Also don’t use the word everyone. It’s a blanket word that is rarely if ever true. There are plenty of players on here and otherwise who enjoy having sprint so it’s not even close to being everyone. Once you start using blanket words without any verifiable stats to back it up people are automatically going to stop paying attention to the rest of your argument because their first thought will be “that’s not true” and from that point on there’s going to be a negative association with the rest of your argument.
> 2533274917158807;1292:
> > 2533274926527272;1263:
> > > 2533274801176260;1190:
> > > > 2533274839169051;1185:
> > > > Although H5G is still making money…thanks to the Req Packs?!?
> > > > It seems like the Halo community is just the core fans now.
> > > > A smaller but fanatic group who will be here to the end.
> > > > I honestly think there is no fix, sprint or non-sprint that brings back the glory days.
> > > > Removing sprint just feels like condemning the future to BR starts, Midship, Ascension and Lockout till the end of eternity.
> > >
> > >
> > > What does Req Packs have to do with gameplay mechanics?
> > > Don’t you think they could make money with microtransactions in a classic game all the same?
> > > Even so, how much money have they made through Reqs? A quick google search sais 1.5 Million in February. Let’s be generous and round that up to 2M by now.
> > > H5G has sold around 2.5 Million copies less than even ODST. With 60$ per copy (In the US, that is. Here in Europe, I’m paying 80€ for any new game release) that alone accounts for 150 Million Dollars less revenue than the next-best-selling Halo title, which even was a spinoff-title. The difference only gets worse when you compare it to Halo 4 or Reach. Those few bucks from Reqs are peanuts compared to that.
> >
> >
> > Halo 5 sold over five million copies. Try again.
>
>
> If you honestly think 343 is being truthful about Halo’s sales, I have some news for you…
And your proof against this notion is? Saying I have some news for you at the end of a statement your trying to make doesn’t make it true or stronger. It usually signifies you have nothing else to offer to that statement.
> 2533274917158807;1292:
> > 2533274926527272;1263:
> > > 2533274801176260;1190:
> > > > 2533274839169051;1185:
> > > > Although H5G is still making money…thanks to the Req Packs?!?
> > > > It seems like the Halo community is just the core fans now.
> > > > A smaller but fanatic group who will be here to the end.
> > > > I honestly think there is no fix, sprint or non-sprint that brings back the glory days.
> > > > Removing sprint just feels like condemning the future to BR starts, Midship, Ascension and Lockout till the end of eternity.
> > >
> > >
> > > What does Req Packs have to do with gameplay mechanics?
> > > Don’t you think they could make money with microtransactions in a classic game all the same?
> > > Even so, how much money have they made through Reqs? A quick google search sais 1.5 Million in February. Let’s be generous and round that up to 2M by now.
> > > H5G has sold around 2.5 Million copies less than even ODST. With 60$ per copy (In the US, that is. Here in Europe, I’m paying 80€ for any new game release) that alone accounts for 150 Million Dollars less revenue than the next-best-selling Halo title, which even was a spinoff-title. The difference only gets worse when you compare it to Halo 4 or Reach. Those few bucks from Reqs are peanuts compared to that.
> >
> >
> > Halo 5 sold over five million copies. Try again.
>
>
> If you honestly think 343 is being truthful about Halo’s sales, I have some news for you…
They wouldn’t outright lie about a concrete statistic. And whatever news you have for me, Icarus, is probably not the most reliable. I seem to recall about a month ago, you trying to make an argument about Halo’s popularity by comparing Machinima views of a video that’s been out for eight years vs a couple months. Here is the counter to that, in case you missed it.
> 2533274917158807;1298:
> > 2535471109694535;1296:
> > > 2533274917158807;1292:
> > > > 2533274926527272;1263:
> > > > > 2533274801176260;1190:
> > > > > > 2533274839169051;1185:
> > > > > > Although H5G is still making money…thanks to the Req Packs?!?
> > > > > > It seems like the Halo community is just the core fans now.
> > > > > > A smaller but fanatic group who will be here to the end.
> > > > > > I honestly think there is no fix, sprint or non-sprint that brings back the glory days.
> > > > > > Removing sprint just feels like condemning the future to BR starts, Midship, Ascension and Lockout till the end of eternity.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > What does Req Packs have to do with gameplay mechanics?
> > > > > Don’t you think they could make money with microtransactions in a classic game all the same?
> > > > > Even so, how much money have they made through Reqs? A quick google search sais 1.5 Million in February. Let’s be generous and round that up to 2M by now.
> > > > > H5G has sold around 2.5 Million copies less than even ODST. With 60$ per copy (In the US, that is. Here in Europe, I’m paying 80€ for any new game release) that alone accounts for 150 Million Dollars less revenue than the next-best-selling Halo title, which even was a spinoff-title. The difference only gets worse when you compare it to Halo 4 or Reach. Those few bucks from Reqs are peanuts compared to that.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Halo 5 sold over five million copies. Try again.
