The sprint discussion thread

> 2625759425619671;11122:
> 4) I did participate in that poll even though I didn’t agree with how it was set up by its OP.
>
> I voted 3. Sprint/No Flinch. How would you have voted?
>
> 5) I disagree… Ultimately the “no sprint fits lore,” concept seems new to me, but IMO lore depicts Spartans that can sprint when the situation demands to do it… Strolling around at one BMS is too relaxed, bulky, and “Robo-cop-like,” to fit the Spartans that I’ve seen in lore sprinting around at top speed. Even when they were kids in the Fall of Reach they had foot races, so one BMS would virtually neutralize that concept because all Spartans would always move around at the same speed regardless of the situation.

4, I voted No Sprint, No Flinch, what does that mean on my stance on Sprint and my stance on Flinch?

5: You disagree that they could easily change the lore so that spartans could shoot accurately while sprinting at their maximum speed?

6: Halo 3 one speed problem???

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> > > > > > > YOU stated that a 10% increase solved the problem of H3’s BMS yet in the next breath say sprint would have done it despite the next Halo game which had sprint got dropped by MLG and the competetive scene has been struggling ever since. You may or may not be trolling but ill say this you are inconsitent and contradict yourself far too often for your opinions to be taken seriously, which funnily enough is exactly whats happening.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The HCS community has been enormously successful in Halo 5, there’s no evidence to support that Halo has been “struggling ever since,” in the competitive scene. There’s nothing contradictory in what I said- Halo 5 has sprint and the competitive community did not have to tweak the default settings to make the game even work in the competitive scene (like they did in Halo 3 when they had one BMS). There’s nothing inconsistent or contradictory about suggesting that the same issues that happened last time Halo had one BMS would just repeat themselves if Halo went back to one BMS.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Had nothing to do with its prize pool 343/MS started with half the Reqs, which I believe they said they would match at the release. Can correct me if you wish, nonetheless, it was still a large sum.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > MLG Dallas had a huge prize pool back in 2006 ($100,000 to the first place team). What’s your point?
> > > >
> > > > Part of the reason that there is an increase in the prize pool is a attributed to the increase in popularity in the game itself; which means that sprint and all- Halo is increasing in popularity in the competitive scene. Another part of the reason is that 343i has been innovative enough to figure out a way to use in-game micro-transactions to help fund the HCS prize pools. Regardless as to how you feel about the micro-transactions, the point remains that the success that 343i accrued from people playing Halo 5 went directly into funding their HCS tournament prize pools.
> > > >
> > > > Either way the “why,” behind the reason that Halo 5 has been successful in the competitive scene isn’t the issue. The issue is that MIGGY483 tried to assert that, “the competetive scene has been struggling ever since,” which is completely untrue! Halo 5 has been successful in the competitive scene with sprint and all.
> > >
> > >
> > > How is competitive halo “thriving”? It’s viewership is awful and people only go to these events because of the money. Even I’d go if there’s 2.5 million dollars involved. If you compare halos competitive scene to others you’ll notice something. Halo has low viewership, but because they throw money out like no other they get a few teams to play it out. Then you compare overwatch which has high viewership but much lower in prize money, however even with said prize money being much lower overwatch gets a lot more people interested in these events. H5 is the first halo game since h3 to have a semi-decent competitive scene, but h5 is in no way thriving. There’s also the issue that it’s pretty much 343/Microsoft lending the money where as other games don’t need to because they have people willing to sponsor them. H5 lacks in sponsors and what’s best is mlg has actually shown interest in partnering with 343 on h5, yet 343 declines it.
> >
> >
> > I didn’t say, “thriving,” I said it has been successful. Most of your points regarding this issue stand, but I don’t see how sprint has anything to do with those sponsorship issues. I have seen over a million viewers at times that I’ve been watching HCS, so I wouldn’t call that “awful,” either however lining up sponsors correctly would definitely help the competitive scene.
>
>
> H5 right now isn’t even top 37 for twitch views. Twitch is what’s used more than anything when it comes to live streaming. I can also link an article where halo5 wasn’t even top 15 when it first launched. You can pretty much find pros and 343 live streaming in it as well. Funny enough they pull in either a few hundred or a few thousand viewers, come these events they hold, I’ve only ever seen it hit 80k at the most. That’s far from a million where as other games do pull in more than even 5 million views. To make it worse destiny is rated higher than h5 and destiny is a joke. It would be amazing to see h5 hit a million cause that’s put it in the top 10, which it’s not even past 37 right now. GoW4 (just came out) is also past h5 in viewership. The one thing the top 10 have in common? Dota, csgo, overwatch, Bo3 (-Yoinking!- Bo3 of all things), LoL, ect ect is they’re watched more for competitive play where as much of h5s streamers are nerds(no offense people) with a few views each lol.
>
> the anwser is simple. While it does have a competitive scene it’s still not found to be an enjoyment to many people. I remember HCS first starting out where 343 had an exclusive emblem only obtainable by watching (which was a lie). That was the only reason I and 5 other guys in party chat did watch it lol.
>
> To a comment you posted saying h5s scene is bigger than h3, nope, h3 and h2 were both known in the competitive scene, h5 is not. and what does money have to do with anything? It’s funded by the devs themselves rather than sponsors. That just shows 343 has to fund it themselves cuz no one else wants to waste money on an incompetent and uncooperative group. Jinx has already mentioned some issues with the current setup. 343 won’t cooperate with their own players on many things, they’ll even lie (breakout being polled when it really wasn’t) to their players and their audience, and they decline offers that would benefit them and their game.
>
> to stay on “topic”, sprint most definately could be part of why h5 lacks in the competitive scene however there’s many other things that could’ve been fixed to mask sprints issues and make the game more tolerable. You have radars, automatics, magnetism, bad maps, bad gametypes mixed with bad maps, the abilities, no LAN, the list goes on.

