Theory to explain infinites trailers

Games Halo Infinite
1

The following theory touches on threads in halo 5, retribution, shadows of reach and last light.

In the infinite marketing the banished are suddenly anti human and I’m hoping 343i learned that misleading marketing and keeping surprises are not the same after hunt the truth.
Also in shadows of reach castor seems to be the only brute accepting of humans.
Atriox is not out for conquest or at least that wasnt the case prior to infinite yet the banished are now out to see humanity “burn” this kind of ruins the character for me personally.
So I was considering the “weapon” trailer and the implications of cortana an AI that may be on the level of the biases after she entered the domain. This lead me to intrepid eye.
In retribution oriel a splintered section of eye working independently infected sloan.
You may recall sloan as the overseeing AI on meridian a confirmed member of the created loyalists.
So is it possible eye infiltrated the created and purged cortana and later manipulated the banished into believing humanity intended to wipe out all other sentient life?
To take the mantle and secure there place in the universe.
Surely a threat of extinction coupled with humanity’s failures leading to cortanas dictatorship is enough of a reason for any brute even atriox to go on a warpath?

2

I see one flaw in your theory, and that is the Keepers of the One Freedom, who from my knowledge still believe in the Great Journey and would love to activate the rings.

In addition, while Atriox was never anti-human in the past, we do know that there was a conflict between the UNSC and the Banished on Zeta Halo that led to the UNSC losing and the Banished holding domain over Zeta, seemingly with assistance from a “Harbinger” and no Cortana to intervene.

Either the conflict itself was so troublesome that Atriox finally had enough of Humanity’s foolishness, or this new Harbinger character is feeding the Banished with lies, turning them hostile. Who knows? Only one way to find out

3

To be clear, the banished are not one minded. It is made up of clans with dif goals and views. This is shown very well in shadows of reach. The banished may not be anti human but escharum could be. We also know Atriox is all about gaining power. Humans on the ring lessens that power and using the term “burn” can be inferred as merely removing humanity fom the ring itself. Idk why everyone seems to think the banished have done a 180 when it comes to hating humanity just cause.

4

> 2533274840624875;3:
> To be clear, the banished are not one minded. It is made up of clans with dif goals and views. This is shown very well in shadows of reach. The banished may not be anti human but escharum could be. We also know Atriox is all about gaining power. Humans on the ring lessens that power and using the term “burn” can be inferred as merely removing humanity fom the ring itself. Idk why everyone seems to think the banished have done a 180 when it comes to hating humanity just cause.

Indeed, that’s very true.

5

> 2533274840624875;3:
> To be clear, the banished are not one minded. It is made up of clans with dif goals and views. This is shown very well in shadows of reach. The banished may not be anti human but escharum could be. We also know Atriox is all about gaining power. Humans on the ring lessens that power and using the term “burn” can be inferred as merely removing humanity fom the ring itself. Idk why everyone seems to think the banished have done a 180 when it comes to hating humanity just cause.

Well i disagree with that statement outright.
For me shadows established Atriox is head of the packs and all the verbiage shown for the banished in trailers has explicitly gone out of its way to reinforce that. But thanks for giving your perspective.

6

> 2533274882898126;2:
> I see one flaw in your theory, and that is the Keepers of the One Freedom, who from my knowledge still believe in the Great Journey and would love to activate the rings.
>
> In addition, while Atriox was never anti-human in the past, we do know that there was a conflict between the UNSC and the Banished on Zeta Halo that led to the UNSC losing and the Banished holding domain over Zeta, seemingly with assistance from a “Harbinger” and no Cortana to intervene.
>
> Either the conflict itself was so troublesome that Atriox finally had enough of Humanity’s foolishness, or this new Harbinger character is feeding the Banished with lies, turning them hostile. Who knows? Only one way to find out

I’m not sure how the keepers are a flaw here, can you explain further?
They and the ferrets are on the ark fighting a different war so if anything castor is the focus of a campaign update after divine wind assuming he’s not dead by then.
See im starting to think the harbinger is intrepid

7

> 2535411919953126;5:
> > 2533274840624875;3:
> > To be clear, the banished are not one minded. It is made up of clans with dif goals and views. This is shown very well in shadows of reach. The banished may not be anti human but escharum could be. We also know Atriox is all about gaining power. Humans on the ring lessens that power and using the term “burn” can be inferred as merely removing humanity fom the ring itself. Idk why everyone seems to think the banished have done a 180 when it comes to hating humanity just cause.
>
> Well i disagree with that statement outright.
> For me shadows established Atriox is head of the packs and all the verbiage shown for the banished in trailers has explicitly gone out of its way to reinforce that. But thanks for giving your perspective.

