Update: What Halo 4 can learn from Halo Reach

Through many matches and being a Halo veteran, here are a few suggestions that are from the silent majority:
(Update: 1-4 seems to have been solved with UNSC Infinity)

  1. Fix quitters by allowing others to join so the games don’t stay uneven for the rest of the game.

  2. The Quitters mainly come from the “DEMOCRATIC VOTING SYSTEM” which leaves the minority of the vote to not enjoy the game and then quit! Remember, a democracy is 2 wolves and a sheep choosing what’s for dinner!

  3. Get rid of the penalizing system for quitting because that makes people not even want to play the darn game!

(So far, mainly its the quitting which is destroying Reach currently, and the solution is pretty simple. Get rid of the voting and allow the choice of the game they want to play to be completely in the users )

  1. Custom game Matchmaking. What a waste has forge been without really sharing the maps that people created, and the search engine to find maps and game types was sloppy and really a waste of time mostly

(maybe solved)5. The DMR…Why make EVERYONE THE DESIGNATED MARKSMAN? The AR/pistol starting equipment was the sweet spot of the game, but some people complained and somewhere along the grapevine someone decided to give EVERYONE THE DMR and now all you hear when playing most games is “Pah, pah, pah, pah” and then you are respawning. It takes away from the AR and the “power weapon” the DMR really is! Make at least a AR selection in the vote for the meantime. And with Halo 4 and the BR…not sure because I haven’t played it, but all I can say is take into consideration the power weapon view compared to the AR and pistol, as well as the potential of the AR being a combative weapon.

6.Vehicles: Give the Falcon flares and an alarm for incoming missiles! Ejection seats? When someone boards the vehicle and not being able to get out is just not right. Maybe if you speed the frame of movement of the highjack/board and grenade/getting out of the vehicle to get out, it can work. But overall, from the feedback I’ve received, it is too slow getting in and out of vehicles. Rocket Hog should be replaced with the Wolverine. Bring in Locusts, Cobras, Vampires to the table. Increase the ceiling and play field. I know many people who dislike the ceilings on the maps and number of players (that may not be possible until the next system, but if not possible now, please keep in mind for the next generation. Think Battlefield/WOW/Mass Effect/StarTrek Online and maybe you might just have a serious masterpiece.)

(solved)7.Loadouts…Execellent, but just up the ante.

Updates:

Just read the Game Informer Magazine and 343 seems to be heading in the right direction. The solutions for quitters with UNSC Infinity and the multiplayer missions, with sprint not being an ability but an actual action that anyone can do, plus the addition of really customizing your abilities, weapons, and unknown modifications. I think some of you nay sayers may be surprised, but as I have seen and heard before, some of those who critique games are not productive towards improvement with statements like " halo reach loadouts sucked", or “trolling”, if you will, and feel good about complaining. Discussion and debates usually lead to that thing called brrrraaaainstorming.

So aside from my opinion of some bloggers, Halo 4 is now bringing back the Battlerifle and the DMR with a few carbines and random spawn drops. I am curious ito see how the that plays out with reference to the point 4, but then we throw your customization of starting weapon, grenades, loadouts, who knows how the crazy heartpounding gameplay will commence.

Update 8.
The last point that I did want to add in my point about the DMR. Through discussions with players who have seen E-sports ruin games, MLG gamestyle takes away what Halo is all about, since nearly its beginning. I’m sure to hear wonderful responses for this, but here is my reaons if you care to understand them with an open mind.

MLG took away the motion tracker, which that right there is the technology that is in the 26th century people, but nope, take that out and lets give everyone the power weapon so the Assault rifle and pistol become quite insignificant. The DMR is for a designated person, and MLG gametype had everyone starting with it, which infested the main gametypes for matchmaking. My main point is to keep MLG seperate and don’t let it change the original gamestyle. Let MLG get rid of the forerunnner technology and everyone be required to start off with this grenade and the Battle Rifle with sprint only!

Maybe, MLG should just try playing a competative game with the way the game was intended. I am 100% competative and am not knocking the competition MLG brings(even though I do laugh, with respect, at how people get paid to play video games while the Federal Reserve just printed at least $50,000 within the time you just read this sentence which just devalued our currency, but anyways).

Update 9.
Bringing back NO Health bar is going to be interesting. I personally thought the health measured the armor damage, rather than taking a fair guess at how close you are to death. I will opine that if they give some measurement like Gears of War blood build up to show how much damage you are taking.

