchased with real money. From what I’ve read the purchase of cosmetcs is not really the issue.
> > > >
> > > > We all expected micro transactions, but not at the cost of our current colour system. I’ve yet to see one compelling reason why we cannot have the new armour coatings and our current colour system, and they could easily have promotional coats that cannot be changed.
> > >
> > > As for why we can’t have both armor coatings and the old color system, it’s been said that the reason is simply that that’s not how the game was built. They opted for the coating system to give the developers an easier way to produce a wider variety of skin options. Implementing two different systems into the game to achieve effectively the same thing is a waste of time and resources. I think we’ll find that the coating system isn’t as bad as people think it is right now.
> > >
> > > Theoretically, they could release coatings that cover the entire spectrum of color combinations available in the current games - which would solve everything.
> > >
> > > Check out the thread on how coatings are planned to work here: https://twitter.com/Unyshek/status/1319827586088747008 That thread should answer some of the questions you brought up.
> >
> > 1) They designed it that way to monetise it imo, still not a compelling reason not to have the existing system. I’m sure they could still have the base colour system in conjunction with it. If anything removing base colours is less options.
> >
> > 2) Theoretically why go to all that trouble when we could use the existing system ? Nothing to solve that way.
> >
> > 3) No, it leaves as many questions as answers.
>
> 1. You’re ignoring the fact that it has been explicitly stated that they chose this path because it gives their developers more options to make more and better armor color variants.
>
> 2. See the answer above: It makes things easier for them.
>
> 3. The thread literally answered some of your questions, including what I wrote in the first answer here.
>
> I get that it’s “cool” to be cynical and hate on anything new 343 does, but you’re freaking out over something we don’t even know much about. Once it releases, I guarantee it’s not going to be as bad as you think. This happens literally every single time 343 does anything.
You know what else helps 343 make more/better armour colors? Letting us pick our own colors.
> 2533274843634673;519:
> 1. You’re ignoring the fact that it has been explicitly stated that they chose this path because it gives their developers more options to make more and better armor color variants.
You’re falling for their PR and vague phrasing.
The only more options the developers get, is that instead of having to create three different looking skins, they can take one skin, and change some colors three times, and have the same amount of “new skins”.
More and better armor color variants?
They’re simply not going to create more coats than there are color combinations in Halo 5, they’re not going to.
On top of that.
Any color they can think of to add to a coat, could instead be updated into the game for color customization of coats, and instead of having that one color limited to a few select coats, it’d be available to everyone for every coat, increasing the number of color and coat combinations far more than i343 could ever individually make.
Didn’t they even update the color selection for Halo 5?
Let’s say the game ships with 16 colors, and each coat has three slots, and the game also features 20 coats.
That’s 81920 available combinations.
Add one single color, and the amount of combinations go up to 98260, that’s an increase of almost 20 000 combinations.
So, how are they going to generate more and better coat/color combinations, subjectively, than were we able to customize them ourselves?
> 2533274843634673;519:
> 2. See the answer above: It makes things easier for them.
At the cost of a perfectly viable system, and literal cost for us if we want something behind a paywall, or cost us something we want but aren’t going to pay for.
Even then, I wonder how many work hours would go into programming and implementing one system, over the supposed ten year period where they need to churn out new coats.
> 2533274843634673;519:
> I guarantee it’s not going to be as bad as you think. This happens literally every single time 343 does anything.
Myes, GDC, a few game articles, Halo 4 first DLC, Halo 5 launch emblem customization, Halo 5 storyline, Halo 5 marketing, to name a few things which come to mind.
> 2533274843634673;519:
> > 2592250499819446;508:
> > > 2533274843634673;507:
> > > > 2592250499819446;492:
> > > > > 2533274843634673;483:
> > > > > 'If we assume that Infinite uses the same REQ pack system as H5 does, then a $5 average retail value could simply mean that it’s unlockable from gold packs – which are easily obtained via in-game currency.
> > > >
> > > > Why would you assume that ?
> > > >
> > > > 343i have already stated that Halo Infinite will not have paid loot crates, they also added that there would be no loot crates available with an in game currency that could be purchased with real money. From what I’ve read the purchase of cosmetcs is not really the issue.