Atriox is the head of the pack, that does not make his views everyones. He is basically a warlord managing multiple clans under him. Heck Escharum is his canonical mentor, but that does not mean him and Escharum share the same views when it comes to everything (we know little of his views outside of him being a very honor driven brute given his views of chief in the game, honor =/= mean he likes humanity though)

Shadows of reach actually reinforces the internal conflict the banished have given the multiple chieftains trying to gain power for their clan or group. I mean, the keepers of the one freedom are the perfect example of that. They followed the banished to gain access to the ark and departed as soon as their interests diverged. Other chieftains will do the same if their views are drastically differ. Atriox is extremely intelligent and knows this, which is why his goal is to gain more and more power shows those groups keep following him. The banished themselves do not hate humans like the covenant did (given the prophets knew of humanities counter to their religion). However, groups within the banished can still despise them for any number of reasons.

The only thing that really points to your point would be the end of the book where Atriox shows disgust towards ferret team (who is with the keepers). Though, you could dismiss that as coming off the heels of him basically getting his butt kicked on the Ark by the Spirit of fire so hes a tad testy.

8

Now this is from someone not totally educated in the deep depths of Halo lore but a hardcore fan but from a basic standpoint this Escharum -Yoink- was a huge fan of Atriox even saying in the initial trailer something along the lines of “we are his legacy” therefore Escharum could simply hate humans because they defeated Atriox making him retreat whether Atriox is still alive or not could be a moot point and the banished hate the humans for defeating their founder and leader. I know this is a very on the surface look at it but seems plausible but I am hoping for something a little deeper in the game itself and I am hoping Atriox comes back for round 2 as that dude was bad as -Yoink- in Halo Wars 2.

9

> 2535411919953126;6:
> > 2533274882898126;2:
> > I see one flaw in your theory, and that is the Keepers of the One Freedom, who from my knowledge still believe in the Great Journey and would love to activate the rings.
> >
> > In addition, while Atriox was never anti-human in the past, we do know that there was a conflict between the UNSC and the Banished on Zeta Halo that led to the UNSC losing and the Banished holding domain over Zeta, seemingly with assistance from a “Harbinger” and no Cortana to intervene.
> >
> > Either the conflict itself was so troublesome that Atriox finally had enough of Humanity’s foolishness, or this new Harbinger character is feeding the Banished with lies, turning them hostile. Who knows? Only one way to find out
>
> I’m not sure how the keepers are a flaw here, can you explain further?
> They and the ferrets are on the ark fighting a different war so if anything castor is the focus of a campaign update after divine wind assuming he’s not dead by then.
> See im starting to think the harbinger is intrepid

I thought some of the Keepers were on Zeta as well? I could definitely be wrong. but I could definitely see the Keeper’s goals end up causing friction within the banished. I mean, when half your homies are trying to wipe out all life in the galaxy i’m sure things might get a little heated if you don’t really see things the same way.

10

> 2533274840624875;7:
> > 2535411919953126;5:
> > > 2533274840624875;3:
> > > To be clear, the banished are not one minded. It is made up of clans with dif goals and views. This is shown very well in shadows of reach. The banished may not be anti human but escharum could be. We also know Atriox is all about gaining power. Humans on the ring lessens that power and using the term “burn” can be inferred as merely removing humanity fom the ring itself. Idk why everyone seems to think the banished have done a 180 when it comes to hating humanity just cause.
> >
> > Well i disagree with that statement outright.
> > For me shadows established Atriox is head of the packs and all the verbiage shown for the banished in trailers has explicitly gone out of its way to reinforce that. But thanks for giving your perspective.
>
> Atriox is the head of the pack, that does not make his views everyones. He is basically a warlord managing multiple clans under him. Heck Escharum is his canonical mentor, but that does not mean him and Escharum share the same views when it comes to everything (we know little of his views outside of him being a very honor driven brute given his views of chief in the game, honor =/= mean he likes humanity though)
>
> Shadows of reach actually reinforces the internal conflict the banished have given the multiple chieftains trying to gain power for their clan or group. I mean, the keepers of the one freedom are the perfect example of that. They followed the banished to gain access to the ark and departed as soon as their interests diverged. Other chieftains will do the same if their views are drastically differ. Atriox is extremely intelligent and knows this, which is why his goal is to gain more and more power shows those groups keep following him. The banished themselves do not hate humans like the covenant did (given the prophets knew of humanities counter to their religion). However, groups within the banished can still despise them for any number of reasons.
>
> The only thing that really points to your point would be the end of the book where Atriox shows disgust towards ferret team (who is with the keepers). Though, you could dismiss that as coming off the heels of him basically getting his butt kicked on the Ark by the Spirit of fire so hes a tad testy.

