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> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2535451091657464;10869:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You know what’d be great? If we forgot about this thread, and it just - blew away
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This thread is a pillow for the 11%ers to scream into. Granted, they’ve been screaming into it for a year now, but it’s cheaper than therapy.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Stop dismissing Anti-Sprinters as the bottom precentile. If Sprint wasn’t a big deal this thread would not be the massive back and forth that it has become. Understand that your stance is not the end all of this debate and If enough people don’t want to put up with the shotty movement of Halo 5 then they have every -Yoinking!- right to Assert their dismay until they’re catered to. Stop acting like an over irritated soccer Mom and Let Discussions run their course. Sprint’s affect on Map Flow is not Innocent. No matter how hard you try to convince yourself otherwise
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Granted, it’s been a while since the poll, but it showed that 11% were completely against sprint. That’s not me making it up. If there has been a more scientific poll with an appropriately sized sample base I completely missed it. As far as thread size, how many unique users does it have? How many of them are anti-sprint? This is an echo chamber of like-minded people that’s been going on for a while now. Of course it’s big. That proves nothing in the grand scheme of things.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You criticize me for asserting an opinion and then go on to state a couple of your own as absolute truths while lecturing me on not allowing a conversation to run it’s course. Do I need to explain why that is just silly/hypocritical?
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Plenty of people have eloquently explained why they disagree with sprint and it has contributed to the discussion in a meaningful way. Your response to me was anything but.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > By the way, I feel for the 11%ers. I’ve said it since day one. I don’t think their opinion has any less merit than my own, I just think I’m fortunate enough to be in the majority on this one. And that’s what it all comes down to. I think most halo players these days just want to sprint. If 343 want’s to maximize profits (they’re a business, they are not our bros) then they have to cater to the majority. Some times that’s you, sometimes it’s someone else.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway wasn’t trying to trigger you. I mean, I can see how that whole pillow comment can be construed as snide. I just try to be a little colorful when I post. Bored at work.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > The majority of people who currently play halo are the minority though. That’s the problem.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry, I don’t follow.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > Let’s say there are 100k people who regularly play H5. Even if 90% of those people like sprint it doesn’t really matter because there are millions upon millions upon millions of potential halo players out there who’s preferences are largely unknown.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > A poll was conducted closer to launch when more people were playing. The results were overwhelmingly pro-sprint.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > What was that again?
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I think the problem here is that you are under the impression that a reddit poll is accurate. It really isn’t, I promise.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Proof speaks louder than words. If I wanted to I could probably go and find all the polls mentioned by the post.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Polls are opinionated in the first place… What’s the point of going down such a rabbit hole? The best way to truly gauge players’ opinions about sprint would be for 343i to let players try the next Halo title in an open beta. 343i can collect feedback after players try playlists with and without sprint.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Sprint is opinionated also, your point?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > An open beta wont give the developers enough time to make the gameplay decisions needed by the time of release. These type of decisions need to be made very early into the development process.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > My “point,” was that showing proof of a poll that’s opinionated in the first place is really mute to begins with. And games can be tweaked a tremendous amount during the development cycle; especially via betas.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Then Halo 6 or future Halo game’s public testing should be on very early stage of development, earlier than alpha, to remove or add mechanics to the game. Simply removing or adding after the feedback doesn’t work.
> > >
> > >
> > > You’re basing that assumption off of what? Your own expert opinion that we should all just believe? How about I help you with this one by citing the multiple open betas for Halo Wars 2 and the fact that 343i has made multiple changes to its gameplay mechanics during the development cycle directly based off of fan feedback.
> >
> >
> > Halo Wars 2’s release date was delayed to 2017. 343’s changes, if you are talking about Halo 5, from beta to final are not notable. Is there a mechanic that was removed or added from the beta?
>
>
> Yeah the leader powers and the way the tree works were all changed due to fan feedback, according to Dan Ayoub. The game types were even tweaked, a ton of monumental changes were applied after the beta which were a direct result of feedback received from the first open beta… And the game wasn’t delayed because of the beta- far as I know February 2017 was always the target month for launch.
The main discussion here is the mechanic. Other than system or U.I. changes (maybe I wasn’t clear enough when I was asking the question), were there any mechanical changes (added or removed) made from beta?
