Big Team Skirmish has a big problem. And it has nothing to do with the balance, weapon spawns or player spawns for once.
It’s a problem with the Warthog.
We all knew that vehicles needed a serious buff a long time ago. But now, the once game-changing Warthog is being treated as a MONGOOSE by some (again, I am frustrated with the fact I lack an Xbox 360 HDD to use Theater Mode for evidence) . What happened to the epic moments I’ve shared with random people as we earned road trip medals and earned victory for our team? What happened to the ability to earn a running riot with the Hog?
I’m not the first to lament the loss of the Warthog’s power.
When a vehicle like the Warthog is being treated like a discount car and a SINGLE player is driving it for a quick flag capture only to fail as soon as he sets foot in enemy territory, you know that’s a pretty good sign you need to make it more useful for players. You need to buff it.
I’m aware that some are okay with the current Warthog, but I’m not. I don’t want players depriving their team of a valuable asset just so he or she can get a quick flag capture and fail miserably.
343, I’m aware that jiggling the knobs for vehicles will affect the entire sandbox as a whole. The Warthog would become almost unstoppable if used right. But the Warthog needs to be restored to its former glory. If you find the right Warthog with power of days of old, I would be extremely grateful.
tl;dr: The Warthog is being treated like a Mongoose by some. This needs to change.
Being able to spawn with a plasma pistol and plasma grenades ruined vehicular combat in Halo 4.
> Being able to spawn with a plasma pistol and plasma grenades ruined vehicular combat in Halo 4.
Don’t forget perks like Grenadier. An EXTRA sticky.
“But you can use the Wheelman mod!”
The Wheelman mod is a bit of a joke at times. What’s stopping everyone from grenade spamming?
Another reason the Hog needs to be restored.
This post has been edited by a moderator. Please do not bump.
*Original post. Click at your own discretion.
To the mods, apologies that I’m bumping the thread, but I feel this NEEDS to be seen, even if many are watching the live stream right now.The Warthog desperately needs a buff.
Your thread doesn’t need to be seen, this issue has been beaten to death several times over.
We problem isn’t the Hog itself, it is the environment in which it operates.
Ultimately highly skilled players won’t need the hog anyway, and buffing it only serves to dumb down the game even more in hopes of giving the newbs a fighting chance.
I’m glad this is the one “Let’s make the game more casual!” move that they decided to avoid.
> Your thread doesn’t need to be seen, this issue has been beaten to death several times over.
>
> We problem isn’t the Hog itself, it is the environment in which it operates.
>
> Ultimately highly skilled players won’t need the hog anyway, and buffing it only serves to dumb down the game even more in hopes of giving the newbs a fighting chance.
>
> I’m glad this is the one “Let’s make the game more casual!” move that they decided to avoid.
What? The warthog was always used as a gamechanger, but it wasn’t a tank that made the players invincible.
It was used to charge into the enemy’s base, capture the flag, and assist the flag carrier while having firepower.
High-skilled players and casuals use it all the time. If according to you, high-skill players and newbs avoid it, then who uses it? Medium players?
I think making the chaingun have bloom was a mistake, they should have just kept the overheating system like in reach instead of having both.
But again, this would be pointless because everyone can spawn with plasma pistol and plasma grenades.
> > Your thread doesn’t need to be seen, this issue has been beaten to death several times over.
> >
> > We problem isn’t the Hog itself, it is the environment in which it operates.
> >
> > Ultimately highly skilled players won’t need the hog anyway, and buffing it only serves to dumb down the game even more in hopes of giving the newbs a fighting chance.
> >
> > I’m glad this is the one “Let’s make the game more casual!” move that they decided to avoid.
>
> What? The warthog was always used as a gamechanger, but it wasn’t a tank that made the players invincible.
>
> It was used to charge into the enemy’s base, capture the flag, and assist the flag carrier while having firepower.
>
> High-skilled players and casuals use it all the time. If according to you, high-skill players and newbs avoid it, then who uses it? Medium players?
>
> I think making the chaingun have bloom was a mistake, they should have just kept the overheating system like in reach instead of having both.
>
> But again, this would be pointless because everyone can spawn with plasma pistol and plasma grenades.