> > >
> > >
> > > If you honestly think 343 is being truthful about Halo’s sales, I have some news for you…
> >
> >
> > I used to have several links confirming this statement, but I lost them. I did read several places where they show they total sales, but they are not accurate because they don’t count digital sales, and that is how a lot of people buy games now.
>
>
> What do you mean “confirming”? 343 has proven to be the most untrustworthy and corrupt game development company, IMO. Even an ‘official’ statement from Microsoft I’d take with a grain of salt. 343 and MS want people to believe Halo 5 is still doing great, buy why is there no multiplayer population counter to show off Halo’s high player count, and why is Halo 6 rumored to come to the PC if Halo’s sales are so fantastic?
Halos always been rumored to go to pc and has been done before with the originals. Also I can actually believe h5 has 5 million in sales cuz 343 would brag about their sales if it were closer to h4, reach and h3s range but 5 mill difference isn’t brag worthy, instead they bragged about their player retention a while back which people can choose to believe or not to.
to pop counter: many popular games don’t have them, over whatch? (Although I personally would wait to see if it has longevity to it before even comparing it to other games), doom? The pop counter never meant much to me as I still played whatever I wanted regardless of playlist pop and then there are some who feel the need to change playlists simply cuz their own playlist is less populated. It doesn’t hurt having it but it really doesn’t mean anything either if you don’t have it.
> 2535471109694535;1293:
> > 2533274819567236;1283:
> > > 2533274809738692;1273:
> > > I again don’t know if anyone has responded to this, but the reason these maps seem so big is due to all the new movement mechanics. The whole point of this thread is to blame one mechanic on how the maps are and how this one plays. You and I are truly on the same page here, I’m just trying to point out that sprint isn’t the sole reason for things in this game. And I also want to point out that if you were to increase base movement speed to the current top speed, it would have the same result as sprint and the other movement mechanics. It would also play completely different to what we are use to, even compared to the original trilogy days.
> >
> >
> > That isn’t entirely true. Sprint is the biggest factor in map size because it’s what allows you to travel the fastest, even in Halo 4 which lacked most of these other abilities the maps are larger. That’s talking horizontally. Vertically, the size is adjusted largely because of clamber.
> >
> > Increasing the base speed would play largely the same to the original trilogy because that’s exactly what the original trilogy allowed. The simple implementation of one player speed that never takes away you ability to use your weapons, grenades or melee (the Golden Triangle Halo is based on) has many positive effects. Maps no longer need to be made with the top speed in mind, which means smaller maps and less cover in large open areas. Combine that with always being allowed to move while keeping the golden triangle in effect means that encounters are more frequents, there’s less cover on the map (because there’s no huge open areas for sprint), which allows for more open map design and that encourages more offensive play rather than constantly getting behind cover. Offense and defense are one in the same which encourages smart play much more than choosing better offensive play or defensive play. When you remove sprint, all of those changes that could be made would theoretically even allow thruster to not be as much of a get out of jail free card. Less cover forces people to use thruster more intelligently (basically, imagine thrust on Halo 3’s level Guardian). Not only does sprint hold back the gameplay as a whole, it can even hold back the other abilities.
>
>
> That’s plain wrong, if base movement speed was increased, the reason for bigger maps or longer maps would be to accommodate for the base speed because theirs no way to interrupt it. You could say since Doom had increased movement speed and it plays pretty well, (my own example, you didn’t say it whatsoever) that it proves sprint unnecessary in modern FPS but those maps are extremely huge for an FPS, like I still play it and find it hard to kill people in clan arena, team deathmatch and freeze tag. Only reason it works is because you die rather fast.
>
> A huge factor in base speed, the speed at which you are killed. The faster the speed you are killed, the faster you should move to accommodate your low durability, but as we know, with shields Spartans could take a frag grenade’s explosion, so they can’t have the same movement speed as doom because it would be incredibly unbalance for people to run away and recover their shields while they flee. That’s why sprint is pretty good, because it works well with the durability of Spartans and prevents you from recovering your shield while fleeing or using it. There would be no way to nerf increased movement speed without killing what other hardcore halo vets call “what makes halo halo” and that would be worse than adding sprint.
>
> I do agree with the people saying that they should add classic playlists to arena that remove all of the new abiities and let you play like the old halos, but I do not agree with removing these abilities entirely. I think they should be further tweaked to fit in Halo and more balanced to prevent the abuse of these abilities (Spartan charge).