Ya shadows had infighting and the strongest tactic used to end it was to use Atriox being mad as a scare Tactic.

Also I never said I believe all the banished hold the same view, he’ll the keepers joined. But the phrasing implies that Atriox wishes to see humanity burn.
Not ONI, not the UNSC, not humanity on the ring. This to me seems to show a fairly major change in mentality. As we know him the line should be all who bow to atriox and pledge servitude will be spared, those who don’t submit shall burn.

Atriox has shown respect to his opponents in the past so again seeing his disgust towards the ferrets seemed to show a shift in character. He even allows silent shadow officers to serve advisory roles within the banished hierarchy.

So while I see your points I feel they don’t negate my own, if anything they highlight my point.

11

> 2533274833071719;8:
> Now this is from someone not totally educated in the deep depths of Halo lore but a hardcore fan but from a basic standpoint this Escharum -Yoink- was a huge fan of Atriox even saying in the initial trailer something along the lines of “we are his legacy” therefore Escharum could simply hate humans because they defeated Atriox making him retreat whether Atriox is still alive or not could be a moot point and the banished hate the humans for defeating their founder and leader. I know this is a very on the surface look at it but seems plausible but I am hoping for something a little deeper in the game itself and I am hoping Atriox comes back for round 2 as that dude was bad as -Yoink- in Halo Wars 2.

Its a solid take. My only reason for not assuming atriox is dead is the ground work they laid for him to be important so it feels like an underwhelming choice to kill him off early. Wasnt that a major complaint with jul and the didact? If 343i repeat that I’d be kind of baffled and question the entire narrative oversight at that point.

12

Banished needed antagonist after Covenant fell. Like Escharum wants a last challenge, they also need an enemy to unite against. Perhaps Atriox pulled a true populist move and just chose humanity to be something compete against. I mean you would think they mainly opposed Created but who knows.

13

> 2533274882898126;9:
> > 2535411919953126;6:
> > > 2533274882898126;2:
> > > I see one flaw in your theory, and that is the Keepers of the One Freedom, who from my knowledge still believe in the Great Journey and would love to activate the rings.
> > >
> > > In addition, while Atriox was never anti-human in the past, we do know that there was a conflict between the UNSC and the Banished on Zeta Halo that led to the UNSC losing and the Banished holding domain over Zeta, seemingly with assistance from a “Harbinger” and no Cortana to intervene.
> > >
> > > Either the conflict itself was so troublesome that Atriox finally had enough of Humanity’s foolishness, or this new Harbinger character is feeding the Banished with lies, turning them hostile. Who knows? Only one way to find out
> >
> > I’m not sure how the keepers are a flaw here, can you explain further?
> > They and the ferrets are on the ark fighting a different war so if anything castor is the focus of a campaign update after divine wind assuming he’s not dead by then.
> > See im starting to think the harbinger is intrepid
>
> I thought some of the Keepers were on Zeta as well? I could definitely be wrong. but I could definitely see the Keeper’s goals end up causing friction within the banished. I mean, when half your homies are trying to wipe out all life in the galaxy i’m sure things might get a little heated if you don’t really see things the same way.

As of what we know right now castor is on the ark and not with banished. The divine winds release date is almost one your after infinite to me suggesting the next big infinite campaign content will take us to the ark to stop the keepers.

14

> 2535411919953126;13:
> > 2533274882898126;9:
> > > 2535411919953126;6:
> > > > 2533274882898126;2:
> > > > I see one flaw in your theory, and that is the Keepers of the One Freedom, who from my knowledge still believe in the Great Journey and would love to activate the rings.
> > > >
> > > > In addition, while Atriox was never anti-human in the past, we do know that there was a conflict between the UNSC and the Banished on Zeta Halo that led to the UNSC losing and the Banished holding domain over Zeta, seemingly with assistance from a “Harbinger” and no Cortana to intervene.
> > > >
> > > > Either the conflict itself was so troublesome that Atriox finally had enough of Humanity’s foolishness, or this new Harbinger character is feeding the Banished with lies, turning them hostile. Who knows? Only one way to find out
> > >
> > > I’m not sure how the keepers are a flaw here, can you explain further?
> > > They and the ferrets are on the ark fighting a different war so if anything castor is the focus of a campaign update after divine wind assuming he’s not dead by then.
> > > See im starting to think the harbinger is intrepid
> >
> > I thought some of the Keepers were on Zeta as well? I could definitely be wrong. but I could definitely see the Keeper’s goals end up causing friction within the banished. I mean, when half your homies are trying to wipe out all life in the galaxy i’m sure things might get a little heated if you don’t really see things the same way.
>
> As of what we know right now castor is on the ark and not with banished. The divine winds release date is almost one your after infinite to me suggesting the next big infinite campaign content will take us to the ark to stop the keepers.

