The sprint discussion thread

Games Halo 5: Guardians
12724

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> > > What Celestis doesn’t know is that you can’t run full speed and keep your gun steady. You need to move your arms back and forth to keep your balance and help you run faster. So to run full speed, a Spartan would in fact have to lower their gun.
> >
> > Yes you can. No you don’t. No he wouldn’t. I’ve done it myself, so why wouldn’t an evolved human from the 2500’s be able to do the same?
> > This “realism” argument is A) based on a false premise and B) falls completely flat in the context of a science-fiction setting with sentient AIs and faster-than-light travel.
> > Even if this were a thing nowadays (which it isn’t), the extension that genetically and cybernetically altered humans in 500 years bow to the same rules, in a completely fictional setting, no less, is merely a preconceived notion and holds no weight.
>
> No you can’t. Look it up.

Yes you can. I don’t have to look up what I literally can do myself.
You being in denial doesn’t change reality. You might just as well repeat at nauseam that gravity repulses instead of attracts, but it won’t make it any less wrong.

12725

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> > 2533274825830455;12718:
> > > 2535455477282651;12716:
> > > Halo 2 and 3 average population = 1 million
> > > Halo 4 and 5 average population = 20k
> >
> > Neither Halo 2 nor Halo 3 ever had over one million players playing simultaneously. The highest provable number of simultanous players in Halo 2 is about 150,000. No evidence exist that there would’ve ever been more players playing simultaneously. A year after release, the momentary population of Halo 2 averaged around 50,000 or so. Likewise, for Halo 3 the highest number of players that can be proven to have been online at the same time is about 372,000, while after a year the average seems to have been more or less 100,000.
> >
> > When it comes Halo 5, there exists no reliable information about the population. So, could you not spread misinformation, please?
>
> Why does no reliable information about the population of Halo 5 exist?
> The only possible reason i can see for 343 to remove the population count, is that they’re not confident showing the small amount of players playing their game.

You said it yourself: there’s no population counter. 343i doesn’t share population numbers—which, to be honest, they aren’t obliged to do. The reasons why they don’t are a matter of speculation. However, that they’re not confident is definitely not the only possible reason.

12726

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> > 2533274939777077;12722:
> > > 2533274825830455;12718:
> > > > 2535455477282651;12716:
> > > > Halo 2 and 3 average population = 1 million
> > > > Halo 4 and 5 average population = 20k
> > >
> > > Neither Halo 2 nor Halo 3 ever had over one million players playing simultaneously. The highest provable number of simultanous players in Halo 2 is about 150,000. No evidence exist that there would’ve ever been more players playing simultaneously. A year after release, the momentary population of Halo 2 averaged around 50,000 or so. Likewise, for Halo 3 the highest number of players that can be proven to have been online at the same time is about 372,000, while after a year the average seems to have been more or less 100,000.
> > >
> > > When it comes Halo 5, there exists no reliable information about the population. So, could you not spread misinformation, please?
> >
> > Why does no reliable information about the population of Halo 5 exist?
> > The only possible reason i can see for 343 to remove the population count, is that they’re not confident showing the small amount of players playing their game.
>
> You said it yourself: there’s no population counter. 343i doesn’t share population numbers—which, to be honest, they aren’t obliged to do. The reasons why they don’t are a matter of speculation. However, that they’re not confident is definitely not the only possible reason.

They aren’t obliged to, but I see no other reason for them to remove the feature. Knowing how many players are in which playlists is really helpful for finding games, which is often hard to do, at least in my country. Halo 5 is the only game where i can sometimes never find games after an hour of searching in multiple playlists. In Overwatch, Titanfall 2, and Battlefield 1, i can find games in less than 30 seconds, so the amount of people playing Halo 5 must be pretty low. Knowing which playlists have the most people would at least give me a CHANCE of finding a game.

12727

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> > 2533274939777077;12722:
> > > 2533274825830455;12718:
> > > > 2535455477282651;12716:
> > > > Halo 2 and 3 average population = 1 million
> > > > Halo 4 and 5 average population = 20k
> > >
> > > Neither Halo 2 nor Halo 3 ever had over one million players playing simultaneously. The highest provable number of simultanous players in Halo 2 is about 150,000. No evidence exist that there would’ve ever been more players playing simultaneously. A year after release, the momentary population of Halo 2 averaged around 50,000 or so. Likewise, for Halo 3 the highest number of players that can be proven to have been online at the same time is about 372,000, while after a year the average seems to have been more or less 100,000.
> > >
> > > When it comes Halo 5, there exists no reliable information about the population. So, could you not spread misinformation, please?
> >
> > Why does no reliable information about the population of Halo 5 exist?
> > The only possible reason i can see for 343 to remove the population count, is that they’re not confident showing the small amount of players playing their game.
>
> You said it yourself: there’s no population counter. 343i doesn’t share population numbers—which, to be honest, they aren’t obliged to do. The reasons why they don’t are a matter of speculation. However, that they’re not confident is definitely not the only possible reason.

