This Game Has Little Skill Gap

Halo 5 has a very tiny skill gap compared to the older games. The amount of aim assist is truly disgusting. Perfect kills happen constantly, and at very long distances. It’s funny how I can play Halo 2 and feel unstoppable because I have great aim and I am constantly out-BRing people, but then in Halo 5, I am constantly trading perfect kills and getting 4 shotted across the map by kids who just started playing and can barely aim. The sniper is a joke, you get a headshot if you aim anywhere near your opponent.

The BR/DMR is ridiculous in Breakout – each team has one player that is twice effective as his teammates because he grabbed the BR/DMR. Then that player sits at the back of the map all game long because of his increased range. What exactly is that supposed to add? How is it fun to go against a kid with a BR that can two shot you from across the map, while you can’t do anything with the pistol? Then you meet those parties of four that camp on their side of the map all game long and defend their BR/DMR god. So unfun. BR starts would be 10x better. And don’t even get me started on the camo on Gambol (I believe that’s the name of the map). Whichever team gets camo wins the round.

Arena is a joke. Players move faster than ever, yet motion tracker range was decreased. It’s totally useless. Either give motion tracker an actual use or remove it completely. Don’t keep it in this gimped out state. I watch my motion tracker like a hawk, and it’s so jarring to get assassinated out of nowhere because a player sprinted into range so quickly that I don’t even have time to react. It’s better off being removed so players don’t rely on a broken tool. And why don’t camo player show up on motion tracker? That is just moronic. Just another reduction in skill gap. Good players watch their motion and are rewarded, bad players don’t. Nerf the hell out of motion and now its a a more even playing field.

Warzone is a hilarious bag of RNG and luck. Bosses award HUGE amounts of VP and swing games in an instant. I never once had a close warzone game. The game is always decided after the final warden eternal. No adrenaline rushes, no comebacks. If a team is up by 20-30 points after warden eternal, it’s over – give up. If a game is close before warden eternal, who ever gets warden eternal through the RNG gods gets a free win. Nothing in between boss battles really matters, as long as you keep your core safe.

With the huge amounts of aim assist, the first shot is huuuuge. Getting the first shot is the most important thing in a fight. Strafing means next to nothing, as the auto-aim just tracks you. Thruster does nothing to turn the tide of a battle in which they got the first shot, as that just prevents you from shooting for a moment (all the while their auto-aim tracks you with precision). On top of that, the aiming feels totally wonky, adding to even more perceived randomness.

I don’t understand why people complain the game is competitive. It’s not. It’s very casual in the way it narrows the skill gap. I hated the idea of warzone, sprint, and thruster coming into the game, but over time, I became attached to them. I feel like classic Halo would be awesome with thruster pack. It’s not so much the concepts I hate, but the actual mechanics of the game and how they were implemented. It’s like 343 attempts to call the game competitive at every facet, but it’s simply not. I’m not asking for an eSport, especially in warzone, but the current state is just lame. I see really bad players have incredible games due to luck and a reduced skill gap. I’m talking players I absolutely crush in Halo 1-3. Players that can barely land a headshot with the sniper in previous Halos are getting killing frenzies worth of consecutive headshots.

The sandbox is dumb currently. There are too many weapons to balance. Weapons like the needler, storm rifle, assault rifle, suppressor, etc… all fit the same role, but MUST be better than starting weapons to warrant being picked up. 343 made feeble attempts to make the weapons unique, but they all come down to just filling the same role. You don’t aim any of them any differently. You may have to lead some by a very slight amount, but magnetism makes up for most errors in aiming. This results in a cluster of overlapped effective ranges of weapons… rock/paper/scissors gameplay. I have an SMG, but the SMG is best at let’s say 10’ engagements, while he has a Needler, which is WAAAAY better at 15’ engagements, and we happen to be at 15’. Therefore I lose. Because of the speed of players, I can’t exactly predict what kind of engagement range I might encounter a player in, so it comes down to pure randomness and luck. You can’t switch weapons instantly, and the TTK is so low that you can’t exactly close or open the distance, or even run away from close to medium range fights. Don’t even get me started on the TTK (which wouldn’t be so low without all these aim assist!).