That’s exciting

15

> 2535411919953126;11:
> > 2533274833071719;8:
> > Now this is from someone not totally educated in the deep depths of Halo lore but a hardcore fan but from a basic standpoint this Escharum -Yoink- was a huge fan of Atriox even saying in the initial trailer something along the lines of “we are his legacy” therefore Escharum could simply hate humans because they defeated Atriox making him retreat whether Atriox is still alive or not could be a moot point and the banished hate the humans for defeating their founder and leader. I know this is a very on the surface look at it but seems plausible but I am hoping for something a little deeper in the game itself and I am hoping Atriox comes back for round 2 as that dude was bad as -Yoink- in Halo Wars 2.
>
> Its a solid take. My only reason for not assuming atriox is dead is the ground work they laid for him to be important so it feels like an underwhelming choice to kill him off early. Wasnt that a major complaint with jul and the didact? If 343i repeat that I’d be kind of baffled and question the entire narrative oversight at that point.

I am with you there but 343 has done more questionable things before so I may be optimistic but also i am at the same level worried about it. lol super pumped to find out either way.

16

> 2533274833071719;15:
> > 2535411919953126;11:
> > > 2533274833071719;8:
> > > Now this is from someone not totally educated in the deep depths of Halo lore but a hardcore fan but from a basic standpoint this Escharum -Yoink- was a huge fan of Atriox even saying in the initial trailer something along the lines of “we are his legacy” therefore Escharum could simply hate humans because they defeated Atriox making him retreat whether Atriox is still alive or not could be a moot point and the banished hate the humans for defeating their founder and leader. I know this is a very on the surface look at it but seems plausible but I am hoping for something a little deeper in the game itself and I am hoping Atriox comes back for round 2 as that dude was bad as -Yoink- in Halo Wars 2.
> >
> > Its a solid take. My only reason for not assuming atriox is dead is the ground work they laid for him to be important so it feels like an underwhelming choice to kill him off early. Wasnt that a major complaint with jul and the didact? If 343i repeat that I’d be kind of baffled and question the entire narrative oversight at that point.
>
> I am with you there but 343 has done more questionable things before so I may be optimistic but also i am at the same level worried about it. lol super pumped to find out either way.

Ya I’m stoked to see how it all turns out haha

17

> 2535411919953126;10:
> > 2533274840624875;7:
> > > 2535411919953126;5:
> > > > 2533274840624875;3:
> > > > To be clear, the banished are not one minded. It is made up of clans with dif goals and views. This is shown very well in shadows of reach. The banished may not be anti human but escharum could be. We also know Atriox is all about gaining power. Humans on the ring lessens that power and using the term “burn” can be inferred as merely removing humanity fom the ring itself. Idk why everyone seems to think the banished have done a 180 when it comes to hating humanity just cause.
> > >
> > > Well i disagree with that statement outright.
> > > For me shadows established Atriox is head of the packs and all the verbiage shown for the banished in trailers has explicitly gone out of its way to reinforce that. But thanks for giving your perspective.
> >
> > Atriox is the head of the pack, that does not make his views everyones. He is basically a warlord managing multiple clans under him. Heck Escharum is his canonical mentor, but that does not mean him and Escharum share the same views when it comes to everything (we know little of his views outside of him being a very honor driven brute given his views of chief in the game, honor =/= mean he likes humanity though)
> >
> > Shadows of reach actually reinforces the internal conflict the banished have given the multiple chieftains trying to gain power for their clan or group. I mean, the keepers of the one freedom are the perfect example of that. They followed the banished to gain access to the ark and departed as soon as their interests diverged. Other chieftains will do the same if their views are drastically differ. Atriox is extremely intelligent and knows this, which is why his goal is to gain more and more power shows those groups keep following him. The banished themselves do not hate humans like the covenant did (given the prophets knew of humanities counter to their religion). However, groups within the banished can still despise them for any number of reasons.
> >
> > The only thing that really points to your point would be the end of the book where Atriox shows disgust towards ferret team (who is with the keepers). Though, you could dismiss that as coming off the heels of him basically getting his butt kicked on the Ark by the Spirit of fire so hes a tad testy.
>
> Ya shadows had infighting and the strongest tactic used to end it was to use Atriox being mad as a scare Tactic.
>
> Also I never said I believe all the banished hold the same view, he’ll the keepers joined. But the phrasing implies that Atriox wishes to see humanity burn.
> Not ONI, not the UNSC, not humanity on the ring. This to me seems to show a fairly major change in mentality. As we know him the line should be all who bow to atriox and pledge servitude will be spared, those who don’t submit shall burn.
>
> Atriox has shown respect to his opponents in the past so again seeing his disgust towards the ferrets seemed to show a shift in character. He even allows silent shadow officers to serve advisory roles within the banished hierarchy.
>
> So while I see your points I feel they don’t negate my own, if anything they highlight my point.

