I see a lot of people talking about how the health of the population is weakening and people claiming that the new Warzone farming methods are running new people off. There is science behind what these people are saying but I doubt any of you will look for it, so I will give you some leads. Watch for the wiki link.
If you have a full 12-man team of veteran players teaming up (because their spartan company only accepts people above a certain SR or with a specific K/D, w/e) and the other team is a mixed bag of veteran solos who don’t have any friends online, new players, or companies who only have a few people available, and the 12-man group goes into Warzone with a plan for taking everything and farming the map for commendations, blah blah… the other team is going to lose. And you’re going to make it miserable for them.
> “Learn to counter it, scrub.”
AHA! But they can’t! At least not the new players. There is something called the zone of proximal development that dictates whether or not you are going to be able to acquire a new skill. Raise your hand if you’ve beaten any Halo game’/s campaign on Legendary in your first playthrough. You didn’t. In fact, most of you probably didn’t even start with Legendary (though I’m sure a few of you hardcore types dive right in). You have to build a foundation for your knowledge and skill base before you can master something.
If your company is stomping every game so hard that the enemy can’t compete, they can’t learn anything. You are too much of a challenge. You are not playing “natural selection,” you are scaring away future opponents and the lifeblood of the game. These new players can’t learn the basic skills that will allow them to compete: map knowledge, boss spawns, base function, the REQ system… Simple system mastery will elude these people who see Warzone as the bastion of the elite, a place where only the hardest of the hardcore can even survive, let alone thrive.
If you have been operating under the assumption that you are helping players get better by providing a greater challenge, you are mistaken. Please reconsider.
How do we even know what the population is?
Personally I think the health of the game was doomed from start due to how it was shipped. Half finished, rest in free updates. You go back to previous Halos, people would milk kills in Objective game types like CTF and take the loss or win… just for kills. Not like it is new. Granted this unlock makes teams do it more often and try harder.
> 2533274873204041;1:
> I see a lot of people talking about how the health of the population is weakening and people claiming that the new Warzone farming methods are running new people off. There is science behind what these people are saying but I doubt any of you will look for it, so I will give you some leads. Watch for the wiki link.
>
> If you have a full 12-man team of veteran players teaming up (because their spartan company only accepts people above a certain SR or with a specific K/D, w/e) and the other team is a mixed bag of veteran solos who don’t have any friends online, new players, or companies who only have a few people available, and the 12-man group goes into Warzone with a plan for taking everything and farming the map for commendations, blah blah… the other team is going to lose. And you’re going to make it miserable for them.
>
>
> > “Learn to counter it, scrub.”
>
>
> AHA! But they can’t! At least not the new players. There is something called the zone of proximal development that dictates whether or not you are going to be able to acquire a new skill. Raise your hand if you’ve beaten any Halo game’/s campaign on Legendary in your first playthrough. You didn’t. In fact, most of you probably didn’t even start with Legendary (though I’m sure a few of you hardcore types dive right in). You have to build a foundation for your knowledge and skill base before you can master something.
>
> If your company is stomping every game so hard that the enemy can’t compete, they can’t learn anything. You are too much of a challenge. You are not playing “natural selection,” you are scaring away future opponents and the lifeblood of the game. These new players can’t learn the basic skills that will allow them to compete: map knowledge, boss spawns, base function, the REQ system… Simple system mastery will elude these people who see Warzone as the bastion of the elite, a place where only the hardest of the hardcore can even survive, let alone thrive.
>
> If you have been operating under the assumption that you are helping players get better by providing a greater challenge, you are mistaken. Please reconsider.
I’m a dedicated Halo player, I’ve completed most campaigns, including H5 Solo Legendary. There is no replacement for speed, skill, coordination and observation, I have little of each. I enjoy playing but mostly in short bursts, friends are not usually on when I am. It’s not fun getting destroyed by organized communicative teams but I love the game. What IS awesome is when you can hear the team you’re on is a bunch of noobs with a couple(few) veterans, sometimes speaking different languages, come together and piss off an organized team by beating them by a good margin. That’s priceless!