> > > >
> > > > We all expected micro transactions, but not at the cost of our current colour system. I’ve yet to see one compelling reason why we cannot have the new armour coatings and our current colour system, and they could easily have promotional coats that cannot be changed.
> > >
> > > As for why we can’t have both armor coatings and the old color system, it’s been said that the reason is simply that that’s not how the game was built. They opted for the coating system to give the developers an easier way to produce a wider variety of skin options. Implementing two different systems into the game to achieve effectively the same thing is a waste of time and resources. I think we’ll find that the coating system isn’t as bad as people think it is right now.
> > >
> > > Theoretically, they could release coatings that cover the entire spectrum of color combinations available in the current games - which would solve everything.
> > >
> > > Check out the thread on how coatings are planned to work here: https://twitter.com/Unyshek/status/1319827586088747008 That thread should answer some of the questions you brought up.
> >
> > 1) They designed it that way to monetise it imo, still not a compelling reason not to have the existing system. I’m sure they could still have the base colour system in conjunction with it. If anything removing base colours is less options.
> >
> > 2) Theoretically why go to all that trouble when we could use the existing system ? Nothing to solve that way.
> >
> > 3) No, it leaves as many questions as answers.
>
> 1. You’re ignoring the fact that it has been explicitly stated that they chose this path because it gives their developers more options to make more and better armor color variants.
>
> 2. See the answer above: It makes things easier for them.
>
> 3. The thread literally answered some of your questions, including what I wrote in the first answer here.
>
> I get that it’s “cool” to be cynical and hate on anything new 343 does, but you’re freaking out over something we don’t even know much about. Once it releases, I guarantee it’s not going to be as bad as you think. This happens literally every single time 343 does anything.
-
I’m not ignoring it. I simply do not believe them at this point. There is more customisation options by adding to our existing colour system. They did this to monetise imo, and you’re falling for PR speak.
-
It makes it easier for them to make money from a feature we already have. Instead of enhancing our experience they’re limiting it to grind or pay from what I, and many others can see.
-
The thread has not answered my main question and issue. Why can’t we have our current system in conjunction with the new options for customisation ? Also, how much is pay walled ?
I’m not trying to be cynical, or hate. In fact, go check my posts about this, you’ll notice I have no issues with the armour coats, I’ve clearly stated it’s NOT a terrible idea. I just want to know why they had to sacrifice our current system instead of merging the two.
I’m also not freaking out, but I’ll agree it’s something we don’t know much about, that’s why I want answers. As for it not being as bad as we think, many said that about the REQ system and it turned out to be exactly what many predicted, a grind or pay rng cash grab that introduced a pay to win element to Halo.
> 2533274795123910;534:
> > 2533274843634673;519:
> > 1. You’re ignoring the fact that it has been explicitly stated that they chose this path because it gives their developers more options to make more and better armor color variants.
>
> You’re falling for their PR and vague phrasing.
> 2592250499819446;535:
> > 2533274843634673;519:
> > > 2592250499819446;508:
> > > > 2533274843634673;507:
> > > > > 2592250499819446;492:
> > > > > > 2533274843634673;483:
> > > > > > 'If we assume that Infinite uses the same REQ pack system as H5 does, then a $5 average retail value could simply mean that it’s unlockable from gold packs – which are easily obtained via in-game currency.
> > > > >
> > > > > Why would you assume that ?
> > > > >
> > > > > 343i have already stated that Halo Infinite will not have paid loot crates, they also added that there would be no loot crates available with an in game currency that could be purchased with real money. From what I’ve read the purchase of cosmetcs is not really the issue.
> > > > >
> > > > > We all expected micro transactions, but not at the cost of our current colour system. I’ve yet to see one compelling reason why we cannot have the new armour coatings and our current colour system, and they could easily have promotional coats that cannot be changed.
> > > >
> > > > As for why we can’t have both armor coatings and the old color system, it’s been said that the reason is simply that that’s not how the game was built. They opted for the coating system to give the developers an easier way to produce a wider variety of skin options. Implementing two different systems into the game to achieve effectively the same thing is a waste of time and resources. I think we’ll find that the coating system isn’t as bad as people think it is right now.
