Thoughts on Shroud’s comments about Halo Infinite?

Games Halo Infinite
1

There’s a couple of news articles from this week about Shroud expressing his thoughts on what Halo Infinite needs to do to succeed, and I think it’s worth examining (since he’s often looked up to as an expert in the gaming community). Here’s a quote that stood out to me in particular:

> “Halo Infinite needs to change a lot so that it meets up with current expectations. Halo is dated, but it makes sense. The games are old, so it makes sense for the games to feel dated.”

He said this after playing Halo 4, describing his experience with that game as follows:

> “It was so short… I don’t like how not chaotic it is. 4v4 and the size of the map and how you can control it is kind of weird. I wish it was more spontaneous and all over the place… More of a deathmatch.”

Is it just me, or does this come across as a little ignorant? After looking at his history with the franchise, I found that this is in line with comments he’s made in the past (apparently he’s called the series boring before). I just think it’s interesting how it’s being amplified by these outlets as some kind of wisdom when he clearly has very little experience with Halo. I’m not trying to call anyone out, so I hope this doesn’t come across that way. I just want to get some additional discussion going on this to see if I’m not alone.

2

> 2535411993815954;1:
> There’s a couple of news articles from this week about Shroud expressing his thoughts on what Halo Infinite needs to do to succeed, and I think it’s worth examining (since he’s often looked up to as an expert in the gaming community). Here’s a quote that stood out to me in particular:
>
>
> > “Halo Infinite needs to change a lot so that it meets up with current expectations. Halo is dated, but it makes sense. The games are old, so it makes sense for the games to feel dated.”
>
> He said this after playing Halo 4, describing his experience with that game as follows:
>
>
> > “It was so short… I don’t like how not chaotic it is. 4v4 and the size of the map and how you can control it is kind of weird. I wish it was more spontaneous and all over the place… More of a deathmatch.”
>
> Is it just me, or does this come across as a little ignorant? After looking at his history with the franchise, I found that this is in line with comments he’s made in the past (apparently he’s called the series boring before). I just think it’s interesting how it’s being amplified by these outlets as some kind of wisdom when he clearly has very little experience with Halo. I’m not trying to call anyone out, so I hope this doesn’t come across that way. I just want to get some additional discussion going on this to see if I’m not alone.

screw him, if he has no interest in maintaining the series’ uniqueness and prefers more modern mechanics than he can just leave and go play those games instead.
Halo doesn’t need to change for everyone else, being unique will allow it to keep a loyal playerbase

3

I think it is important, or should be, to be clear when talking about these yes/no, or yay/nay, or like/dislike, points about Halo, that we state whether or not we’re specifically talking about multiplayer or campaign.
I get the impression this is purely focused on multiplayer?

Ultimately, these questions and the answers all come down to personal preference.
For every gamer who is a staunch advocate for the game being one way, there is another advocating that it be the opposite way, and probably ten others who don’t particularly care so long as they find it enjoyable.

Personally, I don’t dig too deeply into the multiplayer discussion.
I love Halo for its story and developing characters, so my main focus is on the campaign.
I know I can read a thread and without thinking just overlay my thoughts on campaign onto it and then later realise the discussion was mostly multiplayer.
But it seems to me that the discussion around gaming elements in campaign vs multiplayer are very different, or at least that they can often be that way.

So I won’t quite address the point about 4v4 matches, since they don’t interest me whilst gaming and I can probably count the amount of them I’ve played on one hand.
But on BTB and Warzone, I had thought that in both 4 and 5 that they felt fairly frenetic and chaotic, and occasionally a clever strategy would shine through where assets were used in concert with totally unrelated online gamers.
Which made me think back to the old days in original Halo in Blood Gulch where that would happen from time to time.

I don’t love absolutely everything about the newer games, but I do feel like, for the most part, the games are evolving in a manner as they sort of should.

I don’t envy 343i for carrying this evolution when they’ve got such a vocal community. A majority of which seem to be staunchly against one thing or another often in contest with one another.
And then, on the other hand, they’ll be trying to weigh up what the silent majority will think and enjoy most.