> 2533274873204041;5:
> I just want to point out that there are 10+ threads on this issue that have been active in just the past several hours.
>
> 343i can’t afford the negative publicity this might generate if there are gaming journalists on the wrong end of this problem.
You are right. And the wrong end of this problem is that every player complaining about this is making it seem like it happens to them every single game. When in reality it happens every once in a while and they can’t take a beating without a shed of tears.
> 2533274824485044;6:
> > 2533274873204041;5:
> > I just want to point out that there are 10+ threads on this issue that have been active in just the past several hours.
> >
> > 343i can’t afford the negative publicity this might generate if there are gaming journalists on the wrong end of this problem.
>
>
> You are right. And the wrong end of this problem is that every player complaining about this is making it seem like it happens to them every single game. When in reality it happens every once in a while and they can’t take a beating without a shed of tears.
I think most people are just annoyed at the trend. “Once in a while” turned to every weekend, which turned to 3 games in a row every weekend, which turned into every game session. Anyone who has played warzone since launch can see it has changed, and not for the better.
> 2533274824485044;6:
> > 2533274873204041;5:
> > I just want to point out that there are 10+ threads on this issue that have been active in just the past several hours.
> >
> > 343i can’t afford the negative publicity this might generate if there are gaming journalists on the wrong end of this problem.
>
>
> You are right. And the wrong end of this problem is that every player complaining about this is making it seem like it happens to them every single game. When in reality it happens every once in a while and they can’t take a beating without a shed of tears.
Tell that to someone who gets shafted several times in a row. I’m happy for you that you don’t get these bad games. Others aren’t so lucky.
It’s comically ironic getting requests from clans recruiting me. “You did great back there, haha. wanna join muh clain? :P”
No, lol. The only reason I GOT that way is to stop my teammates from quitting. You people ruin casual play so badly for everyone that I can’t stomach doing it to other people, and in the end all you ever accomplished was making the other team quit out until you had no opponents left, which frankly, you deserve. Go play ranked, or something.
You see, there is a reason why Raid on Apex 7 is the best Warzone map: each Home base has a back exit to launch a counterattack from. The other maps lack this, and as such the rare time we have an underdog-victory scenario it almost always occurs on Apex 7, at least in my experience. If it was so easy to counter a spawntrap, then THESE THREADS WOULDN’T EXIST IN THE FIRST PLACE. And the few times I’ve seen such comebacks, they’ve always been overshadowed by the 90 other games where they didn’t happen.
Look, if you enjoy being killed 20 times over a span of 10 minutes, just spawn yourself over a killball in forge over and over again. But I shouldn’t have to deal with people who think that “good map control” and “communicative teamwork” is a justification for ruining so many others’ enjoyment.
> 2533274873204041;1:
> I see a lot of people talking about how the health of the population is weakening and people claiming that the new Warzone farming methods are running new people off. There is science behind what these people are saying but I doubt any of you will look for it, so I will give you some leads. Watch for the wiki link.
>
> If you have a full 12-man team of veteran players teaming up (because their spartan company only accepts people above a certain SR or with a specific K/D, w/e) and the other team is a mixed bag of veteran solos who don’t have any friends online, new players, or companies who only have a few people available, and the 12-man group goes into Warzone with a plan for taking everything and farming the map for commendations, blah blah… the other team is going to lose. And you’re going to make it miserable for them.
>
>
> > “Learn to counter it, scrub.”
>
>
> AHA! But they can’t! At least not the new players. There is something called the zone of proximal development that dictates whether or not you are going to be able to acquire a new skill. Raise your hand if you’ve beaten any Halo game’/s campaign on Legendary in your first playthrough. You didn’t. In fact, most of you probably didn’t even start with Legendary (though I’m sure a few of you hardcore types dive right in). You have to build a foundation for your knowledge and skill base before you can master something.
