The sprint discussion thread

Halo returning to its roots wouldn’t save it, trust me. True, the current state of Halo is unhealthy but the factors involved are more expanse than simple gameplay gimmicks like sprint, or the artstyle. Recognize that Halo as a franchise will be 17 years old November this year. Halo is very old.

Halo’s decline is more a result of fatigue of a franchise that’s had it’s glory days come and gone. 343i’s innovations and additions are not to blame, rather it’s the communal desire to go nearly a decade back in time amongst the peak of Halo 3. Everyone had an Xbox. Games were very limited in quantity. Halo stood on top for a long time because it was one of those games that were funded and developed the most. Halo sold the Xbox. Today, any game can do that. The standard previously set by classic Halos is constantly superceded and frequented that the milestone isn’t something so redeeming anymore. Today, even Indie developers can create small-time games with more fidelity and intricacies that outclass those of a decade ago. Every developer seems to have the money they need. This doesn’t necessarily mean Halo has declined, just that other games have caught up. This illustrates the illusion that Halo has become “generic” or “soulless”, just because new games are capable of competing. Halo still has a huge surplus of funding from Microsoft and it definitely shows; the most recent FPS installment, Halo 5, has so much intricate attention to detail, tuning, and collaborative efforts that regardless of whether you would identify it to be Halo whatsoever, it’s a great, well-rounded, meticulous game. The idea that Halo has become “generic” is the modern fundamentalism of First-Person-Shooters. As much as you want to say that it’s unique, it’s still an FPS. Halo isn’t “special” anymore, but it’s not like its lost that status, it’s because everything else has caught up.

> 2533274870445963;16166:
> Halo returning to its roots wouldn’t save it, trust me. True, the current state of Halo is unhealthy but the factors involved are more expanse than simple gameplay gimmicks like sprint, or the artstyle. Recognize that Halo as a franchise will be 17 years old November this year. Halo is very old.
>
> Halo’s decline is more a result of fatigue of a franchise that’s had it’s glory days come and gone. 343i’s innovations and additions are not to blame, rather it’s the communal desire to go nearly a decade back in time amongst the peak of Halo 3. Everyone had an Xbox. Games were very limited in quantity. Halo stood on top for a long time because it was one of those games that were funded and developed the most. Halo sold the Xbox. Today, any game can do that. The standard previously set by classic Halos is constantly superceded and frequented that the milestone isn’t something so redeeming anymore. Today, even Indie developers can create small-time games with more fidelity and intricacies that outclass those of a decade ago. Every developer seems to have the money they need. This doesn’t necessarily mean Halo has declined, just that other games have caught up. This illustrates the illusion that Halo has become “generic” or “soulless”, just because new games are capable of competing. Halo still has a huge surplus of funding from Microsoft and it definitely shows; the most recent FPS installment, Halo 5, has so much intricate attention to detail, tuning, and collaborative efforts that regardless of whether you would identify it to be Halo whatsoever, it’s a great, well-rounded, meticulous game. The idea that Halo has become “generic” is the modern fundamentalism of First-Person-Shooters. As much as you want to say that it’s unique, it’s still an FPS. Halo isn’t “special” anymore, but it’s not like its lost that status, it’s because everything else has caught up.

People really don’t give Halo the credit it deserves. Back in it’s “heyday” Halo went up against Call of Duty, battlefield, and the like, and won for years. Later years became 2nd and 3rd, but it was old then and Reach was not as well recieved due to things such as armor abilites and bloom.

I’m genuinely surprised that Call of Duty hasn’t suffered such huge fatigue, if that was the issue, or Battlefield.

Halo is “generic and soulless” because instead of doing things the Halo way, they decided to copy other games and their mechanics. Even ignoring sprint, there is spartan charge (5), QTEs (4), a form of ADS (5),…

People want to go back a decade because that was the peak of Halo. Every Halo after 3 keeps on implementing changes to core gameplay. And no, I am not saying Halo can never change, rather the changes made should more of affect the sandbox, and not change the player.

Everything else didn’t catch up to Halo, Halo compromised itself by making decisive changes to the core game.

> 2533274870445963;16166:
> Halo returning to its roots wouldn’t save it, trust me. True, the current state of Halo is unhealthy but the factors involved are more expanse than simple gameplay gimmicks like sprint, or the artstyle. Recognize that Halo as a franchise will be 17 years old November this year. Halo is very old.
>
> Halo’s decline is more a result of fatigue of a franchise that’s had it’s glory days come and gone. 343i’s innovations and additions are not to blame, rather it’s the communal desire to go nearly a decade back in time amongst the peak of Halo 3. Everyone had an Xbox. Games were very limited in quantity. Halo stood on top for a long time because it was one of those games that were funded and developed the most. Halo sold the Xbox. Today, any game can do that. The standard previously set by classic Halos is constantly superceded and frequented that the milestone isn’t something so redeeming anymore. Today, even Indie developers can create small-time games with more fidelity and intricacies that outclass those of a decade ago. Every developer seems to have the money they need. This doesn’t necessarily mean Halo has declined, just that other games have caught up. This illustrates the illusion that Halo has become “generic” or “soulless”, just because new games are capable of competing. Halo still has a huge surplus of funding from Microsoft and it definitely shows; the most recent FPS installment, Halo 5, has so much intricate attention to detail, tuning, and collaborative efforts that regardless of whether you would identify it to be Halo whatsoever, it’s a great, well-rounded, meticulous game. The idea that Halo has become “generic” is the modern fundamentalism of First-Person-Shooters. As much as you want to say that it’s unique, it’s still an FPS. Halo isn’t “special” anymore, but it’s not like its lost that status, it’s because everything else has caught up.

