Vehicle Welding "Support"

Games Halo 5: Guardians
1

Perhaps it is just my unfortunate luck, or maybe there are actually a lot of other people out there experiencing the same problems, either way here it goes starting with some build up…

When I heard about Forge Prefabs I was thrilled, and when I found out that Vehicle Welding would now be officially supported, I was ecstatic. All day at work I was anxious to get home and download the Anvil’s Legacy update so I could take my most prized Forge creation and share it with the world.

I reassembled a clean version to address that pesky coordinate drift that seems to happen with grouped/welded objects, sighed with relief when I could weld without any tricks or waiting, and got ready to save my creation as a Forge Object Group that I had hoped the community could use in creative ways.

However, when I hopped in to test out the scaled viewing distance feature I found that the object I created was a poor reflection of its pre-Anvil’s Legacy self. What was once a fast and nimble vehicle was now little more than a clunky, sluggish, and unwieldy mess.

Before: https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/game-clips?page=1&gamertag=Koma%20DeVius#ugc_halo-5-guardians_xbox-one_gameclip_Koma%20DeVius_d96455a3-95c3-4644-9cb7-1188711b69af

Then compare that to what I now see with the exact same object group after Vehicle Welding became officially “Supported”

After: https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/game-clips?page=1&gamertag=Koma%20DeVius#ugc_halo-5-guardians_xbox-one_gameclip_Koma%20DeVius_637e7c66-b976-4f3d-a3bc-0ce6dfd30b0f

So the end result here is that “Support” for vehicle welding does not seem to mean creative experiences and game play using unique vehicles with a different feel, it just seems to mean that now we are officially allowed to dress up vehicles to look different.

I’m not knocking other cool, interesting, or even funny creations like police hogs, hogs with bull horns, flyable phantoms, unicorn gooses, or any other wild creations. I’m just asking why does official support for this capability have to come at the cost of something so beautiful?

Before vehicle welding was supported we still had all of these same creations. We had spatula Banshees and pankcake warthogs alongside flyable x-wings and tie fighters, and for the first time in Halo history, working boats of different shapes and sizes. The only difference was that previously it took a few tricks to get it working.

Now, something that showed so much potential, and in my case piqued the interest of hundreds of players for the brief time it actually worked, is rendered useless and the countless hours I have poured into Forge feel like a tremendous waste of effort. Testing other cool maps I know for a fact that I am not alone.

I love to Forge, and I truly appreciate everything 343 has tried to accomplish with it in Halo 5, but when official “support” for one of the coolest things to have even become possible in Forge has such a tremendous impact and renders these amazing creations worthless, what is the point?

UPDATE: And along came the Monitor’s Bounty hunter to finish the job…

How is it that the second update featuring vehicle welding support just dropped, and vehicle welding is the worst it has even been? I understand things like this take time to refine, but we are very near the end of life for Halo 5 so there’s not a lot of time to refine vehicle welding support and 99% of the welded vehicles I have built/used worked far better when it was just a glitch. In fact, now that Monitor’s Bounty has released, most of the vehicles I have made or bookmarked no longer work at all!

2

UPDATE:

I have been testing several of my bookmarked maps as well as various prefabs posted since the update, and it seems like the changes have had an adverse effect on a surprisingly large number of welded vehicles, including some from popular custom games.

I’ve decided to start a list of maps using welded vehicles that no longer play right since the Anvil’s Legacy and Monitor’s Bounty updates.

  • Eretrian Naval Conflict by Koma DeVius - “Barracuda Assault Boat” (welded Warthog) - Starfighter Combat by CaptainDirewolf - “Tie Fighter/Bomber” (welded Banshee) - Black Flags by CaptainDirewolf - “Pirate Ship” (welded Scorpion)If you know of any other maps affected by the changes, please post them because I know a lot of good welded vehicles have been rendered unusable and it would be nice to show just how much of an impact this had on community content.
3

I feel like this is a very sad time for Forge. Vehicle welding was such an amazing thing to have, and it is the worst it has ever been, which is saying a lot considering up until a few months ago it was just a glitch.

So very much potential, yet so much of that gets stripped away unnecessarily. Hey, at least now we have the option of using a mere 83 scripts to make a king of the hill game type… joy…

4

Thank god i’m not the only one experiencing this infuriating problem with Prefabs (thanks to Monitor’s Bounty)! Whenever I spawn in my Prefabs they simply don’t work as they used to before Monitor’s Bounty and it REALLY annoys me because of how I love the concept of Prefabs and I enjoy making them…But now Prefabs just seem to jitter, glitch and even completely break! I know a few of my friends who have also noticed this since the update, it seems that everytime 343 update the game something breaks.