I know this isn’t going to change anything, but I am just so sick of the direction Halo is heading. I have zero incentive to play. In older Halos, you could really feel the benefit of getting better. Practicing your aim was important. Your strafe was important. But in Halo 5, it just doesn’t matter. You’re better off playing at a high sensitivity and missing the occasional shot simply to have a higher change of landing the first shot. After all, the game will practically aim for you.

/endrant

I hope I am not alone in feeling this way. I think I’d love Halo 5 if the skill gap was wider. And that’s a LOT coming from me – a player who hated Halo: Reach, Halo 4, and H2A, but loved Halo 1-3.

Well I will say I agree with your overall sentiment but I don’t exactly agree with how you got there. Halo 5 is my least favorite installment in the whole series for sure but I don’t think the skill gap is the issue.

The skill gap between a gold level player like myself and a legit onyx player (not even going to consider champion) is enormous, what the hell are you talking about?

Good players rely on situational awareness, bad players have to rely on radar…

Agree that the sandbox is too redundant.

Definitely agree that aim assist is too high and strafe is undervalued. Most of the ‘difficulty’ comes from the wonky aim mechanics to be honest.

> Don’t even get me started on the TTK (which wouldn’t be so low without all these aim assist!).

A low theoretical killtime paired with low aim assist is the ideal way to design the game. Unless you’re saying it’s bad that players can so easily reach the theoretical killtimes, in which case I agree.

There’s most definitely a decent skill gap.

> Strafing means next to nothing, as the auto-aim just tracks you.

Have you… played against anyone that can strafe?

Sure at low level games, you can get perfect kills a ridiculous amount of times, but this just doesn’t happen to any excessive extent later on.
Look at your post-carnage statistics and you will see that there are very few perfects relatively to the total number of kills once all players in the match are at/near Onyx rank.

Even the pros aren’t particularly amassing hoards of them (other than Snipedown of course). Check their streams, check their post-game carnage. It’s significantly less than you’d expect.

> There are too many weapons to balance. Weapons like the needler, storm rifle, assault rifle, suppressor, etc… all fit the same role

Define “role” here because each of those weapons have a unique range & terrain setting that they excel in. The skill lies in having the awareness to be able to predict & force where your next battle is going to happen. Yes they are similar, but knowing those situations more exactly will massively improve your advantage.

This is the best sandbox of any Halo game to date, none of the others are even slightly close. It’s not perfect, but it’s sure as heck a lot better than just having the BR dominate in 9/10 scenarios.

> Players move faster than ever, yet motion tracker range was decreased. It’s totally useless. Either give motion tracker an actual use or remove it completely. Don’t keep it in this gimped out state. I watch my motion tracker like a hawk, and it’s so jarring to get assassinated out of nowhere because a player sprinted into range so quickly that I don’t even have time to react.

So… ignore it?
The game already shows you where your teammates are at all times, it’s pretty easy to figure out where the enemies are based on that.
The large radius of previous radars was basically a crutch for new players. Now that the range is reduced, the main purpose is as a timing tool to be used when battling around corners.

It’s not “better” or “worse,” it simply has a completely different role. They aren’t really comparable.

A lot of your comparisons are based on comparing why previous games were skillfull, rather than realizing that the new mechanisms offer just as many skillful uses, but just in different ways. OP, it sounds like you’re just having issues adapting.

> This is the best sandbox of any Halo game to date, none of the others are even slightly close.

I disagree with that statement, if only because I have a different view on what balance should be.

There’s balancing so that everything is useful, and then there’s balancing so that skill input is priority. Not mutually exclusive necessarily, but usually ends up that way.

> Define “role” here because each of those weapons have a unique range & terrain setting that they excel in.