Okay but I know there were millions of viewers watching the entire HCS tournament because I was watching it too…And I just gave reasons why I thought Halo 5 was bigger- ultimately Halo 2 was the height of the pro scene for Halo so if anything the decline started with Halo 3. There are a number of faults with Halo 5 in the pro community for many of the reasons you stated so no disagreement there… There were faults within the pro scene for every Halo since 2… But in Halo 3 a major fault was corrected by having to adjust its one BMS. The solution was increasing BMS by 10%… I haven’t seen or heard of any major issue in Halo 5 from the pro community hindering on its movement speed. Everything else you said holds true in regards to the problems that the pro community has had, “You have radars, automatics, magnetism, bad maps, bad gametypes mixed with bad maps, the abilities, no LAN, the list goes on.”

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> > 2625759425619671;11122:
> > 4) I did participate in that poll even though I didn’t agree with how it was set up by its OP.
> >
> > I voted 3. Sprint/No Flinch. How would you have voted?
> >
> > 5) I disagree… Ultimately the “no sprint fits lore,” concept seems new to me, but IMO lore depicts Spartans that can sprint when the situation demands to do it… Strolling around at one BMS is too relaxed, bulky, and “Robo-cop-like,” to fit the Spartans that I’ve seen in lore sprinting around at top speed. Even when they were kids in the Fall of Reach they had foot races, so one BMS would virtually neutralize that concept because all Spartans would always move around at the same speed regardless of the situation.
>
>
> 4, I voted No Sprint, No Flinch, what does that mean on my stance on Sprint and my stance on Flinch?
>
> 5: You disagree that they could easily change the lore so that spartans could shoot accurately while sprinting at their maximum speed?
>
> 6: Halo 3 one speed problem???

  1. It could mean that you don’t want any change to Halo… It could mean that you don’t like sprint or flinch. It could mean that you really don’t like one more than the other- but if that poll was re conducted to ask people just how they felt about sprint the results would have been different… At the very least that Reddit user could have cited the poll correctly to include flinch in the original question as it was asked in the original poll, along with the responses in that poll… Furthermore it would have also been right of that Reddit user to acknowledge that the poll was less than one day old at the time of the video and that the results were inconclusive.

  2. Spartans in lore had to sprint when situations dictated that they had to sprint… They don’t walk, or just “walk briskly,” as you’re implying which is all that one BMS could ever provide to Halo.

  3. You picked and chose what to respond to from my response… Either way I’ve spent the past several hours discussing that in this thread. If you like I’ll go back and link one of those posts for you instead because I’d rather not continue to beat that horse in a back and forth debate today.

(Linked post contains a neutral post with good arguments for and against the one BMS problem in Halo 3. I’d rather leave it at that)

<mark>This post has been edited by a moderator. Please do not create alternate accounts to bypass forum bans. Alternate accounts will be permanently banned, and offending users will be subject to both temporary and permanent bans.</mark>

*Original post. Click at your own discretion.

@Shoot2kill
Please stop quoting me. You clearly just do not have the requisite halo knowledge to adequately participate in this discussion.
You think reach plays faster faster than CE because of sprint.
I’m very open to discussion. This is a very interesting topic. You just don’t know what you’re talking about. I’m not saying this about pro sprinters in general. Just you.
If there was a block user or ignore feature I’d use it. But I can’t. So please leave me alone.

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> > >
>
>
> 4) It could mean that you don’t want any change to Halo… It could mean that you don’t like sprint or flinch. It could mean that you really don’t like one more than the other- but if that poll was re conducted to ask people just how they felt about sprint the results would have been different… At the very least that Reddit user could have cited the poll correctly to include flinch in the original question as it was asked in the original poll, along with the responses in that poll… Furthermore it would have also been right of that Reddit user to acknowledge that the poll was less than one day old at the time of the video and that the results were inconclusive.
>
> 5) Spartans in lore had to sprint when situations dictated that they had to sprint… They don’t walk, or just “walk briskly,” as you’re implying which is what one BMS could ever provide to Halo.
>
> 6) You picked and chose what to respond to from my response… I’ve spent the past several hours discussing that in this thread. If you like I’ll go back and link one of those posts for you instead because I’d rather not continue to beat that horse in a back and forth debate today.

4: I’m not discussing the age of the thread or the results of it, neither what the result would be now. I’m talking about the options. It doesn’t matter that I’d dislike one more than the other if I’m of the opinion that none of them should be present. If I wanted one present and not the other, I’d have picked that option.

5: I don’t think you understand.
There is nothing preventing them from writing new lore now, in which Spartans have the ability to move at their fullest speed, be it whatever speed it is, and accurately fire their weapon.

Which would mean that a high BMS speed and no Sprint would be according to the lore. It’d fit the lore.

6: Your responses to the “One speed Halo 3 problem” ended at Tsassi’s quote and questions.
This was never answered either:

> But how was one BMS a problem, if it was too low? And the solution was to increase it?
> You’d still have one BMS, and if the problem was that you had only one BMS, then it’d still be a problem, no matter how much you increased it.

I’m addressing these specific points for the reason that I don’t see a proper answer, otherwise I would have left them.

@Il be Tails

You’ve twisted my words around multiple times so I don’t think you know how to read points from pro sprinters anyways.

You asked for “anything,” regarding why one BMS couldn’t work for Halo and I provided you with your “anything.” From there you went on the offensive saying things like, “You just don’t know what you’re talking about,” which you just said again right there. You can’t say you’re open to discussion if you’re going to try to discount anyone that disagrees with you like that.