Right, cause again, hes the head and has perceived power, hence why he only wants more power. Once that power becomes weakened, those within the banished will turn on him. The keepers prove the opposite of what your saying though and to an extent, what I just said. If views differ enough, fear wont restrain the groups. The hatred of humans though is not enough as its not an ideological difference and or a difference in goals.

Everything we have seen by the banished and even the covenant infers they speak in catch-alls. Very few times do they refer to specific groups within their enemy. I mean, the last time it was done was from the Arbiter in the h2a cutscene between him and locke when he outright calls out ONI (and hes and ally at this point). Prior to that, the groups merely say “humans” when referring to the UNSC. So putting that much weight into Escharum saying Humanity instead of anything specific seems a bit week to me. I mean, we do the same thing in our own wars. We will use a catch all term such as “terrorist” instead of saying what specific group. We view them as all the same.

You are right, Atriox has been respectful, but again, even the smartest leaders are prideful and him finally getting off the ark after being stranded because of human intervention could make him salty in the moments where he saw ferret team. You cant rule out thats a temporary reaction and he shifts back to his more “normal” views that prior lore infers. Heck, id argue him not killing ferret team outright would negate the idea he wants to kill all of humanity.

I am merely saying there is actually no concrete evidence pointing to a personality shift by atriox or the banished. As everything can be explained by basic reactions and prior actions. So we cant really infer anything about their views at this time as the only goal we know of is to get control of the ring. Why? Guess we will find out, but lets not start pulling hunt the truth comparisons without actual evidence of a switch (those comparisons also would not really fit anyway).

Plus, we actually dont know where Atriox is at the time of infinite. We only know Escharum is there on his behalf and is taking the ring for the banished. We will have to weight and see the rest.

Oh and cause I never addressed the AI stuff. Its possible though I find it way less interesting.

