There was a sprint survey that josh holmes(former studio head of 343) that he posted I think on waypoint,team beyond,reddit etc where he asked if sprint should be i halo 5 after the beta release I believe, and most people voted no, 75% voted no,11%yes i think
> 2533274871425050;13664:
> There was a sprint survey that josh holmes(former studio head of 343) that he posted I think on waypoint,team beyond,reddit etc where he asked if sprint should be i halo 5 after the beta release I believe, and most people voted no, 75% voted no,11%yes i think
That’s insane. I really hope that Halo 6 is being developed without sprint, because if not, they’re just blatantly disregarding the community, which actually up until this point I think they’ve been doing a really good job on. I don’t see any reason as to why 343 would go through this again. I don’t see any pro-sprint people getting super upset about it not being included as long as base movement speed is increased. I feel like a lot of people (not everyone) that are pro-sprint haven’t really played any fps without sprint extensively. There’s really no reason to put sprint in halo 6, even to try and draw players in. Just look at CS:GO and Overwatch. Two of the largest fps games around, and both don’t have sprint. Tossing sprint in games that don’t need it is gimmicky and pointless. Call of Duty is dying, and games without sprint are flourishing more than ever. I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again: People like games that do their own thing. Nobody wants to play a game that just throws in popular mechanics from other games for no reason.
> 2535428931873471;13665:
> > 2533274871425050;13664:
> > There was a sprint survey that josh holmes(former studio head of 343) that he posted I think on waypoint,team beyond,reddit etc where he asked if sprint should be i halo 5 after the beta release I believe, and most people voted no, 75% voted no,11%yes i think
>
> That’s insane. I really hope that Halo 6 is being developed without sprint, because if not, they’re just blatantly disregarding the community, which actually up until this point I think they’ve been doing a really good job on. I don’t see any reason as to why 343 would go through this again. I don’t see any pro-sprint people getting super upset about it not being included as long as base movement speed is increased. I feel like a lot of people (not everyone) that are pro-sprint haven’t really played any fps without sprint extensively. There’s really no reason to put sprint in halo 6, even to try and draw players in. Just look at CS:GO and Overwatch. Two of the largest fps games around, and both don’t have sprint. Tossing sprint in games that don’t need it is gimmicky and pointless. Call of Duty is dying, and games without sprint are flourishing more than ever. I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again: People like games that do their own thing. Nobody wants to play a game that just throws in popular mechanics from other games for no reason.
spot on,.iM 90% sure all future halos(excluding a classic halo title)would not have sprint cause once again josh said at one point(at this point players are “expected to be able to sprint at this point” which is just bull.Halo should have stayed classic so if you want to play slow paced methodical game you pick halo,fast paced destiny,titanfall,cod etc)and frank o connor may have said all future halos will use halo 5 mechanics as foundation.Yeah look at cs go,the game may be on pc its kept the same mechanics and is very popular,imagine if they change its so much(like bungie started but that 343 continued)that it splits the playerbase) in cs go too.Halo should stop trying to appeal to other games like cod with these mechanics and innovate on them,be its own unique thing
> 2533274871425050;13666:
> spot on,.iM 90% sure all future halos(excluding a classic halo title)would not have sprint cause once again josh said at one point(at this point players are “expected to be able to sprint at this point” which is just bull.Halo should have stayed classic so if you want to play slow paced methodical game you pick halo,fast paced destiny,titanfall,cod etc)and frank o connor may have said all future halos will use halo 5 mechanics as foundation.Yeah look at cs go,the game may be on pc its kept the same mechanics and is very popular,imagine if they change its so much(like bungie started but that 343 continued)that it splits the playerbase) in cs go too.Halo should stop trying to appeal to other games like cod with these mechanics and innovate on them,be its own unique thing
Yeah, with COD dying it’s not like that’s the playerbase to appeal to. I’d say Halo might as well just do it’s own thing, and do it well. I hope that 343 has realized that they need to innovate rather than imitate, because if classes/heroes come to Halo I just won’t be able to bring myself to play.