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> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2535451091657464;10869:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You know what’d be great? If we forgot about this thread, and it just - blew away
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This thread is a pillow for the 11%ers to scream into. Granted, they’ve been screaming into it for a year now, but it’s cheaper than therapy.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Stop dismissing Anti-Sprinters as the bottom precentile. If Sprint wasn’t a big deal this thread would not be the massive back and forth that it has become. Understand that your stance is not the end all of this debate and If enough people don’t want to put up with the shotty movement of Halo 5 then they have every -Yoinking!- right to Assert their dismay until they’re catered to. Stop acting like an over irritated soccer Mom and Let Discussions run their course. Sprint’s affect on Map Flow is not Innocent. No matter how hard you try to convince yourself otherwise
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Granted, it’s been a while since the poll, but it showed that 11% were completely against sprint. That’s not me making it up. If there has been a more scientific poll with an appropriately sized sample base I completely missed it. As far as thread size, how many unique users does it have? How many of them are anti-sprint? This is an echo chamber of like-minded people that’s been going on for a while now. Of course it’s big. That proves nothing in the grand scheme of things.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You criticize me for asserting an opinion and then go on to state a couple of your own as absolute truths while lecturing me on not allowing a conversation to run it’s course. Do I need to explain why that is just silly/hypocritical?
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Plenty of people have eloquently explained why they disagree with sprint and it has contributed to the discussion in a meaningful way. Your response to me was anything but.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > By the way, I feel for the 11%ers. I’ve said it since day one. I don’t think their opinion has any less merit than my own, I just think I’m fortunate enough to be in the majority on this one. And that’s what it all comes down to. I think most halo players these days just want to sprint. If 343 want’s to maximize profits (they’re a business, they are not our bros) then they have to cater to the majority. Some times that’s you, sometimes it’s someone else.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway wasn’t trying to trigger you. I mean, I can see how that whole pillow comment can be construed as snide. I just try to be a little colorful when I post. Bored at work.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The majority of people who currently play halo are the minority though. That’s the problem.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry, I don’t follow.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Let’s say there are 100k people who regularly play H5. Even if 90% of those people like sprint it doesn’t really matter because there are millions upon millions upon millions of potential halo players out there who’s preferences are largely unknown.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > A poll was conducted closer to launch when more people were playing. The results were overwhelmingly pro-sprint.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > What was that again?
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > I think the problem here is that you are under the impression that a reddit poll is accurate. It really isn’t, I promise.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Proof speaks louder than words. If I wanted to I could probably go and find all the polls mentioned by the post.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Polls are opinionated in the first place… What’s the point of going down such a rabbit hole? The best way to truly gauge players’ opinions about sprint would be for 343i to let players try the next Halo title in an open beta. 343i can collect feedback after players try playlists with and without sprint.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Sprint is opinionated also, your point?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > An open beta wont give the developers enough time to make the gameplay decisions needed by the time of release. These type of decisions need to be made very early into the development process.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > My “point,” was that showing proof of a poll that’s opinionated in the first place is really mute to begins with. And games can be tweaked a tremendous amount during the development cycle; especially via betas.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Then Halo 6 or future Halo game’s public testing should be on very early stage of development, earlier than alpha, to remove or add mechanics to the game. Simply removing or adding after the feedback doesn’t work.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > You’re basing that assumption off of what? Your own expert opinion that we should all just believe? How about I help you with this one by citing the multiple open betas for Halo Wars 2 and the fact that 343i has made multiple changes to its gameplay mechanics during the development cycle directly based off of fan feedback.
> > >
> > >
> > > Halo Wars 2’s release date was delayed to 2017. 343’s changes, if you are talking about Halo 5, from beta to final are not notable. Is there a mechanic that was removed or added from the beta?
> >
> >
> > Yeah the leader powers and the way the tree works were all changed due to fan feedback, according to Dan Ayoub. The game types were even tweaked, a ton of monumental changes were applied after the beta which were a direct result of feedback received from the first open beta… And the game wasn’t delayed because of the beta- far as I know February 2017 was always the target month for launch.
>
>
> The main discussion here is the mechanic. Other than system or U.I. changes (maybe I wasn’t clear enough when I was asking the question), were there any mechanical changes (added or removed) made from beta?
Changing leader powers is changing a mechanic of the game… Halo Wars 2 is a RTS which is different than a FPS and leader powers are a game mechanic in that type of game (Not a system or U.I. change)
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> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2535451091657464;10869:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You know what’d be great? If we forgot about this thread, and it just - blew away
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This thread is a pillow for the 11%ers to scream into. Granted, they’ve been screaming into it for a year now, but it’s cheaper than therapy.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Stop dismissing Anti-Sprinters as the bottom precentile. If Sprint wasn’t a big deal this thread would not be the massive back and forth that it has become. Understand that your stance is not the end all of this debate and If enough people don’t want to put up with the shotty movement of Halo 5 then they have every -Yoinking!- right to Assert their dismay until they’re catered to. Stop acting like an over irritated soccer Mom and Let Discussions run their course. Sprint’s affect on Map Flow is not Innocent. No matter how hard you try to convince yourself otherwise
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Granted, it’s been a while since the poll, but it showed that 11% were completely against sprint. That’s not me making it up. If there has been a more scientific poll with an appropriately sized sample base I completely missed it. As far as thread size, how many unique users does it have? How many of them are anti-sprint? This is an echo chamber of like-minded people that’s been going on for a while now. Of course it’s big. That proves nothing in the grand scheme of things.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You criticize me for asserting an opinion and then go on to state a couple of your own as absolute truths while lecturing me on not allowing a conversation to run it’s course. Do I need to explain why that is just silly/hypocritical?