Would you speculate for us? I mean, what other possible reasons are ther? I know this has nothing to do with sprint, but removal of the population counters kinda bothers me.

12728

> 2533274801176260;12724:
> > 2535455681930574;12704:
> > > 2533274801176260;12695:
> > > > 2535455681930574;12688:
> > > > What Celestis doesn’t know is that you can’t run full speed and keep your gun steady. You need to move your arms back and forth to keep your balance and help you run faster. So to run full speed, a Spartan would in fact have to lower their gun.
> > >
> > > Yes you can. No you don’t. No he wouldn’t. I’ve done it myself, so why wouldn’t an evolved human from the 2500’s be able to do the same?
> > > This “realism” argument is A) based on a false premise and B) falls completely flat in the context of a science-fiction setting with sentient AIs and faster-than-light travel.
> > > Even if this were a thing nowadays (which it isn’t), the extension that genetically and cybernetically altered humans in 500 years bow to the same rules, in a completely fictional setting, no less, is merely a preconceived notion and holds no weight.
> >
> > No you can’t. Look it up.
>
> Yes you can. I don’t have to look up what I literally can do myself.
> You being in denial doesn’t change reality. You might just as well repeat at nauseam that gravity repulses instead of attracts, but it won’t make it any less wrong.

Lazy link.

12729

> 2533274943854776;12727:
> > 2533274825830455;12725:
> > > 2533274939777077;12722:
> > > > 2533274825830455;12718:
> > > > > 2535455477282651;12716:
> > > > > Halo 2 and 3 average population = 1 million
> > > > > Halo 4 and 5 average population = 20k
> > > >
> > > > Neither Halo 2 nor Halo 3 ever had over one million players playing simultaneously. The highest provable number of simultanous players in Halo 2 is about 150,000. No evidence exist that there would’ve ever been more players playing simultaneously. A year after release, the momentary population of Halo 2 averaged around 50,000 or so. Likewise, for Halo 3 the highest number of players that can be proven to have been online at the same time is about 372,000, while after a year the average seems to have been more or less 100,000.
> > > >
> > > > When it comes Halo 5, there exists no reliable information about the population. So, could you not spread misinformation, please?
> > >
> > > Why does no reliable information about the population of Halo 5 exist?
> > > The only possible reason i can see for 343 to remove the population count, is that they’re not confident showing the small amount of players playing their game.
> >
> > You said it yourself: there’s no population counter. 343i doesn’t share population numbers—which, to be honest, they aren’t obliged to do. The reasons why they don’t are a matter of speculation. However, that they’re not confident is definitely not the only possible reason.
>
> Would you speculate for us? I mean, what other possible reasons are ther? I know this has nothing to do with sprint, but removal of the population counters kinda bothers me.

I mean, how about the fact that it’s an extra feature? Like, they never removed anything here, they just didn’t implement a population counter in Halo 5. The lack of population tracking is like the lack of tracking of any other stat that Halo 5 doesn’t track: it’s not necessarily that they don’t want to show it, nobody just took the time to implement it. That to me seems like a very natural reason not to do something that would require extra work that can be allocated elsewhere.

12730

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> > 2533274825830455;12725:
> > > 2533274939777077;12722:
> > > > 2533274825830455;12718:
> > > > > 2535455477282651;12716:
> > > > > Halo 2 and 3 average population = 1 million
> > > > > Halo 4 and 5 average population = 20k
> > > >
> > > > Neither Halo 2 nor Halo 3 ever had over one million players playing simultaneously. The highest provable number of simultanous players in Halo 2 is about 150,000. No evidence exist that there would’ve ever been more players playing simultaneously. A year after release, the momentary population of Halo 2 averaged around 50,000 or so. Likewise, for Halo 3 the highest number of players that can be proven to have been online at the same time is about 372,000, while after a year the average seems to have been more or less 100,000.
> > > >
> > > > When it comes Halo 5, there exists no reliable information about the population. So, could you not spread misinformation, please?
> > >
> > > Why does no reliable information about the population of Halo 5 exist?
> > > The only possible reason i can see for 343 to remove the population count, is that they’re not confident showing the small amount of players playing their game.
> >
> > You said it yourself: there’s no population counter. 343i doesn’t share population numbers—which, to be honest, they aren’t obliged to do. The reasons why they don’t are a matter of speculation. However, that they’re not confident is definitely not the only possible reason.
>
> Would you speculate for us? I mean, what other possible reasons are ther? I know this has nothing to do with sprint, but removal of the population counters kinda bothers me.

Is it really a big issue when other games don’t? I could say overwatch has no population since it too lacks a pop counter but it wouldn’t be accurate. It too can have search times going into minutes. I could say the same for gears of war 4 (gears used to have a pop counter in previous games). A pop counter is really not an important feature that doesn’t add anything to a game nor does it hurt a game lacking one.