The sad reality is that, despite all the arguments, sprint is not going to get removed. 343 and Microsoft actually take pride in Halo 5’s mobility system, no matter how flawed it is. This thread has shown us that anti-sprinters have without any doubt won the debate, but this sadly isn’t going to change anything. Maybe an even more nerfed sprint, but that’ll be it.
> 2533274968894951;13668:
> The sad reality is that, despite all the arguments, sprint is not going to get removed. 343 and Microsoft actually take pride in Halo 5’s mobility system, no matter how flawed it is. This thread has shown us that anti-sprinters have without any doubt won the debate, but this sadly isn’t going to change anything. Maybe an even more nerfed sprint, but that’ll be it.
Unless 6 flops for gameplay, maybe then.
Hope this mobility trend dies as well.
> 2533274968894951;13668:
> The sad reality is that, despite all the arguments, sprint is not going to get removed. 343 and Microsoft actually take pride in Halo 5’s mobility system, no matter how flawed it is. This thread has shown us that anti-sprinters have without any doubt won the debate, but this sadly isn’t going to change anything. Maybe an even more nerfed sprint, but that’ll be it.
I can’t speak for all anti-sprint players, but personally I don’t necessarily think it needs to be removed (although that would be the simplest option.)
I just think it needs to be limited - i.e. you have stamina and can’t sprint forever. The problem with unlimited sprinting is that it forcefully increases the pace of the game, and consequently forces map sizes to be larger to compensate for higher distance-traveled.
Unlimited sprinting also has other negative consequences: - The Radar is much worse at warning you of incoming danger. Because people move much faster, they appear on your radar for less time before being next to you. This problem was already bad, but it was made much worse by crippling the radar to 18 meters (down from 25 or 30 meters). - Spartan Charge is frustrating. It’s not the charge itself, it’s all the blind spots you have which makes it difficult to handle. Blind spots were never a thing in previous games because the radius of the radar was much greater. If you had less blind spots and sprinting became limited, then Spartan Charge would be easier to dodge and therefore less problematic when it comes to cheap kills. By the time someone shows on my radar they’ve probably already smashed into my spine.I actually considered that if Spartan Charge came with a slightly longer melee cooldown than normal Melee attacks, that could help as well (it would create more double-beatdown situations.)
> 2533274823779352;13670:
> > 2533274968894951;13668:
> > The sad reality is that, despite all the arguments, sprint is not going to get removed. 343 and Microsoft actually take pride in Halo 5’s mobility system, no matter how flawed it is. This thread has shown us that anti-sprinters have without any doubt won the debate, but this sadly isn’t going to change anything. Maybe an even more nerfed sprint, but that’ll be it.
>
> I can’t speak for all anti-sprint players, but personally I don’t necessarily think it needs to be removed (although that would be the simplest option.)
>
> I just think it needs to be limited-
And it was in Reach, it was also selectable among other possible abilities, and it was STILL complained and talked about. It has not stopped.
You can’t fix sprint when sprint itself is the problem.
> 2533274808578327;13671:
> And it was in Reach, it was also selectable among other possible abilities, and it was STILL complained and talked about. It has not stopped.
>
> You can’t fix sprint when sprint itself is the problem.
I didn’t play Reach too much honestly as I was busy with life, but to be honest I never found it to be much of a problem in gameplay (though aforementioned my knowledge is limited.) Was there a specific reason it was hated in Halo: Reach?
I remember the hatred for Armour Lock and Camouflage though. I actually found those fun, but they were highly unbalanced.
> 2533274823779352;13672:
> > 2533274808578327;13671:
> > And it was in Reach, it was also selectable among other possible abilities, and it was STILL complained and talked about. It has not stopped.
> >
> > You can’t fix sprint when sprint itself is the problem.
>
> I didn’t play Reach too much honestly as I was busy with life, but to be honest I never found it to be much of a problem in gameplay (though aforementioned my knowledge is limited.) Was there a specific reason it was hated in Halo: Reach?
Because it’s too good, at least Bungie had the know how that being able to move faster in Halo’s gameplay is huge so they make it a choice among others.
An idea not shared by 343 however, which made it a permanent addition to the player with Halo 4, and then expanding on it more and making it unlimited in 5 despite arguments still going on.
They even acknowledge the debate in a video prior to the release of 5 showcasing it’s development. “We know a lot of players think sprint has no place in Halo, so here, we’ll still try to expand, balance and make it better”.
