The sprint discussion thread

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> Couldn’t agree more. Sadly though, you’re likely going to get shot down for this opinion.

Idc If this gets shot down because the moderators know it’s the truth but they don’t want to hear it

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> > > Honestly guys this thread has been going on for a long time, don’t you have anything better to do with your time?
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> > Couldn’t agree more. Sadly though, you’re likely going to get shot down for this opinion.
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> Idc If this gets shot down because the moderators know it’s the truth but they don’t want to hear it

Not by the mods, man. By another force, one that you’ve likely seen around this thread…

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> > > > Honestly guys this thread has been going on for a long time, don’t you have anything better to do with your time?
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> > > Couldn’t agree more. Sadly though, you’re likely going to get shot down for this opinion.
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> > Idc If this gets shot down because the moderators know it’s the truth but they don’t want to hear it
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> Not by the mods, man. By another force, one that you’ve likely seen around this thread…

Who the Neo Nazis? Or the halo fan boys?

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> > > > > Honestly guys this thread has been going on for a long time, don’t you have anything better to do with your time?
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> > > > Couldn’t agree more. Sadly though, you’re likely going to get shot down for this opinion.
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> > > Idc If this gets shot down because the moderators know it’s the truth but they don’t want to hear it
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> > Not by the mods, man. By another force, one that you’ve likely seen around this thread…
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> Who the Neo Nazis? Or the halo fan boys?

Well, not the Klan or anything, but I think you already know who it is.

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If you’d been paying attention you’ll notice there’s already huge discussions about sprint and abilities in those forums.

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> > > > > > Honestly guys this thread has been going on for a long time, don’t you have anything better to do with your time?
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> > > > > Couldn’t agree more. Sadly though, you’re likely going to get shot down for this opinion.
> > > >
> > > > Idc If this gets shot down because the moderators know it’s the truth but they don’t want to hear it

There is nothing I haven’t seen before.

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> If you’d been paying attention you’ll notice there’s already huge discussions about sprint and abilities in those forums.

Yes, but this is the Sprint Discussion Thread. I think it’ll save a lot of effort to just have the mods move this one or just kill this thread in favor of the others. Keeping this on H5 just doesn’t make all that much sense.

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> This is a discussion forum. Are you really going to to criticize people for discussing something on it?
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> Isn’t that hypocritical of you? Don’t you have a series of posts here, with some as recently as the previous page?

Funny joke yeah hypocrite that’s what I am not only that I’m criticizing people by just saying 2 sentences

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> > If you’d been paying attention you’ll notice there’s already huge discussions about sprint and abilities in those forums.
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> Yes, but this is the Sprint Discussion Thread. I think it’ll save a lot of effort to just have the mods move this one or just kill this thread in favor of the others. Keeping this on H5 just doesn’t make all that much sense.

No point in moving over a 600+ page thread. No one wants to sift through that. If you want this to die then just let it die. You and the other guy revived it.

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> > > > If you guys are so passionate about sprint, isn’t it far more prudent to take this to the Infinite forums?
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> > > If you’d been paying attention you’ll notice there’s already huge discussions about sprint and abilities in those forums.
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> > Yes, but this is the Sprint Discussion Thread. I think it’ll save a lot of effort to just have the mods move this one or just kill this thread in favor of the others. Keeping this on H5 just doesn’t make all that much sense.
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> No point in moving over a 600+ page thread. No one wants to sift through that. If you want this to die then just let it die. You and the other guy revived it.

Even if I wasn’t here people would still be talking about this

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*Original post. Click at your own discretion.

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> > > > > If you guys are so passionate about sprint, isn’t it far more prudent to take this to the Infinite forums?
> > > >
> > > > If you’d been paying attention you’ll notice there’s already huge discussions about sprint and abilities in those forums.
> > >
> > > Yes, but this is the Sprint Discussion Thread. I think it’ll save a lot of effort to just have the mods move this one or just kill this thread in favor of the others. Keeping this on H5 just doesn’t make all that much sense.
> >
> > No point in moving over a 600+ page thread. No one wants to sift through that. If you want this to die then just let it die. You and the other guy revived it.
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> Even if I wasn’t here people would still be talking about this

Like it or not, this one here has a point!

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At least this isn’t as sad as the fortnite forums

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Hmm how long do you think a mod will come in and get triggered at me

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Looking past the crude verbiage, I’d give it a day if not a matter of hours.

Tread carefully.

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They think I’m a -Yoink!-

<mark>This stops now. Continue and it’s a straight up ban - outside the ones I’m about to hand out</mark>

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> “Muh emmersion” is far less important than solid gameplay.

I don’t have anything against this mindset. However I’m wondering if “immersion” lost something along the way.

The definition is kind of difficult to explain. We basically know what it means but putting words on it is a bit difficult. What does it mean to be “immersed”. A common answer I’d say would be something along the line of: “When you lose track if time because it feels like you’re in the game”, is the an adequate description? Perhaps.

How do you get that feeling from a piece if media entertainment? Is immersion experiences the same for games as they are with books? Does the same “criterias” for creating an immersive experience apply between different mediums? I don’t recall immersion being this “big thing” before, why has it cropped up now? Especially around the early stages of VR, even for non-VR stuff.

Google provided some articles regarding immersion. From what I could get from it, getting immersed in a game, or creating an immersive experience, is creating a rule-set which is consistent and makes sense in its own context, consistent visuals and audio, the atmosphere these create, how believable the game is when taken in its own context.

I find Minecraft to be immersive, yet Smite had a wall I couldn’t get past due to the many ridiculous, out if place skins for the characters.

How do you decide if something is immersive? This I think happen on a subconcious level, provided of course you do not actively work against it.

