I enjoy sprint and all the other athletic abilities that these Spartans can perform. It immerses me further into the game and I feel as if I am the Spartan. Halo CE had some pretty big maps and having the ability to sprint would have been super helpful. We managed by doing that goofy astronaut moon jump. Nah, sprint is good. After all we are 7 foot tall something genetically modified humans in these incredible human ability modifying suits… better be able to sprint.
> 2535441152633368;14686:
> I enjoy sprint and all the other athletic abilities that these Spartans can perform. It immerses me further into the game and I feel as if I am the Spartan. Halo CE had some pretty big maps and having the ability to sprint would have been super helpful. We managed by doing that goofy astronaut moon jump. Nah, sprint is good. After all we are 7 foot tall something genetically modified humans in these incredible human ability modifying suits… better be able to sprint.
Please. Stop. Using. This. Argument.
Halo primarily is a video game series, which means it’s primary function is to entertain via means of gameplay. If I’m not mistaken, this thread is 735 pages long, most of which is about how sprint doesn’t work in Halo’s gameplay regardless of lore reasons. And the last time I checked, Spartans were able to shoot while sprinting in the books.
> 2535417761739301;14658:
> Oh, of course. Nobody is trying to say that Halo 5 is a worse game than Halo 4.
I am. H5G to me is by far the worst of the entire series, even when compared to its predecessor. Whatever issues Halo 4 had, with ordnance drops, loadouts and preks, at least the moment-to-moment gameplay wasn’t as broken as it is now. Instead of fixing sprint, they made it infinite, thus exponentially increasing the issues it caused, and the small alibi-nerf, linking it to the shields basically does nothing. Meanwhile, including ADS now also introduces randomness in gunplay, so where previously “only” movement was inconsistent, shooting is now as well. Yes, I am fully aware that Halo 4 also had spread buffs, but only on a select few weapons, none of which were autos. Now it’s on every single gun. And when you f’d up movement and gunplay in a shooter, there’s not really much left that you can screw up…
> 2535409816624774;14660:
> > 2547348539238747;14659:
> > > 2535409816624774;14652:
> > > > 2535417761739301;14649:
> > > > > 2535409816624774;14648:
> > > > > > 2535417761739301;14647:
> > > > > > > 2535409816624774;14622:
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> > > > > > > > > > 2535409816624774;14615:
> > > > > > > > > > DOOM was not successful because it has little to no player base.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I find this logic silly because I can just point to H4’s population numbers and your “sprint makes Halo more successful” argument falls apart. It’s fine if you prefer sprint but there’s no need to make such claims. Player retention can fluctuate for an infinite number of reasons.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Well said
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Except it isn’t. Halo 4 flopped, but Halo 5 did not implementing the only mechanic that matters in this conversation. That is a nice fancy straw man,though. Almost fooled me for a second.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > http://www.vgchartz.com/game/82148/halo-5-guardians/ → 4.5M copies of Halo 5 soldhttp://www.vgchartz.com/game/51758/halo-4/ → **9.8M copies of Halo 4 sold.**Halo 5 did not sell even half as well as Halo 4 did. This argument is a straight up lie and people need to stop making it.
> > > > > > Halo’s largest drop in active players happened early in Halo 4’s history. People bought Halo 4, then decided that Halo 4 “wasn’t Halo” and left.
> > > > > > After that, when Halo 5 showed up with a gameplay format that was still definitely “not Halo”… many of those that left just didn’t buy it. They stayed away. Many of us who did buy Halo 5 bought it because, at the time, we’d buy anything with the Halo name on it.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Sprint or no sprint, Halo 5 does not offer the experience that most people buying a Halo title are looking for. The easiest way to remedy this problem is to stop adding pieces of other games to Halo like they’re Lego bricks, and just follow the formula that made Halo the king of FPS gaming in the first place.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > That means no thrusting and no sprinting. It means putting advanced movement options back on the map in the form of mancannons, pickups, vehicles, grav lifts, and teleporters, and it means bringing the focus back to social play instead of emphasizing an industry copying hyper-competitive sandbox.