I do appreciate the discussion and feedback, unless it is unproductive, like government and wastes time.

Not using the same horrible motionblur.

Can we have a good Halo story? Reach didn’t deliver at all.

Increase speed and jump hight.

Bring back a lvl 1-50 system. Hopefully a new one that works.

Maby ad an armor like Recon armor that you have to earn by doing something for the community. People love things they can’t have u know :wink:

Ability to boot somebody who consistently commits suicide in competitive play. We can boot betrayers, but not suiciders? Pfft.

> Through many matches and being a Halo veteran, here are a few suggestions that are from the silent majority:
>
> 1. Fix quitters by allowing others to join so the games don’t stay uneven for the rest of the game.
> sounds good to me
>
> 2. The Quitters mainly come from the “DEMOCRATIC VOTING SYSTEM” which leaves the minority of the vote to not enjoy the game and then quit! Remember, a democracy is 2 wolves and a sheep choosing what’s for dinner!
> yeah, lets get rid of the system that lets us choose just because some whiners quit when they don’t get their way. Democracy works so why end it?
> 3. Get rid of the penalizing system for quitting because that makes people not even want to play the darn game!
>
> (So far, mainly its the quitting which is destroying Reach currently, and the solution is pretty simple. Get rid of the voting and allow the choice of the game they want to play to be completely in the users hands.)
> Honestly, people will just quit as soon as they are about to lose. Since there is no penalty, they will not have “lost”. This idea is literally teh worst i’ve heard besides AL and JP.
> 4. Custom game Matchmaking. What a waste has forge been without really sharing the maps that people created, and the search engine to find maps and game types was sloppy and really a waste of time mostly
> Yep, we all want this, but hos is this learning from Reach?
> 5. The DMR…Why make EVERYONE THE DESIGNATED MARKSMAN? The AR/pistol starting equipment was the sweet spot of the game, but some people complained and somewhere along the grapevine someone decided to give EVERYONE THE DMR and now all you hear when playing most games is “Pah, pah, pah, pah” and then you are respawning. It takes away from the AR and the “power weapon” the DMR really is! Make at least a AR selection in the vote for the meantime. And with Halo 4 and the BR…not sure because I haven’t played it, but all I can say is take into consideration the power weapon view compared to the AR and pistol, as well as the potential of the AR being a combative weapon.
> The AR is the weapon for new people. The BR rewards aim and skill. Why should I not start with a BR? Honestly it makes the game so much more competitive and fun. Plus, if you have a good enemy team, they will control the BRs and spawn kill the hell out of you all day. BR starts prevent spawn camping to an extent taht is greater than that of ARs
>
> 6.Vehicles: Give the Falcon flares and an alarm for incoming missiles! Ejection seats? When someone boards the vehicle and not being able to get out is just not right. Maybe if you speed the frame of movement of the highjack/board and grenade/getting out of the vehicle to get out, it can work. But overall, from the feedback I’ve received, it is too slow getting in and out of vehicles. Rocket Hog should be replaced with the Wolverine. Bring in Locusts, Cobras, Vampires to the table. Increase the ceiling and play field. I know many people who dislike the ceilings on the maps and number of players (that may not be possible until the next system, but if not possible now, please keep in mind for the next generation. Think Battlefield/WOW/Mass Effect/StarTrek Online and maybe you might just have a serious masterpiece.)
> I dont really care about this as long as balance is maintained.
>
> 7.Loadouts…Execellent, but just up the ante.

At this point I can’t tell if you are actually serious. Please tell me that this is a joke. REach loadouts were part of the game that made people leave.

Lol April Fools.

What can Halo 4 Learn? What NOT to do.

LOL at voting causes quitters. Quite the opposite good sir. When we relied on a veto system, nobody got what they wanted and half the game would quit before the game even started.

Now that we have voting however, at least the majority of players get what they want.

Actually, I’m going to go ahead and say the quitting problem was MUCH worse in Halo 3 all around, and the one thing Reach nailed.

My Replies in bold.

