all the pictures shown in this video were shot from half way across the Colosseum in forge world, and i used the entire mag.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pMvTBXkgimM please forgive the audio lag, my mic is busted
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zero bloom means zero bloom… it doesn’t matter how far away you are.
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how does this make the weapons unfair?
your target will not be standing in spot at all times nor should you when shooting another player
the further you go, the smaller your target becomes, which makes it more difficult to shoot them in the head… especially if they are moving back and forth in an irregular order
that being said, why is there a need for randomization of where your bullet is gonna land when there is already the need of player input in order to hit the person (this is specifically speaking about the halo series that has built its game around a certain set of physics which never included bloom in the past… not a realistic shooter)
your video is a demonstration of what ZB is, not really why people think its unfair
people think its unfair because they can’t move their thumb as quickly as some1 else and continuously shoot some1 in the head
the only people who are complaining are those who get out dmr’d… aka those who never used the br in halo2/3
> 1. zero bloom means zero bloom… it doesn’t matter how far away you are.
>
> 2. how does this make the weapons unfair?
>
> your target will not be standing in spot at all times nor should you when shooting another player
>
> the further you go, the smaller your target becomes, which makes it more difficult to shoot them in the head… especially if they are moving back and forth in an irregular order
>
> that being said, why is there a need for randomization of where your bullet is gonna land when there is already the need of player input in order to hit the person (this is specifically speaking about the halo series that has built its game around a certain set of physics which never included bloom in the past… not a realistic shooter)
>
> your video is a demonstration of what ZB is, not really why people think its unfair
>
> people think its unfair because they can’t move their thumb as quickly as some1 else and continuously shoot some1 in the head
>
> the only people who are complaining are those who get out dmr’d… aka those who never used the br in halo2/3
^
> that being said, why is there a need for randomization of where your bullet is gonna land when there is already the need of player input in order to hit the person (this is specifically speaking about the halo series that has built its game around a certain set of physics which never included bloom in the past… not a realistic shooter)
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and in simpler terms this means you’ve increased the range on the area of impact (a bullet fired may have the possibility of landing anywhere a 10x10 grid…assuming only the head is in the reticle, the head will take up some portion of the grid, now the grid expands the faster and more consecutive times you press the trigger in a given time span making the head take less up of the grid which in turn should reduce accuracy unless the player moderates their rate of fire)… a.k.a added more RNG… and in turn that removes part of the “skill” aspect (such as needing to have quick reflexes and accuracy)
in theory the bloom is cool, it adds another aspect that players have to account for… but because there is still the chance that a person spamming their gun will hit all 4 shots no matter what, it works a lot better on paper than it does in the game
i dont know if this is exactly how it works but just think of a player that strafes vs a player that doesnt both spamming a dmr… because the cone of error grows, the strafing player may actually be moving into the bullets and therefor will be hit more often then the player standing still… does this make the player standing still better? no… it makes RNG the victor against the more skilled player and the player standing still a little happier that he/she may have killed some1 a few higher ranks than him
Now there is less of a “luck” factor.
If anything this update makes things fair.
> i dont know if this is exactly how it works but just think of a player that strafes vs a player that doesnt both spamming a dmr… because the cone of error grows, the strafing player may actually be moving into the bullets and therefor will be hit more often then the player standing still.
Depends, hitscan or not hitscan, bullet-magnetism high or bullet-magnetism low.
That is the major determiner of if a player runs into a bullet or not.
And here’s the thing, if I pace my shots and my red reticle is touching you, no matter what you do, my DMR will hit you. Pacing my shots for a full rested red reticle gives me 100% shooting, if my reticle is touching you (or sometimes not even).
What bloom does for red reticle situations is remove that magnetism as the bloom reticle gets larger. So what that means is I might hit you or I might not. You are not running into my bullets, I am suppose to hit you. If I missed, it is because the random number generator said “no.” But that will only happen if there is an area of my blooming reticle that isn’t touching.
Yes, I knowingly/accidentally can spam my blooming reticle to make it its largest size possible and knowingly/accidently put the edge of it on you for a possible hit. That’s not a guarantee. And like all Halos, your reticle doesn’t have to be pinpoint, it just has to touch.
The reason the CE Pistol and H3BR needed leading was because they were projectiles that “bent through the air.” Shooting from behind won’t let the bullets catch up to the head. Shooting ahead lets the system do the work as intended, assist the player in getting a kill without the mouse-keyboard system.