> 2533274823779352;13670:
> > 2533274968894951;13668:
> > The sad reality is that, despite all the arguments, sprint is not going to get removed. 343 and Microsoft actually take pride in Halo 5’s mobility system, no matter how flawed it is. This thread has shown us that anti-sprinters have without any doubt won the debate, but this sadly isn’t going to change anything. Maybe an even more nerfed sprint, but that’ll be it.
>
> I can’t speak for all anti-sprint players, but personally I don’t necessarily think it needs to be removed (although that would be the simplest option.)
>
> I just think it needs to be limited - i.e. you have stamina and can’t sprint forever. The problem with unlimited sprinting is that it forcefully increases the pace of the game, and consequently forces map sizes to be larger to compensate for higher distance-traveled.
>
> Unlimited sprinting also has other negative consequences: - The Radar is much worse at warning you of incoming danger. Because people move much faster, they appear on your radar for less time before being next to you. This problem was already bad, but it was made much worse by crippling the radar to 18 meters (down from 25 or 30 meters). - Spartan Charge is frustrating. It’s not the charge itself, it’s all the blind spots you have which makes it difficult to handle. Blind spots were never a thing in previous games because the radius of the radar was much greater. If you had less blind spots and sprinting became limited, then Spartan Charge would be easier to dodge and therefore less problematic when it comes to cheap kills. By the time someone shows on my radar they’ve probably already smashed into my spine.I actually considered that if Spartan Charge came with a slightly longer melee cooldown than normal Melee attacks, that could help as well (it would create more double-beatdown situations.)
As someone who hates sprint, I’d preferably have no sprint at all or unlimited sprint. If sprint has to be in the game, I’d rather not have the awkward clunky-ness of limited sprint. That being said, no sprint, faster base movement, slightly higher jump, thrusters, and a little less gravity is the smoothest possible gaming experience.
I understand your perspective; having limited sprint could be seen as a compromise with the devil.
I wonder if there’s a better way to handle Sprinting-Melee other than Spartan Charge?:
- What if the cooldown for Melee’ing after a Sprint was ever-so-slightly longer… - … Then, if your victim Melees you in retaliation before your Melee cooldown expires, your cooldown would match your victim’s; which would result in a lot more double-beatdowns? - **However, if your victim didn’t Melee you quickly enough in retaliation, you’d still get the kill.**I.E. - if you Melee someone whilst Sprinting, then your Melee cooldown becomes ever-so-slightly longer than usual; but if your victim Melees you in retaliation before your cooldown expires, then your melee cooldown will now match theirs, and you will both melee again at the same time. (Resulting in double beatdown.)
Obviously this would need heavy internal testing, but I think it’s a reasonable hypothesis? It sounds over-complicated, but under the hood it’s probably not something most players would even think about? Could be a neat way to subtly nerf sprinting-melee without making it pointless.
Though again, this really does address an issue that never existed when sprinting wasn’t a thing. =/
> 2533274823779352;13670:
> > 2533274968894951;13668:
> > The sad reality is that, despite all the arguments, sprint is not going to get removed. 343 and Microsoft actually take pride in Halo 5’s mobility system, no matter how flawed it is. This thread has shown us that anti-sprinters have without any doubt won the debate, but this sadly isn’t going to change anything. Maybe an even more nerfed sprint, but that’ll be it.
>
> I can’t speak for all anti-sprint players, but personally I don’t necessarily think it needs to be removed (although that would be the simplest option.)
>
> I just think it needs to be limited - i.e. you have stamina and can’t sprint forever. The problem with unlimited sprinting is that it forcefully increases the pace of the game, and consequently forces map sizes to be larger to compensate for higher distance-traveled.
>
> Unlimited sprinting also has other negative consequences: - The Radar is much worse at warning you of incoming danger. Because people move much faster, they appear on your radar for less time before being next to you. This problem was already bad, but it was made much worse by crippling the radar to 18 meters (down from 25 or 30 meters). - Spartan Charge is frustrating. It’s not the charge itself, it’s all the blind spots you have which makes it difficult to handle. Blind spots were never a thing in previous games because the radius of the radar was much greater. If you had less blind spots and sprinting became limited, then Spartan Charge would be easier to dodge and therefore less problematic when it comes to cheap kills. By the time someone shows on my radar they’ve probably already smashed into my spine.I actually considered that if Spartan Charge came with a slightly longer melee cooldown than normal Melee attacks, that could help as well (it would create more double-beatdown situations.)