They’re largely interchangeable, lacking a hard role. True there’s specific ranges where they are at their peak efficiency, but I can enter pretty much any range outside of CQC with a DMR and still be successful, and going up against one of the more efficient weapons isn’t necessarily a death sentence (Except for the Carbine and Storm Rifle, which pretty much shred everything in every related niche).

> 2533274826281848;1:
> Halo 5 has a very tiny skill gap compared to the older games. The amount of aim assist is truly disgusting. Perfect kills happen constantly, and at very long distances. It’s funny how I can play Halo 2 and feel unstoppable because I have great aim and I am constantly out-BRing people, but then in Halo 5, I am constantly trading perfect kills and getting 4 shotted across the map by kids who just started playing and can barely aim. The sniper is a joke, you get a headshot if you aim anywhere near your opponent.
>
> The BR/DMR is ridiculous in Breakout – each team has one player that is twice effective as his teammates because he grabbed the BR/DMR. Then that player sits at the back of the map all game long because of his increased range. What exactly is that supposed to add? How is it fun to go against a kid with a BR that can two shot you from across the map, while you can’t do anything with the pistol? Then you meet those parties of four that camp on their side of the map all game long and defend their BR/DMR god. So unfun. BR starts would be 10x better. And don’t even get me started on the camo on Gambol (I believe that’s the name of the map). Whichever team gets camo wins the round.
>
> Arena is a joke. Players move faster than ever, yet motion tracker range was decreased. It’s totally useless. Either give motion tracker an actual use or remove it completely. Don’t keep it in this gimped out state. I watch my motion tracker like a hawk, and it’s so jarring to get assassinated out of nowhere because a player sprinted into range so quickly that I don’t even have time to react. It’s better off being removed so players don’t rely on a broken tool. And why don’t camo player show up on motion tracker? That is just moronic. Just another reduction in skill gap. Good players watch their motion and are rewarded, bad players don’t. Nerf the hell out of motion and now its a a more even playing field.
>
> Warzone is a hilarious bag of RNG and luck. Bosses award HUGE amounts of VP and swing games in an instant. I never once had a close warzone game. The game is always decided after the final warden eternal. No adrenaline rushes, no comebacks. If a team is up by 20-30 points after warden eternal, it’s over – give up. If a game is close before warden eternal, who ever gets warden eternal through the RNG gods gets a free win. Nothing in between boss battles really matters, as long as you keep your core safe.
>
> With the huge amounts of aim assist, the first shot is huuuuge. Getting the first shot is the most important thing in a fight. Strafing means next to nothing, as the auto-aim just tracks you. Thruster does nothing to turn the tide of a battle in which they got the first shot, as that just prevents you from shooting for a moment (all the while their auto-aim tracks you with precision). On top of that, the aiming feels totally wonky, adding to even more perceived randomness.
>
> I don’t understand why people complain the game is competitive. It’s not. It’s very casual in the way it narrows the skill gap. I hated the idea of warzone, sprint, and thruster coming into the game, but over time, I became attached to them. I feel like classic Halo would be awesome with thruster pack. It’s not so much the concepts I hate, but the actual mechanics of the game and how they were implemented. It’s like 343 attempts to call the game competitive at every facet, but it’s simply not. I’m not asking for an eSport, especially in warzone, but the current state is just lame. I see really bad players have incredible games due to luck and a reduced skill gap. I’m talking players I absolutely crush in Halo 1-3. Players that can barely land a headshot with the sniper in previous Halos are getting killing frenzies worth of consecutive headshots.
>
> The sandbox is dumb currently. There are too many weapons to balance. Weapons like the needler, storm rifle, assault rifle, suppressor, etc… all fit the same role, but MUST be better than starting weapons to warrant being picked up. 343 made feeble attempts to make the weapons unique, but they all come down to just filling the same role. You don’t aim any of them any differently. You may have to lead some by a very slight amount, but magnetism makes up for most errors in aiming. This results in a cluster of overlapped effective ranges of weapons… rock/paper/scissors gameplay. I have an SMG, but the SMG is best at let’s say 10’ engagements, while he has a Needler, which is WAAAAY better at 15’ engagements, and we happen to be at 15’. Therefore I lose. Because of the speed of players, I can’t exactly predict what kind of engagement range I might encounter a player in, so it comes down to pure randomness and luck. You can’t switch weapons instantly, and the TTK is so low that you can’t exactly close or open the distance, or even run away from close to medium range fights. Don’t even get me started on the TTK (which wouldn’t be so low without all these aim assist!).
>
> I know this isn’t going to change anything, but I am just so sick of the direction Halo is heading. I have zero incentive to play. In older Halos, you could really feel the benefit of getting better. Practicing your aim was important. Your strafe was important. But in Halo 5, it just doesn’t matter. You’re better off playing at a high sensitivity and missing the occasional shot simply to have a higher change of landing the first shot. After all, the game will practically aim for you.
>
> /endrant
>
> I hope I am not alone in feeling this way. I think I’d love Halo 5 if the skill gap was wider. And that’s a LOT coming from me – a player who hated Halo: Reach, Halo 4, and H2A, but loved Halo 1-3.