You can go back and clearly see in this thread where I’ve proven time and again that I want to have useful, constructive conversations with anyone who is willing to do so in this thread. You can’t just determine that you think that I don’t have enough knowledge to participate in this thread because you do not agree with me. Disagreeing with someone is wholly different then whether or not someone has knowledge.

Bottom line is don’t openly ask for something if you simply cannot handle the answer.

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> > > > > > > > YOU stated that a 10% increase solved the problem of H3’s BMS yet in the next breath say sprint would have done it despite the next Halo game which had sprint got dropped by MLG and the competetive scene has been struggling ever since. You may or may not be trolling but ill say this you are inconsitent and contradict yourself far too often for your opinions to be taken seriously, which funnily enough is exactly whats happening.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > The HCS community has been enormously successful in Halo 5, there’s no evidence to support that Halo has been “struggling ever since,” in the competitive scene. There’s nothing contradictory in what I said- Halo 5 has sprint and the competitive community did not have to tweak the default settings to make the game even work in the competitive scene (like they did in Halo 3 when they had one BMS). There’s nothing inconsistent or contradictory about suggesting that the same issues that happened last time Halo had one BMS would just repeat themselves if Halo went back to one BMS.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Had nothing to do with its prize pool 343/MS started with half the Reqs, which I believe they said they would match at the release. Can correct me if you wish, nonetheless, it was still a large sum.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > MLG Dallas had a huge prize pool back in 2006 ($100,000 to the first place team). What’s your point?
> > > > >
> > > > > Part of the reason that there is an increase in the prize pool is a attributed to the increase in popularity in the game itself; which means that sprint and all- Halo is increasing in popularity in the competitive scene. Another part of the reason is that 343i has been innovative enough to figure out a way to use in-game micro-transactions to help fund the HCS prize pools. Regardless as to how you feel about the micro-transactions, the point remains that the success that 343i accrued from people playing Halo 5 went directly into funding their HCS tournament prize pools.
> > > > >
> > > > > Either way the “why,” behind the reason that Halo 5 has been successful in the competitive scene isn’t the issue. The issue is that MIGGY483 tried to assert that, “the competetive scene has been struggling ever since,” which is completely untrue! Halo 5 has been successful in the competitive scene with sprint and all.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > How is competitive halo “thriving”? It’s viewership is awful and people only go to these events because of the money. Even I’d go if there’s 2.5 million dollars involved. If you compare halos competitive scene to others you’ll notice something. Halo has low viewership, but because they throw money out like no other they get a few teams to play it out. Then you compare overwatch which has high viewership but much lower in prize money, however even with said prize money being much lower overwatch gets a lot more people interested in these events. H5 is the first halo game since h3 to have a semi-decent competitive scene, but h5 is in no way thriving. There’s also the issue that it’s pretty much 343/Microsoft lending the money where as other games don’t need to because they have people willing to sponsor them. H5 lacks in sponsors and what’s best is mlg has actually shown interest in partnering with 343 on h5, yet 343 declines it.
> > >
> > >
> > > I didn’t say, “thriving,” I said it has been successful. Most of your points regarding this issue stand, but I don’t see how sprint has anything to do with those sponsorship issues. I have seen over a million viewers at times that I’ve been watching HCS, so I wouldn’t call that “awful,” either however lining up sponsors correctly would definitely help the competitive scene.
> >
> >
> > H5 right now isn’t even top 37 for twitch views. Twitch is what’s used more than anything when it comes to live streaming. I can also link an article where halo5 wasn’t even top 15 when it first launched. You can pretty much find pros and 343 live streaming in it as well. Funny enough they pull in either a few hundred or a few thousand viewers, come these events they hold, I’ve only ever seen it hit 80k at the most. That’s far from a million where as other games do pull in more than even 5 million views. To make it worse destiny is rated higher than h5 and destiny is a joke. It would be amazing to see h5 hit a million cause that’s put it in the top 10, which it’s not even past 37 right now. GoW4 (just came out) is also past h5 in viewership. The one thing the top 10 have in common? Dota, csgo, overwatch, Bo3 (-Yoinking!- Bo3 of all things), LoL, ect ect is they’re watched more for competitive play where as much of h5s streamers are nerds(no offense people) with a few views each lol.
> >
> > the anwser is simple. While it does have a competitive scene it’s still not found to be an enjoyment to many people. I remember HCS first starting out where 343 had an exclusive emblem only obtainable by watching (which was a lie). That was the only reason I and 5 other guys in party chat did watch it lol.
> >
> > To a comment you posted saying h5s scene is bigger than h3, nope, h3 and h2 were both known in the competitive scene, h5 is not. and what does money have to do with anything? It’s funded by the devs themselves rather than sponsors. That just shows 343 has to fund it themselves cuz no one else wants to waste money on an incompetent and uncooperative group. Jinx has already mentioned some issues with the current setup. 343 won’t cooperate with their own players on many things, they’ll even lie (breakout being polled when it really wasn’t) to their players and their audience, and they decline offers that would benefit them and their game.
> >
> > to stay on “topic”, sprint most definately could be part of why h5 lacks in the competitive scene however there’s many other things that could’ve been fixed to mask sprints issues and make the game more tolerable. You have radars, automatics, magnetism, bad maps, bad gametypes mixed with bad maps, the abilities, no LAN, the list goes on.
>
>
> Okay but I know there were millions of viewers watching the entire HCS tournament because I was watching it too…And I just gave reasons why I thought Halo 5 was bigger- ultimately Halo 2 was the height of the pro scene for Halo so if anything the decline started with Halo 3. There are a number of faults with Halo 5 in the pro community for many of the reasons you stated so no disagreement there… There were faults within the pro scene for every Halo since 2… But in Halo 3 a major fault was corrected by having to adjust its one BMS. The solution was increasing BMS by 10%… I haven’t seen or heard of any major issue in Halo 5 from the pro community hindering on its movement speed. Everything else you said holds true, “You have radars, automatics, magnetism, bad maps, bad gametypes mixed with bad maps, the abilities, no LAN, the list goes on.”