5

> 2533274983064833;4:
> Thank god i’m not the only one experiencing this infuriating problem with Prefabs (thanks to Monitor’s Bounty)! Whenever I spawn in my Prefabs they simply don’t work as they used to before Monitor’s Bounty and it REALLY annoys me because of how I love the concept of Prefabs and I enjoy making them…But now Prefabs just seem to jitter, glitch and even completely break! I know a few of my friends who have also noticed this since the update, it seems that everytime 343 update the game something breaks.

You’re definitely not alone here. I’ve seen some pretty cool maps completely wrecked by the last two updates. Even Anvil’s Legacy negatively impacted the way some of the best welded vehicles worked. I was disappointed when Anvil’s Legacy made welded vehicles less responsive, but Monitor’s Bounty has pushed it over the edge. I spent months refining my vehicles and getting them balanced just right, but now there’s no way to make them work at all. A buddy of mine welded a few lights, a tire, and a couple boxes to a Warthog, and since Monitor’s Bounty it barely even moves. I mean what is the point of vehicle welding if almost nothing works?

As you said, it seems like every update breaks something relatively big. I can’t update screenshots for maps, game types, or prefabs anymore. The thing that really bugs me the most is that things like this should not make it past testing phases of the development lifecycle. I mean if you’re going to support vehicle welding, wouldn’t you at least test updates on a good handful of popular welded vehicles to make sure they still work? It doesn’t matter if you’re using a waterfall or agile development methodology, thorough testing is always critical.

6

> 2533274882454719;5:
> > 2533274983064833;4:
> > Thank god i’m not the only one experiencing this infuriating problem with Prefabs (thanks to Monitor’s Bounty)! Whenever I spawn in my Prefabs they simply don’t work as they used to before Monitor’s Bounty and it REALLY annoys me because of how I love the concept of Prefabs and I enjoy making them…But now Prefabs just seem to jitter, glitch and even completely break! I know a few of my friends who have also noticed this since the update, it seems that everytime 343 update the game something breaks.
>
> You’re definitely not alone here. I’ve seen some pretty cool maps completely wrecked by the last two updates. Even Anvil’s Legacy negatively impacted the way some of the best welded vehicles worked. I was disappointed when Anvil’s Legacy made welded vehicles less responsive, but Monitor’s Bounty has pushed over the edge. I spent months refining my vehicles and getting them balanced just right, but now there’s no way to make them work at all. A buddy of mine welded a few lights, a tire, and a couple boxes to a Warthog, and since Monitor’s Bounty it barely even moves. I mean what is the point of vehicle welding if almost nothing works?
>
> As you said, it seems like every update breaks something relatively big. I can’t update screenshots for maps, game types, or prefabs anymore, and not to nitpick, but they even misspelled “bravo” in the channel menus for scripting and game labels (barvo, 343! barvo!). The thing that really bugs me the most is that things like this should not make it past testing phases of the development lifecycle. I mean if you’re going to support vehicle welding, wouldn’t you at least test updates on a good handful of popular welded vehicles to make sure they still work? It doesn’t matter if you’re using a waterfall or agile development methodology, thorough testing is always critical.

Indeed so, but that problem with you unable to update screenshots thing is very weird because I had that exact problem before the Monitor’s Bounty update and I would’ve thought that they had fixed it by now but no. Strangely though I tried making a Prefab using the invisible vehicles and it worked and that REALLY annoys me since the vehicles aren’t always invisible and their lights are still visible! Looks like i’m going to have to unweld and weld all my Prefabs to see if it works better, thanks 343 for another solid update! UPDATE: Nope, they glitch even worse!!!

7

> 2533274882454719;2:
> UPDATE:
>
> I have been testing several of my bookmarked maps as well as various prefabs posted since the update, and it seems like the changes have had an adverse effect on a surprisingly large number of welded vehicles, including some from popular custom games.
>
> I’ve decided to start a list of maps using welded vehicles that no longer play right since the Anvil’s Legacy update.
> - Eretrian Naval Conflict by Koma DeVius - “Barracuda Assault Boat” (welded Warthog) - Starfighter Combat by CaptainDireWolf - “Tie Fighter/Bomber” (welded Banshee)If you know of any other maps affected by the changes, please post them because I know a lot of good welded vehicles have been rendered unusable and it would be nice to show just how much of an impact this had on community content.