> Through many matches and being a Halo veteran, here are a few suggestions that are from the silent majority:
>
> 1. Fix quitters by allowing others to join so the games don’t stay uneven for the rest of the game.
> Drop-in/drop-out system for Halo4? i cannot see how that would work right to be honest, for example one team is winning, a guy quits and a better player replaces, the losing team win’s because the replacement starts dominating left right and centre. Seem’s very unbalanced to me.
>
> 2. The Quitters mainly come from the “DEMOCRATIC VOTING SYSTEM” which leaves the minority of the vote to not enjoy the game and then quit! Remember, a democracy is 2 wolves and a sheep choosing what’s for dinner!
> The veto system is better than voting for several reason’s, with veto there is only 2 map choices and even then with good map weighing it makes for lots of variety. With voting this increases the amount of maps you will play back to back for example i once had asylum 12 time’s in a row, that is not fun.
>
> 3. Get rid of the penalizing system for quitting because that makes people not even want to play the darn game!
> Agreed, a 10 minute matchmaking ban is silly, in Halo 3 you lost 2 exp, why did reach not punish by removing cR? the matchmaking ban was a simple slap on the wrist, it did nothing to defter quitter’s it was simply just an annoyance to everyone since the system cant differentiate between quitter’s and people who simply lagged out. People will still quit regardless, they need a reason to stay in the game.
>
> (So far, mainly its the quitting which is destroying Reach currently, and the solution is pretty simple. Get rid of the voting and allow the choice of the game they want to play to be completely in the users hands.)
> Actually no, quitting player’s is far from the reason that is destroying Reach, i see no reason why i should go into detail on this subject as that is another thread entirely.
>
> 4. Custom game Matchmaking. What a waste has forge been without really sharing the maps that people created, and the search engine to find maps and game types was sloppy and really a waste of time mostly
> This would be a nice addition i agree, i’m sure 343i could come up with a good search/matching system to make this work amazingly well.
>
> 5. The DMR…Why make EVERYONE THE DESIGNATED MARKSMAN? The AR/pistol starting equipment was the sweet spot of the game, but some people complained and somewhere along the grapevine someone decided to give EVERYONE THE DMR and now all you hear when playing most games is “Pah, pah, pah, pah” and then you are respawning. It takes away from the AR and the “power weapon” the DMR really is! Make at least a AR selection in the vote for the meantime. And with Halo 4 and the BR…not sure because I haven’t played it, but all I can say is take into consideration the power weapon view compared to the AR and pistol, as well as the potential of the AR being a combative weapon.
> The DMR is effectively a ‘mini-sniper’, it restrict’s map movement for example. Also i do not see it as a skilled weapon, large hitboxes and extreme range accuracy are some reason’s again going into detail on the DMR is another thread for me entirely to explain.
>
>
> 6.Vehicles: Give the Falcon flares and an alarm for incoming missiles! Ejection seats? When someone boards the vehicle and not being able to get out is just not right. Maybe if you speed the frame of movement of the highjack/board and grenade/getting out of the vehicle to get out, it can work. But overall, from the feedback I’ve received, it is too slow getting in and out of vehicles. Rocket Hog should be replaced with the Wolverine. Bring in Locusts, Cobras, Vampires to the table. Increase the ceiling and play field. I know many people who dislike the ceilings on the maps and number of players (that may not be possible until the next system, but if not possible now, please keep in mind for the next generation. Think Battlefield/WOW/Mass Effect/StarTrek Online and maybe you might just have a serious masterpiece.)
> Vehicles should not be unstoppable killing machines, all the reasons you mentioned point’s to them being near-uber and to me that’s broken. Granted vehicles should give an advantage but not one that causes you to be unstoppable.
>
> 7.Loadouts…Execellent, but just up the ante.
> No, loadouts are unbalanced, even now i cannot see how 343i can quite possibly make these balanced, this is effectively making Halo a class based shooter, again this is moving Halo away from even start’s of which i am a great supporter therefore this counts as my opinion.

Having a skill based utility weapon isn’t a bad thing. Why don’t people understand that? It’s not like the AR can’t beat it close range. It can. But when it doesn’t it’s because they DMR/BR user is skillful enough to beat a person using a non-skilled weapon. There’s nothing wrong with it as long as it takes skill to use.

> Having a skill based utility weapon isn’t a bad thing. Why don’t people understand that? It’s not like the AR can’t beat it close range. It can. But when it doesn’t it’s because they DMR/BR user is skillful enough to beat a person using a non-skilled weapon. There’s nothing wrong with it as long as it takes skill to use.

Yet the DMR isn’t really a skillful weapon, on paper it should be, in reality it’s not.

blasphemy
EDIT: April fools

What Halo 4 can learn from reach:

When somethings messed up, nip it at the -Yoink- instantly or else you’ll have a million whining kids arguing for or against it (TU/bloom/bleedthrough/etc.)

What not to do?