12731

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> > 2533274801176260;12724:
> > > 2535455681930574;12704:
> > > > 2533274801176260;12695:
> > > > > 2535455681930574;12688:
> > > > > What Celestis doesn’t know is that you can’t run full speed and keep your gun steady. You need to move your arms back and forth to keep your balance and help you run faster. So to run full speed, a Spartan would in fact have to lower their gun.
> > > >
> > > > Yes you can. No you don’t. No he wouldn’t. I’ve done it myself, so why wouldn’t an evolved human from the 2500’s be able to do the same?
> > > > This “realism” argument is A) based on a false premise and B) falls completely flat in the context of a science-fiction setting with sentient AIs and faster-than-light travel.
> > > > Even if this were a thing nowadays (which it isn’t), the extension that genetically and cybernetically altered humans in 500 years bow to the same rules, in a completely fictional setting, no less, is merely a preconceived notion and holds no weight.
> > >
> > > No you can’t. Look it up.
> >
> > Yes you can. I don’t have to look up what I literally can do myself.
> > You being in denial doesn’t change reality. You might just as well repeat at nauseam that gravity repulses instead of attracts, but it won’t make it any less wrong.
>
> Lazy link.

It helps balance, which in turn can allow you to run faster. We’re talking about augmented super soldiers in trillion dollar power armor five hundred years from now, if you want to get into realism, which iI already prefer to avoid for gameplays sake, there’s no reason that a spartan can’t manage to run full speed without pumping their arms.

12732

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> > 2535455477282651;12719:
> > > 2533274825830455;12718:
> > > > 2535455477282651;12716:
> > > > Halo 2 and 3 average population = 1 million
> > > > Halo 4 and 5 average population = 20k
> > >
> > > Neither Halo 2 nor Halo 3 ever had over one million players playing simultaneously. The highest provable number of simultanous players in Halo 2 is about 150,000. No evidence exist that there would’ve ever been more players playing simultaneously. A year after release, the momentary population of Halo 2 averaged around 50,000 or so. Likewise, for Halo 3 the highest number of players that can be proven to have been online at the same time is about 372,000, while after a year the average seems to have been more or less 100,000.
> > >
> > > When it comes Halo 5, there exists no reliable information about the population. So, could you not spread misinformation, please?
> >
> > Halo 2 and 3 had like 900,000- 1,100,000 lmao
> > And even if those were the numbers my point still stands
>
> No, they really didn’t. I have all the Halo population data that’s available online, you can see my signature for more info. There exists no evidence of Halo 2 ever having more than 150,000 simultaneous players, or Halo 3 ever having more than 370,000 simultaneous players. I’m sorry, but you’re simply misinformed.

I’ve been told differently. But my point still stands 370,000 compared to 20,000

12733

> 2533274939777077;12722:
> > 2533274825830455;12718:
> > > 2535455477282651;12716:
> > > Halo 2 and 3 average population = 1 million
> > > Halo 4 and 5 average population = 20k
> >
> > Neither Halo 2 nor Halo 3 ever had over one million players playing simultaneously. The highest provable number of simultanous players in Halo 2 is about 150,000. No evidence exist that there would’ve ever been more players playing simultaneously. A year after release, the momentary population of Halo 2 averaged around 50,000 or so. Likewise, for Halo 3 the highest number of players that can be proven to have been online at the same time is about 372,000, while after a year the average seems to have been more or less 100,000.
> >
> > When it comes Halo 5, there exists no reliable information about the population. So, could you not spread misinformation, please?
>
> Why does no reliable information about the population of Halo 5 exist?
> The only possible reason i can see for 343 to remove the population count, is that they’re not confident showing the small amount of players playing their game.

Watch Wpns Grade Video about Halo 5’ population. Great channel

12734

343 should just develop a classic multiplayer mode where you can’t sprint. There needs to be sprint in the campaign, Spartans are super soldiers in nearly the 27th century.

12735

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> > > > 2535455681930574;12704:
> > > > > 2533274801176260;12695:
> > > > > > 2535455681930574;12688:
> > > > > > What Celestis doesn’t know is that you can’t run full speed and keep your gun steady. You need to move your arms back and forth to keep your balance and help you run faster. So to run full speed, a Spartan would in fact have to lower their gun.
> > > > >
> > > > > Yes you can. No you don’t. No he wouldn’t. I’ve done it myself, so why wouldn’t an evolved human from the 2500’s be able to do the same?
> > > > > This “realism” argument is A) based on a false premise and B) falls completely flat in the context of a science-fiction setting with sentient AIs and faster-than-light travel.
> > > > > Even if this were a thing nowadays (which it isn’t), the extension that genetically and cybernetically altered humans in 500 years bow to the same rules, in a completely fictional setting, no less, is merely a preconceived notion and holds no weight.
> > > >
> > > > No you can’t. Look it up.
> >
> > Lazy link.
>
> It helps balance, which in turn can allow you to run faster. We’re talking about augmented super soldiers in trillion dollar power armor five hundred years from now, if you want to get into realism, which iI already prefer to avoid for gameplays sake, there’s no reason that a spartan can’t manage to run full speed without pumping their arms.