The pros and the competetive community don’t want sprint but no ones asking for it to be taken out of halo 5 and I dont think anyone in here even is, that would be stupid the maps movement bullet magnetism etc are all designed around it, for better or worse.

> 2625759425619671;11129:
> @Il be Tails
>
> You’ve twisted my words around multiple times so I don’t think you know how to read points from pro sprinters anyways.
>
> You asked for “anything,” regarding why one BMS couldn’t work for Halo and I provided you with your “anything.” From there you went on the offensive saying things like, “You just don’t know what you’re talking about,” which you just said again right there. You can’t say you’re open to discussion if you’re going to try to discount anyone that disagrees with you like that.
>
> You can go back see in this thread where I’ve proven time and again that I want to have useful, constructive conversations with anyone who is willing to do so in this thread. You can’t just determine that you think that I don’t have enough knowledge to participate in this thread because you do not agree with me. Disagreeing with someone is wholly different then whether or not someone has knowledge.
>
> Bottom line is don’t openly ask for something if you simply cannot handle the answer.

It’s not that I disagree with you. You just say things that make literally no sense and no matter how many people try to explain why what you’re saying makes no sense, you just keep saying it over and over. I’m convinced you don’t even read what people post.

Saying the entire concept of 1 BMS is flawed because default h3 BMS felt too slow is like saying the entire concept of television is flawed because one channel isn’t coming in well.

@SiN SHOOT2KILL

I want to discuss with you. What is your most up to date post that I can use to talk about the effects of sprint?

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> >
> >
> > 4) It could mean that you don’t want any change to Halo… It could mean that you don’t like sprint or flinch. It could mean that you really don’t like one more than the other- but if that poll was re conducted to ask people just how they felt about sprint the results would have been different… At the very least that Reddit user could have cited the poll correctly to include flinch in the original question as it was asked in the original poll, along with the responses in that poll… Furthermore it would have also been right of that Reddit user to acknowledge that the poll was less than one day old at the time of the video and that the results were inconclusive.
> >
> > 5) Spartans in lore had to sprint when situations dictated that they had to sprint… They don’t walk, or just “walk briskly,” as you’re implying which is what one BMS could ever provide to Halo.
> >
> > 6) You picked and chose what to respond to from my response… I’ve spent the past several hours discussing that in this thread. If you like I’ll go back and link one of those posts for you instead because I’d rather not continue to beat that horse in a back and forth debate today.
>
>
> 4: I’m not discussing the age of the thread or the results of it, neither what the result would be now. I’m talking about the options. It doesn’t matter that I’d dislike one more than the other if I’m of the opinion that none of them should be present. If I wanted one present and not the other, I’d have picked that option.
>
> 5: I don’t think you understand.
> There is nothing preventing them from writing new lore now, in which Spartans have the ability to move at their fullest speed, be it whatever speed it is, and accurately fire their weapon.
>
> Which would mean that a high BMS speed and no Sprint would be according to the lore. It’d fit the lore.
>
> 6: Your responses to the “One speed Halo 3 problem” ended at Tsassi’s quote and questions.
> This was never answered either:
>
>
>
>
> > But how was one BMS a problem, if it was too low? And the solution was to increase it?
> > You’d still have one BMS, and if the problem was that you had only one BMS, then it’d still be a problem, no matter how much you increased it.
>
>
> I’m addressing these specific points for the reason that I don’t see a proper answer, otherwise I would have left them.

  1. The biggest problem with the way the poll was cited on Reddit was the way the poll was cited; versus how it was conducted in the first place. Whether or not the poll was conducted properly in the first place wasn’t even the primary issue for me but I still think the most accurate way to gauge how
    someone feels about sprint is to ask them how they feel about sprint. Either way that Reddit user should have definitely cited that poll correctly to state the original question of the poll and the responses from it.

  2. It’s still neutralizes any notion that speed matters in lore, which I don’t see how that could ever fit in the storyline… Starting from when they were children, Spartans had foot races to see who has faster. In combat, they literally have to move faster than walking speed when the situation dictates. I can’t see one BMS ever fitting into lore- the different you’re describing is sprint/shoot versus sprint/no shoot which could potentially fit but still requires the Spartan to be sprinting in the first place.

  3. I didn’t want to get into a back and forth with a monitor because that’s not generally a wise decision. If that’s how he feels then it’s still a good point.

To answer your persistence to hear my thoughts on this:
It’s not like you can just pick another speed and “hope,” that it would satisfy the pro community. You’d likely miss the mark again just like in Halo 3. You know how to satisfy the pro community on this? Fix the problem before it starts again by giving them multiple speeds- don’t restrict them to one BMS.

> 2533274968707582;11132:
> @SiN SHOOT2KILL
>
> I want to discuss with you. What is your most up to date post that I can use to talk about the effects of sprint?

I’ll look it up for you and link it here in a sec…

Here are 27 or so points where I’ve defending why I think sprint is good for Halo and should stay.

Here and here are two sources from Josh Holmes, 343i’s Executive Producer advocating for sprint in Halo.

For more current points, here are 11 more points that I’ve recently argued for keeping sprint in Halo.

There are more than those, but those are perhaps the most succinct ones out listed out if you’re interested to read them.

Geez. Why’s everybody hating on the sprint? I can’t see any downsides to it. Sprinting is simply a way to get from Point A to Point B quicker than usual. They even developed the game to balance it. Shields don’t regen. No shooting or reloading either, unless you have a certain Armor Mod.