Maps would still probably be larger than maps from the original trilogy, but not by much. Keep in mind, I don’t think the base speed should be increased to the top sprint speed (I think I forgot to say that). Maybe the mid point between the Halo 5 base speed and top sprint speed. Halo 5’s maps are bigger than they would be without sprint because if a map were too small, sprint would break the map. Maps are too big with sprint precisely because you’re not always sprinting. Remove sprint and the maps are built for one constant speed, not the faster of multiple speeds.
You mention it working well in Doom because you die fast. That’s another problem the map design and movement abilties in Halo cause. In Halo 5, I believe kill times are shorter than they have been in recent installments, but the movement and map design cancels out how effective that should be. The kills times also need to be be made faster because of abilities that focus on defensive play, but in Halo 5, they weren’t made faster enough to accomadate that. I believe Halo CE still has the fastest kill times in the series and it obviously has no movement abilities.
You also say a faster base speed in Halo would be unbalanced because it would allow people to run away more. That’s simply not so. No sprint means everyones moving at a constant speed with the abilitiy to always be offensive. If someone runs away, you can pursue them without giving up your offensive capabilities, whereas with sprint, if someone sprints away (all they have to do is thrust behind a wall and sprint away) then you have two options if you want to pursue him: sprint after him without shooting or run after him at normal speed and risk losing him. He can easily get away because they game limits what you can do. As I said earlier, no sprint allows for offense and defense to be one in the same. If someone runs away now, you can pursue him at the same speed while still being offensive and shooting at him without risk of him outrunning you. The big difference is that people trying to get away more often than not now have to fight back while trying to flee instead of just fleeing. It forces engagements and allows for faster paced gameplay because of that.
> 2533274814988883;1295:
> I don’t see why people complain about sprint…
>
> It’s useful. If you have trouble killing so done because they use sprint… Then that’s your own fault… If you die because your using sprint… That’s also your own fault.
>
> Sprint itself has very little impact on the game
This is objectively wrong, which you would know if you had read any of the anti-sprint posts in this thread. Whether or not you think the impact is positive or negative, it is absolutely ignorant and inaccurate to say the sprint has had “very little impact on the game.” If that were the case, we wouldn’t have 6 years of threads like this one. So, basically, your opinion is meaningless. You fundamentally don’t understand the issue you’ve decided to weigh in on, which is pretty common on Waypoint.
> 2535419905163263;1300:
> Sprint is not bad for Halo. You are supposed to be a badass super solider spartan with -Yoink- armor, 500 years in the future. Sprinting is just moving your legs faster. Why wouldn’t it be an ability?
This literally has no relevance to the discussion, nor is it a meaningful argument. It’s also been posted countless times on this forum. Do you think you’re making an intelligent argument that we haven’t seen before? You aren’t. This argument is terrible. It addresses none of the major issues being raised in any way. Halo is not a science fantasy simulator. “You’re a super soldier” does not make its impact on how Halo PLAYS a good thing. We are discussing game design and game balance, not some idiotic notion of pseudo-realism (in a science fiction video game) and “immersion.” As for a simple response: Spartans are already running by default. They don’t need the goofy mechanic that lowers your weapon and only works in one direction to move quickly.
I can’t decide which I want…
> 2533274926527272;1303:
> > 2533274917158807;1292:
> > > 2533274926527272;1263:
> > > > 2533274801176260;1190:
> > > > > 2533274839169051;1185:
> > > > > Although H5G is still making money…thanks to the Req Packs?!?
> > > > > It seems like the Halo community is just the core fans now.
> > > > > A smaller but fanatic group who will be here to the end.
> > > > > I honestly think there is no fix, sprint or non-sprint that brings back the glory days.
> > > > > Removing sprint just feels like condemning the future to BR starts, Midship, Ascension and Lockout till the end of eternity.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > What does Req Packs have to do with gameplay mechanics?
> > > > Don’t you think they could make money with microtransactions in a classic game all the same?
> > > > Even so, how much money have they made through Reqs? A quick google search sais 1.5 Million in February. Let’s be generous and round that up to 2M by now.
> > > > H5G has sold around 2.5 Million copies less than even ODST. With 60$ per copy (In the US, that is. Here in Europe, I’m paying 80€ for any new game release) that alone accounts for 150 Million Dollars less revenue than the next-best-selling Halo title, which even was a spinoff-title. The difference only gets worse when you compare it to Halo 4 or Reach. Those few bucks from Reqs are peanuts compared to that.
> > >
> > >
> > > Halo 5 sold over five million copies. Try again.
> >
> >
> > If you honestly think 343 is being truthful about Halo’s sales, I have some news for you…
>
>
> They wouldn’t outright lie about a concrete statistic. And whatever news you have for me, Icarus, is probably not the most reliable. I seem to recall about a month ago, you trying to make an argument about Halo’s popularity by comparing Machinima views of a video that’s been out for eight years vs a couple months. Here is the counter to that, in case you missed it.