Maybe a bit of a dawdling reply to you there OP…

4

His first quote I feel like he’s trying to imply that the games need to change in order to feel good but also it’s okay if they fall in line with an older style of game design because it’s a very long standing franchise.

It has to be one or the other. Halo tried being different and what happened with that is we got a game trying to mimic its competition and ended up being a poor rendition. Halo 5 wasn’t really any better especially in the midst of all the microtransactions and narrative direction. I really don’t feel like Halo’s gameplay is something that needs to change drastically or hardly at all for it to be a “good” game. It’s the things surrounding the core gameplay that will make it enticing to play.

5

He doesn’t have to play the games. He could just stick to Call for Money: Recycled Warfare or Destiny and just leave Halo alone. And out of all honesty, I never heard of him until I saw him in my recommendations but that one video alone was enough for me to block his channel.

6

> 2535411993815954;1:
> There’s a couple of news articles from this week about Shroud expressing his thoughts on what Halo Infinite needs to do to succeed, and I think it’s worth examining (since he’s often looked up to as an expert in the gaming community). Here’s a quote that stood out to me in particular:
>
>
> > “Halo Infinite needs to change a lot so that it meets up with current expectations. Halo is dated, but it makes sense. The games are old, so it makes sense for the games to feel dated.”
>
> He said this after playing Halo 4, describing his experience with that game as follows:
>
>
> > “It was so short… I don’t like how not chaotic it is. 4v4 and the size of the map and how you can control it is kind of weird. I wish it was more spontaneous and all over the place… More of a deathmatch.”
>
> Is it just me, or does this come across as a little ignorant? After looking at his history with the franchise, I found that this is in line with comments he’s made in the past (apparently he’s called the series boring before). I just think it’s interesting how it’s being amplified by these outlets as some kind of wisdom when he clearly has very little experience with Halo. I’m not trying to call anyone out, so I hope this doesn’t come across that way. I just want to get some additional discussion going on this to see if I’m not alone.

The problem with halo was, and to be clear was, lack of passion. 343 purchased a cash cow and threw money at it. It is not all their fault; bungie sold out and made destiny for the broader younger market segment.

Now, the godfather of halo is back. They need passion and soulful intelligent design to make it amazing again. They need heart and they got it now.

I, as an underground player, have one assessment - Mr Spencer job is to tell the godfather of halo that he has complete creative control and delay as long as he needs.

On that note, think about it - he created the franchise and for 10 years he has been watching it get obliterated… He assuredly can provide more innovative ideas and gameplay than all the greatest minds of the world combined. He just needs the time.

Apologies for the tangential reply… So as for shroud… What halo 3,4,5 is is like Bob Marley handing over his name to studio musicians. Sure we listen but he should have stuck around.

#HireIlliGodfather (Jk I won’t ever not be underground)

7

as someone who has played fps for like 27 years from the comments made by this person just sounds like hes to use to the current trend of fps and running around like a chicken cod style is the way halo should be today? i dunno i honestly will say if halo changed to be more like moden shooters and went aim down sights and all that garbage id probably stop playing it after all these years.
One of the reasons i still love halo mp is because it still has that old school arena fps vibe just ofc slower. but its , its own game and there is nothing like it. Start making halo like all other shooters and suddenly you just have another shooter, and i cant help but feel it a be worse off for it.

8

> 2533274815692039;4:
> His first quote I feel like he’s trying to imply that the games need to change in order to feel good but also it’s okay if they fall in line with an older style of game design because it’s a very long standing franchise.
>
> It has to be one or the other. Halo tried being different and what happened with that is we got a game trying to mimic its competition and ended up being a poor rendition. Halo 5 wasn’t really any better especially in the midst of all the microtransactions and narrative direction. I really don’t feel like Halo’s gameplay is something that needs to change drastically or hardly at all for it to be a “good” game. It’s the things surrounding the core gameplay that will make it enticing to play.