> >
> >
> >
> > > 2535441687762024;14654:
> > > > 2547348539238747;14650:
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> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2535441687762024;14539:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > A testament to why we need sprint is the Halo 3 playlist that was going on. It just doesn’t work in 2016/2017…
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > You’re seriously basing your opinion, just on one playlist, and not the actual game that wasn’t built around Sprint? Wow. Just, wow.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > Stop bashing other peoples opinions because you dont agree. I, and a large majority of Halo fans, want sprint to stay based off of a poll 343i, the developers of Halo by the way, conducted.
> > > > > > > > > > > > I want it to stay because my favorite 3 games in the series have it and other PERSONAL reason surounding the feature.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > Here are a couple more OPINIONS about the subject. Feel free to bash them if you want.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > Does sprint make maps larger and give the illusion of speed while actually slowing down gameplay? Maybe, but who cares? The games are still fun.
> > > > > > > > > > > > Oh, you dont agree? Maybe because your OPINION differs from my own.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > Does sprint allow people to get away and provide a more chaotic play environment? Maybe, but who cares? The games are still fun.
> > > > > > > > > > > > Oh, you dont agree? Maybe because your OPINION differs from my own.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > THANK YOU!!! Its legit so hard to just express OPINIONS nowadays… Ridiculous
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Disregarding the above heated discussion, would you be prepared to flesh your initial statement out?
> > > > > > > > > > Here are some questions I feel would help me understand what you built your opinion on:
> > > > > > > > > > 1: How is one playlist void of mechanics the game was built upon, an indication of why sprint is needed?
> > > > > > > > > > 2: How is the current year any justification of a game mechanic? Why doesn’t no-sprint work in the current year?
> > > > > > > > > > 3: Are you implying that removing sprint will revert Halo back to Halo 3 in its entirety?
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Is this a better approach to understanding your statement? Which is essentially treycen’s initial goal, though a blunt approach.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > I don’t find it difficult to express my opinions.
> > > > > > > > > > However sometimes I may find it hard to explain my opinions, why I think the way I do aboit something. Generally I keep quiet if I can’t explain my opinions.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > FallenKnight, I’ll get back to you sometime later.
> > > > >
> > > > > I’m stating that not having sprint in games nowadays is wrong.
> > > >
> > > > Why?
>
> You have a lot of time on your hand, but I guess I have 14 days on Halo 5, so who am I to judge. I don’t know the exact numbers, but there are many big IPs such as Overwatch and Destiny, as well as Titanfall before that game dropped. There are also multiple Call of Duty games being played at any given time. I am referring to the overall landscape of multiplayer shooting games, which is definitely changing significantly.
The landscape is most definitely changing. But still, even during the Halo 3 days there were multiple COD titles knocking about on the top ten most played list.
Here’s the thing. Halo saw a decline in popularity with Halo Reach. (Halo 3 only lost the top spot during the third year) Halo Reach has the first big drop. Halo 4 had by far the worst drop the series has ever seen. Games like Overwatch, Destiny and Titanfall launched at least 2 years after Halo 4. People didn’t move away from Halo because there were new big franchises launching. The migration began before these games launched. And to this day, out of all the big franchises I mentioned, only Halo has suffered the way it has. COD, BF etc all still have huge communities that support the titles.
Why would players single out Halo?, why abandon just that one franchise and before Destiny had launched to replace it?, It wasn’t a case of other titles doing it better, it was a case of the newer Halo titles not providing the experience players wanted from the franchise. This caused players to leave, and for a huge space to be left open. Giving these new franchises a chance to stake their claim.
And given that players left after sprint was introduced, it clearly wasn’t the magical missing element from the franchise.