Solid gameplay is important, and I believe that is an ingredient for immersion, but not the only ingredient. Some ingredients may not work well with other ingredients to form an immersive experience, that’s also not taking into account the quality of them.

I’m going to draw parallells to attraction.
You’re not making concious decisions on wether or not you’re attracted to a person.
You may know some preferences, and name them. Doesn’t mean you may not end up attracted to a person lacking one or two of your known and named preferences. Or that you’ll be attracted to a person with all your known and named preferences.

Additionally - due to forum limitations it’s not possible to move this thread to another forum

I’m well aware that these arguments have probably already been made, but I want to lay out definitively where sprint helps and hurts halo, in my opinion:
Spirt is useful when traversing large maps without vehicles, such as Warzone. Sprint DOES have a place there, and I would say there alone.
The issue with sprint in BTB, Slayer, and most other forms of arena is that it makes vehicles rather useless. Why grab a mongoose if you can sprint across map?
while you CAN add more vehicles to a large map to make it more easily traveled, you can’t remove sprint from a small one. Furthermore, sprint makes radar useless. It’s nearly impossible for me to anticipate someone flying around a corner to spartan charge or assassinate me if I briefly look away from radar. No sprint simply gives me more time to make strategic, well thought out gameplay decisions instead of getting into a fly-arround-the-map fest.
However, some will argue that it’s possible to have both a sprint and no sprint halo game, two gamemodes. This is flawed for a few reasons. 1. Campaign, especially legendary campaign, is designed (now) with sprint in mind. This means that enemies are incredibly strong and overwhelming in number and damage, reducing many spots in levels to bullet sponge boss fights with little to no choice involved. Halo single player is like chess. Each weapon has strengths and weaknesses that can be carefully utilized. Sprint absolutely ruins even design by essentially allowing you to outrun and outmaneuver any enemy- level design and choice no longer matters. This is complicated; there are videos published by LNG, HiddenXperia, etc. that explain this better.
2. Halo throwback playlists, as they are today, are still somewhat broken. ADS on ARs is ridiculous, but that’s another debate. Bullet magnetism, meant to counter the sprint-behind-cover chicken strategy that’s so effective in normal arena, is so infuriating in throwback playlists. Maps designed to work with sprint just don’t play well with it not in mind. Weapon balancing, meant for sprint gameplay, simply feels off in normal gameplay.
3. The argument “if you don’t like it, don’t use it” is boneheaded. I don’t like it because everyone can use it; I’m not going to feel much better if I’m the only one not flying around the map when it gives people such a game breaking advantage. It truly is game breaking. Just because everyone can do it and it’s fair and balanced doesn’t make it good. Look at games like Madden and the more broken NBA 2ks- there are mechanics everyone CAN DO, but just because everyone can do it and it’s fair and balanced doesn’t make it FUN or strategic.
4. Some will argue they feel like a turtle with a gun without sprint- this is likely a effect of playing the modern, 343 Halo games, which focus on balancing sprint (while limited in Halo 4) with lots of bullet spongey enemies with large damage output (cough prometheans cough). Essentially, if you gave Halo 2’s jackal snipers more health and had more of them. Play Halo CE or 3 (I’d skip 2 because of it’s admittedly broken campaign) and come back to me about being a turtle with a gun. I tried to speed run levels in those games with success: mind you, I had no sprint.
5. The worst argument I’ve heard is “You had halo for 10 years, let us have ours.”
What? Why is there a us and we? How about us, all of us? We’ve tried sprint and it didn’t go over particularly well as far as level and game design go, so can all of us maybe discuss this without making two sides?

I always think that if there’s a problem, you can complain all you want, but you need to propose a solution. Here’s mine:

  1. Sprint is now a campaign skull with a multiplier, able to be applied like all the other fun skulls like infinite ammo or the like. Therefore, in score-based campaign or for speed running, the game is put on the competitive, no sprint difficulty, but for those of us who want to run around, sprint is available , but not a feature the game is designed around. Same goes for clamber, spartan charge, ground pound, and thrust.
  2. In arena, there are two solutions: Two playlists with separate 343 and forge maps with separate weapon tunings OR:
    Something interesting such as a mechanic where you can sprint while you have full shields, but at no other time. Clambering stays, spartan charge is gone, thrust is still there (I guess, I’d like it to go but whatever, maybe make it a running speed burst instead of actual jetpack mechanics), and ground pound is gone. You cannot thrust with non-full shields.
    Weapons would be tuned more closely to Halo 3 with reduced bullet magnet, etc.

Oh, and PLEASE remove ADS on weapons without sights. ZOOM is fine and using the sights is fine, but increasing accuracy is not okay (Magnum, AR, BR (2x ZOOM is fine), Needler, Plasma pistol, rifle, SMG, Boltshot, shotguns, scattershots, I hope the storm rifle dies but if it stays that too, CE pistol, etc. Only DMRs, snipers, Carbines, Beam Rifles, Lightrifles, that weird looking promethean sniper whose name eludes me, SPNKR and Rocket launcher variants where lock on applies, and the Hydra should have true ADS features like better accuracy aimed down sights).3. In warzone, sprint stays largely as is due to the size of the maps and casual nature of gameplay.

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> Spirt is useful when traversing large maps without vehicles, such as Warzone. Sprint DOES have a place there, and I would say there alone.
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> The issue with sprint in BTB, Slayer, and most other forms of arena is that it makes vehicles rather useless. Why grab a mongoose if you can sprint across map?

343 made it so sprint was a necessity, but they can change that by adding more man cannons or teleporters. I also think with a higher BMS, moving around the map won’t be that much of a hassle.

Vehicles are still useful in BTB especially with objective modes. From my own playing, I’ve used a Mongoose plenty of times to get to the enemy base quicker.