Updates don't justify an unfinished product

Games Other Halo
1

We did not buy a finished product. We paid 60+/- bucks for an unfinished product.

If you are happy with it that’s great, but don’t tell me “343 are working on updates” and expect it to be enough. Come ON! I’ve never heard such warped reasoning in my life. It should not have been released in it’s current state. Future updates and improvements do NOT justify releasing a game riddled with flaws.

So many people are saying we are an ungrateful community. No. Gratitude doesn’t enter into this.

If you go to a restaurant and your meal is disgusting and you complain about it, how would you respond if someone says “You’re being ungrateful to the chef”?

If this was a new IP it would get slaughtered for the bugs and glitches and flaws. Just because it is Halo it is excused. Reviewers ignored the bugs and flaws, they ignored the linearity of the campaign, they ignored the barebones Spartan Ops feature, they ignored the limited options in custom games, and 343 is hailed as a holy developer with the Midas touch. Why?

EDIT: I’m normally lax about stuff like this. What is bothering me is when people are blindly defending 343’s actions by saying they’re working on an update to fix everything. The very fact that they need to work on an update is what’s making many of us so mad!

2

People only see the flaws when they’re looking at them. Then they focus only on those flaws as if they were the defining characteristic of the whole game. So for all the things they did wrong, in what parts did they do right? If you can’t give me some, I’m going to call this just a biased argument.

3

343 has given NO indication that there will be an update, for anything but the broken maps.

4

> People only see the flaws when they’re looking at them. Then they focus only on those flaws as if they were the defining characteristic of the whole game. So for all the things they did wrong, in what parts did they do right? If you can’t give me some, I’m going to call this just a biased argument.

Ok I’ll tell you (in my subjective opinion) some things that I think they did right. I’ll focus only on the positives.

Campaign: The Epilogue and the first 2 missions were amazing.
Multiplayer: The Spartans look great. The multitude of colours are welcome after the greys of Reach. I think the maps are mostly good (when you get to play on others besides Ragnarok and Haven). On the rare occasions that it works, I think multiplayer is very enjoyable.
Theater: Being able to save recent films without having to leave the MM lobby is a really great feature.

There are more positives, of course, but those are the ones that stick out in my mind.

P.S When speaking of flaws I was mainly referring to actual bugs or game mechanics (e.g instant respawn). I was not referring to subjective things (e.g weapon buffs).

5

> People only see the flaws when they’re looking at them. Then they focus only on those flaws as if they were the defining characteristic of the whole game. So for all the things they did wrong, in what parts did they do right? If you can’t give me some, I’m going to call this just a biased argument.

I’m sort of split between agreeing with either of you. Your idea that flaws are only apparent if you look at them is…flawed. Flaws are apparent when they get in the way of the positives e.g. facing a team that’s taking advantage of glitches in competitive game modes.

In cases like this (though not limited to) you can’t really say “just ignore those flaws, and look at all the positives” because you can’t look at the positives when the flaws are literally getting in the way.

Though, to the OP, I wouldn’t call the game unfinished. That would imply there are things missing, straight up. The problem with the game is the bugs and glitches.

If I go to a restaurant and order a steak, but I just get the sides then yeah, that’d be an unfinished product and I’d ask for my money back/get a discount. If I ordered a steak rare, and it was well done, then I’d ask them to fix it.

343i is (hopefully) fixing the done-ness of Halo 4 to a good medium rare.

6

> Though, to the OP, I wouldn’t call the game unfinished. That would imply there are things missing, straight up. The problem with the game is the bugs and glitches.
>
> If I go to a restaurant and order a steak, but I just get the sides then yeah, that’d be an unfinished product and I’d ask for my money back/get a discount. If I ordered a steak rare, and it was well done, then I’d ask them to fix it.
>
> 343i is (hopefully) fixing the done-ness of Halo 4 to a good medium rare.

Fair point. My post was a little self-contradicting.

7

Dude chill out… 343 actually did pretty good. I was expecting the launch to be riddled with lag and crap glitches but it was kept pretty minimal. 10x better than Reach was handled. The game is beyond a finished product. They offer so much to do. The fact that the standard game is only $60 is impressive. Not too many games offer episodic co-op campaign, regular campaign, forge, theater, multiplayer, huge armory, etc… Halo is packed with things to do so I’d hardly consider it unfinished. Just because you get smacked around every once in a while doesn’t mean you have to cry hard. I’ve seen far worse launches. This was one of the cleanest Halo launches yet IMO. You must not have been around for the Halo 2 launch… Button Glitches and super jumps never got patched up to the day that original live went down. How about the horrendous BR spread and framerate issues with Halo 3?