Do you have some sort of other profile? Because all of this coming from someone who has no records of Halo 5 games played at all, and very few games from the Master Chief collection makes me think this is just a troll.

The amount of times I died in Warzone last night says the exact opposite. I couldn’t hit a thing.

I’m not sure… I think you’re really having a hard time in Halo 5. The skill gap is very wide. I occasionally come across players who out does me by a lot.

Pretty much. I thought Reach and Halo 4 had a low individual skill-gap, but man, this game is easy for bad and new players lol. Don’t get me wrong, I like the game and the mechanics are solid (this isn’t even touching on the overall disgusting lack of features and content) but this is the easiest Halo game to date.

Lower awareness skillgap, lower knowledge skillgap, lower aim and movement skillgap, and lower map skillgap - because of stupid dynamic, random spawns and lack of true power positions. Getting constant Steaktaculars in all the games in MCC and then coming to Halo 5 and having all close matches to people you’d just annihilate in literally any other Halo game is telling.

2 steps forward, 5.13 trillion steps back, as per
usual with 343.

Feels like the ridiculous Bullet Magnetism takes the biggest part in this
It’s harder to get a kill in 2 & 3 then it is in 5

Too late for 343 to change the aiming system to something with little Assist and zero Bullet Magnetism
But it would be nice if they could add it into Custom Game Options

> 2533274879137433;12:
> Feels like the ridiculous Bullet Magnetism takes the biggest part in this
> It’s harder to get a kill in 2 & 3 then it is in 5
>
> Too late for 343 to change the aiming system to something with little Assist and zero Bullet Magnetism
> But it would be nice if they could add it into Custom Game Options

It’s honestly probably a sizable portion of why everyone seems like they’re at least decent at the game, and no one seems individually exceptional. I mean, even Halo 4 is harder to aim in than Halo 5 - at least for me - and Halo 4 was designed to be easy for everyone.

<mark>Do not make nonconstructive posts.</mark>

Omg stop whining, I’ve been playing the crap out of halo 5 and I’m pretty decent, I put in halo mcc the other night and played a lil halo 3 and it felt SUPER EASY. You just don’t like change and can’t handle learning the new mechanics of the game, that’s YOUR FAULT. People like you just need to shut up stop living in the past they can’t make the same game over and over again. If you love halo 1,2,3 then go play them and stop whining about halo 5 simply because you suck at it.

> 2533274952936773;14:
> Omg stop whining, I’ve been playing the crap out of halo 5 and I’m pretty decent, I put in halo mcc the other night and played a lil halo 3 and it felt SUPER EASY. You just don’t like change and can’t handle learning the new mechanics of the game, that’s YOUR FAULT. People like you just need to shut up stop living in the past they can’t make the same game over and over again. If you love halo 1,2,3 then go play them and stop whining about halo 5 simply because you suck at it.

Does the fact that many good Halo 5 players (who, by the way, enjoy Halo 5) agree with the OP’s overall sentiment destroy your argument, or does the mere fact that your argument is ad hominem and overly speculative serve to destroy itself?