Also, I’m too lazy to look through the many, many pages of text to find a good anti-sprint argument. Does anyone remember any? I need help understanding this

I did a little delving and found some scary stuff.
This thread is a virus. Sure, people are sharing good arguments, but I’m finding a lot content that is hateful and just plain mean. Can’t we all just agree that we have opinions and move on?

> 2625759425619671;11134:
> > 2533274968707582;11132:
> > @SiN SHOOT2KILL
> >
> > I want to discuss with you. What is your most up to date post that I can use to talk about the effects of sprint?
>
>
> I’ll look it up for you and link it here in a sec…
>
> Here are 27 or so points where I’ve defending why I think sprint is good for Halo and should stay.
>
> Here and here are two sources from Josh Holmes, 343i’s Executive Producer advocating for sprint in Halo.
>
> For more current points, here are 11 more points that I’ve recently argued for keeping sprint in Halo.
>
> There are more than those, but those are perhaps the most succinct ones out listed out if you’re interested to read them.

For future reference, please refer to this post when talking about Josh Holmes in why he included sprint in halo 5.

<mark>This post has been edited by a moderator. Please refrain from making non-constructive posts.</mark>

*Original post. Click at your own discretion.

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> > > > > > YOU stated that a 10% increase solved the problem of H3’s BMS yet in the next breath say sprint would have done it despite the next Halo game which had sprint got dropped by MLG and the competetive scene has been struggling ever since. You may or may not be trolling but ill say this you are inconsitent and contradict yourself far too often for your opinions to be taken seriously, which funnily enough is exactly whats happening.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > The HCS community has been enormously successful in Halo 5, there’s no evidence to support that Halo has been “struggling ever since,” in the competitive scene. There’s nothing contradictory in what I said- Halo 5 has sprint and the competitive community did not have to tweak the default settings to make the game even work in the competitive scene (like they did in Halo 3 when they had one BMS). There’s nothing inconsistent or contradictory about suggesting that the same issues that happened last time Halo had one BMS would just repeat themselves if Halo went back to one BMS.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Had nothing to do with its prize pool 343/MS started with half the Reqs, which I believe they said they would match at the release. Can correct me if you wish, nonetheless, it was still a large sum.
> > >
> > >
> > > MLG Dallas had a huge prize pool back in 2006 ($100,000 to the first place team). What’s your point?
> > >
> > > Part of the reason that there is an increase in the prize pool is a attributed to the increase in popularity in the game itself; which means that sprint and all- Halo is increasing in popularity in the competitive scene. Another part of the reason is that 343i has been innovative enough to figure out a way to use in-game micro-transactions to help fund the HCS prize pools. Regardless as to how you feel about the micro-transactions, the point remains that the success that 343i accrued from people playing Halo 5 went directly into funding their HCS tournament prize pools.
> > >
> > > Either way the “why,” behind the reason that Halo 5 has been successful in the competitive scene isn’t the issue. The issue is that MIGGY483 tried to assert that, “the competetive scene has been struggling ever since,” which is completely untrue! Halo 5 has been successful in the competitive scene with sprint and all.
> >
> >
> > 1) I’m convinced you don’t watch the HCS, and know literally nothing about the scene.
> >
> > 2) Competitive Halo has been doing slightly better in Halo 5.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > >
>
>
> 1) You have no basis for which to stand upon to even tell me something like that… You don’t like sprint so makes sense for you to go on such an offensive but trying to tell me that I “know literally nothing about the scene,” is just stupid so stop it.
>
> 2) Based off… what? Oh yeah, your opinions about how you feel competitive Halo is doing- well based on the millions of viewers that I’ve seen on Twitch for HCS and the millions of dollars in prize pools I think competitive Halo has been doing fine in Halo 5. It’s certainlybeen doing better than it did in Halo 3, with sprint and all…
>
> You know in this thread you extreme anti-sprint guys have been very aggressive against anyone with a pro sprint opinion. You try to run people out of the thread if they say they like sprint but won’t get into an argument with you about it. So you’ll continuously press and demand for pro sprint opinions just to try to shoot them down and “demolish,” or “destroy,” (as you call it) any pro sprint opinions that you see anyway. You don’t want to hear people’s opinions on sprint you want to argue to no end about it. That’s really not a debate- you guys are just waging a flame war against sprint.
>
> Understand that this thread is not where sprint/no sprint will be decided. Getting into heated arguments with your fellow Halo fans about this accomplishes nothing but potentially dividing the community further… That’s it. There are potential compromises to this issue that don’t involve shouting matches over sprint/no sprint being an all or nothing issue.

  1. Is this a joke? This is 100% wrong. No other event besides the HWC Regionals made it even CLOSE to 100k.

> Part of the reason that there is an increase in the prize pool is a attributed to the increase in popularity in the game itself; which means that sprint and all- Halo is increasing in popularity in the competitive scene.

  1. Based off of the above statement and you thinking the scene has had millions of views on twitch. SiN, I think you’re trolling us. EU HCS, NA is sub 10k average without OpTic.

> It’s certainly been doing better than it did in Halo 3, with sprint and all…

You’re delusional. I’m being serious now, did even WATCH comp H3? I can’t take you seriously anymore, this has to be a troll.

Look SiN, I’m not trying to be condescending with this post, but almost everything you wrote was completely false.

Why do you think we press for reasons? The pro sprint side DOES NOT GIVE THEM. I can give you a whole list of problems sprint does, and an incredibly talented forger is already making a video on sprint and its effects on map design. These are NOT opinions SiN, and we are not trying to attack anyone. The issue is that people on the pro sprint side do not give any reason besides immersion.