We also cant play black flags by CaptainDireWolf that was My favorite game type to play with my friends.

8

> 2533274976234674;7:
> > 2533274882454719;2:
> > UPDATE:
> >
> > I have been testing several of my bookmarked maps as well as various prefabs posted since the update, and it seems like the changes have had an adverse effect on a surprisingly large number of welded vehicles, including some from popular custom games.
> >
> > I’ve decided to start a list of maps using welded vehicles that no longer play right since the Anvil’s Legacy update.
> > - Eretrian Naval Conflict by Koma DeVius - “Barracuda Assault Boat” (welded Warthog) - Starfighter Combat by CaptainDireWolf - “Tie Fighter/Bomber” (welded Banshee)If you know of any other maps affected by the changes, please post them because I know a lot of good welded vehicles have been rendered unusable and it would be nice to show just how much of an impact this had on community content.
>
> We also cant play black flags by CaptainDireWolf that was My favorite game type to play with my friends.

Seriously? That one was still working fine after Anvil’s Legacy. This is a shame. I tested out Flapjack Frenzy on The Great Griddle, and even those Banshees are a bit wonky now, not as bad as the others, but still not as good as before the update.

9

> 2533274983064833;6:
> > 2533274882454719;5:
> > > 2533274983064833;4:
> > > Thank god i’m not the only one experiencing this infuriating problem with Prefabs (thanks to Monitor’s Bounty)! Whenever I spawn in my Prefabs they simply don’t work as they used to before Monitor’s Bounty and it REALLY annoys me because of how I love the concept of Prefabs and I enjoy making them…But now Prefabs just seem to jitter, glitch and even completely break! I know a few of my friends who have also noticed this since the update, it seems that everytime 343 update the game something breaks.
> >
> > You’re definitely not alone here. I’ve seen some pretty cool maps completely wrecked by the last two updates. Even Anvil’s Legacy negatively impacted the way some of the best welded vehicles worked. I was disappointed when Anvil’s Legacy made welded vehicles less responsive, but Monitor’s Bounty has pushed over the edge. I spent months refining my vehicles and getting them balanced just right, but now there’s no way to make them work at all. A buddy of mine welded a few lights, a tire, and a couple boxes to a Warthog, and since Monitor’s Bounty it barely even moves. I mean what is the point of vehicle welding if almost nothing works?
> >
> > As you said, it seems like every update breaks something relatively big. I can’t update screenshots for maps, game types, or prefabs anymore, and not to nitpick, but they even misspelled “bravo” in the channel menus for scripting and game labels (barvo, 343! barvo!). The thing that really bugs me the most is that things like this should not make it past testing phases of the development lifecycle. I mean if you’re going to support vehicle welding, wouldn’t you at least test updates on a good handful of popular welded vehicles to make sure they still work? It doesn’t matter if you’re using a waterfall or agile development methodology, thorough testing is always critical.
>
> Indeed so, but that problem with you unable to update screenshots thing is very weird because I had that exact problem before the Monitor’s Bounty update and I would’ve thought that they had fixed it by now but no. Strangely though I tried making a Prefab using the invisible vehicles and it worked and that REALLY annoys me since the vehicles aren’t always invisible and their lights are still visible! Looks like i’m going to have to unweld and weld all my Prefabs to see if it works better, thanks 343 for another solid update! UPDATE: Nope, they glitch even worse!!!

Does the problem with invisible vehicles being visible happen in customs too? I assumed it was just a Forge thing because Forge has always been a bit buggier than gameplay. Also, I haven’t tested it much, but the few times I did try them out the visibility issue only seemed to affect the driver and not the other players.

10

It’s an unfotunate issue with welding, but one that the Forge team is aware of and looking into. No eta on a fix for it though, sometime in the new year