If a player is stationary, the CE Pistol and H3BR, being projectiles, need their reticles to barely touch the enemy to get them to hit.
so the problem players face with the RNG is a mixture of the formula that determines the miss ratio if a part of the player is touching the reticle as well as the players movement speed
a player can maximize their reticle in order to deal with a person strafing… a larger surface area would make them more likely to get a piece of their reticle onto their opponent for a chance to hit them while they are moving side to side
at the current movement speed, a maximized bloom is hard to dodge and therefor strafing seems useless at times due to the slow side to side movement
the situation can be fixed by reworking the percentage of which the function returns a “no” or what the determinants are such as “if 50% of the bloomed reticle of N size(for the various sizes that the reticle can expand to) is occupied by the player, there is a 50% chance the RNG will return a no… and so on based on the percentage of the reticle that is occupied” but no matter how you rework this system… RNG is still a factor (and no matter how low the percentage is people will often complain about the oddity that occurs once in a blue moon because that is most memorable)
an easier fix that would not require adjustment to movement speed OR the formula is to just reduce it or remove it all together which is obviously what you guys have done in the TU playlist and i am very happy for that =)
For the most part yes.
There aren’t huge head hit-boxes, there is the bullet magnetism with large reticles.
Here is a video of what I mean. Observe how my bullets deviated far off my centre reticle, and even outside of it (H3 BR). I still think it looks like I actually shoot around my guest’s head at about 1:19.
It has the same problem you have with the over-sized reticle allowing a wider shot than normal when spamming, I am not touching you/I am not dead-aim, yet you can run into my bullets/I can shoot too soon and still be rewarded.
Honestly, that’s part of Halo since CE. The Pistol is a head-shot magnet that doesn’t require as much precision to use as some claim. And the only way to determine the difference between a lucky 3-shot and a skilled 3-shot is to… um… I’m still working on that 10 years later. But what I can do is determine a skilled Pistol user is by the consistency of their 3-shotting.
> > that being said, why is there a need for randomization of where your bullet is gonna land when there is already the need of player input in order to hit the person (this is specifically speaking about the halo series that has built its game around a certain set of physics which never included bloom in the past… not a realistic shooter)
>
> “Reticle “bloom” is more than just the way the reticle expands when the player shoots. What we actually have done is take control over the maximum radius of the cone of error that expands as the player fires. The actual UI “bloom” is just a representation of a feature that has been in Halo since the beginning. The colloquial “BR Spread” from Halo 3 was this same set of variables, just implemented differently. The same goes for the Halo CE magnum, where holding the trigger down resulted in less accuracy than pulling the trigger rapidly.”
Sorry but you fail. BR spread and bloom are TOTALLYdiffernt things.
> For the most part yes.
>
> There aren’t huge head hit-boxes, there is the bullet magnetism with large reticles.
>
> Here is a video of what I mean. Observe how my bullets deviated far off my centre reticle, and even outside of it (H3 BR). I still think it looks like I actually shoot around my guest’s head at about 1:19.
>
> It has the same problem you have with the over-sized reticle allowing a wider shot than normal when spamming, I am not touching you/I am not dead-aim, yet you can run into my bullets/I can shoot too soon and still be rewarded.
>
> Honestly, that’s part of Halo since CE. The Pistol is a head-shot magnet that doesn’t require as much precision to use as some claim. And the only way to determine the difference between a lucky 3-shot and a skilled 3-shot is to… um… I’m still working on that 10 years later. But what I can do is determine a skilled Pistol user is by the consistency of their 3-shotting.
Try the H2 Br and see what happens. Again, you fail at knowing how the “OTHER HALO’s” have worked. The H2 BR and ZB DMR are pretty much two in the same. Nobody complained about it being unfair. If you don’t like it then don’t play it.
> > > that being said, why is there a need for randomization of where your bullet is gonna land when there is already the need of player input in order to hit the person (this is specifically speaking about the halo series that has built its game around a certain set of physics which never included bloom in the past… not a realistic shooter)
> >
> > “Reticle “bloom” is more than just the way the reticle expands when the player shoots. What we actually have done is take control over the maximum radius of the cone of error that expands as the player fires. The actual UI “bloom” is just a representation of a feature that has been in Halo since the beginning. The colloquial “BR Spread” from Halo 3 was this same set of variables, just implemented differently. The same goes for the Halo CE magnum, where holding the trigger down resulted in less accuracy than pulling the trigger rapidly.”
>
> Sorry but you fail. BR spread and bloom are TOTALLYdiffernt things.
They are not. All weapons have a margin of error that are offset by bullet magnetism. The size of the reticle determines the area available.
In Reach, our crosshairs and centre reticles show the margin of error. They act as blue reticle precision indicators and red reticle bullet magnetism indicators.
Now, the H3BR had an invisible centre reticle that expanded after the first and second shots as for each burst. The weapon could not be fired till the bloom completely reset.
Each H3BR bullet is made further random on the second and third shot in its trajectory when leaving, but all are equal in amount of magnetism when red reticle.
When in blue reticle, the second and third bullets are completely random in where they will go. Without the effect of bullet magnetism, they travel freely in whichever way they were randomly determined to go.
> > For the most part yes.
> >
> > There aren’t huge head hit-boxes, there is the bullet magnetism with large reticles.