(Both)

Right, that’s why Lunchbox, Maniac, and Royal2, all said that this game was hard to aim.

Lunchbox even said it was harder than Halo 3, to aim I mean.

One pro also said that the new movement mechanics allowed for more outplays.

The gun skill required is more than both Halo 2-3. Even Royal2 said that he has to focus on his aim in this game, while he shot without thinking about it in the previous games.

Plus, there’s still a lot of skill super slide jumps to learn, and super slide in general. I think this game has plenty skillgap, and it’s not very easy to learn either.

A lot of people don’t even stick with Halo 5 because it’s too hard for them. I’ve heard a couple of kids complaining about it, and my brothers friends left because they thought the same.

I’m playing in the halo championships and I can assure you the skill gap is huge and far greater than any other halo I’ve experienced and Ive been playing from day 1 Halo:CE.

The movement and awareness of the tiniest detail of a map is key to me. I can come up on onyx players and take half their shield before they do some wicked skill moves to reverse the kill often using the Map to their advantage.

I barely read your post but I get what you you are talking about. I’m in your boat, I’m now evenly matched to people I would have easily destroyed in the original trilogy. I do think that the skill gap is just as high though, it’s just now based on situational awareness and teamwork rather than ability to 4 shot. In one hand I really enjoy it, but in the other I just don’t have the same motivation to work as a team and be on the strategic ball. Now I’m in my 20’s I can only put so much concentration into a game before I lose interest.

<mark>This post has been edited by a moderator. Please do not post spam.</mark>

*Original post. Click at your own discretion.

I’m European, I am from Spain. Like many of you, I am angry about not being able to play and select servers in Europe. I’m sick of playing games with players USA, they are immortal. I encourage everyone in my situation to start a campaign both Halowaypoint, and Twitter. 343i and Microsoft need to listen to us, they notice the pressure.
Write tweets letting your anger. I wrote several tweets where I said “I’m European. I cant choose server in Europe. I have friends Who Do not playHalo 5 for esta reason”
Twitter of people who tell him:
Phil Spencer: https://twitter.com/XboxP3
Larry Hryb: https://twitter.com/majornelson
Xbox: https://twitter.com/Xbox
Josh Holmes: https://twitter.com/JoshingtonState
Frank O’Connor: https://twitter.com/franklez
Quinn DelHoyo: https://twitter.com/quinndelhoyo
Bonnie Ross: https://twitter.com/PlutonForEver
Kevin Franklin: https://twitter.com/kevin_franklin
Campaign for server selector. European servers needed !!!
The game is great. But there are games, which is very frustrating. Sometimes I kill 18 in a game and other games my opponents are immortal and they kill me very easily.
Can you please keep us updated 343i? Why haven’t we got any further news?
Solution now !!! We write all our complaints again and again in this post.
Speaking of the situation in the forums of consoles, to join our cause.
Writing emails and tweets, all videogames websites, to talk about the situation of Europeans in Halo 5.
Let’s all work together.
343i SOLUTION NOW !!!
I’m tweeting all video games website I know.
Let’s all try to listen to us
VERY IMPORTANT VOTING IN THE OFFICIAL REQUEST XBOX FEEDBACK. VOTE PLEASE EVERYONE https://xbox.uservoice.com/forums/251647-gaming-achievements/suggestions/11153313-data-centre-selection-in-halo-5-guardians
SHARE REQUEST FEEDBACK ON ALL XBOX FORUMS.

Maybe you just aren’t as good as you think you are. And the people who you think are killing you, but shouldn’t be able to, are actually AT your skill level…

im sure that the skill gap between Snipedown and some kid who just got Halo5 for Christmas is absolutely massive… Just as big as any other halo, if not more so thanks to all of the new trick jumps.

heck, you can watch two teams full of champion ranked players, and still see a huge skill gap between top champs and bottoms champs.

edit: sniper bullet mag IS rediculous