> 2533274968894951;14687:
> > 2535441152633368;14686:
> > I enjoy sprint and all the other athletic abilities that these Spartans can perform. It immerses me further into the game and I feel as if I am the Spartan. Halo CE had some pretty big maps and having the ability to sprint would have been super helpful. We managed by doing that goofy astronaut moon jump. Nah, sprint is good. After all we are 7 foot tall something genetically modified humans in these incredible human ability modifying suits… better be able to sprint.
>
> Please. Stop. Using. This. Argument.
>
> Halo primarily is a video game series, which means it’s primary function is to entertain via means of gameplay. If I’m not mistaken, this thread is 735 pages long, most of which is about how sprint doesn’t work in Halo’s gameplay regardless of lore reasons. And the last time I checked, Spartans were able to shoot while sprinting in the books.
Its a valid argument. And sprint can work in Halo’s gameplay. Half of the main series has the ability, 3 of them being the most recent. Im not defending sprint or antisprint but you cant say someones argument is wrong just because you disagree with their opinion.
I do have a quick question though, and this may have already been asked but i haven seen it. If 343 were to leave sprint in the way it is now, 2 step process, unable to initiate while being shot, shields stay down in sprint, but make it to where your gun stays up would that be ok with the antisprinters?
> 2535409816624774;14660:
> You have a lot of time on your hand, but I guess I have 14 days on Halo 5, so who am I to judge. I don’t know the exact numbers, but there are many big IPs such as Overwatch and Destiny, as well as Titanfall before that game dropped. There are also multiple Call of Duty games being played at any given time. I am referring to the overall landscape of multiplayer shooting games, which is definitely changing significantly.
Overwatch came out about 7 months after Halo 5.
> 2533274816299345;14690:
> Its a valid argument. And sprint can work in Halo’s gameplay. Half of the main series has the ability, 3 of them being the most recent.
That once again raises the question if Reach counts as a main series game. As far as I (and a lot of people I’ve spoken to or seen YouTube videos of) am concerned, 343 took its gameplay inspiration from a spinoff that deliberately distanced itself from the core series in terms of gameplay, design, etc.
> 2533274816299345;14690:
> Im not defending sprint or antisprint but you cant say someones argument is wrong just because you disagree with their opinion.
For what it’s worth, I have disproven that argument multiple times already by showing proof of Spartans being able to run and shoot simultaneously, at speeds higher than sprint speed in the games. There’s nothing wrong with him enjoying sprint despite it contradicting preestablished canon, but you certainly cannot justify it with lore.
> 2533274816299345;14690:
> I do have a quick question though, and this may have already been asked but i haven seen it. If 343 were to leave sprint in the way it is now, 2 step process, unable to initiate while being shot, shields stay down in sprint, but make it to where your gun stays up would that be ok with the antisprinters?
Well, it certainly is the bare minimum that needs to happen for it to no longer break gameplay into “combat time” and “movement time”. Although it still fits the definition of “inconsistent gameplay”, it would have to be tested how well it works within the games.
> 2533274816299345;14690:
> > 2533274968894951;14687:
> > > 2535441152633368;14686:
> > > I enjoy sprint and all the other athletic abilities that these Spartans can perform. It immerses me further into the game and I feel as if I am the Spartan. Halo CE had some pretty big maps and having the ability to sprint would have been super helpful. We managed by doing that goofy astronaut moon jump. Nah, sprint is good. After all we are 7 foot tall something genetically modified humans in these incredible human ability modifying suits… better be able to sprint.
> >
> > Please. Stop. Using. This. Argument.
> >
> > Halo primarily is a video game series, which means it’s primary function is to entertain via means of gameplay. If I’m not mistaken, this thread is 735 pages long, most of which is about how sprint doesn’t work in Halo’s gameplay regardless of lore reasons. And the last time I checked, Spartans were able to shoot while sprinting in the books.
>
> Its a valid argument. And sprint can work in Halo’s gameplay. Half of the main series has the ability, 3 of them being the most recent. Im not defending sprint or antisprint but you cant say someones argument is wrong just because you disagree with their opinion.