“Halo returning to it’s roots wouldn’t save it” this is something I won’t hear as true untill it’s been done. If we’re aware that current Halo isn’t producing good numbers then what’s the harm in trying an old school approach to see what happens? If it fails then go back to what you was doing before. I also noticed someone mentioning that in going back to classic gameplay, you risk alienating the newer players, something that is true, but it also works both ways. You can also bring in other players in doing so, I’d be curious on who outnumbers who and that question would finally be answered. What I will say Is it makes absolutely no sense to continue doing what isn’t working, so something HAS to change be it doing an old school approach or something entirely new.

Regarding franchise fatigue: i’d put that on the developers not doing anything new to keep people interested. When you’re doing the same thing as everyone else, hence people calling the industry generic, people aren’t going to be enticed or interested enough to keep playing. There are franchises older than Halo like Zelda or Mario that still sell a ton and has the interest to keep churning them out. You’ll find various games in said franchises will have different eras where they’re different to what was done before. Halo can have the same outcome if it too did something new but also something that doesn’t agitate the playerbases. Essentially do the correct change, change itself isn’t the issue, it’s what you change that will fire people up. Franchise fatigue can definitely be an issue, but it’s something that can be limited if the devs go about shrinking it’s impact.

Lastly: “games were limited in quantity” (quoted from you going on why H3 did so well) is something developers have stated as false. Since games have become more expensive to make now compared to the past, you see less games made as a result. So there being less competition in the past isn’t true, there was more of it.

https://www.overclock.net/forum/82-video-games-general/1530832-why-there-less-games-ps3-ps4-compared-ps1-ps2.html#/topics/1530832This link will show graphs comparing just the PlayStation games (emphasis on GAMES, not consoles) by generation. You’ll see ps1 start out low, then the ps2 skyrockets, the PS3 drops and the PS4 is even lower. If you look at the Xbox you’ll see the same thing in generational comparison, it starts slow with the OG Xbox, skyrockets with the 360 and now it’s dropping quite a bit, it’s also pretty clear the Xbox one itself has issues on having exclusives which is probably the most brought up issue with it. There are less games out today than the past, so I don’t view competition in quantity as an issue but by quality. What shooter does X better than the others? That’s where most players will go towards.

Outside of development costs rising, you also have the bigger brands trying to shovel out 3rd party games (Indie devs, which is funny cause years ago people were on about the rise of indie games but in reality they’re being more limited) which is also contributing to less games than before. In relation to this, (and I can link indie devs on subreddit saying exactly what I’ll say) Indie games and free to play stuff simply doesn’t grab an audiences attention compared to your average AAA game, they don’t have the marketing power to hold people’s interest and that marketing requires money (I could’ve sworn you said every dev has money? Indie devs really don’t, they have to rely on kick starter funds just for the games themselves), something AAA devs don’t lack as much, especially with publisher support. So when you have little interest, you start seeing various projects get shelved as the inspiration to continue working on a game no one cares about drops. Quantity wise this shows as you only have a few standouts like the very popular fortnite right now or a 5 year old Warframe that still gets so much interest that it still sits on steams top ten most played games for PC (and PC has more options than anything), or the F2P smite being the only viable console MOBA to play.

> 2533274870445963;16166:
> Halo returning to its roots wouldn’t save it, trust me. True, the current state of Halo is unhealthy but the factors involved are more expanse than simple gameplay gimmicks like sprint, or the artstyle.

You say that as if it’s a fact, but there’s no proof behind it. No one has proof one way or the other.

You even call Sprint a “simple gimmick”, but recognize that there are 800 pages about this one topic and contains some people who’s willingness to buy the game solely depends on whether said gimmick exists or not.

A really good proof would be for a “classic” Halo game to actually fail or be unable to complete with games of the current lineup. If Microsoft/343i released a perfectly “classic” Halo game and it bombed, then that would be the end of that, no argument necessary. But that doesn’t exist.