Absolutely agree with the radar argument. I found myself almost never looking at the radar because people move faster than it can update. Without sprint you had some tense situations where you knew an enemy was around the corner and the enemy knew you were there too. It was like a stand-off from a western.
I made this video last night. There are many reasons sprint is a broken mechanic in Halo, and any attempt to balance sprint just further emphasizes the point. Sprint serves no purpose and is simply an illusion. Sprint slows down gameplay and breaks maps. Please watch, listen, and learn. If you have any issues with what I’ve said please let me know I’m eager to hear all viewpoints. Thanks for your time.
343i: Please remove sprint for the HCS and do not include sprint in Halo 6. You cannot give me any reason for it to be included based on it’s merit. Anything sprint can accomplish is accomplished better by increasing base movespeed. Sprint breaks Halo and ruin map design.
> 2533274925975862;13677:
> I made this video last night. There are many reasons sprint is a broken mechanic in Halo, and any attempt to balance sprint just further emphasizes the point. Sprint serves no purpose and is simply an illusion. Sprint slows down gameplay and breaks maps. Please watch, listen, and learn. If you have any issues with what I’ve said please let me know I’m eager to hear all viewpoints. Thanks for your time.
>
> 343i: Please remove sprint for the HCS and do not include sprint in Halo 6. You cannot give me any reason for it to be included based on it’s merit. Anything sprint can accomplish is accomplished better by increasing base movespeed. Sprint breaks Halo and ruin map design.
>
> Explaining Sprint - Clutchism - YouTube
I agree with not including sprint in Halo 6, but it would suck for the pros if they removed it from tournaments because they wouldn’t be able to practice well in the regular game (although they might just do scrimmages all the time, I’m not sure) Maybe they could add an MLG playlist for Slayer, Team Arena, and FFA? I know that I would play the hell out of that.
> 2535428931873471;13678:
> > 2533274925975862;13677:
> > I made this video last night. There are many reasons sprint is a broken mechanic in Halo, and any attempt to balance sprint just further emphasizes the point. Sprint serves no purpose and is simply an illusion. Sprint slows down gameplay and breaks maps. Please watch, listen, and learn. If you have any issues with what I’ve said please let me know I’m eager to hear all viewpoints. Thanks for your time.
> >
> > 343i: Please remove sprint for the HCS and do not include sprint in Halo 6. You cannot give me any reason for it to be included based on it’s merit. Anything sprint can accomplish is accomplished better by increasing base movespeed. Sprint breaks Halo and ruin map design.
> >
> > Explaining Sprint - Clutchism - YouTube
>
> I agree with not including sprint in Halo 6, but it would suck for the pros if they removed it from tournaments because they wouldn’t be able to practice well in the regular game (although they might just do scrimmages all the time, I’m not sure) Maybe they could add an MLG playlist for Slayer, Team Arena, and FFA? I know that I would play the hell out of that.
Pros have actually been begging for these changes for a long time, 343i is just too stubborn. The pros practice all the time and the time to make changes is now. It is currently between seasons. Now is the time to test and release new settings that are actually competitive. It breaks my heart that the largest two tournaments have pros running around with ARs. It’s embarrassing and insulting.
> 2533274925975862;13679:
> Pros have actually been begging for these changes for a long time, 343i is just too stubborn. The pros practice all the time and the time to make changes is now. It is currently between seasons. Now is the time to test and release new settings that are actually competitive. It breaks my heart that the largest two tournaments have pros running around with ARs. It’s embarrassing and insulting.
Yeah I feel like an MLG playlist for slayer, team arena, and FFA would be the way to go. There could be no sprint, no abilities except thrusters, increased base movement, higher jump height and less gravity so clamber could possibly be removed. I don’t think that there’s a good alternative to the AR as a secondary though, because the BR is too easy.