>
> I do have a quick question though, and this may have already been asked but i haven seen it. If 343 were to leave sprint in the way it is now, 2 step process, unable to initiate while being shot, shields stay down in sprint, but make it to where your gun stays up would that be ok with the antisprinters?
So you can shoot while sprinting?
The advantage would be a boost in forward speed only?
> 2533274816299345;14690:
> I do have a quick question though, and this may have already been asked but i haven seen it. If 343 were to leave sprint in the way it is now, 2 step process, unable to initiate while being shot, shields stay down in sprint, but make it to where your gun stays up would that be ok with the antisprinters?
To be honest, I just don’t see the point.
You see, the issue for me is that, all the effects of sprint aside, it’s just not a fun ability. You’ll have to understand that from the perspective of someone who’s against sprint, it’s not an ability that allows you to do more. It’s just a list of restrictions on what you can do while running at full speed. That is, instead of just being able to run at full speed without worrying, you’re suggesting that:
- I wouldn’t be able to run at full speed while being shot at, - my shields wouldn’t recharge while running at full speed, - I couldn’t run at full speed in every direction.This doesn’t sound fun. This is just a list of frustrating restrictions on my ability to move in a game that is all about moving.
There is just no implementation of sprint that I find tolerable. The more you restrict it, the more frustrating it becomes to use. On the other hand, if you try to make it less like sprint—that is, if you allow players to shoot while using it—then it just feels ever more like there’s this completely artifical list of restrictions on what I can do when running at full speed. Why not just give me full freedom?
After some help regarding sprint not sure if it’s a bug or just my controller setup (have a brand new controller this has been happening across multiple conteollers) but almost half the time I click in my stick to sprint and it doesn’t go and have to click it in another once or twice or If I get shot at any point I lose my sprint and can’t start it back up yet I get spartan charged no matter how many bullets i put into people (side note I am playing from Australia and my ping is brutal it runs between 250-650 on any given match ) and helps or advice would be appreciated
Sprint needs to be removed period. Go back to Halo 2s movement speeds. They were perfect.
> 2533274816299345;14690:
> I do have a quick question though, and this may have already been asked but i haven seen it. If 343 were to leave sprint in the way it is now, 2 step process, unable to initiate while being shot, shields stay down in sprint, but make it to where your gun stays up would that be ok with the antisprinters?
What’s the point of not Sprinting then? You would be Sprinting every chance you get just because it gives you every advantage not Sprinting would give you.
You’re basically 95% of the way there to removing Sprint and increasing the BMS to what Sprint is. Why not take that last step?
You didn’t even really solve all the problems with Sprint. It still only works in one direction, and your speed only increases in one direction: forwards. Bullets and explosions are still gonna be really large and really accurate, because they have to hit Sprinting opponents and are therefore too effective against not Sprinting opponents.
> 2533274816299345;14690:
> > 2533274968894951;14687:
> > > 2535441152633368;14686:
> > > I enjoy sprint and all the other athletic abilities that these Spartans can perform. It immerses me further into the game and I feel as if I am the Spartan. Halo CE had some pretty big maps and having the ability to sprint would have been super helpful. We managed by doing that goofy astronaut moon jump. Nah, sprint is good. After all we are 7 foot tall something genetically modified humans in these incredible human ability modifying suits… better be able to sprint.
> >
> > Please. Stop. Using. This. Argument.
> >
> > Halo primarily is a video game series, which means it’s primary function is to entertain via means of gameplay. If I’m not mistaken, this thread is 735 pages long, most of which is about how sprint doesn’t work in Halo’s gameplay regardless of lore reasons. And the last time I checked, Spartans were able to shoot while sprinting in the books.
>
> Its a valid argument. And sprint can work in Halo’s gameplay. Half of the main series has the ability, 3 of them being the most recent. Im not defending sprint or antisprint but you cant say someones argument is wrong just because you disagree with their opinion.
Again, it’s not his opinion that’s the problem, it’s the fact that his opinion is based on something so flimsy and paper thin.