Look, let’s cover some ground here. These are sprint’s cons-

- Maps are stretched to accommodate the different speeds
- Forced to put gun down to effectively move around the map
- Death is less penalized, as you are able to return fast to the action
- Movement outside of sprint is sluggish to justify you sprinting
- It messes up a consistent pace, since there’re multiple movement speeds you can move at**What are sprint’s pros? There isn’t much to debate about these issues besides the points themselves.

Reading recent comments/conversations, and I still don’t understand why people describe Halo CE-Halo 3 movement speed as “walking” or “power-walking”. If you actually pay attention to a) how the Master Chief moves and b) his movement speed in comparison to the Marines and enemies, he (and therefore multiplayer Spartans) is not “walking/power walking”. In the game, you are still moving faster than anyone else.

Also, if Halo Reach-Halo 5 did not have sprinting features, you would probably feel just as “slow” trying to make your way across a wide-open map. The size of the maps create a sensation of moving “slow”, but once you get into any confined map in any Halo game, immediately you “feel” you are going “faster”. It’s all an illusion.

> 2535422073870659;11135:
> Geez. Why’s everybody hating on the sprint? I can’t see any downsides to it. Sprinting is simply a way to get from Point A to Point B quicker than usual. They even developed the game to balance it. Shields don’t regen. No shooting or reloading either, unless you have a certain Armor Mod.
>
> Also, I’m too lazy to look through the many, many pages of text to find a good anti-sprint argument. Does anyone remember any? I need help understanding this
> …
> I did a little delving and found some scary stuff.
> This thread is a virus. Sure, people are sharing good arguments, but I’m finding a lot content that is hateful and just plain mean. Can’t we all just agree that we have opinions and move on?

-Sprint seperates movement from combat.

-Sprint adds a risk/reward mechanic into a game that was built from the ground up to limit/eliminate risk reward mechanics and replace them with reward/reward mechanics.

-Sprint causes maps to be stretched out. This causes all sorts of issues with the main one being that it causes the BMS to feel very slow.

> 2535450703392903;11139:
> > 2535422073870659;11135:
> > Geez. Why’s everybody hating on the sprint? I can’t see any downsides to it. Sprinting is simply a way to get from Point A to Point B quicker than usual. They even developed the game to balance it. Shields don’t regen. No shooting or reloading either, unless you have a certain Armor Mod.
> >
> > Also, I’m too lazy to look through the many, many pages of text to find a good anti-sprint argument. Does anyone remember any? I need help understanding this
> > …
> > I did a little delving and found some scary stuff.
> > This thread is a virus. Sure, people are sharing good arguments, but I’m finding a lot content that is hateful and just plain mean. Can’t we all just agree that we have opinions and move on?
>
>
> -Sprint seperates movement from combat.
>
> -Sprint adds a risk/reward mechanic into a game that was built from the ground up to limit/eliminate risk reward mechanics and replace them with reward/reward mechanics.
>
> -Sprint causes maps to be stretched out. This causes all sorts of issues with the main one being that it causes the BMS to feel very slow.

Thank you

<mark>This post has been edited by a moderator. Please refrain from making non-constructive posts.</mark>

*Original post. Click at your own discretion.

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> > 2625759425619671;11118:
> > > 2533274970658419;11117:
> > > > 2625759425619671;11092:
> > > > > 2533274819667356;11090:
> > > > > > 2625759425619671;11077:
> > > > > > > 2533274921982810;11076:
> > > > > > > YOU stated that a 10% increase solved the problem of H3’s BMS yet in the next breath say sprint would have done it despite the next Halo game which had sprint got dropped by MLG and the competetive scene has been struggling ever since. You may or may not be trolling but ill say this you are inconsitent and contradict yourself far too often for your opinions to be taken seriously, which funnily enough is exactly whats happening.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The HCS community has been enormously successful in Halo 5, there’s no evidence to support that Halo has been “struggling ever since,” in the competitive scene. There’s nothing contradictory in what I said- Halo 5 has sprint and the competitive community did not have to tweak the default settings to make the game even work in the competitive scene (like they did in Halo 3 when they had one BMS). There’s nothing inconsistent or contradictory about suggesting that the same issues that happened last time Halo had one BMS would just repeat themselves if Halo went back to one BMS.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Had nothing to do with its prize pool 343/MS started with half the Reqs, which I believe they said they would match at the release. Can correct me if you wish, nonetheless, it was still a large sum.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > MLG Dallas had a huge prize pool back in 2006 ($100,000 to the first place team). What’s your point?
> > > >
> > > > Part of the reason that there is an increase in the prize pool is a attributed to the increase in popularity in the game itself; which means that sprint and all- Halo is increasing in popularity in the competitive scene. Another part of the reason is that 343i has been innovative enough to figure out a way to use in-game micro-transactions to help fund the HCS prize pools. Regardless as to how you feel about the micro-transactions, the point remains that the success that 343i accrued from people playing Halo 5 went directly into funding their HCS tournament prize pools.
> > > >
> > > > Either way the “why,” behind the reason that Halo 5 has been successful in the competitive scene isn’t the issue. The issue is that MIGGY483 tried to assert that, “the competetive scene has been struggling ever since,” which is completely untrue! Halo 5 has been successful in the competitive scene with sprint and all.
> > >
> > >
> > > 1) I’m convinced you don’t watch the HCS, and know literally nothing about the scene.
> > >
> > > 2) Competitive Halo has been doing slightly better in Halo 5.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> >
> >
> > 1) You have no basis for which to stand upon to even tell me something like that… You don’t like sprint so makes sense for you to go on such an offensive but trying to tell me that I “know literally nothing about the scene,” is just stupid so stop it.
> >
> > 2) Based off… what? Oh yeah, your opinions about how you feel competitive Halo is doing- well based on the millions of viewers that I’ve seen on Twitch for HCS and the millions of dollars in prize pools I think competitive Halo has been doing fine in Halo 5. It’s certainlybeen doing better than it did in Halo 3, with sprint and all…
> >
> > You know in this thread you extreme anti-sprint guys have been very aggressive against anyone with a pro sprint opinion. You try to run people out of the thread if they say they like sprint but won’t get into an argument with you about it. So you’ll continuously press and demand for pro sprint opinions just to try to shoot them down and “demolish,” or “destroy,” (as you call it) any pro sprint opinions that you see anyway. You don’t want to hear people’s opinions on sprint you want to argue to no end about it. That’s really not a debate- you guys are just waging a flame war against sprint.
> >
> > Understand that this thread is not where sprint/no sprint will be decided. Getting into heated arguments with your fellow Halo fans about this accomplishes nothing but potentially dividing the community further… That’s it. There are potential compromises to this issue that don’t involve shouting matches over sprint/no sprint being an all or nothing issue.
>
>
> 1) Is this a joke? This is 100% wrong. No other event besides the HWC Regionals made it even CLOSE to 100k.
>
>
> > Part of the reason that there is an increase in the prize pool is a attributed to the increase in popularity in the game itself; which means that sprint and all- Halo is increasing in popularity in the competitive scene.
>
>
> 2) Based off of the above statement and you thinking the scene has had millions of views on twitch. SiN, I think you’re trolling us. EU HCS, NA is sub 10k average without OpTic.
>
>
> > It’s certainly been doing better than it did in Halo 3, with sprint and all…
>
>
> You’re delusional. I’m being serious now, did even WATCH comp H3? I can’t take you seriously anymore, this has to be a troll.
>
> Look SiN, I’m not trying to be condescending with this post, but almost everything you wrote was completely false.
> —
> Why do you think we press for reasons? The pro sprint side DOES NOT GIVE THEM. I can give you a whole list of problems sprint does, and an incredibly talented forger is already making a video on sprint and its effects on map design. These are NOT opinions SiN, and we are not trying to attack anyone. The issue is that people on the pro sprint side do not give any reason besides immersion.
>
> Look, let’s cover some ground here. These are sprint’s cons-
>
> - Maps are stretched to accommodate the different speeds
> - Forced to put gun down to effectively move around the map
> - Death is less penalized, as you are able to return fast to the action
> - Movement outside of sprint is sluggish to justify you sprinting
> - It messes up a consistent pace, since there’re multiple movement speeds you can move at
> What are sprint’s pros? There isn’t much to debate about these issues besides the points themselves.