> >
> > Here is a video of what I mean. Observe how my bullets deviated far off my centre reticle, and even outside of it (H3 BR). I still think it looks like I actually shoot around my guest’s head at about 1:19.
> >
> > It has the same problem you have with the over-sized reticle allowing a wider shot than normal when spamming, I am not touching you/I am not dead-aim, yet you can run into my bullets/I can shoot too soon and still be rewarded.
> >
> > Honestly, that’s part of Halo since CE. The Pistol is a head-shot magnet that doesn’t require as much precision to use as some claim. And the only way to determine the difference between a lucky 3-shot and a skilled 3-shot is to… um… I’m still working on that 10 years later. But what I can do is determine a skilled Pistol user is by the consistency of their 3-shotting.
>
> Try the H2 Br and see what happens. Again, you fail at knowing how the “OTHER HALO’s” have worked. The H2 BR and ZB DMR are pretty much two in the same. Nobody complained about it being unfair. If you don’t like it then don’t play it.
You’re going to have to find the part where I or BS Angel said that Halo2 didn’t have bloom. You’re also going to have to explain your release of anger. I am having a conversation with someone that at no point attacked you or brought up Halo2 or bashed it, or denied it.
But you are right on something, a combo-less BR in Halo2 was great with the Carbine in the mix. Add in button combos and we have a different story.
Ya know what’s funny? If there is ZB and only spread in H2… doesn’t that make that the black sheep?
> > > > that being said, why is there a need for randomization of where your bullet is gonna land when there is already the need of player input in order to hit the person (this is specifically speaking about the halo series that has built its game around a certain set of physics which never included bloom in the past… not a realistic shooter)
> > >
> > > “Reticle “bloom” is more than just the way the reticle expands when the player shoots. What we actually have done is take control over the maximum radius of the cone of error that expands as the player fires. The actual UI “bloom” is just a representation of a feature that has been in Halo since the beginning. The colloquial “BR Spread” from Halo 3 was this same set of variables, just implemented differently. The same goes for the Halo CE magnum, where holding the trigger down resulted in less accuracy than pulling the trigger rapidly.”
> >
> > Sorry but you fail. BR spread and bloom are TOTALLYdiffernt things.
>
> They are not. All weapons have a margin of error that are offset by bullet magnetism. The size of the reticle determines the area available.
> In Reach, our crosshairs and centre reticles show the margin of error. They act as blue reticle precision indicators and red reticle bullet magnetism indicators.
>
> Now, the H3BR had an invisible centre reticle that expanded after the first and second shots as for each burst. The weapon could not be fired till the bloom completely reset.
> Each H3BR bullet is random on the second and third shot in its trajectory when leaving, but all are equal in amount of magnetism when red reticle.
> When in blue reticle, the second and third bullets are completely random in where they will go. Without the effect of bullet magnetism, they travel freely in whichever way they were randomly determined to go.
Wow. If this is the Halo community now,then there is no hope. That is the poorest attempt to try and convience any functioning human being with eyes that bullet spread is = to bloom. Facepalm
Then a tip of my hat to you good sir.
> But you are right on something, a combo-less BR in Halo2 was great with the Carbine in the mix. Add in button combos and we have a different story.
let the BxR nostalgia begin lol
how is his comparison of spread vs bloom wrong?
if bloom has to do with your cone of error increasing a.k.a your bullet spread widening… aren’t they related?
in halo reach; spread is visually portrayed by the reticle increasing in size (what we refer to as reticle bloom)… they could simply have not called it bloom when reach was released and simply said “bullet spread is now visualized by the increase in size of your reticle as you shoot”
spread is a part of bloom
> all the pictures shown in this video were shot from half way across the Colosseum in forge world, and i used the entire mag.
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pMvTBXkgimM please forgive the audio lag, my mic is busted
Stop! You violated the law! Pay the court a fine or serve your sentence. Your stolen goods are now forfeit.
Audio Lag- 4000G
Pay the Fine
Go to Jail
Resist Arrest < You pick this one
Then pay with your blood!!
Basically, bad kids don’t like being shown that they’re bad. Which is exactly what ZB does.
> > But you are right on something, a combo-less BR in Halo2 was great with the Carbine in the mix. Add in button combos and we have a different story.
>
> let the BxR nostalgia begin lol
>
>
>
> how is his comparison of spread vs bloom wrong?
>
> if bloom has to do with your cone of error increasing a.k.a your bullet spread widening… aren’t they related?
>
> in halo reach; spread is visually portrayed by the reticle increasing in size (what we refer to as reticle bloom)… they could simply have not called it bloom when reach was released and simply said “bullet spread is now visualized by the increase in size of your reticle as you shoot”
>
> spread is a part of bloom
Halo 2 had spread on the BR before it got patched, After patch though, It did not have spread.
Little history lesson for everyone :>