Balance is part of the equation to reach top speed, or you could be analogized to a super car without swaybars. And not sure which cutscene it is but I do know H5 did toss in a moment where instead of jumping a gap (too obvious), the Spartans ran a tight beam and the thrusters kept them leveled that way.

For a high powered vehicle, even if you’re not turning, if you don’t find a way to control the individual suspension parts from creating a resonance due to imperfections on the surface, outside factors like wind and actual torque of the powertrain on the frame, you will spin out of control when accelerating too fast AND lose straight line control at high speeds as soon as corrections need to be made, or the wind whispers.

Sooooo, the amount of power you put into the legs of a super soldier won’t matter for top speed if they’re not properly “bouncing” to control it.
Now, having said that, there is something built into the suit that can be used to help stabilize Spartans while sprinting for balance OR even shooting to control recoil kick… That happens to be, THRUSTERS!!!

Ohhh baby, love me my thrusters!

For “lore’s” sake, the GENII suits can let a Spartan achieve great speeds while shooting thanks to thrusters. There is not doubts about that… But it honestly requires a GENII suit do so, and it makes the Spartan even slipperier and more unpredictable than by any complaints against H5.

But even when we concede that Spartans in GENII suits can run fast while shooting, there’s still sprinting, ground pound and hover thanks to those same abilities to help with momentary shooting at even above top speed.

So, while it’s possible to have fast running, even a form of sprinting Spartan that can reliably shoot while doing so, it’s even more possible to go beyond that that one pumping their arms while thrustering and using microbursts from balance will be moving even faster, jumping off of walls, climbing walls, using the non-gameplay burst vertical jump (removed from Alpha phase)…

I think it’s best remember, MJOLNIR is more a combat skin over a suit. It augements the user, in MJOLNIR’s case, still just humans. At least MK.IV and on. The Mk.III… Ok, that’s a mobile armour, not combat skin.
:slight_smile:

12736

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> > 2533274825830455;12721:
> > > 2535455477282651;12719:
> > > > 2533274825830455;12718:
> > > > > 2535455477282651;12716:
> > > > > Halo 2 and 3 average population = 1 million
> > > > > Halo 4 and 5 average population = 20k
> > > >
> > > > Neither Halo 2 nor Halo 3 ever had over one million players playing simultaneously. The highest provable number of simultanous players in Halo 2 is about 150,000. No evidence exist that there would’ve ever been more players playing simultaneously. A year after release, the momentary population of Halo 2 averaged around 50,000 or so. Likewise, for Halo 3 the highest number of players that can be proven to have been online at the same time is about 372,000, while after a year the average seems to have been more or less 100,000.
> > > >
> > > > When it comes Halo 5, there exists no reliable information about the population. So, could you not spread misinformation, please?
> > >
> > > Halo 2 and 3 had like 900,000- 1,100,000 lmao
> > > And even if those were the numbers my point still stands
> >
> > No, they really didn’t. I have all the Halo population data that’s available online, you can see my signature for more info. There exists no evidence of Halo 2 ever having more than 150,000 simultaneous players, or Halo 3 ever having more than 370,000 simultaneous players. I’m sorry, but you’re simply misinformed.
>
> I’ve been told differently. But my point still stands 370,000 compared to 20,000

Well, you’ve been told by people who regurgitate myths without fact checking. But you’re still not paying attention to what I’m saying. 370,000 is the highest number of concurrent players Halo 3 can be proven to have had. It is not the average number of players you would’ve had seen jumping into matchmaking a year after release. That number is around 100,000.

And to be clear, I don’t really care about the point you’re trying to make because it is the same old useless dead end of a discussion. I’m just trying to make sure we have our facts straight.

12737

Guys, ignore realism for a second.

We’re playing as augmented super soldiers in high tech suits, fighting anime robots, space zombies, aliens, and now an AI.

We can’t kick, we can’t swim, we can’t put our gun down, how do we even take off the suit to use the bathroom when Chief needed a giant machine thing to do it for him?

But people want sprint, something that is damaging to gameplay, and is something that brings us even closer to other military shooters.

All for realism. Really now.