> 2533274870445963;16166:
> Halo returning to its roots wouldn’t save it, trust me. True, the current state of Halo is unhealthy but the factors involved are more expanse than simple gameplay gimmicks like sprint, or the artstyle. Recognize that Halo as a franchise will be 17 years old November this year. Halo is very old.
>
> Halo’s decline is more a result of fatigue of a franchise that’s had it’s glory days come and gone. 343i’s innovations and additions are not to blame, rather it’s the communal desire to go nearly a decade back in time amongst the peak of Halo 3. Everyone had an Xbox. Games were very limited in quantity. Halo stood on top for a long time because it was one of those games that were funded and developed the most. Halo sold the Xbox. Today, any game can do that. The standard previously set by classic Halos is constantly superceded and frequented that the milestone isn’t something so redeeming anymore. Today, even Indie developers can create small-time games with more fidelity and intricacies that outclass those of a decade ago. Every developer seems to have the money they need. This doesn’t necessarily mean Halo has declined, just that other games have caught up. This illustrates the illusion that Halo has become “generic” or “soulless”, just because new games are capable of competing. Halo still has a huge surplus of funding from Microsoft and it definitely shows; the most recent FPS installment, Halo 5, has so much intricate attention to detail, tuning, and collaborative efforts that regardless of whether you would identify it to be Halo whatsoever, it’s a great, well-rounded, meticulous game. The idea that Halo has become “generic” is the modern fundamentalism of First-Person-Shooters. As much as you want to say that it’s unique, it’s still an FPS. Halo isn’t “special” anymore, but it’s not like its lost that status, it’s because everything else has caught up.

Franchise fatigue yet millions still bought H4 after Reach (see the quote below). “None of 343’s additions or innovations were to blame. They left because there was a desire for classic gameplay.” Wow, just when I thought I’ve seen it all in this thread. So people left due to wanting classic gameplay, but millions of people still bought H4 and H5 knowing that modern abilities were in the game. Only after they experienced the gameplay is when they left the game in droves at least in H4’s case. We don’t know with H5 since that info isn’t available, but we know there are population issues just based on Dr Menke’s MM threads and people’s MM experiences. I think it’s safe to assume that it’s related to something that 343 did in both games and not because it’s just due to people wanting classic gameplay.

> Halo 4 grossed $220 million in its first 24 hours of release alone, marking a new record for the series. [7] Halo 4 was also the third most-sold video game of its release year, 2012. [8]. Currently, it has sold 5.57 million copies in North America alone, with 1.79 million in Europe and 0.04 million in Japan.

Link.

This video pretty much annihilates your entire argument about Halo being old, limited quality games, being well funded and other FPS games being or not being caught up .

You guys are hilarious with your COD references. First… Halo CE came out two years before COD.
You always try to compare Halo with COD and say it’s stealing things from “New” games… Well I hate to break it to you young lads but Halo isn’t an original game. Sure it is an evolved FPS from previous titles (actually barely because FPS from earlier platforms had more abilities than HaloCE) that came before it but even the story for the majority is lifted from the Aliens franchise. The pelican, the assault rifle, the aggressive one liners from the Marines all from Aliens, yet we all collectively gloss over this and accept it. Yet the game adds other features that dates back to Mario Bros on the NES (yeah he could sprint, and slide, and clamber and ground pound) and your go to is… COD… it’s COD… Nope… COD… ugggghhh… COD…

Wait… was there a line in Aliens that referenced COD, because then that would make so much sense. It’s just canon.

> 2535441152633368;16171:
> You guys are hilarious with your COD references. First… Halo CE came out two years before COD.
> You always try to compare Halo with COD and say it’s stealing things from “New” games… Well I hate to break it to you young lads but Halo isn’t an original game. Sure it is an evolved FPS from previous titles (actually barely because FPS from earlier platforms had more abilities than HaloCE) that came before it but even the story for the majority is lifted from the Aliens franchise. The pelican, the assault rifle, the aggressive one liners from the Marines all from Aliens, yet we all collectively gloss over this and accept it. Yet the game adds other features that dates back to Mario Bros on the NES (yeah he could sprint, and slide, and clamber and ground pound) and your go to is… COD… it’s COD… Nope… COD… ugggghhh… COD…
>
> Wait… was there a line in Aliens that referenced COD, because then that would make so much sense. It’s just canon.

There actually hasn’t been a lot of comparisons to Call of Duty within the last few pages. Most of it was about Halo directly competing with CoD. So I really don’t know where you lifted this “You always try to compare Halo with COD” as if you’re trying to handwave an argument.

Now, since you’re going to inexplicably disappear, I’m still waiting for you to show me how the Marines are running faster than you in the first level of Halo 3, when it’s clear that it’s the opposite.

> 2533274833081329;16172:
> > 2535441152633368;16171:
> > You guys are hilarious with your COD references. First… Halo CE came out two years before COD.
> > You always try to compare Halo with COD and say it’s stealing things from “New” games… Well I hate to break it to you young lads but Halo isn’t an original game. Sure it is an evolved FPS from previous titles (actually barely because FPS from earlier platforms had more abilities than HaloCE) that came before it but even the story for the majority is lifted from the Aliens franchise. The pelican, the assault rifle, the aggressive one liners from the Marines all from Aliens, yet we all collectively gloss over this and accept it. Yet the game adds other features that dates back to Mario Bros on the NES (yeah he could sprint, and slide, and clamber and ground pound) and your go to is… COD… it’s COD… Nope… COD… ugggghhh… COD…
> >
> > Wait… was there a line in Aliens that referenced COD, because then that would make so much sense. It’s just canon.
>
> There actually hasn’t been a lot of comparisons to Call of Duty within the last few pages. Most of it was about Halo directly competing with CoD. So I really don’t know where you lifted this “You always try to compare Halo with COD” as if you’re trying to handwave an argument.
>
> Now, since you’re going to inexplicably disappear, I’m still waiting for you to show me how the Marines are running faster than you in the first level of Halo 3, when it’s clear that it’s the opposite.