Half the main series having the ability doesn’t make it a good thing. We had Loadouts for 2 games but that didn’t stop us from removing it. It really just shows that we’re too adamant to remove Sprint despite the problem it brings. For a game series everyone complains that it should be “evolving”, we sure don’t want to evolve past Sprint. What are they to say now?
You say Sprint works with Halo’s gameplay, but again you still haven’t shown how that wasn’t already discussed. We have 3 games that show Sprint doesn’t work with Halo’s gameplay.
Yes, an argument can be wrong, if the thing the argument is based on is wrong as well.
> 2533274816299345;14690:
> > 2533274968894951;14687:
> > > 2535441152633368;14686:
> > > I enjoy sprint and all the other athletic abilities that these Spartans can perform. It immerses me further into the game and I feel as if I am the Spartan. Halo CE had some pretty big maps and having the ability to sprint would have been super helpful. We managed by doing that goofy astronaut moon jump. Nah, sprint is good. After all we are 7 foot tall something genetically modified humans in these incredible human ability modifying suits… better be able to sprint.
> >
> > Please. Stop. Using. This. Argument.
> >
> > Halo primarily is a video game series, which means it’s primary function is to entertain via means of gameplay. If I’m not mistaken, this thread is 735 pages long, most of which is about how sprint doesn’t work in Halo’s gameplay regardless of lore reasons. And the last time I checked, Spartans were able to shoot while sprinting in the books.
>
> Its a valid argument.
No, it isn’t. There’s a reason why lore relatively has little to no control over how Spartans play in-game.
> And sprint can work in Halo’s gameplay. Half of the main series has the ability, 3 of them being the most recent.
Well, so far, it hasn’t worked out for those three games. What makes you think it will work in the next installment?
> 2533274806427910;14699:
> Well, so far, it hasn’t worked out for those three games. What makes you think it will work in the next installment?
I’d say it was used well in Reach as an ability with a cooldown. Halo 4 did it okayish because it wasn’t infinite sprint (ignoring the simple run-sprint-jump move that allowed infinite sprint)
However, I get tons of kills because people sprint everywhere with there guns unable to be at the ready. You still have to use it strategically to a small degree.
I’d be in favor of sprint, but not infinite sprint. I think Reach did sprint the best and they should move back that direction.
I also think it is a fallacy that 343 can’t go backwards with these abilities and go back to old play style. Some have said that once you make these abilities, you have to keep them in future games, but 343 and bungie have taken away and added things back and forth each new game.
> 2533274833081329;14698:
> We have 3 games that show Sprint doesn’t work with Halo’s gameplay.
Those 3 games happen to be the best 3 games in the series in terms of multiplayer in my opinion because i felt more like a Spartan in those 3 games. So to me it does work.
> 2533274816299345;14701:
> > 2533274833081329;14698:
> > We have 3 games that show Sprint doesn’t work with Halo’s gameplay.
>
> Those 3 games happen to be the best 3 games in the series in terms of multiplayer in my opinion because i felt more like a Spartan in those 3 games. So to me it does work.
343 can’t even keep it consistent so I would say it has yet to work. If something really works it tends to be left alone so as to not ruin it. This is why people think it’s forced as 343 will try to make it work any way they can think of.
If 343 are having to “balance” out sprint, that should be pretty evident that it hasn’t worked. I’m quite curious how H6 will rework it as I’ll be bringing up my same points when I see it. Sprint will not work with a game designed with a long ttk. Even H5s sprint has ticked off people who DO prefer sprint because of the punishment for using it, the only thing different to halos sprint compared to others.
> 2533274955181440;14700:
> > 2533274806427910;14699:
> > Well, so far, it hasn’t worked out for those three games. What makes you think it will work in the next installment?
>
> I’d say it was used well in Reach as an ability with a cooldown. Halo 4 did it okayish because it wasn’t infinite sprint (ignoring the simple run-sprint-jump move that allowed infinite sprint)
Reach’s Sprint - elongated maps, inability to fire your gun while sprinting, a “get-out-of-jail” card.