You’re right, which is why it was specifically stated that Halo 5 SHIPPED over 5 million copies. You can reach your own conclusion as to why that makes a significant difference, but the piles of Collector’s Edition games and consoles sitting at local Gamestops and Best Buys might offer a hint.
Nope. Though I do think they can make ONE sort of classic playlist where there’s no abilities. Then all the slow people can play there and speed walk chase each other around.
But sprint is not going anywhere any time soon, it probably only get faster as games evolve. So adapt or get left behind.
> 2533274890584596;1308:
> > 2533274926527272;1303:
> > > 2533274917158807;1292:
> > > > 2533274926527272;1263:
> > > > > 2533274801176260;1190:
> > > > > > 2533274839169051;1185:
> > > > > > Although H5G is still making money…thanks to the Req Packs?!?
> > > > > > It seems like the Halo community is just the core fans now.
> > > > > > A smaller but fanatic group who will be here to the end.
> > > > > > I honestly think there is no fix, sprint or non-sprint that brings back the glory days.
> > > > > > Removing sprint just feels like condemning the future to BR starts, Midship, Ascension and Lockout till the end of eternity.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > What does Req Packs have to do with gameplay mechanics?
> > > > > Don’t you think they could make money with microtransactions in a classic game all the same?
> > > > > Even so, how much money have they made through Reqs? A quick google search sais 1.5 Million in February. Let’s be generous and round that up to 2M by now.
> > > > > H5G has sold around 2.5 Million copies less than even ODST. With 60$ per copy (In the US, that is. Here in Europe, I’m paying 80€ for any new game release) that alone accounts for 150 Million Dollars less revenue than the next-best-selling Halo title, which even was a spinoff-title. The difference only gets worse when you compare it to Halo 4 or Reach. Those few bucks from Reqs are peanuts compared to that.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Halo 5 sold over five million copies. Try again.
> > >
> > >
> > > If you honestly think 343 is being truthful about Halo’s sales, I have some news for you…
> >
> >
> > They wouldn’t outright lie about a concrete statistic. And whatever news you have for me, Icarus, is probably not the most reliable. I seem to recall about a month ago, you trying to make an argument about Halo’s popularity by comparing Machinima views of a video that’s been out for eight years vs a couple months. Here is the counter to that, in case you missed it.
>
>
> You’re right, which is why it was specifically stated that Halo 5 SHIPPED over 5 million copies. You can reach your own conclusion as to why that makes a significant difference, but the piles of Collector’s Edition games and consoles sitting at local Gamestops and Best Buys might offer a hint.
If you’re implying that Halo 5 had a massive return rate, then I’d like to remind you that selling your game back is nothing new to Halo or video gaming in general.
> 2533274926527272;1310:
> > 2533274890584596;1308:
> > > 2533274926527272;1303:
> > > > 2533274917158807;1292:
> > > > > 2533274926527272;1263:
> > > > > > 2533274801176260;1190:
> > > > > > > 2533274839169051;1185:
> > > > > > > Although H5G is still making money…thanks to the Req Packs?!?
> > > > > > > It seems like the Halo community is just the core fans now.
> > > > > > > A smaller but fanatic group who will be here to the end.
> > > > > > > I honestly think there is no fix, sprint or non-sprint that brings back the glory days.
> > > > > > > Removing sprint just feels like condemning the future to BR starts, Midship, Ascension and Lockout till the end of eternity.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > What does Req Packs have to do with gameplay mechanics?
> > > > > > Don’t you think they could make money with microtransactions in a classic game all the same?
> > > > > > Even so, how much money have they made through Reqs? A quick google search sais 1.5 Million in February. Let’s be generous and round that up to 2M by now.
> > > > > > H5G has sold around 2.5 Million copies less than even ODST. With 60$ per copy (In the US, that is. Here in Europe, I’m paying 80€ for any new game release) that alone accounts for 150 Million Dollars less revenue than the next-best-selling Halo title, which even was a spinoff-title. The difference only gets worse when you compare it to Halo 4 or Reach. Those few bucks from Reqs are peanuts compared to that.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Halo 5 sold over five million copies. Try again.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > If you honestly think 343 is being truthful about Halo’s sales, I have some news for you…
> > >
> > >
> > > They wouldn’t outright lie about a concrete statistic. And whatever news you have for me, Icarus, is probably not the most reliable. I seem to recall about a month ago, you trying to make an argument about Halo’s popularity by comparing Machinima views of a video that’s been out for eight years vs a couple months. Here is the counter to that, in case you missed it.
> >
> >
> > You’re right, which is why it was specifically stated that Halo 5 SHIPPED over 5 million copies. You can reach your own conclusion as to why that makes a significant difference, but the piles of Collector’s Edition games and consoles sitting at local Gamestops and Best Buys might offer a hint.