Dude, save your sanity and ignore him as best you can. He is literally delusional or trolling.

My new theory is that he’s trying to just say the most flame baity things possible to trigger people so either all the “anti sprint” posters get banned or the thread gets locked. His posts just get more and more ridiculous. It’s gotten to the point where it’s now obvious that he’s trolling.

Im going to start reporting his posts.

> 2625759425619671;10186:
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> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2533275047762341;10136:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why do so many of you hate sprinting
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > That’s a good question- my theory is that most of the anti sprinters think they’d play better without sprint so they want it removed to cater to their play style so they can chase people easier.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 500 pages in, over 10 000 posts, and you have a theory about it, when there are posts about why it’s disliked, and have been since its inclusion in Reach.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What a mystery.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > You know what I find most eye-opening about that poll?? It just asked players if they wanted to keep flinch/sprint… That’s it- yet it’s important enough for you to cite it. Point is that you told me and others that our pro sprint opinions are worthless if we don’t explain ourselves yet no one who voted in those polls that mean so much to you now had to explain themselves. Once again those opinions matter to you because they support your opinion- opinions that don’t support your own never seem to matter to you- such as all the polls that sprint did win in these forums
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever you say, man. Your poll reading skills - or lack thereof - aren’t hurting me.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > 2625759425619671;10144:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2533274819567236;10139:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2533274977828559;10134:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sprint is an evolution in any game, remove it is not an option
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > You need to stop discounting pro sprinters who just want to give their opinion about sprint- especially if you’re going to keep referencing polls that were taken regarding players opinions on sprint.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > If they want to make some claim about why sprint is better or why no sprint is worse, then they should back it up. If they don’t like that, then they shouldn’t post.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Just learn to read polls man. That’s on you, I can’t help you there. I don’t know why you keep bringing it up.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > No you can’t defend yourself here you have NO RIGHT to tell someone they shouldn’t post.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > And you know perfectly well why I’m bringing up the polls - you want to use polls to defend your anti sprint opinion but NO ONE in those polls you use now were required to back up their opinions on sprint. Under your logic you shouldn’t ever reference a poll again because they don’t have to back up their opinions to vote in those polls.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > No right? I just did, look at that. You’re free to not post to btw. This topic seems to be bothering you, so maybe it’s for the best.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > You telling someone not to post because their opinions are worthless is like a fake bully with no real power trying to tell people they can’t walk on a sidewalk. You have no basis to say something like that in the first place and people don’t have to and shouldn’t listen to you in the first place…
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I didn’t say that, so what’s the problem again?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > You wanna tell me how sprint benefits the game? You don’t even need to read any polls, just use your own words. Or maybe you already did and it was just lost in a sea posts complaining about something else. Either way, try giving your thoughts or linking to where you did.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > My problem was clear and you’re trying to deflect again.
> > > > >
> > > > > My problem. is you telling people they “shouldn’t post,” or equally to that- when you say that their opinions are “worthless,” and you try to drive people out of this thread if they don’t agree with your anti sprint opinion.
> > > > >
> > > > > And I just told you that so maybe you should try reading this time.
> > > > >
> > > > > You said,
> > > > > “If they want to make some claim about why sprint is better or why no sprint is worse, then they should back it up. If they don’t like that, then they shouldn’t post.”
> > > > >
> > > > > I said my problem with you in the first sentence on my reply to that here:
> > > > >
> > > > > “No you can’t defend yourself here or deflect anything this time- you have absolutely NO RIGHT to tell someone they shouldn’t post.
> > > > >
> > > > > And you know perfectly well why I’m bringing up the polls - you want to use polls to defend your anti sprint opinion but NO ONE in those polls you use now were required to back up their opinions on sprint. Under your logic you shouldn’t ever reference a poll again because they don’t have to back up their opinions to vote in those polls.
> > > > >
> > > > > What it actually boils down to is that you want another way to try to discredit anyone who is pro sprint, but that’s not the point. The point is that you’re being a pure hypocrite by citing polls about sprint when those are just opinions in the first place and then flipping around here and trying to tell people not to post their opinions because they’re “worthless,” to you if they’re pro sprint.”
> > > > >
> > > > > I was succinct and to the point in describing how you’re trying to act like a cyber bully to people in this thread by running them out simply if they disagree with you.
> > > > > You do the same thing every time in this thread:
> > > > >
> > > > > -First you demand explanation for pro sprint opinions otherwise you tell those people their opinions are worthless and then you try to run them out of the thread
> > > > >
> > > > > -Otherwise if they do engage with you you’ll just try to chew ups their opinions and if they don’t change their minds about sprint then you’ll just try to run them out of the thread anyway.