> > > >
> > > > Theoretically, they could release coatings that cover the entire spectrum of color combinations available in the current games - which would solve everything.
> > > >
> > > > Check out the thread on how coatings are planned to work here: https://twitter.com/Unyshek/status/1319827586088747008 That thread should answer some of the questions you brought up.
> > >
> > > 1) They designed it that way to monetise it imo, still not a compelling reason not to have the existing system. I’m sure they could still have the base colour system in conjunction with it. If anything removing base colours is less options.
> > >
> > > 2) Theoretically why go to all that trouble when we could use the existing system ? Nothing to solve that way.
> > >
> > > 3) No, it leaves as many questions as answers.
> >
> > 1. You’re ignoring the fact that it has been explicitly stated that they chose this path because it gives their developers more options to make more and better armor color variants.
> >
> > 2. See the answer above: It makes things easier for them.
> >
> > 3. The thread literally answered some of your questions, including what I wrote in the first answer here.
> >
> > I get that it’s “cool” to be cynical and hate on anything new 343 does, but you’re freaking out over something we don’t even know much about. Once it releases, I guarantee it’s not going to be as bad as you think. This happens literally every single time 343 does anything.
>
> 1) I’m not ignoring it. I simply do not believe them at this point. There is more customisation options by adding to our existing colour system. They did this to monetise imo, and you’re falling for PR speak.
Are you guys also flat-Earthers? The fact that you really seem to believe that everything is a conspiracy against you is very telling.
This may be a shock, but most of the time there’s no ulterior motive at work when a change is made between iterations of a game. Obviously, they want to make Infinite better than the previous games. They’ve decided that this armor coating system is one way to achieve this. That’s it.
Consider this: Wouldn’t it be a really bad idea for 343 to implement something that players universally hate in their game? Wouldn’t that scare away many players who 343 want to become paying customers? It doesn’t make sense for them to do that. They’ll be far more successful if they make the game with the players in mind. That’s what they’ve done here. They’ve come to the conclusion that armor coatings are better in the long run. But, because people can’t fathom the possibility of 343 doing something that’s good, you assume they’re being greedy.
Maybe wait until you actually get your hands on the game and see how it works for yourself before deciding that it’s the worst thing humanity has ever done.
> 2533274843634673;536:
> Are you guys also flat-Earthers? The fact that you really seem to believe that everything is a conspiracy against you is very telling.
>
> This may be a shock, but most of the time there’s no ulterior motive at work when a change is made between iterations of a game. Obviously, they want to make Infinite better than the previous games. They’ve decided that this armor coating system is one way to achieve this. That’s it.
>
> Consider this: Wouldn’t it be a really bad idea for 343 to implement something that players universally hate in their game? Wouldn’t that scare away many players who 343 want to become paying customers? It doesn’t make sense for them to do that. They’ll be far more successful if they make the game with the players in mind. That’s what they’ve done here. They’ve come to the conclusion that armor coatings are better in the long run. But, because people can’t fathom the possibility of 343 doing something that’s good, you assume they’re being greedy.
>
> Maybe wait until you actually get your hands on the game and see how it works for yourself before deciding that it’s the worst thing humanity has ever done.
Don’t get me wrong, I think that 343 honestly had some good intention with the armor coating system, given the information we know about it. The system does bring some welcome changes imo, such as weapon/vehicle skins and applicable textures/materials to Spartans so you can look more fancy or what not.
But its a bit hard to deny the potential that armor coatings have to become microtransactions. The only official thing I’ve seen in reference to armor coatings being monetized is a confirmation that these and other cosmetic items will be microtransactions(https://twitter.com/Unyshek/status/1319827587296710662), albeit with other earnable methods and in a fairly vague manner, but nonetheless purchasable. I think people are more concerned about how much potential the system has to sell to us than what good the system can actually do, and for good reason given Halo’s previous history with customization and 343’s recent history with selling cosmetics to us.