>
>
> If you’re implying that Halo 5 had a massive return rate, then I’d like to remind you that selling your game back is nothing new to Halo or video gaming in general.
No, I’m referring to UNSOLD collector’s editions. New ones. The distinction between “shipped” and “sold” has absolutely no relevance to the used game market. Used games have already been sold.
> 2533274819567236;1305:
> > 2535471109694535;1293:
> > > 2533274819567236;1283:
> > > > 2533274809738692;1273:
> > > > I again don’t know if anyone has responded to this, but the reason these maps seem so big is due to all the new movement mechanics. The whole point of this thread is to blame one mechanic on how the maps are and how this one plays. You and I are truly on the same page here, I’m just trying to point out that sprint isn’t the sole reason for things in this game. And I also want to point out that if you were to increase base movement speed to the current top speed, it would have the same result as sprint and the other movement mechanics. It would also play completely different to what we are use to, even compared to the original trilogy days.
> > >
> > >
> > > That isn’t entirely true. Sprint is the biggest factor in map size because it’s what allows you to travel the fastest, even in Halo 4 which lacked most of these other abilities the maps are larger. That’s talking horizontally. Vertically, the size is adjusted largely because of clamber.
> > >
> > > Increasing the base speed would play largely the same to the original trilogy because that’s exactly what the original trilogy allowed. The simple implementation of one player speed that never takes away you ability to use your weapons, grenades or melee (the Golden Triangle Halo is based on) has many positive effects. Maps no longer need to be made with the top speed in mind, which means smaller maps and less cover in large open areas. Combine that with always being allowed to move while keeping the golden triangle in effect means that encounters are more frequents, there’s less cover on the map (because there’s no huge open areas for sprint), which allows for more open map design and that encourages more offensive play rather than constantly getting behind cover. Offense and defense are one in the same which encourages smart play much more than choosing better offensive play or defensive play. When you remove sprint, all of those changes that could be made would theoretically even allow thruster to not be as much of a get out of jail free card. Less cover forces people to use thruster more intelligently (basically, imagine thrust on Halo 3’s level Guardian). Not only does sprint hold back the gameplay as a whole, it can even hold back the other abilities.
> >
> >
> > That’s plain wrong, if base movement speed was increased, the reason for bigger maps or longer maps would be to accommodate for the base speed because theirs no way to interrupt it. You could say since Doom had increased movement speed and it plays pretty well, (my own example, you didn’t say it whatsoever) that it proves sprint unnecessary in modern FPS but those maps are extremely huge for an FPS, like I still play it and find it hard to kill people in clan arena, team deathmatch and freeze tag. Only reason it works is because you die rather fast.
> >
> > A huge factor in base speed, the speed at which you are killed. The faster the speed you are killed, the faster you should move to accommodate your low durability, but as we know, with shields Spartans could take a frag grenade’s explosion, so they can’t have the same movement speed as doom because it would be incredibly unbalance for people to run away and recover their shields while they flee. That’s why sprint is pretty good, because it works well with the durability of Spartans and prevents you from recovering your shield while fleeing or using it. There would be no way to nerf increased movement speed without killing what other hardcore halo vets call “what makes halo halo” and that would be worse than adding sprint.
> >
> > I do agree with the people saying that they should add classic playlists to arena that remove all of the new abiities and let you play like the old halos, but I do not agree with removing these abilities entirely. I think they should be further tweaked to fit in Halo and more balanced to prevent the abuse of these abilities (Spartan charge).
>
>
> Maps would still probably be larger than maps from the original trilogy, but not by much. Keep in mind, I don’t think the base speed should be increased to the top sprint speed (I think I forgot to say that). Maybe the mid point between the Halo 5 base speed and top sprint speed. Halo 5’s maps are bigger than they would be without sprint because if a map were too small, sprint would break the map. Maps are too big with sprint precisely because you’re not always sprinting. Remove sprint and the maps are built for one constant speed, not the faster of multiple speeds.
>
> You mention it working well in Doom because you die fast. That’s another problem the map design and movement abilties in Halo cause. In Halo 5, I believe kill times are shorter than they have been in recent installments, but the movement and map design cancels out how effective that should be. The kills times also need to be be made faster because of abilities that focus on defensive play, but in Halo 5, they weren’t made faster enough to accomadate that. I believe Halo CE still has the fastest kill times in the series and it obviously has no movement abilities.
>
> You also say a faster base speed in Halo would be unbalanced because it would allow people to run away more. That’s simply not so. No sprint means everyones moving at a constant speed with the abilitiy to always be offensive. If someone runs away, you can pursue them without giving up your offensive capabilities, whereas with sprint, if someone sprints away (all they have to do is thrust behind a wall and sprint away) then you have two options if you want to pursue him: sprint after him without shooting or run after him at normal speed and risk losing him. He can easily get away because they game limits what you can do. As I said earlier, no sprint allows for offense and defense to be one in the same. If someone runs away now, you can pursue him at the same speed while still being offensive and shooting at him without risk of him outrunning you. The big difference is that people trying to get away more often than not now have to fight back while trying to flee instead of just fleeing. It forces engagements and allows for faster paced gameplay because of that.