Halo 4’s Sprint - elongated maps, inability to fire your gun while sprinting, a “get-out-of-jail” card.
See a pattern, here? Sprint wasn’t implemented well in Reach, and it certainly wasn’t “okayish” in Halo 4. The problem with Halo 5’s Sprint isn’t only that it’s infinite, it’s the fact that it’s been proven three times, now, that Sprint fundamentally changes the core gameplay of Halo. It gives people the illusion that the game is sped up, it slows down the TTK, it disrupts the map flow… Should I go on?
> However, I get tons of kills because people sprint everywhere with there guns unable to be at the ready. You still have to use it strategically to a small degree.
There isn’t any strategy in knowing when to “not Sprint” because it’s a basic, common sense.
> 2533274816299345;14701:
> > 2533274833081329;14698:
> > We have 3 games that show Sprint doesn’t work with Halo’s gameplay.
>
> Those 3 games happen to be the best 3 games in the series in terms of multiplayer in my opinion because i felt more like a Spartan in those 3 games. So to me it does work.
And here we come back to “in your opinion”
Your opinion means nothing to anyone but yourself. You can’t quantify how good it is because all you give are subjective statements.
And again with “I felt more like a Spartan”. This is where I come back to my previous statement that wasn’t answered.
> 2533274833081329;14617:
> You can’t balance a game entirely around lore, especially this franchise. It just doesn’t work. The only reason people use this argument is because it fits their narrative to justify Sprint in the first place. Suddenly these “lore” based super soldiers lost the ability to run and shoot at the same time?
>
> Notice how none of those people have anything to say about ADS and how it brings a gun to your face for aiming, despite the fact that it’s already established that their visor does the zooming for them so they don’t have to manually aim the gun? It just doesn’t make sense.
Like time I checked, Spartans were able to shoot and run at the same time. Last time I checked, Spartans can handle the recoil of a Pistol without it going wildly out of control.
You can call Halo Reach-5 the best in the series all you want, but you consider it the best despite Sprint’s problems, not because of them. The fact that 343i needs three different balances of Sprint (and the fact that 343i created NSNB Reach in the first place) says it all.
> 2533274806427910;14703:
> > 2533274955181440;14700:
> > > 2533274806427910;14699:
> > > Well, so far, it hasn’t worked out for those three games. What makes you think it will work in the next installment?
> >
> > I’d say it was used well in Reach as an ability with a cooldown. Halo 4 did it okayish because it wasn’t infinite sprint (ignoring the simple run-sprint-jump move that allowed infinite sprint)
>
> Reach’s Sprint - elongated maps, inability to fire your gun while sprinting, a “get-out-of-jail” card.
>
> Halo 4’s Sprint - elongated maps, inability to fire your gun while sprinting, a “get-out-of-jail” card.
>
> See a pattern, here? Sprint wasn’t implemented well in Reach, and it certainly wasn’t “okayish” in Halo 4. The problem with Halo 5’s Sprint isn’t only that it’s infinite, it’s the fact that it’s been proven three times, now, that Sprint fundamentally changes the core gameplay of Halo. It gives people the illusion that the game is sped up, it slows down the TTK, it disrupts the map flow… Should I go on?
>
>
> > However, I get tons of kills because people sprint everywhere with there guns unable to be at the ready. You still have to use it strategically to a small degree.
>
> There isn’t any strategy in knowing when to “not Sprint” because it’s a basic, common sense.
Alright man. I see your points. All im saying is that reach implemented it the best out of the 3. It also takes strategy to use any game mechanic effectively. Most of the time people dont use it as a get out of jail free card, and instead as a speedy way into a battle and die quick. I agree with your points that it disrupts map flow and speed and i even believe it should be fixed or taken out too. Im not a sprint supporter, i barely use it in fact. I was just pointing out that Reach used it the best so far, and that many use it ineffectively anyways.