12738

> 2533274825830455;12736:
> > 2535455477282651;12732:
> > > 2533274825830455;12721:
> > > > 2535455477282651;12719:
> > > > > 2533274825830455;12718:
> > > > > > 2535455477282651;12716:
> > > > > > Halo 2 and 3 average population = 1 million
> > > > > > Halo 4 and 5 average population = 20k
> > > > >
> > > > > Neither Halo 2 nor Halo 3 ever had over one million players playing simultaneously. The highest provable number of simultanous players in Halo 2 is about 150,000. No evidence exist that there would’ve ever been more players playing simultaneously. A year after release, the momentary population of Halo 2 averaged around 50,000 or so. Likewise, for Halo 3 the highest number of players that can be proven to have been online at the same time is about 372,000, while after a year the average seems to have been more or less 100,000.
> > > > >
> > > > > When it comes Halo 5, there exists no reliable information about the population. So, could you not spread misinformation, please?
> > > >
> > > > Halo 2 and 3 had like 900,000- 1,100,000 lmao
> > > > And even if those were the numbers my point still stands
> > >
> > > No, they really didn’t. I have all the Halo population data that’s available online, you can see my signature for more info. There exists no evidence of Halo 2 ever having more than 150,000 simultaneous players, or Halo 3 ever having more than 370,000 simultaneous players. I’m sorry, but you’re simply misinformed.
> >
> > I’ve been told differently. But my point still stands 370,000 compared to 20,000
>
> Well, you’ve been told by people who regurgitate myths without fact checking. But you’re still not paying attention to what I’m saying. 370,000 is the highest number of concurrent players Halo 3 can be proven to have had. It is not the average number of players you would’ve had seen jumping into matchmaking a year after release. That number is around 100,000.
>
> And to be clear, I don’t really care about the point you’re trying to make because it is the same old useless dead end of a discussion. I’m just trying to make sure we have our facts straight.

There is no way H3 held that many players (370 000) a year after launch, especially competing against COD4, and MW2. Surprisingly enough, H3 still did great against them. (From Major Nelsen’s blog).

12739

> 2533274825830455;12729:
> > 2533274943854776;12727:
> > > 2533274825830455;12725:
> > > > 2533274939777077;12722:
> > > > > 2533274825830455;12718:
> > > > > > 2535455477282651;12716:
> > > > > > Halo 2 and 3 average population = 1 million
> > > > > > Halo 4 and 5 average population = 20k
> > > > >
> > > > > Neither Halo 2 nor Halo 3 ever had over one million players playing simultaneously. The highest provable number of simultanous players in Halo 2 is about 150,000. No evidence exist that there would’ve ever been more players playing simultaneously. A year after release, the momentary population of Halo 2 averaged around 50,000 or so. Likewise, for Halo 3 the highest number of players that can be proven to have been online at the same time is about 372,000, while after a year the average seems to have been more or less 100,000.
> > > > >
> > > > > When it comes Halo 5, there exists no reliable information about the population. So, could you not spread misinformation, please?
> > > >
> > > > Why does no reliable information about the population of Halo 5 exist?
> > > > The only possible reason i can see for 343 to remove the population count, is that they’re not confident showing the small amount of players playing their game.
> > >
> > > You said it yourself: there’s no population counter. 343i doesn’t share population numbers—which, to be honest, they aren’t obliged to do. The reasons why they don’t are a matter of speculation. However, that they’re not confident is definitely not the only possible reason.
> >
> > Would you speculate for us? I mean, what other possible reasons are ther? I know this has nothing to do with sprint, but removal of the population counters kinda bothers me.
>
> I mean, how about the fact that it’s an extra feature? Like, they never removed anything here, they just didn’t implement a population counter in Halo 5. The lack of population tracking is like the lack of tracking of any other stat that Halo 5 doesn’t track: it’s not necessarily that they don’t want to show it, nobody just took the time to implement it. That to me seems like a very natural reason not to do something that would require extra work that can be allocated elsewhere.

“The fact that it’s an extra feature”- based on what? If they were to take out, I mean not implement a campaing in H6, people would be pissed off(like with Rainbow6 and Battlefront). Also, population tracking is not like the tracking of any other stat. Playlist population tracking would be useful to the customer, whereas something like monthly active users-tracking wouldn’t. It would shut up conspiracists like myself for a bit. So, I’m not just gonna believe that they were too lazy to put it there, because people have been complaining about it not being there. On the other hand: I understand that if the game launches without things like BTB and Forge, they’re gonna take priority over playlist population counters. But shouldn’t they have been added to the game by now?

Yeah, I think that they don’t want people to smell blood in the water, because when a community is this badly split, the community eats its wounded.

12740

> 2533274970658419;12737:
> Guys, ignore realism for a second.
> We’re playing as augmented super soldiers in high tech suits, fighting anime robots, space zombies, aliens, and now an AI.
> We can’t kick, we can’t swim, we can’t put our gun down, how do we even take off the suit to use the bathroom when Chief needed a giant machine thing to do it for him?
> But people want sprint, something that is damaging to gameplay, and is something that brings us even closer to other military shooters.
> All for realism. Really now.

We can kick, seen the assassination animations. We use variable animations for weapons and position to determine if fist or not.

We can put our gun down in some older games by looking down or using button inputs, now it’s an option to toggle for customs.

You’re using the term “military shooters” as though you’re not the highest (or were) ranking NCO in something called the UNSC fighting a war!