You take something and improve slightly upon it and make it your own. By now from halo 2-5 it should be dynamic and its not.

For instance, you innovate based upon pros and cons of additions that add to the gameplay mechanics. The failure to do so leads to detriment to the lifetime of the product. So, if you are going to introduce things like unlimited sprint and thrusters, then are negated the grenade impact and importance for overall speed. There is no con for the player and the faster you go except a two second crouch, the better the player you are which does not make sense and disenfranchised the bungie players and begs the question who are your in house pros; simply put, you sacrificed all grenade value and made prenading the new ability of what used to be gold-i used to hang on to nades and now we chuck them like candy.

There is supposed to be balance and strategy in the game. They even got rid of dual wielding and took the br and nerfed it.

What were they thinking.

The concept is the fundamental of halo… And all fps, pros and cons. So if you are taking away dual wielding, you have to make better smgs (higher caliber) and if you want to increase speed, you have to make sure that you increase shields and dynamics of breaking them, so the game maintains the same overall pace.

To summarize, you have to make adjustments to the additional gameplay mechanics so that the fundamentals of what made halo great does not change.

And straight up if you are removing a battle rifle from halo then you should seriously work on collecting unemployment. Straight up, they think they bought the gamers of halo when bungie sold out and I’m not for sale, :v: out

9

Don’t care what some streamer thinks.

10

If anything, it sounds like he doesn’t enjoy Halo.
The Call of Duty way of doing things is also dated by now, but I assume he enjoys them as that is the kind of game he prefers.

Halo, at its core, is an Arena Shooter, if you don’t like them, then the series isn’t for you.
It’d be like telling a person who doesn’t like platformers to go play Mario; just because they don’t like platformers doesn’t mean that there’s something wrong with the Mario franchise.

11

Halo doesnt need an overrated streamer like him. I honestly couldnt care less about someone who plays BR’s
Halo HAS changed, since reach halo kept evolving. Halo 5 changed up alot from the previous entry’s and i still liked it
Halo infinite is fine as it is.

12

> 2535411993815954;1:
> There’s a couple of news articles from this week about Shroud expressing his thoughts on what Halo Infinite needs to do to succeed, and I think it’s worth examining (since he’s often looked up to as an expert in the gaming community). Here’s a quote that stood out to me in particular:
>
>
> > “Halo Infinite needs to change a lot so that it meets up with current expectations. Halo is dated, but it makes sense. The games are old, so it makes sense for the games to feel dated.”
>
> He said this after playing Halo 4, describing his experience with that game as follows:
>
>
> > “It was so short… I don’t like how not chaotic it is. 4v4 and the size of the map and how you can control it is kind of weird. I wish it was more spontaneous and all over the place… More of a deathmatch.”
>
> Is it just me, or does this come across as a little ignorant? After looking at his history with the franchise, I found that this is in line with comments he’s made in the past (apparently he’s called the series boring before). I just think it’s interesting how it’s being amplified by these outlets as some kind of wisdom when he clearly has very little experience with Halo. I’m not trying to call anyone out, so I hope this doesn’t come across that way. I just want to get some additional discussion going on this to see if I’m not alone.

You have to look at his comments in context. His opinions are based on a very brief session of H4. The second quote in particular was just his thoughts after one game of social H4 SWAT. He headshot everyone immediately after spotting them (surprise he’s super good at this gamemode), killing them quickly enough to literally sit in one spot and kill them off spawn. He had complete control the entire time without even knowing the map, they had absolutely no chance I’m surprised he didn’t have a perfect game the way he was dominating. So yeah, his opinion on that one game makes sense. He also played a few games of BTB, in which he was also destroying everybody with ease. I think he would like H5 a lot more in terms of movement and pistol starts. I can totally see someone who never played the old Halo’s hop on 1-4 in 2020 and feel they’re dated, because they are.

13

Who?

Why should we care about what some random says about Halo?