When did I say newbs avoid it? Newbs LOVE it. Also I’m going to go out on a limb and say that my definition of “Highly skilled players” greatly differs from yours.
I also don’t like the bloom aspect. Not that I’m a big hog user mind you, but I don’t like the idea of adding in luck to something, even if it is a newb weapon/vehicle. I don’t like it when anybody loses out on a kill due to the luck factor, even if they are a newb.
And yes, at YOUR level of play, the Warthog is a game changer. When you’re playing at 50 CSR, nobody touches that garbage.
The resources are out there for players to improve if they so desire, yet people like the TC would rather say that the game needs to be changed for them.
If you want the Warthog to be stronger, you’re missing the simple truth that 2 players on foot > 2 players in a Warthog
You’re saying “I don’t want to work as an 8 man team, I just want to have 3 people in the warthog win the game”. If winning is what you’re concerned about, use the 8 people and stop relying on weak vehicles.
Sorry for double, but one last thing before I go to work…
There are 2 (For this illustration) routes you can take to make the game easier…
A) Improve YOURSELF
B) Ask that the game be changed
If you improve yourself, nothing can take that away from you. No weapon buffs, no nerfs, nothing. You improve yourself and you can take it all the way with you to Halo 6 if you want.
If you ask that the game be changed, you get no advantage. Let’s say that they buff the Warthog. You’re now happy because your team can use a decent Warthog…guess what? So can the other team. You aren’t going to get a unilateral advantage. If the Warthog is buffed for YOUR team, your opponents also get a buffed Warthog, and you’re right back where you started. Both teams have a solid warthog, but the team with the better TEAMWORK wins.
So do you see now? Complaining about individual weapons/vehicles won’t get you very far, because at the end of the day it is about the individual skill of the player, and the teamwork as a unit. The sooner you guys take personal responsibility and access the many resources which are out there to help you improve, the sooner you’ll be able to play the game at higher levels.
I hope you two will take what I’ve said to heart, as well as anybody else reading this. You can’t ask that the game be changed so that it is easier for you, because it becomes easier for everyone else as well, and then you’re in no better position than in which you started. Improve yourself if winning is that important to you.
Is launching it off the man-cannons on Ragnarok misusing it?
Because I do that, splatter people upon landing, and drive away triumphantly… only to then be booted because those people I landed on were teammates.
> > > Your thread doesn’t need to be seen, this issue has been beaten to death several times over.
> > >
> > > We problem isn’t the Hog itself, it is the environment in which it operates.
> > >
> > > Ultimately highly skilled players won’t need the hog anyway, and buffing it only serves to dumb down the game even more in hopes of giving the newbs a fighting chance.
> > >
> > > I’m glad this is the one “Let’s make the game more casual!” move that they decided to avoid.
> >
> > What? The warthog was always used as a gamechanger, but it wasn’t a tank that made the players invincible.
> >
> > It was used to charge into the enemy’s base, capture the flag, and assist the flag carrier while having firepower.
> >
> > High-skilled players and casuals use it all the time. If according to you, high-skill players and newbs avoid it, then who uses it? Medium players?
> >
> > I think making the chaingun have bloom was a mistake, they should have just kept the overheating system like in reach instead of having both.
> >
> > But again, this would be pointless because everyone can spawn with plasma pistol and plasma grenades.
>
> When did I say newbs avoid it? Newbs LOVE it. Also I’m going to go out on a limb and say that my definition of “Highly skilled players” greatly differs from yours.
>
> I also don’t like the bloom aspect. Not that I’m a big hog user mind you, but I don’t like the idea of adding in luck to something, even if it is a newb weapon/vehicle. I don’t like it when anybody loses out on a kill due to the luck factor, even if they are a newb.
>
> And yes, at YOUR level of play, the Warthog is a game changer. When you’re playing at 50 CSR, nobody touches that garbage.
>
> The resources are out there for players to improve if they so desire, yet people like the TC would rather say that the game needs to be changed for them.