343 knew that this choice would upset players. They didn’t know to what degree or how widespread it would become, but they nonetheless knew people would find this choice unfavorable. It would be a terrible idea for 343 to put something that’s universally hated into their game, but putting an idea into their game that they knew was going to receive backlash isn’t exactly the brightest idea either. While I am no game developer, I do not believe that 343 wasn’t capable of making a system that would’ve been arguably better than what we’re getting. Why couldn’t 343 just separate colors and textures/materials? That change would’ve most likely allowed 343 to avoid this entirely, but instead of going for a system like that, they decided to go with something they knew would garner backlash, and now 343 is where it is current day. We don’t know what events lead to 343 picking this system, all we know is that there are arguably better alternatives to it, and instead of choosing those alternatives, 343 went for this system that would be received negatively by the Halo community, and now beyond that with larger names beyond Halo such as YongYea and Angry Joe picking up on it.
343 most likely didn’t think the response was going to be as visceral as its been. But nothing can change what’s already been done to the already rocky reputation Halo Infinite had with the gaming community, especially the Halo fanbase. Yes, we should 100% wait till we get more info, but with the info we do have, little looks promising to the public eye. 343’s delayed response has since allowed this topic to fester and blow up, and I believe if they were quicker to give more clear, consistent information about Infinite and its points of contention that this wouldn’t be as bad as it is now. 343 may or may not have an ulterior motive behind armor coatings, but they look like that they can be and will be monetized. 343 doesn’t look like they want to deliver ideas that the community will hate, but knows that some of the ideas they’ve had will cause controversy within the community. I doubt 343 is malevolent. I don’t think anyone or anything inherently is. But 343 saw this coming, with the reputation they have with the community, and okayed the system regardless of that. They took a chance, and it turns out it didn’t end so well for them.
Should wait for more info, but with what we have right now, its a bit hard to say many of us are content, and for good reason. More bad than good.
> 2533274843634673;536:
> > 2533274795123910;534:
> > > 2533274843634673;519:
> > > 1. You’re ignoring the fact that it has been explicitly stated that they chose this path because it gives their developers more options to make more and better armor color variants.
> >
> > You’re falling for their PR and vague phrasing.
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>
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> > > > > > > 'If we assume that Infinite uses the same REQ pack system as H5 does, then a $5 average retail value could simply mean that it’s unlockable from gold packs – which are easily obtained via in-game currency.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Why would you assume that ?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > 343i have already stated that Halo Infinite will not have paid loot crates, they also added that there would be no loot crates available with an in game currency that could be purchased with real money. From what I’ve read the purchase of cosmetcs is not really the issue.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > We all expected micro transactions, but not at the cost of our current colour system. I’ve yet to see one compelling reason why we cannot have the new armour coatings and our current colour system, and they could easily have promotional coats that cannot be changed.
> > > > >
> > > > > As for why we can’t have both armor coatings and the old color system, it’s been said that the reason is simply that that’s not how the game was built. They opted for the coating system to give the developers an easier way to produce a wider variety of skin options. Implementing two different systems into the game to achieve effectively the same thing is a waste of time and resources. I think we’ll find that the coating system isn’t as bad as people think it is right now.
> > > > >
> > > > > Theoretically, they could release coatings that cover the entire spectrum of color combinations available in the current games - which would solve everything.
> > > > >
> > > > > Check out the thread on how coatings are planned to work here: https://twitter.com/Unyshek/status/1319827586088747008 That thread should answer some of the questions you brought up.
> > > >
> > > > 1) They designed it that way to monetise it imo, still not a compelling reason not to have the existing system. I’m sure they could still have the base colour system in conjunction with it. If anything removing base colours is less options.
> > > >
> > > > 2) Theoretically why go to all that trouble when we could use the existing system ? Nothing to solve that way.
> > > >
> > > > 3) No, it leaves as many questions as answers.
> > >
> > > 1. You’re ignoring the fact that it has been explicitly stated that they chose this path because it gives their developers more options to make more and better armor color variants.
> > >
> > > 2. See the answer above: It makes things easier for them.
> > >
> > > 3. The thread literally answered some of your questions, including what I wrote in the first answer here.
> > >
> > > I get that it’s “cool” to be cynical and hate on anything new 343 does, but you’re freaking out over something we don’t even know much about. Once it releases, I guarantee it’s not going to be as bad as you think. This happens literally every single time 343 does anything.