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Plenty of people have eloquently explained why they disagree with sprint and it has contributed to the discussion in a meaningful way. Your response to me was anything but.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > By the way, I feel for the 11%ers. I’ve said it since day one. I don’t think their opinion has any less merit than my own, I just think I’m fortunate enough to be in the majority on this one. And that’s what it all comes down to. I think most halo players these days just want to sprint. If 343 want’s to maximize profits (they’re a business, they are not our bros) then they have to cater to the majority. Some times that’s you, sometimes it’s someone else.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway wasn’t trying to trigger you. I mean, I can see how that whole pillow comment can be construed as snide. I just try to be a little colorful when I post. Bored at work.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The majority of people who currently play halo are the minority though. That’s the problem.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry, I don’t follow.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Let’s say there are 100k people who regularly play H5. Even if 90% of those people like sprint it doesn’t really matter because there are millions upon millions upon millions of potential halo players out there who’s preferences are largely unknown.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > A poll was conducted closer to launch when more people were playing. The results were overwhelmingly pro-sprint.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > What was that again?
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > I think the problem here is that you are under the impression that a reddit poll is accurate. It really isn’t, I promise.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Proof speaks louder than words. If I wanted to I could probably go and find all the polls mentioned by the post.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Polls are opinionated in the first place… What’s the point of going down such a rabbit hole? The best way to truly gauge players’ opinions about sprint would be for 343i to let players try the next Halo title in an open beta. 343i can collect feedback after players try playlists with and without sprint.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Sprint is opinionated also, your point?
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > An open beta wont give the developers enough time to make the gameplay decisions needed by the time of release. These type of decisions need to be made very early into the development process.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > My “point,” was that showing proof of a poll that’s opinionated in the first place is really mute to begins with. And games can be tweaked a tremendous amount during the development cycle; especially via betas.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Polls are supposed to be opinions on debatable topics. They show a consensus of the general public on the topic being discussed (In this case Halo and sprint). I dont see how thousands of peoples opinions can just be disregarded, I bet if the polls favored differently you wouldnt be saying the same thing.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Again, if you think a beta can solve all the problems then you are gravely mistaken. Sprint is not a minor change, it needs to be adjusted within the game accordingly. You remove sprint and a huge dynamic of the game changes. Removing sprint is not something you can adjust to within a year. Sprint is something that must be decided upon early in development.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Polls only show a census if properly executed. There have been a plethora of polls executed incorrectly such as the Reddit poll which tried to combine flinch/sprint and people later referenced the poll by trying to skew results out of the flinch/sprint poll to support their anti sprint stance… Furthermore those polls have have anywhere from a few dozen to a maximum of a few thousand participants. Halo titles sell units in the millions so that’s hardly acceptable as a sample size of the population- especially since such a large amount of gamers wouldn’t take the time to go onto forums looking for polls like that in the first place… And the ones that would have a problem with something are more likely to go looking for mediums to express their discontent than those who are satisfied with something like sprint.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Why does flinch matter? The people voting still stated they did not want sprint, with or without flinch.
> > > > >
> > > > > The people on the forums are the ones who truly care about the game, these are the people companies should be listening to. If we were to ask the general gaming community then they would vote for sprint without a doubt, however these aren’t the people buying the games so why do their opinions have a big say in what goes on? They have other games to accommodate their needs, why do they need to change Halo to their liking?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Flinch and sprint are two separate game mechanics. Convoluting the two into one poll dilutes the results. The Reddit user should have cited the poll the way it was conducted because the results could have been completely different if the original poll didn’t include anything about flinch. Flinch was a mechanic that could have been removed and was it hated by a lot of people.
> > >
> > >
> > > The people voting still stated they did not want sprint, with or without flinch.
> > > Its not like they would just magically change their mind and vote for keeping sprint if the flinch part of the text was removed.
>
>
> Then why couldn’t the Reddit user just cite the poll the way it was conducted. A poll about just sprint is indeed different from a poll about flinch and sprint- with every question tying back into flinch somehow. And that poll wasn’t even something that was cited correctly. It was less than a day old at the time of the video which was linked- so that poll ended a lot
> differently than those inconclusive results at the time
> of that video. No way that poll can be referenced the way that Reddit user tried to referenced- especially when omitted the fact that it was less than a day old.