Ignore this, I made a summary in the next quote.

> 2533274990620516;11034:
> They add more variety to gameplay. There are so many more things players can do now, which keeps matches exciting and unpredictable. It doesn’t alienate older fans in the slightest, you’re only alienating yourself by choosing not to consider any new features.

But A.) This variety’s always been in Halo, and B.) unpredictability is a bad thing, and doesn’t always equal “excitement”. If anything, it makes the game more stressful, because you know next to nothing about enemy movement or paths, since there are so many paths to take, and so many speeds and actions to travel across them with. Being killed because you couldn’t predict one of the six ways the enemy could come at you isn’t exciting. It’s annoying.

> 2533274990620516;11034:
> Assassinate: forcing yourself into an animation for a few seconds so you’re exposed to enemy attacks
> Sprint: your shields don’t recharge. AND you can’t shoot your gun…
> Ground Pound: you’re exposed to incoming fire and takes a couple seconds to prepare; risky kill
> Spartan Charge: can’t shoot while you’re in the animation and requires you to be sprinting beforehand to get to a close range
> Smart Scope: remvoes radar in most cases

Assassinations - Don’t get what that has to do with abilities.

Sprint - Okay? Your shields don’t recharge? And? Just run away. The maps are segmented enough to where being able to run is stupidly easy and you’re moving faster than your opponent who’s attacking you, so in order to follow you, they’d need to sprint as well, just resulting in cat and mouse gameplay. There’s no risk to that. It just slows down gameplay, while also messing with the pace of games in general.

Ground Pound - You’re exposed, sure, but you can also just quickly activate the ability and hit someone with your splash damage, without needing a direct hit. And because of the splash damage’s bleedthrough and your increased vulnerability to projectiles without shielding, you’re going to most likely die unless you have a good enough headstart before they hit you. Or a power weapon at that. It’s one of the better abilities, being solely offensive, but you should be vulnerable for slightly longer and the splash damage should be nowhere near as big as it is. Good idea, super generous ability.

Spartan Charge - Okay? The lunge and magnetism on the ability make it stupidly easy to abuse. You can sprint, charge, stunlock someone, and shoot them before they come out of the stunlock. It’s the worst offensive offender, because it literally rewards you for reckless plays. It’s not a good ability at all in its current implementation. The beta’s was, when you literally had no auto aim for the ability and would miss more often than you’d hit. And the hit was equal to a melee, not a melee and a little more via bleedthrough.

Smart Scope - What? Every scoping system in Halo did that to you.

> 2533274990620516;11034:
> Walk, crouch, melee, shoot, and grenade do not have negatives because they are true basic functions. Thrust, clamber, and slide don’t have repercussions because ultimately they don’t impact much, as they are A) very quick movements and B) don’t impact the death of an enemy, unlike the other spartan abilities I listed. The only one that is questionable is slide since you can shoot while doing it. But you do have to be sprinting first, which does add the fact that you can’t recharge your shields or shoot until you’re actually on the ground sliding.

Sprint and thrust don’t impact much? What? They literally impact how the very game plays, now. They don’t impact the death of the enemy, but they sure impact your own, and can prevent you from dying in situations that you should die from. They make the game less punishing overall. And they yank control from the player as well. You can’t shoot when you sprint, thrust, or slide until the ability’s done.

> 2533274990620516;11034:
> > people can abuse many of the new abilities without repercussions. People can sprint or thrust out of situations, use clamber to gain higher elevation for the same purpose. They can also use Spartan Charge and sometimes Ground Pound (Only through the splash damage sense) to gain braindead easy kills, no matter the skill level, and use slide as an escape method.
>
>
> How exactly is any of that abuse? Seems like you were just defining their uses. It’s only abuse if you do the same thing over and over again with no signs of being stopped or having to deal with any negative outcomes. But like I wrote above, there are problems if you choose to Spartan Charge or Ground Pound repeatedly.

The negative outcomes are literally listed there. People escape situations they’d normally die in, or get kills they normally shouldn’t have, regardless of skill. I can’t begin to tell you how many times I’ve been randomly spartan charged by someone obviously new to the game, and they got the kill on me, because it left me one bullet away from death, to where I couldn’t do anything, and they could shoot me, before I could react. It’s super frustrating to be killed by in game cheese like that, when I’m outright better than someone, solely because of improperly balanced and unneeded mechanics.