> >
> > 1) I’m not ignoring it. I simply do not believe them at this point. There is more customisation options by adding to our existing colour system. They did this to monetise imo, and you’re falling for PR speak.
>
> Are you guys also flat-Earthers? The fact that you really seem to believe that everything is a conspiracy against you is very telling.
>
> This may be a shock, but most of the time there’s no ulterior motive at work when a change is made between iterations of a game. Obviously, they want to make Infinite better than the previous games. They’ve decided that this armor coating system is one way to achieve this. That’s it.
>
> Consider this: Wouldn’t it be a really bad idea for 343 to implement something that players universally hate in their game? Wouldn’t that scare away many players who 343 want to become paying customers?It doesn’t make sense for them to do that. They’ll be far more successful if they make the game with the players in mind. That’s what they’ve done here. They’ve come to the conclusion that armor coatings are better in the long run. But, because people can’t fathom the possibility of 343 doing something that’s good, you assume they’re being greedy.
>
> Maybe wait until you actually get your hands on the game and see how it works for yourself before deciding that it’s the worst thing humanity has ever done.
You’re the only one that mentioned conspiracy, I never said or implied that about anything, nevermind everything. Don’t put words in my mouth. Like I said, I have nothing against the new system, it may very well improve the game but I fail to see how reducing our customisation is a good thing. I would also like a compelling reason why we cannot have both.
You want to accept what the say ? That’s fine. I simply do not believe them at this point. To me it looks like gating content for the sake of monetisation. You ask "_Wouldn’t it be a really bad idea for 343 to implement something that players universally hate in their game? Wouldn’t that scare away many players who 343 want to become paying customers?"_It seems that’s exactly what they’re doing because there’s back lash and it’s not just one or two complaining either, and they knew it would annoy players. At this point it appears to me that they’re gating colours to monetise them. If that’s not the case, 343i need to clear it up.
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> > > Maybe wait until you actually get your hands on the game and see how it works for yourself before deciding that it’s the worst thing humanity has ever done.
By that time, 343 has already achieved it’s goal of selling you the game. Waiting till after it launches, seeing what others have to say about it, and making an informed purchase is a good route, but it’s part of marketing to try and hype up a game and get pre-orders and day 1 purchases. The current lack of clear communication from the company seems to really undermine the goal of pre-release marketing and has the player base on the back foot and very hesitant instead of in a “take my money” mood. It’s comforting to hear that others are not rushing forth blindly and are skeptical of something the company would probably of loved to gloss over at the last minute after so many people had pre-ordered the game, or maybe missed such news before going to buy in-store. This game is currently on my “skip” list, but I keep checking in, for hope that there would actually be something to entice me as a costumer, rather than “I’m a halo fan and should buy it blindly to follow the story”. YouTube has done a great job of negating that as a reason. Didn’t buy Spider-Man till I could get it for $20 with all DLC, but I digress.
Armor coatings certainly need more details released for a good decision to be made. These vague statements from John Junyszek and the company have led to more confusion than clarity.
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> > > > > > > > Ya know what? If this is what we get instead of REQ packs . . . I will just have to live with it. Because at least its only the textures that are being affected. You never know, maybe 343 will explain the system and people will suddenly love it. Because lets get real, would you rather have every armor locked behind a pay-wall? Or would you prefer to have colors behind a pay-wall? I personally would prefer for colors to be locked behind a pay-wall.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I’d rather unlock armor/colors by simply playing like I used for a game I ALREADY PAID FOR. Anything else is exorbitant greed.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Who says you can’t?
> > > > >
> > > > > Sure hope that the color scheme you like isn’t behind a massive grind wall designed to frustrate you into just buying it for $5.
> > > > >
> > > > > Come on people, use your heads, we’ve all seen how this F2P crap works.
> > > >
> > > > Personally, I’m just more excited about the potential of armor coatings than mourning the loss of having primary colors. The potential of unique patterns, designs, effects, equipment, and more on your armor excites me too much to care about simple color schemes.
> > >
> > > “The Prophets are liars, but you are fools to do their bidding.”