Are your feet magnetically locked to the ground when playing Halo? Are you out of ammo? Do you not know how to throw grenades? If so that would explain your inability to kill someone running away who’s almost dead. Also the maps are big and open, when someone starts sprinting you can knock them out of it just by shooting them. You can also run after them with sprint since you have it too.
While a more classic halo game would be great, unfortunately it most likely won’t ever happen as it wouldn’t be as marketable as Microsoft would like it to be. As a reminder 343 takes orders from Microsoft, which had a massive affect on the development of the master chief collection as well as what became of the halo 5 campaign.
> 2533274890584596;1311:
> > 2533274926527272;1310:
> > > 2533274890584596;1308:
> > > > 2533274926527272;1303:
> > > > > 2533274917158807;1292:
> > > > > > 2533274926527272;1263:
> > > > > > > 2533274801176260;1190:
> > > > > > > > 2533274839169051;1185:
> > > > > > > > Although H5G is still making money…thanks to the Req Packs?!?
> > > > > > > > It seems like the Halo community is just the core fans now.
> > > > > > > > A smaller but fanatic group who will be here to the end.
> > > > > > > > I honestly think there is no fix, sprint or non-sprint that brings back the glory days.
> > > > > > > > Removing sprint just feels like condemning the future to BR starts, Midship, Ascension and Lockout till the end of eternity.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > What does Req Packs have to do with gameplay mechanics?
> > > > > > > Don’t you think they could make money with microtransactions in a classic game all the same?
> > > > > > > Even so, how much money have they made through Reqs? A quick google search sais 1.5 Million in February. Let’s be generous and round that up to 2M by now.
> > > > > > > H5G has sold around 2.5 Million copies less than even ODST. With 60$ per copy (In the US, that is. Here in Europe, I’m paying 80€ for any new game release) that alone accounts for 150 Million Dollars less revenue than the next-best-selling Halo title, which even was a spinoff-title. The difference only gets worse when you compare it to Halo 4 or Reach. Those few bucks from Reqs are peanuts compared to that.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Halo 5 sold over five million copies. Try again.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > If you honestly think 343 is being truthful about Halo’s sales, I have some news for you…
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > They wouldn’t outright lie about a concrete statistic. And whatever news you have for me, Icarus, is probably not the most reliable. I seem to recall about a month ago, you trying to make an argument about Halo’s popularity by comparing Machinima views of a video that’s been out for eight years vs a couple months. Here is the counter to that, in case you missed it.
> > >
> > >
> > > You’re right, which is why it was specifically stated that Halo 5 SHIPPED over 5 million copies. You can reach your own conclusion as to why that makes a significant difference, but the piles of Collector’s Edition games and consoles sitting at local Gamestops and Best Buys might offer a hint.
> >
> >
> > If you’re implying that Halo 5 had a massive return rate, then I’d like to remind you that selling your game back is nothing new to Halo or video gaming in general.
>
>
> No, I’m referring to UNSOLD collector’s editions. New ones. The distinction between “shipped” and “sold” has absolutely no relevance to the used game market. Used games have already been sold.
Source? My first source clearly states “sold” and Frankie didn’t say specify either way.
> 2535466914543129;1312:
> Are your feet magnetically locked to the ground when playing Halo? Are you out of ammo? Do you not know how to throw grenades? If so that would explain your inability to kill someone running away who’s almost dead. Also the maps are big and open, when someone starts sprinting you can knock them out of it just by shooting them. You can also run after them with sprint since you have it too.
How is it that 90% of the people who respond with “git gud” (as if it’s relevant) are not “gud” at the game and in no position to pass judgement? I hate to break it to you, but better players can abuse these mechanics more easily. The maps are big and open? We aren’t talking about BTB here. We’re talking about Arena. Please do tell me how EMPIRE is not full of corners, cover, and paths that make it completely trivial to use thruster pack and sprint defensively. Oh, wait. You won’t. Because it definitely is and so are plenty of other maps. The mediocre BTB forge maps in this game are not a major part of the conversation. There is plenty of cover in most Arena maps and there is often minimal incentive to go out in the open (think top mid on Truth, for example).