18

> 2533274840624875;17:
> > 2535411919953126;10:
> > > 2533274840624875;7:
> > > > 2535411919953126;5:
> > > > > 2533274840624875;3:
> > > > > To be clear, the banished are not one minded. It is made up of clans with dif goals and views. This is shown very well in shadows of reach. The banished may not be anti human but escharum could be. We also know Atriox is all about gaining power. Humans on the ring lessens that power and using the term “burn” can be inferred as merely removing humanity fom the ring itself. Idk why everyone seems to think the banished have done a 180 when it comes to hating humanity just cause.
> > > >
> > > > Well i disagree with that statement outright.
> > > > For me shadows established Atriox is head of the packs and all the verbiage shown for the banished in trailers has explicitly gone out of its way to reinforce that. But thanks for giving your perspective.
> > >
> > > Atriox is the head of the pack, that does not make his views everyones. He is basically a warlord managing multiple clans under him. Heck Escharum is his canonical mentor, but that does not mean him and Escharum share the same views when it comes to everything (we know little of his views outside of him being a very honor driven brute given his views of chief in the game, honor =/= mean he likes humanity though)
> > >
> > > Shadows of reach actually reinforces the internal conflict the banished have given the multiple chieftains trying to gain power for their clan or group. I mean, the keepers of the one freedom are the perfect example of that. They followed the banished to gain access to the ark and departed as soon as their interests diverged. Other chieftains will do the same if their views are drastically differ. Atriox is extremely intelligent and knows this, which is why his goal is to gain more and more power shows those groups keep following him. The banished themselves do not hate humans like the covenant did (given the prophets knew of humanities counter to their religion). However, groups within the banished can still despise them for any number of reasons.
> > >
> > > The only thing that really points to your point would be the end of the book where Atriox shows disgust towards ferret team (who is with the keepers). Though, you could dismiss that as coming off the heels of him basically getting his butt kicked on the Ark by the Spirit of fire so hes a tad testy.
> >
> > Ya shadows had infighting and the strongest tactic used to end it was to use Atriox being mad as a scare Tactic.
> >
> > Also I never said I believe all the banished hold the same view, he’ll the keepers joined. But the phrasing implies that Atriox wishes to see humanity burn.
> > Not ONI, not the UNSC, not humanity on the ring. This to me seems to show a fairly major change in mentality. As we know him the line should be all who bow to atriox and pledge servitude will be spared, those who don’t submit shall burn.
> >
> > Atriox has shown respect to his opponents in the past so again seeing his disgust towards the ferrets seemed to show a shift in character. He even allows silent shadow officers to serve advisory roles within the banished hierarchy.
> >
> > So while I see your points I feel they don’t negate my own, if anything they highlight my point.
>
> Right, cause again, hes the head and has perceived power, hence why he only wants more power. Once that power becomes weakened, those within the banished will turn on him. The keepers prove the opposite of what your saying though and to an extent, what I just said. If views differ enough, fear wont restrain the groups. The hatred of humans though is not enough as its not an ideological difference and or a difference in goals.
>
> Everything we have seen by the banished and even the covenant infers they speak in catch-alls. Very few times do they refer to specific groups within their enemy. I mean, the last time it was done was from the Arbiter in the h2a cutscene between him and locke when he outright calls out ONI (and hes and ally at this point). Prior to that, the groups merely say “humans” when referring to the UNSC. So putting that much weight into Escharum saying Humanity instead of anything specific seems a bit week to me. I mean, we do the same thing in our own wars. We will use a catch all term such as “terrorist” instead of saying what specific group. We view them as all the same.
>
> You are right, Atriox has been respectful, but again, even the smartest leaders are prideful and him finally getting off the ark after being stranded because of human intervention could make him salty in the moments where he saw ferret team. You cant rule out thats a temporary reaction and he shifts back to his more “normal” views that prior lore infers. Heck, id argue him not killing ferret team outright would negate the idea he wants to kill all of humanity.
>
> I am merely saying there is actually no concrete evidence pointing to a personality shift by atriox or the banished. As everything can be explained by basic reactions and prior actions. So we cant really infer anything about their views at this time as the only goal we know of is to get control of the ring. Why? Guess we will find out, but lets not start pulling hunt the truth comparisons without actual evidence of a switch (those comparisons also would not really fit anyway).
>
> Plus, we actually dont know where Atriox is at the time of infinite. We only know Escharum is there on his behalf and is taking the ring for the banished. We will have to weight and see the rest.

Except he still had the hold even when he has been missing for 4 years without word to most packs. Still seen as the head of power while so far away he cannot hurt them.
This power remains even in defeat.

I really don’t see how the keepers being a separate faction the entire time works against the point. Where the phrasing here has defined this as the banished serving the ideals of atriox.

Atriox has shown the ability to separate factions of human it was one of the lessons that made him more effective than castor who is still learning to lead.

I agree the evidence isn’t great but the information that we do have seems to imply a new dynamic among the banished or else the choice of words have just been intentionally misleading. Surely they know by now misleading isn’t accepted by many fans. This seems correct seeing as zeta and the weapon were teased from the start.