> > >
> > > --Arbiter
> >
> > Meh, to me it seems more productive to be excited about the potential of a new direction than complain pointlessly online about a topic we don’t fully understand yet. Because remember, all this whining is from a paragraph and some screenshots.
>
> Why is blind support and hype “more productive” then being critical? Enjoying a product doesn’t mean you accept anything that is given to you simply because it has the name of that product on it.
Where’s the blind support? It points to reason to wait to hear the full information before losing your mind over partial information and jumping to conclusions 
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> > > > > > > > > > > > Ya know what? If this is what we get instead of REQ packs . . . I will just have to live with it. Because at least its only the textures that are being affected. You never know, maybe 343 will explain the system and people will suddenly love it. Because lets get real, would you rather have every armor locked behind a pay-wall? Or would you prefer to have colors behind a pay-wall? I personally would prefer for colors to be locked behind a pay-wall.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > I’d rather unlock armor/colors by simply playing like I used for a game I ALREADY PAID FOR. Anything else is exorbitant greed.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Who says you can’t?
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Sure hope that the color scheme you like isn’t behind a massive grind wall designed to frustrate you into just buying it for $5.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Come on people, use your heads, we’ve all seen how this F2P crap works.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Personally, I’m just more excited about the potential of armor coatings than mourning the loss of having primary colors. The potential of unique patterns, designs, effects, equipment, and more on your armor excites me too much to care about simple color schemes.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > “The Prophets are liars, but you are fools to do their bidding.”
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > --Arbiter
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Meh, to me it seems more productive to be excited about the potential of a new direction than complain pointlessly online about a topic we don’t fully understand yet. Because remember, all this whining is from a paragraph and some screenshots.
> > > > >
> > > > > And a receipt calling a coating a $5 value.
> > > >
> > > > Wouldn’t that just be an ERP for promotional purposes? Kind of like how ERP for Xbox Series X was like $699 in US promos a couple months before pricing was announced? It doesn’t necessarily mean the skin itself will be $5 in Halo. That’s part of the problem, people speculating based thigs they don’t fully comprehend. We need to wait to get the full story before complaining. If it ends up being a horrible system, I’ll be first in line to be upset, but so far I have no reason to be angry. Concerned, maybe, but angry? Come on.
> > >
> > > Imagine being outside, and walking between a pair of metal rails. You see a pair of flashing red lights lights, and a bell. Then the ground rumbles, and you hear a loud whistle in the distance.
> > >
> > > You’d apparently sit there and wait to see what happens
> > > I use my common sense, and realize that there’s a -yoinking- train barreling towards me.
> >
> > It’s pretty fitting that people on the Halo forum are comparing potentially paying money for one armor coating to being hit by a train.
> >
> > I love how we are hyper-analyzing a promotional price, even after I gave a real-world example of how they are, more often than not, simply placeholders. Not to mention there is no reason to believe that every single armor coating will be purchase-only.
> >
> > Stop with the melodrama guys, please.
>
> Just checking, your best argument against my point is that my metaphor is an exaggeration?
>
> Because that’s literally hilarious.
I mean, it was an absolutely brutal metaphor. But nice strawman, focusing on that instead of the very real argument of not hyper-analyzing vague information and losing your mind over it. Point is, instead of getting worked up over something you don’t understand, wait to see what it is first. It’s embarrassing to watch people panic but their entire arguments are based on speculation.
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> > > > > > > > > Ya know what? If this is what we get instead of REQ packs . . . I will just have to live with it. Because at least its only the textures that are being affected. You never know, maybe 343 will explain the system and people will suddenly love it. Because lets get real, would you rather have every armor locked behind a pay-wall? Or would you prefer to have colors behind a pay-wall? I personally would prefer for colors to be locked behind a pay-wall.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > I’d rather unlock armor/colors by simply playing like I used for a game I ALREADY PAID FOR. Anything else is exorbitant greed.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Who says you can’t?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Sure hope that the color scheme you like isn’t behind a massive grind wall designed to frustrate you into just buying it for $5.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Come on people, use your heads, we’ve all seen how this F2P crap works.
> > > > >
> > > > > Personally, I’m just more excited about the potential of armor coatings than mourning the loss of having primary colors. The potential of unique patterns, designs, effects, equipment, and more on your armor excites me too much to care about simple color schemes.