<mark>Edit: moved to support</mark>

11

> 2533274882454719;9:
> > 2533274983064833;6:
> > > 2533274882454719;5:
> > > > 2533274983064833;4:
> > > > Thank god i’m not the only one experiencing this infuriating problem with Prefabs (thanks to Monitor’s Bounty)! Whenever I spawn in my Prefabs they simply don’t work as they used to before Monitor’s Bounty and it REALLY annoys me because of how I love the concept of Prefabs and I enjoy making them…But now Prefabs just seem to jitter, glitch and even completely break! I know a few of my friends who have also noticed this since the update, it seems that everytime 343 update the game something breaks.
> > >
> > > You’re definitely not alone here. I’ve seen some pretty cool maps completely wrecked by the last two updates. Even Anvil’s Legacy negatively impacted the way some of the best welded vehicles worked. I was disappointed when Anvil’s Legacy made welded vehicles less responsive, but Monitor’s Bounty has pushed over the edge. I spent months refining my vehicles and getting them balanced just right, but now there’s no way to make them work at all. A buddy of mine welded a few lights, a tire, and a couple boxes to a Warthog, and since Monitor’s Bounty it barely even moves. I mean what is the point of vehicle welding if almost nothing works?
> > >
> > > As you said, it seems like every update breaks something relatively big. I can’t update screenshots for maps, game types, or prefabs anymore, and not to nitpick, but they even misspelled “bravo” in the channel menus for scripting and game labels (barvo, 343! barvo!). The thing that really bugs me the most is that things like this should not make it past testing phases of the development lifecycle. I mean if you’re going to support vehicle welding, wouldn’t you at least test updates on a good handful of popular welded vehicles to make sure they still work? It doesn’t matter if you’re using a waterfall or agile development methodology, thorough testing is always critical.
> >
> > Indeed so, but that problem with you unable to update screenshots thing is very weird because I had that exact problem before the Monitor’s Bounty update and I would’ve thought that they had fixed it by now but no. Strangely though I tried making a Prefab using the invisible vehicles and it worked and that REALLY annoys me since the vehicles aren’t always invisible and their lights are still visible! Looks like i’m going to have to unweld and weld all my Prefabs to see if it works better, thanks 343 for another solid update! UPDATE: Nope, they glitch even worse!!!
>
> Does the problem with invisible vehicles being visible happen in customs too? I assumed it was just a Forge thing because Forge has always been a bit buggier than gameplay. Also, I haven’t tested it much, but the few times I did try them out the visibility issue only seemed to affect the driver and not the other players.

Yes it does, you can still see their lights and they become visible when you shoot.

12

> 2533274813317074;10:
> It’s an unfotunate issue with welding, but one that the Forge team is aware of and looking into. No eta on a fix for it though, sometime in the new year

Well I’m glad they’re aware of it and I hope this issue is addressed soon.

13

Wouldn’t this fit more under support forums?

14

> 2533274858572140;13:
> Wouldn’t this fit more under support forums?

It looks like it was indeed moved to Support. I’m glad that the issue isn’t being ignored. The updates to Forge, Customs, etc. have added so much great content and I really hope the welding issue can get resolved because I, and many others I’m sure, have so many things in mind to try with the new scripting options and vehicle welding.

15

I have also been experiencing this same issue and I dearly want them to fix this but we have to look at this from their point of view. They might literally not he able to. But if they can, please 343… Fix this… As it is the only reason I got on halo…

16

> 2535441361389534;15:
> I have also been experiencing this same issue and I dearly want them to fix this but we have to look at this from their point of view. They might literally not he able to. But if they can, please 343… Fix this… As it is the only reason I got on halo…

I do appreciate the challenge they face in getting things like this to work as intended, but the problem with the “they might literally not be able to” argument is that we know it worked before the last patch, and in many ways it worked even better when it was just a glitch. “Kind of” working is better than not working at all. Again, I’m super glad they want to support this functionality, but as it stands right now it might as well have been patched out completely.

17

The update could have added something to counter welding. Such as a physics edit

18

> 2535441361389534;15:
> I have also been experiencing this same issue and I dearly want them to fix this but we have to look at this from their point of view. They might literally not he able to. But if they can, please 343… Fix this… As it is the only reason I got on halo…

Almost 6 months since the original post… and it is still broken. They’re not going to fix vehicle welding in Halo 5.

I guess it would take too much attention away from their work on Halo $ix.

19

> 2533274882454719;18:
> Almost 6 months since the original post… and it is still broken. They’re not going to fix vehicle welding in Halo 5.
>
> I guess it would take too much attention away from their work on Halo $ix.

On the contrary
https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/news/patch-party

> - Fixed miscellaneous vehicle welding issues

20

> 2533274813317074;19:
> > 2533274882454719;18:
> > Almost 6 months since the original post… and it is still broken. They’re not going to fix vehicle welding in Halo 5.
> >
> > I guess it would take too much attention away from their work on Halo $ix.
>
> On the contrary
> https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/news/patch-party
>
>
> > - Fixed miscellaneous vehicle welding issues

I know this is a late reply, but this patch fixed almost nothing with how many welded vehicles behave. They still worked substantially better when it was just a “glitch” and many of them are still completely unusable.