Something else to keep in mind there: In later levels, Chief is also capable of moving and firing with pinpoint accuracy. Marines typically stop to fire, and will rarely, if ever, fire while not standing or crouching still.

Anyway, I’ve been playing some CEA lately, and I’ve noticed that the base movement speed of Chief during campaign is astoundingly fast. If you look close enough, you can see it. You can feel it.

Anyone who claims that Halo CE is too slow or feels too slow because of no sprint has zero idea what they’re talking about.

> 2535441152633368;16171:
> You guys are hilarious with your COD references. First… Halo CE came out two years before COD.
> You always try to compare Halo with COD and say it’s stealing things from “New” games… Well I hate to break it to you young lads but Halo isn’t an original game. Sure it is an evolved FPS from previous titles (actually barely because FPS from earlier platforms had more abilities than HaloCE) that came before it but even the story for the majority is lifted from the Aliens franchise. The pelican, the assault rifle, the aggressive one liners from the Marines all from Aliens, yet we all collectively gloss over this and accept it. Yet the game adds other features that dates back to Mario Bros on the NES (yeah he could sprint, and slide, and clamber and ground pound) and your go to is… COD… it’s COD… Nope… COD… ugggghhh… COD…
>
> Wait… was there a line in Aliens that referenced COD, because then that would make so much sense. It’s just canon.

Can you quote the recent post that you’re referring to because I don’t see anyone talking about COD the way you’re describing. No one that I know of is glossing over that Halo took inspiration from Aliens since that’s been known for a long time, but people in your scenario would be talking about recent game idea borrowing like if Halo had wall running in the next game for example. I agree that complaining about stealing ideas isn’t really a strong argument considering games do borrow from each other, but it’s certainly eyebrow raising when a franchise suddenly takes a completely different direction featuring mechanics that weren’t in previous games, but they’re in their competitors’ games like ADS for example. It’s perfectly reasonable to wonder why the sudden change on things that seemed to be a nonissue in previous games.

Your NES comparisons aren’t good because it’s ridiculous to think that no one could ever come up with those generic ideas for a game on their own especially thirty years later and who knows how many games already have those features as well. You’re basically saying that if people didn’t see Mario we would never know that we could sprint in a game. Do you see how absurd that sounds?

> 2535444702990491;16136:
> Halo 3 was slower- the slowest Halo ever. And sprint would have undoubtably saved it.

> 2547348539238747;16140:
> > 2535444702990491;16131:
> > > 2533274833081329;16130:
> > > > 2535441152633368;16124:
> > > > I tried playing HaloCE the other day and it was like master chief and the warthog were towing a boat anchor. My thumbs got sore from jamming the stick forward hoping he’d move just a little faster. Not to mention watching the marines at the beginning of Halo 3 clamber up the side of a cliff while Chief has to crouch hop jump along the creek was a little depressing.
> > >
> > > I’m still waiting for you to show me how the Marines are running faster than you, when it’s clear that it’s the opposite. Johnson told the marines to climb that rock wall and you to go the other way for a reason.
> >
> > I think you’re being a little harsh here, mean I get where he’s coming from- the marines are indeed more agile than a Spartan in that level. It is upsetting to see regular humans moving swifter than an augmented super human wearing MJOLNIR armor. Overall they’re slightly slower than Chief in H3, but the movement for the player was the slowest ever in H3 anyway so if the marines are slow, the Spartans are slow- everyone is slow in Halo 3. A little speed boost in the way of sprint could have gone such a long way for Halo 3…
>
> This is all untrue. Halo 3 had the exact same speed as Halo CE and Halo 2. All the original trilogy had the same BMS and Halo Reach’s BMS was slightly slower. Halo CE had 90 FOV, while Halo 3 had 70 FOV. This is why everything is slow in Halo 3.With this gen and games allowing us to pick our FOV I’ve found that I prefer 90. It adds enough view and speed without hurting the game. Sprint wouldn’t have felt fast in Halo 3.I’d argue, given Halo 3’s success without sprint, that adding in the mechanic would have ruined all the fond memories that millions of gamers still have of Halo 3…

Just on a side note here, the slowest Halo was ODST with 5.5m/s, compared to the trilogy’s 7m/s. And while Reach reduced that to 6.85m/s, Halo 4 was even slower at 6.6m/s. Only afterwards was movement speed raised again to 7.6m/s in H2A and then to 8.3m/s in H5G (which was lower in the beta, but I don’t have an exact number, since I missed out on the beta test back in the day). Sprint speed was always the same 10.75m/s ever since it’s introduction in Reach. (Which ironically is slower than 12m/s, the Spartans’ highest documented running speed at which they are still able to shoot precisely. So much for lore consistency.)