> Through many matches and being a Halo veteran, here are a few suggestions that are from the silent majority:
>
> 1. Fix quitters by allowing others to join so the games don’t stay uneven for the rest of the game.
>
> 2. The Quitters mainly come from the “DEMOCRATIC VOTING SYSTEM” which leaves the minority of the vote to not enjoy the game and then quit! Remember, a democracy is 2 wolves and a sheep choosing what’s for dinner!
>
> 3. Get rid of the penalizing system for quitting because that makes people not even want to play the darn game!
>
> (So far, mainly its the quitting which is destroying Reach currently, and the solution is pretty simple. Get rid of the voting and allow the choice of the game they want to play to be completely in the users hands.)
>
> 4. Custom game Matchmaking. What a waste has forge been without really sharing the maps that people created, and the search engine to find maps and game types was sloppy and really a waste of time mostly
>
> 5. The DMR…Why make EVERYONE THE DESIGNATED MARKSMAN? The AR/pistol starting equipment was the sweet spot of the game, but some people complained and somewhere along the grapevine someone decided to give EVERYONE THE DMR and now all you hear when playing most games is “Pah, pah, pah, pah” and then you are respawning. It takes away from the AR and the “power weapon” the DMR really is! Make at least a AR selection in the vote for the meantime. And with Halo 4 and the BR…not sure because I haven’t played it, but all I can say is take into consideration the power weapon view compared to the AR and pistol, as well as the potential of the AR being a combative weapon.
>
> 6.Vehicles: Give the Falcon flares and an alarm for incoming missiles! Ejection seats? When someone boards the vehicle and not being able to get out is just not right. Maybe if you speed the frame of movement of the highjack/board and grenade/getting out of the vehicle to get out, it can work. But overall, from the feedback I’ve received, it is too slow getting in and out of vehicles. Rocket Hog should be replaced with the Wolverine. Bring in Locusts, Cobras, Vampires to the table. Increase the ceiling and play field. I know many people who dislike the ceilings on the maps and number of players (that may not be possible until the next system, but if not possible now, please keep in mind for the next generation. Think Battlefield/WOW/Mass Effect/StarTrek Online and maybe you might just have a serious masterpiece.)
>
> 7.Loadouts…Execellent, but just up the ante.

Allow me to comment on each of your points.

  1. That simply isn’t Halo.

  2. That may be attributed to some quitting, but in the bigger, it all relies on incentive. For example, in Halo 3, losing that 1 single experience point was the downside to quitting a game. However, in Halo: Reach, there are no downsides whatsoever. Yes, there was a quitter ban, but honestly, it helped very little, considering by my own experience quitters are worse in Halo: Reach than they were in Halo 3.

  3. I agree with this but for a much different reason: it’s redundant. It’s no motivator whatsoever to stay in a game. It was a stupid way to fix a problem that all games have. Like I said in the previous statement, it’s all about motivating the player to stay in the game.

  4. I would like this implemented in Halo 4’s matchmaking. You know, some sort of button you can turn on in your custom games lobby to enable the flow of players searching in some sort of custom games playlist into your lobby. This is a much, much better idea than placing undesirable community maps in matchmaking.

  5. If for some reason Falcons or some other aerial vehicles are in the game, I wouldn’t mind seeing some sort of feature like this implemented. The removal of fall damage would fix your next problem.

In the end, the majority of these points aren’t necessarily what 343i could “learn from Halo: Reach”, but learn from all community feedback of Halo multiplayer and game design overall. The only thing I could see 343i leaning from Halo: Reach is how far not to move away from the original Halo gameplay in Halo’s most successful titles, Halo 2 and Halo 3.

No gimmicks.

kthnxbi

Reach in general was an all around terrible game bungie really didn’t give any effort shur it brought new graphics and new forge but forge was just blan and grey and boring. Halo 4 should NOT be anything like that-yoink-of a game.