> If you want the Warthog to be stronger, you’re missing the simple truth that 2 players on foot > 2 players in a Warthog
> You’re saying “I don’t want to work as an 8 man team, I just want to have 3 people in the warthog win the game”. If winning is what you’re concerned about, use the 8 people and stop relying on weak vehicles.
Lol, 2 players on foot beat 2 people in a warthog? Maybe if the driver is awful and the person can’t shoot and aim, but double kills occur all the time for a warthog gunner.
People of all ranks and skill from past halo games have always used the warthog, in fact, one of the changes for the warthog from halo 3 to halo reach was giving the turret an overheat feature and making it have reduced health, because people felt that the vehicles were too strong.
Teamplay is still important for a warthog, you need people on foot to work together to gain power weapons and map control.
But this isn’t the TC’s point, his point is that people have been using warthogs to get to a weapon or a certain part of the map by themselves. People did this in past halo games too, but not as much as this one.
The worthogs are not the issue. It’s the players. You can buff the worthog into oblivion and the people that want the PW’s that bad will still miss use them.
If you actually want players to use equipment and vehicles right run with a team. Expecting randoms to behave in a good way in any game these days is simply your own downfall.
> The worthogs are not the issue. It’s the players.
i disagree
if the warthog itself is almost useless to people that know how to play the game, why would they use it?
and since very few decent people are now driving Hogs, those drivers and gunners are now replaced by the people who don’t care about using it properly.
no decent player wants to give free points to the enemy team by driving the now coffin-on-wheels
> > The worthogs are not the issue. It’s the players.
>
> i disagree
>
> if the warthog itself is almost useless to people that know how to play the game, why would they use it?
>
> and since very few decent people are now driving Hogs, those drivers and gunners are now replaced by the people who don’t care about using it properly.
>
> no decent player wants to give free points to the enemy team by driving the now coffin-on-wheels
You can disagree all you wish. Still doesn’t stop me from using the worthog effectively against the enemy team. Then again i also run with good drivers and am one myself.
The only aspect that the worthog fails in is damage protection. But the chain gun is stronger then any chain gun we’ve had on the worthog. I assume by “knowing how to play” you mean the PP sticky combo? That’s not knowing anything. There are direct counters. AND if your banking your reasoning that the worthog is bad based off of that it’s still the players and the worthog itself.
> The only aspect that the worthog fails in is damage protection. But the chain gun is stronger then any chain gun we’ve had on the worthog. I assume by “knowing how to play” you mean the PP sticky combo? That’s not knowing anything. There are direct counters. AND if your banking your reasoning that the worthog is bad based off of that it’s still the players and the worthog itself.
Up until Halo 4 the Warthog was the game-changer. Even if you weren’t the guy that was driving or gunning, having two people on your team that were halfway decent at crewing a Warthog meant your team was going to win if the other team didn’t have two people that could crew a Warthog.
I don’t know how many times I got trampled by my own teammates at the beginning of a match because they wanted to get to the Warthogs on Standoff, Valhalla or Sandtrap first. Half the strategy was either taking or blowing up the other team’s Hogs. That’s how important they were.
In Reach, not so much because the Reach Hogs seemed to be filled with helium.
Now if you even think about climbing in a Hog you should just shoot yourself because you are going to die anyway. All they’re really any good for now is a quick trip to the nearest power weapon. If you have a gunner you just give the other team a double kill.
Honestly if it were possible to survive in a Warthog for more than fifteen seconds more people would use them as intended. As it stands now they may as well be Mongooses.
Everytime a new Halo game comes out with teaks and changes to the gameplay people complain.
Instead of adapting, the vocal minority -Yoink- and moan and act like the voice of the whole community.
Remember the armour lock in Reach? Easy to avoid and counter yet the minority kept rushing in and getting killed so they moaned load enough and it was changed.
The last thing we need is the warthog to be changed. For a double or 3 main team it can be a brilliant tactical vehicle, providing support and firepower to situations that need it pretty quickly. Even with ppl able to spawn with Plasma pistols doesn’t instantly mean they can stop it.But a good opposing team can counter it, on foot or in another vehicle.
It is balanced, sure the bloom seems abit much but it would reap a higher kill rate with a more concentrated stream of firepower.
Anyway, rant over. Good day to you fine people.