You don’t want to sprint for the same reason others want to sprint, because of how it makes you feel.
And for many of us, we do indeed want the unrealism of the lore, not the realism of it :slight_smile:

As for damaging to gameplay, now we’re back to where if H5 is damaging, and especially with its current netcode, MCC’s H2A should be being used to show 343i what to make for Halo6.

If we take Sprint on a default level, it’s barely quicker than running and is the check-system to prevent the spamming of Shoulder Charge or Slide, while allowing thruster as the neutral or combat option in reserve.

On a meta-level, Thrustering and Clambering off of objects, as well as Sprint-Thruster-Slide-Jump, are about temporary bursts of speed to travel greater distances, verticaly and/or horizontally, rather than walking or running for the same time, while having your weapon out.

If Halo must evolve past CE-H2, and competitive Halo doesn’t use H3’s equipment or much dualing (which, equipment, bubbleshield & regen are why maps ARE larger, except for Midship, in H3. Grav-lift is why MLG put boxes where they did on maps to promote flow where jumping couldn’t be discovered)… THEN, we can’t say we need to change or evolve but Reach, H4 or H5 all do it wrong because they contain sprint as just 1 joining variable.

Hurting gameplay is most certainly a PoV, as I feel H2’s increased aim-assists, lack of fall damage and floaty high jumps really changed how pathfinding works. I also noticed how Tombstone & Desolation are much different than Hang’em High or Derelict beyond location. Don’t forget how health packs reset fights to square one and don’t help teams chip away at positions as fluidly.
Yet, I love the return to a medium ground of many mechanics with 85% Bloom Reach TU gameplay.
Not very keen on H4’s flinch…

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> > > > > > > Halo 2 and 3 average population = 1 million
> > > > > > > Halo 4 and 5 average population = 20k
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Neither Halo 2 nor Halo 3 ever had over one million players playing simultaneously. The highest provable number of simultanous players in Halo 2 is about 150,000. No evidence exist that there would’ve ever been more players playing simultaneously. A year after release, the momentary population of Halo 2 averaged around 50,000 or so. Likewise, for Halo 3 the highest number of players that can be proven to have been online at the same time is about 372,000, while after a year the average seems to have been more or less 100,000.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > When it comes Halo 5, there exists no reliable information about the population. So, could you not spread misinformation, please?
> > > > >
> > > > > Why does no reliable information about the population of Halo 5 exist?
> > > > > The only possible reason i can see for 343 to remove the population count, is that they’re not confident showing the small amount of players playing their game.
> > > >
> > > > You said it yourself: there’s no population counter. 343i doesn’t share population numbers—which, to be honest, they aren’t obliged to do. The reasons why they don’t are a matter of speculation. However, that they’re not confident is definitely not the only possible reason.
> > >
> > > Would you speculate for us? I mean, what other possible reasons are ther? I know this has nothing to do with sprint, but removal of the population counters kinda bothers me.
> >
> > I mean, how about the fact that it’s an extra feature? Like, they never removed anything here, they just didn’t implement a population counter in Halo 5. The lack of population tracking is like the lack of tracking of any other stat that Halo 5 doesn’t track: it’s not necessarily that they don’t want to show it, nobody just took the time to implement it. That to me seems like a very natural reason not to do something that would require extra work that can be allocated elsewhere.
>
> “The fact that it’s an extra feature”- based on what? If they were to take out, I mean not implement a campaing in H6, people would be pissed off(like with Rainbow6 and Battlefront). Also, population tracking is not like the tracking of any other stat. Playlist population tracking would be useful to the customer, whereas something like monthly active users-tracking wouldn’t. It would shut up conspiracists like myself for a bit. So, I’m not just gonna believe that they were too lazy to put it there, because people have been complaining about it not being there. On the other hand: I understand that if the game launches without things like BTB and Forge, they’re gonna take priority over playlist population counters. But shouldn’t they have been added to the game by now?
>
> Yeah, I think that they don’t want people to smell blood in the water, because when a community is this badly split, the community eats its wounded.

I don’t think you can compare not having a campaign to not having a population counter. That’s just such terrible hyperbole that I’m not really interested in saying more about that.

I’m not really sure of the real usefulness of playlist population tracking. I mean, it sounds useful at first, but I don’t really know how much I’d ultimately do with that information. It was one of those things that was nice to have, but I don’t remember when the playlist population would’ve significantly impacted my decision about whether to play it or not. That said, that might just be me, and maybe other people base their decisions more heavily on playlist population. I don’t really know. I’ve personally just always found population tracking to feed my data addiction, but not have any practical use for me.

One reason I sometimes doubt the “they’re afraid” argument is that when you think about it, it’s a catch-22 for them. If the population is low and there’s a counter to show that, the people who don’t like the game will use that to argue the game is a failure. If there is no population counter, then people who don’t like the game will say that they’re hiding something, and use that to argue the game is a failure. They’re not going to win that scenario no matter what way they go, so why care about what those people think?