It’s hilarious that you find Halo 4 to be an unfinished product… So their was a hole in the wall on Complex… WOW… That is essentially the only thing that needed patched. I can’t wait to see all the primaries shift in functionality because people are butthurt that the DMR is better than the BR. The game is fine and the complainers are just terrible. I seriously just can’t wait until all the complainers get what they want and ruin Halo 4 just like they ruined all the other Halo games. The devs know what they are doing and shouldn’t listen to little babies that are getting Boltshot’s to the face because they are too dumb to figure out how to avoid it. Go play CoD I hear that people that are terrible at Halo are usually a little less terrible at CoD.

8

The only thing about the Halo 4 release that I deem absolutely unacceptable is how the Fileshare system was down and IS still down and there is NO sign of support for it being worked on.

It is a 100% useless feature right now. You can’t make use of it here on the site. You wont see players make much use of it in game. The entire feature is going to suffer permanent damage because people are going to totally lose interest in content creation.

Bungie never let themselves fall behind on the content creation bits of the community. It NEEDS attention and support. Forge geniuses only bother to do miracles again and again when they can expect help from the site to get their map out and downloaded.

Yet still. Nothing. Forge and Gametype creation is almost as limited as it was in Halo 3 and we are seeing and hearing nothing from anyone about saving it OR the community that was so dedicated and useful to Halo coming from the other Halo games.

9

> Dude chill out… 343 actually did pretty good.
>
> Just because you get smacked around every once in a while doesn’t mean you have to cry hard.
> You must not have been around for the Halo 2 launch…
>
> I can’t wait to see all the primaries shift in functionality because people are butthurt that the DMR is better than the BR.
>
> I seriously just can’t wait until all the complainers get what they want and ruin Halo 4 just like they ruined all the other Halo games.The devs know what they are doing and shouldn’t listen to little babies that are getting Boltshot’s to the face because they are too dumb to figure out how to avoid it. Go play CoD I hear that people that are terrible at Halo are usually a little less terrible at CoD.

Someone needs to take their own advice and chill out…

10

“Just wait for the TU”

motto of the forum

11

He has a good point though to be honest.

12

I don’t care what game, for $60.00, I should get every map ever made free in each update. Especially when 343 has probably completed several map packs and are just waiting to release them for an extra buck. I mean, remember when games were so much cheaper and they were complete?

Not to mention add-ons/expansions weren’t necessary because of this.

13

> > Dude chill out… 343 actually did pretty good.
> >
> > Just because you get smacked around every once in a while doesn’t mean you have to cry hard.
> > You must not have been around for the Halo 2 launch…
> >
> > I can’t wait to see all the primaries shift in functionality because people are butthurt that the DMR is better than the BR.
> >
> > I seriously just can’t wait until all the complainers get what they want and ruin Halo 4 just like they ruined all the other Halo games.The devs know what they are doing and shouldn’t listen to little babies that are getting Boltshot’s to the face because they are too dumb to figure out how to avoid it. Go play CoD I hear that people that are terrible at Halo are usually a little less terrible at CoD.
>
> Someone needs to take their own advice and chill out…

I’m mono-tone so just imagine all of that written out in a calm calm form. :slight_smile: I’m only madBrO because this dude is freaking out without any real reason to. The game is a full complete game. It’ far more complete than many many games on the market. Aside from the Complex wall glitch the game was fine. The whole topic of the post being 343 sold us an unfinished game and talking about how a patch doesn’t justify 343 selling us an unfinished product is laughable.

I never thought I would see the day that someone complaining because devs are fixing the game… Only the Halo community…

14

> I’m mono-tone so just imagine all of that written out in a calm calm form. :slight_smile: I’m only madBrO because this dude is freaking out without any real reason to. The game is a full complete game. It’ far more complete than many many games on the market. Aside from the Complex wall glitch the game was fine. The whole topic of the post being 343 sold us an unfinished game and talking about how a patch doesn’t justify 343 selling us an unfinished product is laughable.
>
>
> I never thought I would see the day that someone complaining because devs are fixing the game… Only the Halo community…

To be fair to the OP, I already pointed out how weird it was to call it unfinished. He agreed, and said he was mainly dissappointed with the number of bugs and glitches there are (which I believe, have decreased now).

15

> We did not buy a finished product. We paid 60+/- bucks for an unfinished product.
>
> If you are happy with it that’s great, but don’t tell me “343 are working on updates” and expect it to be enough. Come ON! I’ve never heard such warped reasoning in my life. It should not have been released in it’s current state. Future updates and improvements do NOT justify releasing a game riddled with flaws.
>
> So many people are saying we are an ungrateful community. No. Gratitude doesn’t enter into this.
>
> If you go to a restaurant and your meal is disgusting and you complain about it, how would you respond if someone says “You’re being ungrateful to the chef”?
>
>
>
> If this was a new IP it would get slaughtered for the bugs and glitches and flaws. Just because it is Halo it is excused. Reviewers ignored the bugs and flaws, they ignored the linearity of the campaign, they ignored the barebones Spartan Ops feature, they ignored the limited options in custom games, and 343 is hailed as a holy developer with the Midas touch. Why?
>
>
> EDIT: I’m normally lax about stuff like this. What is bothering me is when people are blindly defending 343’s actions by saying they’re working on an update to fix everything. The very fact that they need to work on an update is what’s making many of us so mad!