> 2533274801176260;16175:
> > 2535444702990491;16136:
> >
>
>
>
> > 2547348539238747;16140:
> > > 2535444702990491;16131:
> > > > 2533274833081329;16130:
> > > > > 2535441152633368;16124:
> > > > > I tried playing HaloCE the other day and it was like master chief and the warthog were towing a boat anchor. My thumbs got sore from jamming the stick forward hoping he’d move just a little faster. Not to mention watching the marines at the beginning of Halo 3 clamber up the side of a cliff while Chief has to crouch hop jump along the creek was a little depressing.
> > > >
> > > > I’m still waiting for you to show me how the Marines are running faster than you, when it’s clear that it’s the opposite. Johnson told the marines to climb that rock wall and you to go the other way for a reason.
>
> Sprint speed was always the same 10.75m/s ever since it’s introduction in Reach. (Which ironically is slower than 12m/s, the Spartans’ highest documented running speed at which they are still able to shoot precisely. So much for lore consistency.)

Great point. All they need to do in the next Halo then is slightly increase the speed of sprint to perfect it.

> 2535444702990491;16176:
> > 2533274801176260;16175:
> > > 2535444702990491;16136:
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > > 2547348539238747;16140:
> > > > 2535444702990491;16131:
> > > > > 2533274833081329;16130:
> > > > > > 2535441152633368;16124:
> > > > > > I tried playing HaloCE the other day and it was like master chief and the warthog were towing a boat anchor. My thumbs got sore from jamming the stick forward hoping he’d move just a little faster. Not to mention watching the marines at the beginning of Halo 3 clamber up the side of a cliff while Chief has to crouch hop jump along the creek was a little depressing.
> > > > >
> > > > > I’m still waiting for you to show me how the Marines are running faster than you, when it’s clear that it’s the opposite. Johnson told the marines to climb that rock wall and you to go the other way for a reason.
> >
> > Sprint speed was always the same 10.75m/s ever since it’s introduction in Reach. (Which ironically is slower than 12m/s, the Spartans’ highest documented running speed at which they are still able to shoot precisely. So much for lore consistency.)
>
> Great point. All they need to do in the next Halo then is slightly increase the speed of sprint to perfect it.

And add the shooting part, otherwise it still wouldn’t be very lore-consistent when super soldiers lose the ability to shoot.

> 2535444702990491;16176:
> > 2533274801176260;16175:
> > > 2535444702990491;16136:
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > > 2547348539238747;16140:
> > > > 2535444702990491;16131:
> > > > > 2533274833081329;16130:
> > > > > > 2535441152633368;16124:
> > > > > > I tried playing HaloCE the other day and it was like master chief and the warthog were towing a boat anchor. My thumbs got sore from jamming the stick forward hoping he’d move just a little faster. Not to mention watching the marines at the beginning of Halo 3 clamber up the side of a cliff while Chief has to crouch hop jump along the creek was a little depressing.
> > > > >
> > > > > I’m still waiting for you to show me how the Marines are running faster than you, when it’s clear that it’s the opposite. Johnson told the marines to climb that rock wall and you to go the other way for a reason.
> >
> > Sprint speed was always the same 10.75m/s ever since it’s introduction in Reach. (Which ironically is slower than 12m/s, the Spartans’ highest documented running speed at which they are still able to shoot precisely. So much for lore consistency.)
>
> Great point. All they need to do in the next Halo then is slightly increase the speed of sprint to perfect it.

Or remove it, increase FOV with an increase in BMS, and the game will actually work as intended again.

Halo CE feels a whole lot faster than Halo 5 does
And it is verifiably faster, mind you.

> 2533274833081329;16177:
> > 2535444702990491;16176:
> > > 2533274801176260;16175:
> > > > 2535444702990491;16136:
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > > 2547348539238747;16140:
> > > > > 2535444702990491;16131:
> > > > > > 2533274833081329;16130:
> > > > > > > 2535441152633368;16124:
> > > > > > > I tried playing HaloCE the other day and it was like master chief and the warthog were towing a boat anchor. My thumbs got sore from jamming the stick forward hoping he’d move just a little faster. Not to mention watching the marines at the beginning of Halo 3 clamber up the side of a cliff while Chief has to crouch hop jump along the creek was a little depressing.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I’m still waiting for you to show me how the Marines are running faster than you, when it’s clear that it’s the opposite. Johnson told the marines to climb that rock wall and you to go the other way for a reason.
> > >
> > > Sprint speed was always the same 10.75m/s ever since it’s introduction in Reach. (Which ironically is slower than 12m/s, the Spartans’ highest documented running speed at which they are still able to shoot precisely. So much for lore consistency.)
> >
> > Great point. All they need to do in the next Halo then is slightly increase the speed of sprint to perfect it.
>
> And add the shooting part, otherwise it still wouldn’t be very lore-consistent when super soldiers lose the ability to shoot.

Wait…wouldn’t being able to shoot while sprinting be just like the airborne class on call of duty? Just saying. Those mechanics don’t belong in halo.