14

> 2535415744086631;13:
> Who?
>
> Why should we care about what some random says about Halo?

He’s not a random lol, he is probably the most influential streamer on Twitch. He isn’t saying what it needs to be “good” or “Halo”, rather he is expressing what it needs to be successful in the current gaming climate.

Yes, he doesn’t know anything about Halo but that will also be the case for many players trying the F2P multiplayer so it is worth something to consider his viewpoint.

15

He basically just makes it clear that he doesn’t like Halo, which is fine. But, that’s like me going into Titanfall and saying that I don’t like how people are so mobile and fast. It’s completely rediculous to want a game to be completely different from what it is.

Asking for some improvements is one thing, asking for it to be an entirely different game is another

16

> 2535411993815954;1:
> There’s a couple of news articles from this week about Shroud expressing his thoughts on what Halo Infinite needs to do to succeed, and I think it’s worth examining (since he’s often looked up to as an expert in the gaming community). Here’s a quote that stood out to me in particular:
>
>
> > “Halo Infinite needs to change a lot so that it meets up with current expectations. Halo is dated, but it makes sense. The games are old, so it makes sense for the games to feel dated.”
>
> He said this after playing Halo 4, describing his experience with that game as follows:
>
>
> > “It was so short… I don’t like how not chaotic it is. 4v4 and the size of the map and how you can control it is kind of weird. I wish it was more spontaneous and all over the place… More of a deathmatch.”
>
> Is it just me, or does this come across as a little ignorant? After looking at his history with the franchise, I found that this is in line with comments he’s made in the past (apparently he’s called the series boring before). I just think it’s interesting how it’s being amplified by these outlets as some kind of wisdom when he clearly has very little experience with Halo. I’m not trying to call anyone out, so I hope this doesn’t come across that way. I just want to get some additional discussion going on this to see if I’m not alone.

Shroud is just a guy with good aim, he doesn’t like Halo. He comes from CS Go which is and feels dated too. He plays Valorant which is a clone of CS. No sprint, clamber, no hitmarker. This games are unique and that’s why they’re successful.
But Shroud gets what he want. 343 is following all trends out there. But even if Infinite is like “holy” Shroud wants it to be, he wouldn’t play it for more than a week.

17

> 2535449665894532;15:
> He basically just makes it clear that he doesn’t like Halo, which is fine. But, that’s like me going into Titanfall and saying that I don’t like how people are so mobile and fast. It’s completely rediculous to want a game to be completely different from what it is.
>
> Asking for some improvements is one thing, asking for it to be an entirely different game is another

Exactly. I have no idea why his comments are considered newsworthy by any standards. They’re portrayed as ‘words of wisdom’ despite the fact that he literally admits his experience with Halo is limited.

18

> 2535431933064458;14:
> Yes, he doesn’t know anything about Halo but that will also be the case for many players trying the F2P multiplayer so it is worth something to consider his viewpoint.

Yes, exactly as much as considering yours or mine. Popularity doesn’t make a person’s opinion more informed. The only difference between you and Shroud commenting on Halo Infinite is that you won’t get an article written about your remarks.

19

> 2533274825830455;18:
> > 2535431933064458;14:
> > Yes, he doesn’t know anything about Halo but that will also be the case for many players trying the F2P multiplayer so it is worth something to consider his viewpoint.
>
> Yes, exactly as much as considering yours or mine. Popularity doesn’t make a person’s opinion more informed. The only difference between you and Shroud commenting on Halo Infinite is that you won’t get an article written about your remarks.

Well of course. My comment was directed at not dismissing feedback from people outside the Halo circle (or “randoms”). There is a copious amount of feedback on Reddit/Waypoint/Twitter from diehards but not much from the potential new playerbase.

20

I realise Shroud said the 2nd comment after the H4 swat game, but its weird that someone who got famous for playing CS criticises Halo for not being chaotic and too much control while playing games that aren’t chaotic and have map control. Think this might be a case of someone who only plays PC saying “lul console” in a more complicated way.