>
> If your company is stomping every game so hard that the enemy can’t compete, they can’t learn anything. You are too much of a challenge. You are not playing “natural selection,” you are scaring away future opponents and the lifeblood of the game. These new players can’t learn the basic skills that will allow them to compete: map knowledge, boss spawns, base function, the REQ system… Simple system mastery will elude these people who see Warzone as the bastion of the elite, a place where only the hardest of the hardcore can even survive, let alone thrive.
>
> If you have been operating under the assumption that you are helping players get better by providing a greater challenge, you are mistaken. Please reconsider.
Some people just can’t NOT be competitive. They are so driven that they don’t care if their actions end up killing the game’s population.
That’s why 343i should add a PvE only Warzone game type. So that way, Halo 5 could actually have a causal game type. Because Warzone is changing into more and more of a competitive game type.
I think what you’re missing, is that though this game is Halo (and I really feel that it is, want to say that before the haters kick in and say no) it handles much differently than its predecessors. As in, someone with no halo experience is able to achieve the same level of skill that a seasoned vet can in a similar amount of time. The problem is not vet vs noob, but party vs solo. No matter how good a solo player is, communicatiom and teamwork will always triumph. But the only way to nerf this ‘advantage’ is to take away from peoples’ ability to party up (which imo is a staple of halo).
In my one and only experience (mind you I play H5 a LOT) of the whole ‘Achilles strategy,’ only occured after my entire retarded team of 12 was too stupid to focus on one armory. I just don’t feel like a team of people who have taken the time to strategize and learn the game should be punished for beating people with no sense of objective. I play solo a lot, and Im2 sure I’ve lost plenty to full warzone parties, but I feel like it’s less of a call to nerf teamplay and more of a call to quit playing selfish as a solo player.
So no, it’s not vet vs new player, it’s teamwork vs solo players ignoring teamwork. Thus, blowouts.
> 2533274826090763;16:
> I still think it should be ranked, then you wouldn’t have as much disparity in games that there is
Ranking wouldn’t be bad. If only so that the servers would TRY to balance the teams out. But I would hope that the server’s idea of balance would be better than “Okay, this team will be all gold and silver, but this team is going to get two diamond players, a half dozen bronze players, and some unranked guys.”
I don’t really have a “solution” to the “problem” because the problem is the people, not the game. There’s not a clean or simple way to reshape their behavior to make them stop being selfish -Yoinks!-. They could change the way the Achilles armor is awarded to change the behavior, but people would -Yoink- about it because they’ve been “working so hard” and “wasting their time” (hugely ridiculous concepts when you really think about what the armor REALLY is).
This whole episode is really revealing of elitist gamer culture and how AAA gaming companies are fostering that kind of behavior, encouraging it, even. Unless 343i addresses it (even if they don’t make a fix immediately), they will lose some customers. Probably won’t faze them in the slightest, which makes this an even sadder state of affairs.
Warzone farming is unavoidable. The kill commendations are astronomical, and if we simply cored the enemy team the first opportunity we got, we would NEVER reach the levels we need. The only feasible solution that doesn’t punish COORDINATED TEAMS WHO SIMPLY PLAY THE GAME is the “surrender” option, which would implement a vote among a team after certain prerequisites are reached (such as total control by the opposing team for X minutes, 80%+ kills or boss kills being held by the opposing team, point deficit of x amount, etc).
> 2533274989334266;19:
> Not that i really care about armour but what are the prerequisites for getting it?
>
> The achilles set that is.
You must master (complete fully) every single company commendation under the kill category. Basically, this entails 500,000+ kills, 300,000+ marine kills, then hundreds of thousands of specific medals like from the grave, splatters, hijacks, etc etc. Basically, if we were to core the enemy team first chance we got (which in most cases is within the first 5 minutes of the game), we would NEVER finish these commendations because we wouldn’t create the opportunity to get many of them.