> 2535435109040224;16179:
> > 2533274833081329;16177:
> > > 2535444702990491;16176:
> > > > 2533274801176260;16175:
> > > > > 2535444702990491;16136:
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > 2547348539238747;16140:
> > > > > > 2535444702990491;16131:
> > > > > > > 2533274833081329;16130:
> > > > > > > > 2535441152633368;16124:
> > > > > > > > I tried playing HaloCE the other day and it was like master chief and the warthog were towing a boat anchor. My thumbs got sore from jamming the stick forward hoping he’d move just a little faster. Not to mention watching the marines at the beginning of Halo 3 clamber up the side of a cliff while Chief has to crouch hop jump along the creek was a little depressing.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I’m still waiting for you to show me how the Marines are running faster than you, when it’s clear that it’s the opposite. Johnson told the marines to climb that rock wall and you to go the other way for a reason.
> > > >
> > > > Sprint speed was always the same 10.75m/s ever since it’s introduction in Reach. (Which ironically is slower than 12m/s, the Spartans’ highest documented running speed at which they are still able to shoot precisely. So much for lore consistency.)
> > >
> > > Great point. All they need to do in the next Halo then is slightly increase the speed of sprint to perfect it.
> >
> > And add the shooting part, otherwise it still wouldn’t be very lore-consistent when super soldiers lose the ability to shoot.
>
> Wait…wouldn’t being able to shoot while sprinting be just like the airborne class on call of duty? Just saying. Those mechanics don’t belong in halo.

Well my implication was to make moving (almost) as fast as Sprinting, then you would just shoot regularly.

Basically CE-3, but like 5% faster.

Having a Sprint function and then a shoot while Sprinting function kinda defeats the purpose of regular movement.

> 2533274829213703;16167:
> > 2533274870445963;16166:
> > Halo returning to its roots wouldn’t save it, trust me. True, the current state of Halo is unhealthy but the factors involved are more expanse than simple gameplay gimmicks like sprint, or the artstyle. Recognize that Halo as a franchise will be 17 years old November this year. Halo is very old.
> >
> > Halo’s decline is more a result of fatigue of a franchise that’s had it’s glory days come and gone. 343i’s innovations and additions are not to blame, rather it’s the communal desire to go nearly a decade back in time amongst the peak of Halo 3. Everyone had an Xbox. Games were very limited in quantity. Halo stood on top for a long time because it was one of those games that were funded and developed the most. Halo sold the Xbox. Today, any game can do that. The standard previously set by classic Halos is constantly superceded and frequented that the milestone isn’t something so redeeming anymore. Today, even Indie developers can create small-time games with more fidelity and intricacies that outclass those of a decade ago. Every developer seems to have the money they need. This doesn’t necessarily mean Halo has declined, just that other games have caught up. This illustrates the illusion that Halo has become “generic” or “soulless”, just because new games are capable of competing. Halo still has a huge surplus of funding from Microsoft and it definitely shows; the most recent FPS installment, Halo 5, has so much intricate attention to detail, tuning, and collaborative efforts that regardless of whether you would identify it to be Halo whatsoever, it’s a great, well-rounded, meticulous game. The idea that Halo has become “generic” is the modern fundamentalism of First-Person-Shooters. As much as you want to say that it’s unique, it’s still an FPS. Halo isn’t “special” anymore, but it’s not like its lost that status, it’s because everything else has caught up.
>
> People really don’t give Halo the credit it deserves. Back in it’s “heyday” Halo went up against Call of Duty, battlefield, and the like, and won for years. Later years became 2nd and 3rd, but it was old then and Reach was not as well recieved due to things such as armor abilites and bloom.
>
> I’m genuinely surprised that Call of Duty hasn’t suffered such huge fatigue, if that was the issue, or Battlefield.
>
> Halo is “generic and soulless” because instead of doing things the Halo way, they decided to copy other games and their mechanics. Even ignoring sprint, there is spartan charge (5), QTEs (4), a form of ADS (5),…
>
> People want to go back a decade because that was the peak of Halo. Every Halo after 3 keeps on implementing changes to core gameplay. And no, I am not saying Halo can never change, rather the changes made should more of affect the sandbox, and not change the player.
>
> Everything else didn’t catch up to Halo, Halo compromised itself by making decisive changes to the core game.

Halo isn’t doing well because the Xbox one isn’t doing well halo I don’t know why you guys keep blaming halo down fall on 343. Yea they could have made halo 4 better and fixed mcc before hit came out but there are multiple factors that go into why halo isn’t populated. For example like I said before super smash bros and legend of Zelda are two of the best ( not the best two) franchises in gaming and they couldn’t revive a dead Wii U but Nintendo was smart and waited for a innovative switch and sold Zelda and the switch’s sold well because both Zelda and the switch was something new people don’t want the same old thing again part of the reason fortnite is successful plus it’s free what makes you think halo is going to revive halo 5 yea it will help the Xbox sell a few more copies.

factors that also contributed to low player count.