Ultimately, I never wanted to speculate. You asked me to. As far as I’m concerned, I don’t really have any strong theory on why Halo 5 population data isn’t available. Could be that they don’t want to show it, could be that they don’t think it’s important. We don’t know. Someone simply stated that the former is the only possible reason, I responded that it’s not. You asked me to speculate, I didn’t want to because I knew where this was going to go: I speculate, you try to counter argue my speculation because for some reason it’s really important for you what the reason is. And here we are.

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> > > > > > 2533274939777077;12722:
> > > > > > > 2533274825830455;12718:
> > > > > > > > 2535455477282651;12716:
> > > > > > > > Halo 2 and 3 average population = 1 million
> > > > > > > > Halo 4 and 5 average population = 20k
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Neither Halo 2 nor Halo 3 ever had over one million players playing simultaneously. The highest provable number of simultanous players in Halo 2 is about 150,000. No evidence exist that there would’ve ever been more players playing simultaneously. A year after release, the momentary population of Halo 2 averaged around 50,000 or so. Likewise, for Halo 3 the highest number of players that can be proven to have been online at the same time is about 372,000, while after a year the average seems to have been more or less 100,000.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > When it comes Halo 5, there exists no reliable information about the population. So, could you not spread misinformation, please?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Why does no reliable information about the population of Halo 5 exist?
> > > > > > The only possible reason i can see for 343 to remove the population count, is that they’re not confident showing the small amount of players playing their game.
> > > > >
> > > > > You said it yourself: there’s no population counter. 343i doesn’t share population numbers—which, to be honest, they aren’t obliged to do. The reasons why they don’t are a matter of speculation. However, that they’re not confident is definitely not the only possible reason.
> > > >
> > > > Would you speculate for us? I mean, what other possible reasons are ther? I know this has nothing to do with sprint, but removal of the population counters kinda bothers me.
> > >
> > > I mean, how about the fact that it’s an extra feature? Like, they never removed anything here, they just didn’t implement a population counter in Halo 5. The lack of population tracking is like the lack of tracking of any other stat that Halo 5 doesn’t track: it’s not necessarily that they don’t want to show it, nobody just took the time to implement it. That to me seems like a very natural reason not to do something that would require extra work that can be allocated elsewhere.
> >
> > “The fact that it’s an extra feature”- based on what? If they were to take out, I mean not implement a campaing in H6, people would be pissed off(like with Rainbow6 and Battlefront). Also, population tracking is not like the tracking of any other stat. Playlist population tracking would be useful to the customer, whereas something like monthly active users-tracking wouldn’t. It would shut up conspiracists like myself for a bit. So, I’m not just gonna believe that they were too lazy to put it there, because people have been complaining about it not being there. On the other hand: I understand that if the game launches without things like BTB and Forge, they’re gonna take priority over playlist population counters. But shouldn’t they have been added to the game by now?
> >
> > Yeah, I think that they don’t want people to smell blood in the water, because when a community is this badly split, the community eats its wounded.
>
> I don’t think you can compare not having a campaign to not having a population counter. That’s just such terrible hyperbole that I’m not really interested in saying more about that.
>
> I’m not really sure of the real usefulness of playlist population tracking. I mean, it sounds useful at first, but I don’t really know how much I’d ultimately do with that information. It was one of those things that was nice to have, but I don’t remember when the playlist population would’ve significantly impacted my decision about whether to play it or not. That said, that might just be me, and maybe other people base their decisions more heavily on playlist population. I don’t really know. I’ve personally just always found population tracking to feed my data addiction, but not have any practical use for me.
>
> One reason I sometimes doubt the “they’re afraid” argument is that when you think about it, it’s a catch-22 for them. If the population is low and there’s a counter to show that, the people who don’t like the game will use that to argue the game is a failure. If there is no population counter, then people who don’t like the game will say that they’re hiding something, and use that to argue the game is a failure. They’re not going to win that scenario no matter what way they go, so why care about what those people think?
>
> Ultimately, I never wanted to speculate. You asked me to. As far as I’m concerned, I don’t really have any strong theory on why Halo 5 population data isn’t available. Could be that they don’t want to show it, could be that they don’t think it’s important. We don’t know. Someone simply stated that the former is the only possible reason, I responded that it’s not. You asked me to speculate, I didn’t want to because I knew where this was going to go: I speculate, you try to counter argue my speculation because for some reason it’s really important for you what the reason is. And here we are.

At this point, I do not have a lot to add to the conversation. I can say that back on H4 me and a friend of mine wanted to play doubles. There were like 20 players in that playlist, so it took a long time to find a match and when we did find a match the connection was bad. So a population counter wouldn’t be that helpful, but knowing which playlists are dead or under a 100 players would be useful.