19

> 2535411919953126;18:
> > 2533274840624875;17:
> > > 2535411919953126;10:
> > > > 2533274840624875;7:
> > > > > 2535411919953126;5:
> > > > > > 2533274840624875;3:
> > > > > > To be clear, the banished are not one minded. It is made up of clans with dif goals and views. This is shown very well in shadows of reach. The banished may not be anti human but escharum could be. We also know Atriox is all about gaining power. Humans on the ring lessens that power and using the term “burn” can be inferred as merely removing humanity fom the ring itself. Idk why everyone seems to think the banished have done a 180 when it comes to hating humanity just cause.
> > > > >
> > > > > Well i disagree with that statement outright.
> > > > > For me shadows established Atriox is head of the packs and all the verbiage shown for the banished in trailers has explicitly gone out of its way to reinforce that. But thanks for giving your perspective.
> > > >
> > > > Atriox is the head of the pack, that does not make his views everyones. He is basically a warlord managing multiple clans under him. Heck Escharum is his canonical mentor, but that does not mean him and Escharum share the same views when it comes to everything (we know little of his views outside of him being a very honor driven brute given his views of chief in the game, honor =/= mean he likes humanity though)
> > > >
> > > > Shadows of reach actually reinforces the internal conflict the banished have given the multiple chieftains trying to gain power for their clan or group. I mean, the keepers of the one freedom are the perfect example of that. They followed the banished to gain access to the ark and departed as soon as their interests diverged. Other chieftains will do the same if their views are drastically differ. Atriox is extremely intelligent and knows this, which is why his goal is to gain more and more power shows those groups keep following him. The banished themselves do not hate humans like the covenant did (given the prophets knew of humanities counter to their religion). However, groups within the banished can still despise them for any number of reasons.
> > > >
> > > > The only thing that really points to your point would be the end of the book where Atriox shows disgust towards ferret team (who is with the keepers). Though, you could dismiss that as coming off the heels of him basically getting his butt kicked on the Ark by the Spirit of fire so hes a tad testy.
> > >
> > > Ya shadows had infighting and the strongest tactic used to end it was to use Atriox being mad as a scare Tactic.
> > >
> > > Also I never said I believe all the banished hold the same view, he’ll the keepers joined. But the phrasing implies that Atriox wishes to see humanity burn.
> > > Not ONI, not the UNSC, not humanity on the ring. This to me seems to show a fairly major change in mentality. As we know him the line should be all who bow to atriox and pledge servitude will be spared, those who don’t submit shall burn.
> > >
> > > Atriox has shown respect to his opponents in the past so again seeing his disgust towards the ferrets seemed to show a shift in character. He even allows silent shadow officers to serve advisory roles within the banished hierarchy.
> > >
> > > So while I see your points I feel they don’t negate my own, if anything they highlight my point.
> >
> > Right, cause again, hes the head and has perceived power, hence why he only wants more power. Once that power becomes weakened, those within the banished will turn on him. The keepers prove the opposite of what your saying though and to an extent, what I just said. If views differ enough, fear wont restrain the groups. The hatred of humans though is not enough as its not an ideological difference and or a difference in goals.
> >
> > Everything we have seen by the banished and even the covenant infers they speak in catch-alls. Very few times do they refer to specific groups within their enemy. I mean, the last time it was done was from the Arbiter in the h2a cutscene between him and locke when he outright calls out ONI (and hes and ally at this point). Prior to that, the groups merely say “humans” when referring to the UNSC. So putting that much weight into Escharum saying Humanity instead of anything specific seems a bit week to me. I mean, we do the same thing in our own wars. We will use a catch all term such as “terrorist” instead of saying what specific group. We view them as all the same.
> >
> > You are right, Atriox has been respectful, but again, even the smartest leaders are prideful and him finally getting off the ark after being stranded because of human intervention could make him salty in the moments where he saw ferret team. You cant rule out thats a temporary reaction and he shifts back to his more “normal” views that prior lore infers. Heck, id argue him not killing ferret team outright would negate the idea he wants to kill all of humanity.
> >
> > I am merely saying there is actually no concrete evidence pointing to a personality shift by atriox or the banished. As everything can be explained by basic reactions and prior actions. So we cant really infer anything about their views at this time as the only goal we know of is to get control of the ring. Why? Guess we will find out, but lets not start pulling hunt the truth comparisons without actual evidence of a switch (those comparisons also would not really fit anyway).
> >
> > Plus, we actually dont know where Atriox is at the time of infinite. We only know Escharum is there on his behalf and is taking the ring for the banished. We will have to weight and see the rest.
>
> Except he still had the hold even when he has been missing for 4 years without word to most packs. Still seen as the head of power while so far away he cannot hurt them.
> This power remains even in defeat.
>
> I really don’t see how the keepers being a separate faction the entire time works against the point. Where the phrasing here has defined this as the banished serving the ideals of atriox.
>
> Atriox has shown the ability to separate factions of human it was one of the lessons that made him more effective than castor who is still learning to lead.
>
> I agree the evidence isn’t great but the information that we do have seems to imply a new dynamic among the banished or else the choice of words have just been intentionally misleading. Surely they know by now misleading isn’t accepted by many fans. This seems correct seeing as zeta and the weapon were teased from the start.

Thats where you have Escharum who is his mentor and extention of Atriox. While Atriox was not there directly, Escharum continued that perception of power, especially given Escharum was in contact with Atriox. Something the brutes were well aware of.

The keepers being present further cement the point that not all brutes in the banished have the same views. Some may had humans, some may not. Escharum may hate humans, Atriox may not. Thats the point.

Yes he can, however Atriox was not the one speaking in the vid your quoting. He also is not perfect and can succumb to annoyance derived from an extended period of loss. Again, you seem to be unwilling to let the idea of that being a temprary reaction be a thing. Thats not how personalities work.