  1. fortnite ( there wasn’t a free to play and good game like this during halo prime)
  2. Xbox sold poorly (a franchise can’t revive a dead console)
  3. Halo mcc was plagued with bugs and was unplayable especially the multiplayer halos heart and soul. IVE seen videos telling people not to buy halo 5 for that reason.
  4. halo 5 a too competitive game (social and warzone. Shouldn’t be a sweat fest driving away casuals)

But halo 5 isn’t a bad game it wasn’t given enough time and was made at the wrong system at the wrong time if you know what I mean

i could go on for days

During halo 3 (prime)
nothing but good things were happening

> 2535447612273772;16181:
> > 2533274829213703;16167:
> > > 2533274870445963;16166:
> > > Halo returning to its roots wouldn’t save it, trust me. True, the current state of Halo is unhealthy but the factors involved are more expanse than simple gameplay gimmicks like sprint, or the artstyle. Recognize that Halo as a franchise will be 17 years old November this year. Halo is very old.
> > >
> > > Halo’s decline is more a result of fatigue of a franchise that’s had it’s glory days come and gone. 343i’s innovations and additions are not to blame, rather it’s the communal desire to go nearly a decade back in time amongst the peak of Halo 3. Everyone had an Xbox. Games were very limited in quantity. Halo stood on top for a long time because it was one of those games that were funded and developed the most. Halo sold the Xbox. Today, any game can do that. The standard previously set by classic Halos is constantly superceded and frequented that the milestone isn’t something so redeeming anymore. Today, even Indie developers can create small-time games with more fidelity and intricacies that outclass those of a decade ago. Every developer seems to have the money they need. This doesn’t necessarily mean Halo has declined, just that other games have caught up. This illustrates the illusion that Halo has become “generic” or “soulless”, just because new games are capable of competing. Halo still has a huge surplus of funding from Microsoft and it definitely shows; the most recent FPS installment, Halo 5, has so much intricate attention to detail, tuning, and collaborative efforts that regardless of whether you would identify it to be Halo whatsoever, it’s a great, well-rounded, meticulous game. The idea that Halo has become “generic” is the modern fundamentalism of First-Person-Shooters. As much as you want to say that it’s unique, it’s still an FPS. Halo isn’t “special” anymore, but it’s not like its lost that status, it’s because everything else has caught up.
> >
> > People really don’t give Halo the credit it deserves. Back in it’s “heyday” Halo went up against Call of Duty, battlefield, and the like, and won for years. Later years became 2nd and 3rd, but it was old then and Reach was not as well recieved due to things such as armor abilites and bloom.
> >
> > I’m genuinely surprised that Call of Duty hasn’t suffered such huge fatigue, if that was the issue, or Battlefield.
> >
> > Halo is “generic and soulless” because instead of doing things the Halo way, they decided to copy other games and their mechanics. Even ignoring sprint, there is spartan charge (5), QTEs (4), a form of ADS (5),…
> >
> > People want to go back a decade because that was the peak of Halo. Every Halo after 3 keeps on implementing changes to core gameplay. And no, I am not saying Halo can never change, rather the changes made should more of affect the sandbox, and not change the player.
> >
> > Everything else didn’t catch up to Halo, Halo compromised itself by making decisive changes to the core game.
>
> Halo isn’t doing well because the Xbox one isn’t doing well halo I don’t know why you guys keep blaming halo down fall on 343. Yea they could have made halo 4 better and fixed mcc before hit came out but there are multiple factors that go into why halo isn’t populated. For example like I said before super smash bros and legend of Zelda are two of the best ( not the best two) franchises in gaming and they couldn’t revive a dead Wii U but Nintendo was smart and waited for a innovative switch and sold Zelda and the switch’s sold well because both Zelda and the switch was something new people don’t want the same old thing again part of the reason fortnite is successful plus it’s free what makes you think halo is going to revive halo 5 yea it will help the Xbox sell a few more copies.
>
> factors that also contributed to low player count.
> 1) fortnite ( there wasn’t a free to play and good game like this during halo prime)
> 2) Xbox sold poorly (a franchise can’t revive a dead console)
> 3) Halo mcc was plagued with bugs and was unplayable especially the multiplayer halos heart and soul. IVE seen videos telling people not to buy halo 5 for that reason.
> 4) halo 5 a too competitive game (social and warzone. Shouldn’t be a sweat fest driving away casuals)
>
> But halo 5 isn’t a bad game it wasn’t given enough time and was made at the wrong system at the wrong time if you know what I mean
>
> i could go on for days
>
> During halo 3 (prime)
> nothing but good things were happening

The Xbox One selling poorly doesn’t explain how multiplatform games are beating Halo on it’s own console.

Fortnite was released in late 2017, that doesn’t explain 2016 and the first half of 2017.

I would expect people to be upset at the then-treatment of MCC considering how much it was swept under the rug so you would buy their new new game. Mix that with microtransactions, Campaign not being very good, and it’s sorry state at launch, it’s no wonder.

And the last one is attributed solely to Halo 5.

At the end of the day, this is the Sprint discussion thread, not the population discussion thread.