I’m sorry for putting you in the awkward position of having to speculate. I just wanted some perspective. I guess removing a population counter is not as bad as removing a campaing. If it isn’t clear at this point, I do not like H5. I played my last game(which I rage-quit) like 3 months ago and deleted the game sometime after that.
I do not know why there is no population counter and it is absolutely possible that they just didn’t wanna put time, money or work into it. But it’s just so much fun complaining about H5 that I might as well add the “if they have a strong population, why not show it off?”- question to the list.

Also, you made me look up what a catch-22 is and I’ve killed for less. Please use layman’s terms.

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> > > > > > 2533274939777077;12722:
> > > > > > > 2533274825830455;12718:
> > > > > > > > 2535455477282651;12716:
> > > > > > > > Halo 2 and 3 average population = 1 million
> > > > > > > > Halo 4 and 5 average population = 20k
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Neither Halo 2 nor Halo 3 ever had over one million players playing simultaneously. The highest provable number of simultanous players in Halo 2 is about 150,000. No evidence exist that there would’ve ever been more players playing simultaneously. A year after release, the momentary population of Halo 2 averaged around 50,000 or so. Likewise, for Halo 3 the highest number of players that can be proven to have been online at the same time is about 372,000, while after a year the average seems to have been more or less 100,000.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > When it comes Halo 5, there exists no reliable information about the population. So, could you not spread misinformation, please?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Why does no reliable information about the population of Halo 5 exist?
> > > > > > The only possible reason i can see for 343 to remove the population count, is that they’re not confident showing the small amount of players playing their game.
> > > > >
> > > > > You said it yourself: there’s no population counter. 343i doesn’t share population numbers—which, to be honest, they aren’t obliged to do. The reasons why they don’t are a matter of speculation. However, that they’re not confident is definitely not the only possible reason.
> > > >
> > > > Would you speculate for us? I mean, what other possible reasons are ther? I know this has nothing to do with sprint, but removal of the population counters kinda bothers me.
> > >
> > > I mean, how about the fact that it’s an extra feature? Like, they never removed anything here, they just didn’t implement a population counter in Halo 5. The lack of population tracking is like the lack of tracking of any other stat that Halo 5 doesn’t track: it’s not necessarily that they don’t want to show it, nobody just took the time to implement it. That to me seems like a very natural reason not to do something that would require extra work that can be allocated elsewhere.
> >
> > “The fact that it’s an extra feature”- based on what? If they were to take out, I mean not implement a campaing in H6, people would be pissed off(like with Rainbow6 and Battlefront). Also, population tracking is not like the tracking of any other stat. Playlist population tracking would be useful to the customer, whereas something like monthly active users-tracking wouldn’t. It would shut up conspiracists like myself for a bit. So, I’m not just gonna believe that they were too lazy to put it there, because people have been complaining about it not being there. On the other hand: I understand that if the game launches without things like BTB and Forge, they’re gonna take priority over playlist population counters. But shouldn’t they have been added to the game by now?
> >
> > Yeah, I think that they don’t want people to smell blood in the water, because when a community is this badly split, the community eats its wounded.
>
> I don’t think you can compare not having a campaign to not having a population counter. That’s just such terrible hyperbole that I’m not really interested in saying more about that.
>
> I’m not really sure of the real usefulness of playlist population tracking. I mean, it sounds useful at first, but I don’t really know how much I’d ultimately do with that information. It was one of those things that was nice to have, but I don’t remember when the playlist population would’ve significantly impacted my decision about whether to play it or not. That said, that might just be me, and maybe other people base their decisions more heavily on playlist population. I don’t really know. I’ve personally just always found population tracking to feed my data addiction, but not have any practical use for me.
>
> One reason I sometimes doubt the “they’re afraid” argument is that when you think about it, it’s a catch-22 for them. If the population is low and there’s a counter to show that, the people who don’t like the game will use that to argue the game is a failure. If there is no population counter, then people who don’t like the game will say that they’re hiding something, and use that to argue the game is a failure. They’re not going to win that scenario no matter what way they go, so why care about what those people think?
>
> Ultimately, I never wanted to speculate. You asked me to. As far as I’m concerned, I don’t really have any strong theory on why Halo 5 population data isn’t available. Could be that they don’t want to show it, could be that they don’t think it’s important. We don’t know. Someone simply stated that the former is the only possible reason, I responded that it’s not. You asked me to speculate, I didn’t want to because I knew where this was going to go: I speculate, you try to counter argue my speculation because for some reason it’s really important for you what the reason is. And here we are.

It’s not a terrible hyperbole. He’s saying that if a company doesn’t include something that has been in previous games constantly, then that is basically the same as Removing it. Especially when you look at a series as a whole, and not at the games individually. At this point in the series, the population counter has been ‘Removed’. And for no good reason.

When Halo 5 is so difficult to find games in compared to other games, a population counter is kinda necessary. I would rather 343 be honest with us and show us the low population, rather than hide it from us. Just seems kinda shady, and 343 is already not exactly the most truthful company anyway. They’ve done quite a lot to tarnish peoples opinion of them over the years.