Sorry you are not enjoying this great game like we are.

I understand your frustration but there is not any deal breakers in the game for me or many other to be honest. Granted I think Theater mode is totally flawed NOT allowing parties to watch video together.

IF 343i can fix this, the game will be pretty solid and complete for me.

I also noticed you have no stats in your service record.

Just saying.

16

I find it funny that you all mention problems with Multiplayer. All I care for is Campaign but it’s hardly likely my issues will be patched. Nice huh. But I suppose if Microsoft never had a agenda (sorry, business (=money) in getting Halo out before Black Ops, we might have a decent, detailed game which reminded us of it’s predecessors’. Just half baked and half worked on IMO.

17

> We did not buy a finished product. We paid 60+/- bucks for an unfinished product.
>
> If you are happy with it that’s great, but don’t tell me “343 are working on updates” and expect it to be enough. Come ON! I’ve never heard such warped reasoning in my life. It should not have been released in it’s current state. Future updates and improvements do NOT justify releasing a game riddled with flaws.
>
> So many people are saying we are an ungrateful community. No. Gratitude doesn’t enter into this.
>
> If you go to a restaurant and your meal is disgusting and you complain about it, how would you respond if someone says “You’re being ungrateful to the chef”?
>
>
>
> If this was a new IP it would get slaughtered for the bugs and glitches and flaws. Just because it is Halo it is excused. Reviewers ignored the bugs and flaws, they ignored the linearity of the campaign, they ignored the barebones Spartan Ops feature, they ignored the limited options in custom games, and 343 is hailed as a holy developer with the Midas touch. Why?
>
>
> EDIT: I’m normally lax about stuff like this. What is bothering me is when people are blindly defending 343’s actions by saying they’re working on an update to fix everything. The very fact that they need to work on an update is what’s making many of us so mad!

You effin’ rock. You’re dead on.

When we discussed the need for a beta 343 basically said their in house testing was enough and good enough , and they needed to “polish”. All the 343 fanboys said “Ya, they’re right , betas are useless! Just do it without!” And now that H4 is out and horrendous all the fanboys are “But they didn’t have a beta, give them a break!”

Sorry, no.

They’re supposed to be professionals. If your surgeon operated on you and left a scalpel in you would you give him a break? No, you’d think you’d just won the lottery and sue him.

343 should have had an open beta. There’s no substitute for it.

Here’s what happened. They got behind. They skipped the public beta hoping that would allow them to release a completed game but it didn’t. However; their daddy, Money$oft, had to have a Halo game out for the 2012 Holiday dollars. So they finished campaign, and shipped the game with an unfinished multiplayer. They had to have SOMETHING on the shelf for black Friday, right?

They should have announced the game was delayed until January, had a beta test in November, and incorporated changes in December.

But instead we get to pay to beta test.

And the lag and black screens are even worse than Reach because these so called professionals kept us in P2p networking and wouldn’t put us in dedicated servers.

Shoulda had a beta.
Shoulda went with dedicated servers…

18

Nerds over analyzing things. Yay!

This forum is unbearable.

19

> So they finished campaign, and shipped the game with an unfinished multiplayer.

Campaign is far from finished. It’s still got glitches and things people haven’t reported.

And why give Microsoft’s Cash piñata dedicated servers when Gears of War can have them instead? “The net-code is so good, you don’t need dedicated servers” I believe was the quote from Frank. Nice going. But no.

20

> I don’t care what game, for $60.00, I should get every map ever made free in each update. Especially when 343 has probably completed several map packs and are just waiting to release them for an extra buck. I mean, remember when games were so much cheaper and they were complete?
>
> Not to mention add-ons/expansions weren’t necessary because of this.

Sadly, those days are long gone, thanx largely to companies like Microsoft, EA, etc, etc. Some games these days can have DLC doubling, even tripling the cost of the game. But what can you do? Most of the gaming community is apathetic to this & just churn out money to buy, buy, buy. A lot of games these days feel like they gut the game, just to squeeze more cash out of you via that magic word, DLC.

I hope it will eventually turn around & we’ll see a return to those days, but I’m not holding my breath for it. While companies like Microsoft, Sony, EA dominate the industry, they’ll squeeze every last dollar they can out of us. Mayhaps another video games market crash like what happened in the 80’s would do the industry some good?