> 2535447612273772;16181:
> > 2533274829213703;16167:
> > > 2533274870445963;16166:
> > > Halo returning to its roots wouldn’t save it, trust me. True, the current state of Halo is unhealthy but the factors involved are more expanse than simple gameplay gimmicks like sprint, or the artstyle. Recognize that Halo as a franchise will be 17 years old November this year. Halo is very old.
> > >
> > > Halo’s decline is more a result of fatigue of a franchise that’s had it’s glory days come and gone. 343i’s innovations and additions are not to blame, rather it’s the communal desire to go nearly a decade back in time amongst the peak of Halo 3. Everyone had an Xbox. Games were very limited in quantity. Halo stood on top for a long time because it was one of those games that were funded and developed the most. Halo sold the Xbox. Today, any game can do that. The standard previously set by classic Halos is constantly superceded and frequented that the milestone isn’t something so redeeming anymore. Today, even Indie developers can create small-time games with more fidelity and intricacies that outclass those of a decade ago. Every developer seems to have the money they need. This doesn’t necessarily mean Halo has declined, just that other games have caught up. This illustrates the illusion that Halo has become “generic” or “soulless”, just because new games are capable of competing. Halo still has a huge surplus of funding from Microsoft and it definitely shows; the most recent FPS installment, Halo 5, has so much intricate attention to detail, tuning, and collaborative efforts that regardless of whether you would identify it to be Halo whatsoever, it’s a great, well-rounded, meticulous game. The idea that Halo has become “generic” is the modern fundamentalism of First-Person-Shooters. As much as you want to say that it’s unique, it’s still an FPS. Halo isn’t “special” anymore, but it’s not like its lost that status, it’s because everything else has caught up.
> >
> > People really don’t give Halo the credit it deserves. Back in it’s “heyday” Halo went up against Call of Duty, battlefield, and the like, and won for years. Later years became 2nd and 3rd, but it was old then and Reach was not as well recieved due to things such as armor abilites and bloom.
> >
> > I’m genuinely surprised that Call of Duty hasn’t suffered such huge fatigue, if that was the issue, or Battlefield.
> >
> > Halo is “generic and soulless” because instead of doing things the Halo way, they decided to copy other games and their mechanics. Even ignoring sprint, there is spartan charge (5), QTEs (4), a form of ADS (5),…
> >
> > People want to go back a decade because that was the peak of Halo. Every Halo after 3 keeps on implementing changes to core gameplay. And no, I am not saying Halo can never change, rather the changes made should more of affect the sandbox, and not change the player.
> >
> > Everything else didn’t catch up to Halo, Halo compromised itself by making decisive changes to the core game.
>
> Halo isn’t doing well because the Xbox one isn’t doing well halo I don’t know why you guys keep blaming halo down fall on 343. Yea they could have made halo 4 better and fixed mcc before hit came out but there are multiple factors that go into why halo isn’t populated. For example like I said before super smash bros and legend of Zelda are two of the best ( not the best two) franchises in gaming and they couldn’t revive a dead Wii U but Nintendo was smart and waited for a innovative switch and sold Zelda and the switch’s sold well because both Zelda and the switch was something new people don’t want the same old thing again part of the reason fortnite is successful plus it’s free what makes you think halo is going to revive halo 5 yea it will help the Xbox sell a few more copies.
>
> factors that also contributed to low player count.
> 1) fortnite ( there wasn’t a free to play and good game like this during halo prime)
> 2) Xbox sold poorly (a franchise can’t revive a dead console)
> 3) Halo mcc was plagued with bugs and was unplayable especially the multiplayer halos heart and soul. IVE seen videos telling people not to buy halo 5 for that reason.
> 4) halo 5 a too competitive game (social and warzone. Shouldn’t be a sweat fest driving away casuals)
>
> But halo 5 isn’t a bad game it wasn’t given enough time and was made at the wrong system at the wrong time if you know what I mean
>
> i could go on for days
>
> During halo 3 (prime)
> nothing but good things were happening

There’s 59 million active Xbox live members on Xbox. It has nothing to due with Xbox sales. If you can’t even keep a population of 50k out of even a 3rd of the 59 million somethings up.

> 2535444702990491;16176:
> > 2533274801176260;16175:
> > > 2535444702990491;16136:
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > > 2547348539238747;16140:
> > > > 2535444702990491;16131:
> > > > > 2533274833081329;16130:
> > > > > > 2535441152633368;16124:
> > > > > > I tried playing HaloCE the other day and it was like master chief and the warthog were towing a boat anchor. My thumbs got sore from jamming the stick forward hoping he’d move just a little faster. Not to mention watching the marines at the beginning of Halo 3 clamber up the side of a cliff while Chief has to crouch hop jump along the creek was a little depressing.
> > > > >
> > > > > I’m still waiting for you to show me how the Marines are running faster than you, when it’s clear that it’s the opposite. Johnson told the marines to climb that rock wall and you to go the other way for a reason.
> >
> > Sprint speed was always the same 10.75m/s ever since it’s introduction in Reach. (Which ironically is slower than 12m/s, the Spartans’ highest documented running speed at which they are still able to shoot precisely. So much for lore consistency.)
>
> Great point. All they need to do in the next Halo then is slightly increase the speed of sprint to perfect it.

I think you missed the part where they are able to shoot with maximum accuracy while sprinting, but Vegeto already pointed that out…

> 2535447612273772;16181:
> Halo isn’t doing well because the Xbox one isn’t doing well
>
> […]2) Xbox sold poorly (a franchise can’t revive a dead console)

H5G released at the same point in the lifespan of the XBone as Halo 3 released in relation to the 360 (roughly 1.5 - 2 years after its initial release).
At the time of both games respective releases, the XBone had already sold 15 million units while the 360 had sold “only” 13 million.
While Microsoft was no longer the top dog, with Sony leading the 8th console generation, the sales were nowhere near as horrible as to cause the franchise’s decline.