Oh, you can run after them? Meaning you can’t shoot at the same time? Meaning the defending player is given tons of opportunities to lose you? Meaning the engagement is being needlessly prolonged and you have to play cat and mouse and over-extend yourself to finish a kill you earned because the game provides players with easy defensive options? Wow, dude. Great point. That’s not at all EXACTLY what we’re talking about. /s
> 2535466914543129;1312:
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> > > > 2533274819567236;1283:
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> > > > > I again don’t know if anyone has responded to this, but the reason these maps seem so big is due to all the new movement mechanics. The whole point of this thread is to blame one mechanic on how the maps are and how this one plays. You and I are truly on the same page here, I’m just trying to point out that sprint isn’t the sole reason for things in this game. And I also want to point out that if you were to increase base movement speed to the current top speed, it would have the same result as sprint and the other movement mechanics. It would also play completely different to what we are use to, even compared to the original trilogy days.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > That isn’t entirely true. Sprint is the biggest factor in map size because it’s what allows you to travel the fastest, even in Halo 4 which lacked most of these other abilities the maps are larger. That’s talking horizontally. Vertically, the size is adjusted largely because of clamber.
> > > >
> > > > Increasing the base speed would play largely the same to the original trilogy because that’s exactly what the original trilogy allowed. The simple implementation of one player speed that never takes away you ability to use your weapons, grenades or melee (the Golden Triangle Halo is based on) has many positive effects. Maps no longer need to be made with the top speed in mind, which means smaller maps and less cover in large open areas. Combine that with always being allowed to move while keeping the golden triangle in effect means that encounters are more frequents, there’s less cover on the map (because there’s no huge open areas for sprint), which allows for more open map design and that encourages more offensive play rather than constantly getting behind cover. Offense and defense are one in the same which encourages smart play much more than choosing better offensive play or defensive play. When you remove sprint, all of those changes that could be made would theoretically even allow thruster to not be as much of a get out of jail free card. Less cover forces people to use thruster more intelligently (basically, imagine thrust on Halo 3’s level Guardian). Not only does sprint hold back the gameplay as a whole, it can even hold back the other abilities.
> > >
> > >
> > > That’s plain wrong, if base movement speed was increased, the reason for bigger maps or longer maps would be to accommodate for the base speed because theirs no way to interrupt it. You could say since Doom had increased movement speed and it plays pretty well, (my own example, you didn’t say it whatsoever) that it proves sprint unnecessary in modern FPS but those maps are extremely huge for an FPS, like I still play it and find it hard to kill people in clan arena, team deathmatch and freeze tag. Only reason it works is because you die rather fast.
> > >
> > > A huge factor in base speed, the speed at which you are killed. The faster the speed you are killed, the faster you should move to accommodate your low durability, but as we know, with shields Spartans could take a frag grenade’s explosion, so they can’t have the same movement speed as doom because it would be incredibly unbalance for people to run away and recover their shields while they flee. That’s why sprint is pretty good, because it works well with the durability of Spartans and prevents you from recovering your shield while fleeing or using it. There would be no way to nerf increased movement speed without killing what other hardcore halo vets call “what makes halo halo” and that would be worse than adding sprint.
> > >
> > > I do agree with the people saying that they should add classic playlists to arena that remove all of the new abiities and let you play like the old halos, but I do not agree with removing these abilities entirely. I think they should be further tweaked to fit in Halo and more balanced to prevent the abuse of these abilities (Spartan charge).
> >
> >
> > Maps would still probably be larger than maps from the original trilogy, but not by much. Keep in mind, I don’t think the base speed should be increased to the top sprint speed (I think I forgot to say that). Maybe the mid point between the Halo 5 base speed and top sprint speed. Halo 5’s maps are bigger than they would be without sprint because if a map were too small, sprint would break the map. Maps are too big with sprint precisely because you’re not always sprinting. Remove sprint and the maps are built for one constant speed, not the faster of multiple speeds.
> >
> > You mention it working well in Doom because you die fast. That’s another problem the map design and movement abilties in Halo cause. In Halo 5, I believe kill times are shorter than they have been in recent installments, but the movement and map design cancels out how effective that should be. The kills times also need to be be made faster because of abilities that focus on defensive play, but in Halo 5, they weren’t made faster enough to accomadate that. I believe Halo CE still has the fastest kill times in the series and it obviously has no movement abilities.
> >
> > You also say a faster base speed in Halo would be unbalanced because it would allow people to run away more. That’s simply not so. No sprint means everyones moving at a constant speed with the abilitiy to always be offensive. If someone runs away, you can pursue them without giving up your offensive capabilities, whereas with sprint, if someone sprints away (all they have to do is thrust behind a wall and sprint away) then you have two options if you want to pursue him: sprint after him without shooting or run after him at normal speed and risk losing him. He can easily get away because they game limits what you can do. As I said earlier, no sprint allows for offense and defense to be one in the same. If someone runs away now, you can pursue him at the same speed while still being offensive and shooting at him without risk of him outrunning you. The big difference is that people trying to get away more often than not now have to fight back while trying to flee instead of just fleeing. It forces engagements and allows for faster paced gameplay because of that.