> > Through many matches and being a Halo veteran, here are a few suggestions that are from the silent majority:
> >
> > 1. Fix quitters by allowing others to join so the games don’t stay uneven for the rest of the game.
> > sounds good to me
> >
> > 2. The Quitters mainly come from the “DEMOCRATIC VOTING SYSTEM” which leaves the minority of the vote to not enjoy the game and then quit! Remember, a democracy is 2 wolves and a sheep choosing what’s for dinner!
> > yeah, lets get rid of the system that lets us choose just because some whiners quit when they don’t get their way. Democracy works so why end it?
> > 3. Get rid of the penalizing system for quitting because that makes people not even want to play the darn game!
> >
> > (So far, mainly its the quitting which is destroying Reach currently, and the solution is pretty simple. Get rid of the voting and allow the choice of the game they want to play to be completely in the users hands.)
> > Honestly, people will just quit as soon as they are about to lose. Since there is no penalty, they will not have “lost”. This idea is literally teh worst i’ve heard besides AL and JP.
> > 4. Custom game Matchmaking. What a waste has forge been without really sharing the maps that people created, and the search engine to find maps and game types was sloppy and really a waste of time mostly
> > Yep, we all want this, but hos is this learning from Reach?
> > 5. The DMR…Why make EVERYONE THE DESIGNATED MARKSMAN? The AR/pistol starting equipment was the sweet spot of the game, but some people complained and somewhere along the grapevine someone decided to give EVERYONE THE DMR and now all you hear when playing most games is “Pah, pah, pah, pah” and then you are respawning. It takes away from the AR and the “power weapon” the DMR really is! Make at least a AR selection in the vote for the meantime. And with Halo 4 and the BR…not sure because I haven’t played it, but all I can say is take into consideration the power weapon view compared to the AR and pistol, as well as the potential of the AR being a combative weapon.
> > The AR is the weapon for new people. The BR rewards aim and skill. Why should I not start with a BR? Honestly it makes the game so much more competitive and fun. Plus, if you have a good enemy team, they will control the BRs and spawn kill the hell out of you all day. BR starts prevent spawn camping to an extent taht is greater than that of ARs
> >
> > 6.Vehicles: Give the Falcon flares and an alarm for incoming missiles! Ejection seats? When someone boards the vehicle and not being able to get out is just not right. Maybe if you speed the frame of movement of the highjack/board and grenade/getting out of the vehicle to get out, it can work. But overall, from the feedback I’ve received, it is too slow getting in and out of vehicles. Rocket Hog should be replaced with the Wolverine. Bring in Locusts, Cobras, Vampires to the table. Increase the ceiling and play field. I know many people who dislike the ceilings on the maps and number of players (that may not be possible until the next system, but if not possible now, please keep in mind for the next generation. Think Battlefield/WOW/Mass Effect/StarTrek Online and maybe you might just have a serious masterpiece.)
> > I dont really care about this as long as balance is maintained.
> >
> > 7.Loadouts…Execellent, but just up the ante.
>
> At this point I can’t tell if you are actually serious. Please tell me that this is a joke. REach loadouts were part of the game that made people leave.

Ha, I think its funny to blame everyone leaving on loadouts. By your comment, you seem to have angst towards the loadouts. I am suggesting taking another look into the loadouts, because the concept is great, but maybe just adjust the loadouts. Sprint, Jetpack, hologram have good traits. Invisibility with jammer, armorlock, health shield, and dodge need some adjustments.

Loadouts are a good step into building individuality in the game.

> LOL at voting causes quitters. Quite the opposite good sir. When we relied on a veto system, nobody got what they wanted and half the game would quit before the game even started.
>
> Now that we have voting however, at least the majority of players get what they want.
>
>
>
>
> Actually, I’m going to go ahead and say the quitting problem was MUCH worse in Halo 3 all around, and the one thing Reach nailed.

Apparently you don’t understand the point of how “Majority rules” does not work.

The quitters can be solved if the playlist was more in the hands of the gamer, ie let me choose capture the flag on such and such map. The matchmaking is broke and is obsolete.

I find your justification that “at least majority of the players get what they want” very silly and democratic. Majority rules does not work. Yes, the veto system was terrible, and the voting was a step up because we felt good to “decide” what we want. But in reality we don’t have a full choice. What if 6 players vote for Slayer on Boneyard and the 7 vote for Capture the Flag on Spire? You most likely have 6 quitters because why waste their time with a game they do not want to play? Think about it Dear Sir.

> What can Halo 4 Learn? What NOT to do.

Other then, the netcode

Not much really

That having No Ranked playlist is an Epic Fail

And Exp system is better then Cr systems

Thank you

I agree with the first 4 points!

> Through many matches and being a Halo veteran, here are a few suggestions that are from the silent majority:
>
> 1. Fix quitters by allowing others to join so the games don’t stay uneven for the rest of the game.

Thats not a good idea.
Would you join the looser team if its 45-23 (or 980-560???) ???

…or you join the match and after 20 seconds its over…

not good…