> 2535428931873471;13680:
> > 2533274925975862;13679:
> > Pros have actually been begging for these changes for a long time, 343i is just too stubborn. The pros practice all the time and the time to make changes is now. It is currently between seasons. Now is the time to test and release new settings that are actually competitive. It breaks my heart that the largest two tournaments have pros running around with ARs. It’s embarrassing and insulting.
>
> Yeah I feel like an MLG playlist for slayer, team arena, and FFA would be the way to go. There could be no sprint, no abilities except thrusters, increased base movement, higher jump height and less gravity so clamber could possibly be removed. I don’t think that there’s a good alternative to the AR as a secondary though, because the BR is too easy.
We just need one 4v4 playlist. Remove Radar. Remove Sprint. Magnum Only Starts. Remove Autos. Remove Splinters. Remove Plasma Caster. Remove Hydra.
> 2533274925975862;13681:
> > 2535428931873471;13680:
> > > 2533274925975862;13679:
> > > Pros have actually been begging for these changes for a long time, 343i is just too stubborn. The pros practice all the time and the time to make changes is now. It is currently between seasons. Now is the time to test and release new settings that are actually competitive. It breaks my heart that the largest two tournaments have pros running around with ARs. It’s embarrassing and insulting.
> >
> > Yeah I feel like an MLG playlist for slayer, team arena, and FFA would be the way to go. There could be no sprint, no abilities except thrusters, increased base movement, higher jump height and less gravity so clamber could possibly be removed. I don’t think that there’s a good alternative to the AR as a secondary though, because the BR is too easy.
>
> We just need one 4v4 playlist. Remove Radar. Remove Sprint. Magnum Only Starts. Remove Autos. Remove Splinters. Remove Plasma Caster. Remove Hydra.
That wont work very well, respectfully. Why? Because the maps are designed with these abilities in mind. E.g Sprint causes maps to be stretched out and cover is sparse compared to previous titles. This is to accomodate two varying movement speeds. As, if you remember with reach, a sprinting player with an energy sword was insane, as the maps were not adapted for this speed differential. Adjusting base speed helps (and is much more enjoyable, tried it myself) with sprint off would be ok, but again wont work too well due to the impact on map design from sprint and such.
EDIT: This may of caused confusion, quick clarification. No sprint with no tweaks=not work very well at all. No sprint with base speed increase-Fun, better than with sprint, however again wont work well due to map design for all spartan abilities. I.e clamber. Gravity tweaks can mitigate this, however we still have the issue of map stretching and other design balances for sprint/movement speed differential.
> 2533274875084332;13682:
> > 2533274925975862;13681:
> > > 2535428931873471;13680:
> > > > 2533274925975862;13679:
> > > > Pros have actually been begging for these changes for a long time, 343i is just too stubborn. The pros practice all the time and the time to make changes is now. It is currently between seasons. Now is the time to test and release new settings that are actually competitive. It breaks my heart that the largest two tournaments have pros running around with ARs. It’s embarrassing and insulting.
> > >
> > > Yeah I feel like an MLG playlist for slayer, team arena, and FFA would be the way to go. There could be no sprint, no abilities except thrusters, increased base movement, higher jump height and less gravity so clamber could possibly be removed. I don’t think that there’s a good alternative to the AR as a secondary though, because the BR is too easy.
> >
> > We just need one 4v4 playlist. Remove Radar. Remove Sprint. Magnum Only Starts. Remove Autos. Remove Splinters. Remove Plasma Caster. Remove Hydra.
>
> That wont work very well, respectfully. Why? Because the maps are designed with these abilities in mind. E.g Sprint causes maps to be stretched out and cover is sparse compared to previous titles. This is to accomodate two varying movement speeds. As, if you remember with reach, a sprinting player with an energy sword was insane, as the maps were not adapted for this speed differential. Adjusting base speed helps (and is much more enjoyable, tried it myself) with sprint off would be ok, but again wont work too well due to the impact on map design from sprint and such.
I know what you’re saying, but fortunately you’re wrong here. Maps on H5 work fine without sprint. I tested the movespeeds myself. You just have to increase the base movespeed. It does work.
https://twitter.com/masoncobb/status/846579140027297793