>
>
> Are your feet magnetically locked to the ground when playing Halo? Are you out of ammo? Do you not know how to throw grenades? If so that would explain your inability to kill someone running away who’s almost dead. Also the maps are big and open, when someone starts sprinting you can knock them out of it just by shooting them. You can also run after them with sprint since you have it too.
I explained in my posts what the problems are regarding everything you just said.
> 2533274890584596;1315:
> > 2535466914543129;1312:
> > Are your feet magnetically locked to the ground when playing Halo? Are you out of ammo? Do you not know how to throw grenades? If so that would explain your inability to kill someone running away who’s almost dead. Also the maps are big and open, when someone starts sprinting you can knock them out of it just by shooting them. You can also run after them with sprint since you have it too.
>
>
> How is it that 90% of the people who respond with “git gud” (as if it’s relevant) are not “gud” at the game and in no position to pass judgement? I hate to break it to you, but better players can abuse these mechanics more easily. The maps are big and open? We aren’t talking about BTB here. We’re talking about Arena. Please do tell me how EMPIRE is not full of corners, cover, and paths that make it completely trivial to use thruster pack and sprint defensively. Oh, wait. You won’t. Because it definitely is and so are plenty of other maps. The mediocre BTB forge maps in this game are not a major part of the conversation. There is plenty of cover in most Arena maps and there is often minimal incentive to go out in the open (think top mid on Truth, for example).
>
> Oh, you can run after them? Meaning you can’t shoot at the same time? Meaning the defending player is given tons of opportunities to lose you? Meaning the engagement is being needlessly prolonged and you have to play cat and mouse and over-extend yourself to finish a kill you earned because the game provides players with easy defensive options? Wow, dude. Great point. That’s not at all EXACTLY what we’re talking about. /s
^Pretty much this.
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> > > > > > > > > Although H5G is still making money…thanks to the Req Packs?!?
> > > > > > > > > It seems like the Halo community is just the core fans now.
> > > > > > > > > A smaller but fanatic group who will be here to the end.
> > > > > > > > > I honestly think there is no fix, sprint or non-sprint that brings back the glory days.
> > > > > > > > > Removing sprint just feels like condemning the future to BR starts, Midship, Ascension and Lockout till the end of eternity.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > What does Req Packs have to do with gameplay mechanics?
> > > > > > > > Don’t you think they could make money with microtransactions in a classic game all the same?
> > > > > > > > Even so, how much money have they made through Reqs? A quick google search sais 1.5 Million in February. Let’s be generous and round that up to 2M by now.
> > > > > > > > H5G has sold around 2.5 Million copies less than even ODST. With 60$ per copy (In the US, that is. Here in Europe, I’m paying 80€ for any new game release) that alone accounts for 150 Million Dollars less revenue than the next-best-selling Halo title, which even was a spinoff-title. The difference only gets worse when you compare it to Halo 4 or Reach. Those few bucks from Reqs are peanuts compared to that.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Halo 5 sold over five million copies. Try again.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > If you honestly think 343 is being truthful about Halo’s sales, I have some news for you…
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > They wouldn’t outright lie about a concrete statistic. And whatever news you have for me, Icarus, is probably not the most reliable. I seem to recall about a month ago, you trying to make an argument about Halo’s popularity by comparing Machinima views of a video that’s been out for eight years vs a couple months. Here is the counter to that, in case you missed it.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > You’re right, which is why it was specifically stated that Halo 5 SHIPPED over 5 million copies. You can reach your own conclusion as to why that makes a significant difference, but the piles of Collector’s Edition games and consoles sitting at local Gamestops and Best Buys might offer a hint.
> > >
> > >
> > > If you’re implying that Halo 5 had a massive return rate, then I’d like to remind you that selling your game back is nothing new to Halo or video gaming in general.
> >
> >
> > No, I’m referring to UNSOLD collector’s editions. New ones. The distinction between “shipped” and “sold” has absolutely no relevance to the used game market. Used games have already been sold.
>
>
> Source? My first source clearly states “sold” and Frankie didn’t say specify either way.
No, your first source says sold. then someone in response says “5m shipped at the end of 2015,” to which said source says “same thing.” So, yes, it’s 5 million SHIPPED, not sold through. And of course Frankie didn’t specify. He never does. He always says vague nonsense that could be interpreted a bunch of different ways with a slant that implies but doesn’t confirm something favorable for 343.
I really hope 343i would return to the roots and stop being so disrespectful to Bungie. I understand that they now are the owners but you cannot disrespect the original founders. The people that made Halo’s legacy one of the best!
If I’m playing as a super solider I want to feel like one. Granting me all the abilities that will make me feel like a super solider. Sprint wasn’t in the other Halo’s. It’s in here and accept that we have it.