> > > >
> > > > “The Prophets are liars, but you are fools to do their bidding.”
> > > >
> > > > --Arbiter
> > >
> > > Meh, to me it seems more productive to be excited about the potential of a new direction than complain pointlessly online about a topic we don’t fully understand yet. Because remember, all this whining is from a paragraph and some screenshots.
> >
> > Why is blind support and hype “more productive” then being critical? Enjoying a product doesn’t mean you accept anything that is given to you simply because it has the name of that product on it.
>
> Where’s the blind support? It points to reason to wait to hear the full information before losing your mind over partial information and jumping to conclusions
But it’s not us jumping to conclusions that they took out classic customization in favor for shaders, many of which are confirmed to be paywalled, even if temporarily. There’s no speculation in those facts, and that is what we’re mad about.
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> > > > > > > > > > Ya know what? If this is what we get instead of REQ packs . . . I will just have to live with it. Because at least its only the textures that are being affected. You never know, maybe 343 will explain the system and people will suddenly love it. Because lets get real, would you rather have every armor locked behind a pay-wall? Or would you prefer to have colors behind a pay-wall? I personally would prefer for colors to be locked behind a pay-wall.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I’d rather unlock armor/colors by simply playing like I used for a game I ALREADY PAID FOR. Anything else is exorbitant greed.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Who says you can’t?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Sure hope that the color scheme you like isn’t behind a massive grind wall designed to frustrate you into just buying it for $5.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Come on people, use your heads, we’ve all seen how this F2P crap works.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Personally, I’m just more excited about the potential of armor coatings than mourning the loss of having primary colors. The potential of unique patterns, designs, effects, equipment, and more on your armor excites me too much to care about simple color schemes.
> > > > >
> > > > > “The Prophets are liars, but you are fools to do their bidding.”
> > > > >
> > > > > --Arbiter
> > > >
> > > > Meh, to me it seems more productive to be excited about the potential of a new direction than complain pointlessly online about a topic we don’t fully understand yet. Because remember, all this whining is from a paragraph and some screenshots.
> > >
> > > Why is blind support and hype “more productive” then being critical? Enjoying a product doesn’t mean you accept anything that is given to you simply because it has the name of that product on it.
> >
> > Where’s the blind support? It points to reason to wait to hear the full information before losing your mind over partial information and jumping to conclusions
>
> But it’s not us jumping to conclusions that they took out classic customization in favor for shaders, many of which are confirmed to be paywalled, even if temporarily. There’s no speculation in those facts, and that is what we’re mad about.
Fair enough, but while they did confirm coatings would replace primary/secondary color options, we don’t know the full extent of what WILL be available. It could be better than what we had, it could be worse. We truly don’t know and I personally want to see what it is before panicking.
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> > > > > > > > > > > Ya know what? If this is what we get instead of REQ packs . . . I will just have to live with it. Because at least its only the textures that are being affected. You never know, maybe 343 will explain the system and people will suddenly love it. Because lets get real, would you rather have every armor locked behind a pay-wall? Or would you prefer to have colors behind a pay-wall? I personally would prefer for colors to be locked behind a pay-wall.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > I’d rather unlock armor/colors by simply playing like I used for a game I ALREADY PAID FOR. Anything else is exorbitant greed.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Who says you can’t?
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Sure hope that the color scheme you like isn’t behind a massive grind wall designed to frustrate you into just buying it for $5.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Come on people, use your heads, we’ve all seen how this F2P crap works.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Personally, I’m just more excited about the potential of armor coatings than mourning the loss of having primary colors. The potential of unique patterns, designs, effects, equipment, and more on your armor excites me too much to care about simple color schemes.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > “The Prophets are liars, but you are fools to do their bidding.”
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --Arbiter
> > > > >
> > > > > Meh, to me it seems more productive to be excited about the potential of a new direction than complain pointlessly online about a topic we don’t fully understand yet. Because remember, all this whining is from a paragraph and some screenshots.
> > > >
> > > > And a receipt calling a coating a $5 value.
Please don’t post multiple time in a row. If you need to add more information or quote other users, you can edit your last post. Thanks