Given not everyone is on the same page with their intentions, we cant even say it was misleading as a whole. The only thing it infers is the banished wanted to defeat the humans to get the ring and that Atriox is not leading the attack. Thats all it does.

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> > > > > > > To be clear, the banished are not one minded. It is made up of clans with dif goals and views. This is shown very well in shadows of reach. The banished may not be anti human but escharum could be. We also know Atriox is all about gaining power. Humans on the ring lessens that power and using the term “burn” can be inferred as merely removing humanity fom the ring itself. Idk why everyone seems to think the banished have done a 180 when it comes to hating humanity just cause.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Well i disagree with that statement outright.
> > > > > > For me shadows established Atriox is head of the packs and all the verbiage shown for the banished in trailers has explicitly gone out of its way to reinforce that. But thanks for giving your perspective.
> > > > >
> > > > > Atriox is the head of the pack, that does not make his views everyones. He is basically a warlord managing multiple clans under him. Heck Escharum is his canonical mentor, but that does not mean him and Escharum share the same views when it comes to everything (we know little of his views outside of him being a very honor driven brute given his views of chief in the game, honor =/= mean he likes humanity though)
> > > > >
> > > > > Shadows of reach actually reinforces the internal conflict the banished have given the multiple chieftains trying to gain power for their clan or group. I mean, the keepers of the one freedom are the perfect example of that. They followed the banished to gain access to the ark and departed as soon as their interests diverged. Other chieftains will do the same if their views are drastically differ. Atriox is extremely intelligent and knows this, which is why his goal is to gain more and more power shows those groups keep following him. The banished themselves do not hate humans like the covenant did (given the prophets knew of humanities counter to their religion). However, groups within the banished can still despise them for any number of reasons.
> > > > >
> > > > > The only thing that really points to your point would be the end of the book where Atriox shows disgust towards ferret team (who is with the keepers). Though, you could dismiss that as coming off the heels of him basically getting his butt kicked on the Ark by the Spirit of fire so hes a tad testy.
> > > >
> > > > Ya shadows had infighting and the strongest tactic used to end it was to use Atriox being mad as a scare Tactic.
> > > >
> > > > Also I never said I believe all the banished hold the same view, he’ll the keepers joined. But the phrasing implies that Atriox wishes to see humanity burn.
> > > > Not ONI, not the UNSC, not humanity on the ring. This to me seems to show a fairly major change in mentality. As we know him the line should be all who bow to atriox and pledge servitude will be spared, those who don’t submit shall burn.
> > > >
> > > > Atriox has shown respect to his opponents in the past so again seeing his disgust towards the ferrets seemed to show a shift in character. He even allows silent shadow officers to serve advisory roles within the banished hierarchy.
> > > >
> > > > So while I see your points I feel they don’t negate my own, if anything they highlight my point.
> > >
> > > .
>
> Thats where you have Escharum who is his mentor and extention of Atriox. While Atriox was not there directly, Escharum continued that perception of power, especially given Escharum was in contact with Atriox. Something the brutes were well aware of.
>
> The keepers being present further cement the point that not all brutes in the banished have the same views. Some may had humans, some may not. Escharum may hate humans, Atriox may not. Thats the point.
>
> Yes he can, however Atriox was not the one speaking in the vid your quoting. He also is not perfect and can succumb to annoyance derived from an extended period of loss. Again, you seem to be unwilling to let the idea of that being a temprary reaction be a thing. Thats not how personalities work.
>
> Given not everyone is on the same page with their intentions, we cant even say it was misleading as a whole. The only thing it infers is the banished wanted to defeat the humans to get the ring and that Atriox is not leading the attack. Thats all it does.

I feel like we are gonna just do this till launch :joy:

My point is the speech given while not by atriox is very much designed to make it appear as the banished on zeta are intent on serving Atriox’s wishes and belief. I understand your points and I see most as true but where I feel we are not quite understanding each other is im not saying the banished have Atriox’s beliefs they and the unsc are of the understanding they are carrying out his wishes and beliefs and those bels seem to have escalate ld. Granted these wishes are delivered Via Escharum but he is intentionally invoking Atriox and what Atriox wants something that would end up feeling like a major flat note if we learn this banished force is a splinter cell given the hype Atriox has had. I also couldn’t fathom atriox went back to the arc feeling earned. Only time will guess. But as it stands the marketing appears to be going out of its way to make Atriox out to be far more one note evil space gorilla intent on genocide. Not that I’m against that characterisation entirely it just all feels off with the early fiction establishing Atriox and his banished.