That was a mistake on his part however its reasonable to suggest he did this to avoid confusion as the topic being discussed was about sprint not flinch. Besides you cant just dismiss his whole argument because of one minor variable such as flinch.
> 2625759425619671;10976:
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> > > 2625759425619671;10972:
> > > The second Team Beyond poll had all of about 200 responses before it was closed by its OP.
> >
> >
> > 95% of 200 people is 190 people… So you’re telling me 10 people voted pro-sprint… and that’s not saying something?
>
>
> I’m saying it’s inconclusive… If OP makes an anti-sprint post followed with a poll and closes it prematurely when the results favor their POV then it doesn’t mean as much as a poll that was executed properly- that’s what I’m saying.
But when the results are overwhelmingly anti-sprint, that should also say something to you. Sure the poll could have been fleshed out more, but… If the poll had only 40 people in it and 38 voted no sprint, I would give that to you. 40 is not nearly enough to test bench a mechanic such as sprint. However, 200 people voted on this. 200 people is the size of some High school classes. That’s more than enough to see that a change needs to be made, especially after 343 said that this game was designed to be competitive… and you know what… it’s not.
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> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You know what’d be great? If we forgot about this thread, and it just - blew away
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This thread is a pillow for the 11%ers to scream into. Granted, they’ve been screaming into it for a year now, but it’s cheaper than therapy.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Stop dismissing Anti-Sprinters as the bottom precentile. If Sprint wasn’t a big deal this thread would not be the massive back and forth that it has become. Understand that your stance is not the end all of this debate and If enough people don’t want to put up with the shotty movement of Halo 5 then they have every -Yoinking!- right to Assert their dismay until they’re catered to. Stop acting like an over irritated soccer Mom and Let Discussions run their course. Sprint’s affect on Map Flow is not Innocent. No matter how hard you try to convince yourself otherwise
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Granted, it’s been a while since the poll, but it showed that 11% were completely against sprint. That’s not me making it up. If there has been a more scientific poll with an appropriately sized sample base I completely missed it. As far as thread size, how many unique users does it have? How many of them are anti-sprint? This is an echo chamber of like-minded people that’s been going on for a while now. Of course it’s big. That proves nothing in the grand scheme of things.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You criticize me for asserting an opinion and then go on to state a couple of your own as absolute truths while lecturing me on not allowing a conversation to run it’s course. Do I need to explain why that is just silly/hypocritical?
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Plenty of people have eloquently explained why they disagree with sprint and it has contributed to the discussion in a meaningful way. Your response to me was anything but.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > By the way, I feel for the 11%ers. I’ve said it since day one. I don’t think their opinion has any less merit than my own, I just think I’m fortunate enough to be in the majority on this one. And that’s what it all comes down to. I think most halo players these days just want to sprint. If 343 want’s to maximize profits (they’re a business, they are not our bros) then they have to cater to the majority. Some times that’s you, sometimes it’s someone else.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway wasn’t trying to trigger you. I mean, I can see how that whole pillow comment can be construed as snide. I just try to be a little colorful when I post. Bored at work.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The majority of people who currently play halo are the minority though. That’s the problem.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry, I don’t follow.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Let’s say there are 100k people who regularly play H5. Even if 90% of those people like sprint it doesn’t really matter because there are millions upon millions upon millions of potential halo players out there who’s preferences are largely unknown.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > A poll was conducted closer to launch when more people were playing. The results were overwhelmingly pro-sprint.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > What was that again?
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > I think the problem here is that you are under the impression that a reddit poll is accurate. It really isn’t, I promise.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Proof speaks louder than words. If I wanted to I could probably go and find all the polls mentioned by the post.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Polls are opinionated in the first place… What’s the point of going down such a rabbit hole? The best way to truly gauge players’ opinions about sprint would be for 343i to let players try the next Halo title in an open beta. 343i can collect feedback after players try playlists with and without sprint.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Sprint is opinionated also, your point?
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > An open beta wont give the developers enough time to make the gameplay decisions needed by the time of release. These type of decisions need to be made very early into the development process.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > My “point,” was that showing proof of a poll that’s opinionated in the first place is really mute to begins with. And games can be tweaked a tremendous amount during the development cycle; especially via betas.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Then Halo 6 or future Halo game’s public testing should be on very early stage of development, earlier than alpha, to remove or add mechanics to the game. Simply removing or adding after the feedback doesn’t work.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > You’re basing that assumption off of what? Your own expert opinion that we should all just believe? How about I help you with this one by citing the multiple open betas for Halo Wars 2 and the fact that 343i has made multiple changes to its gameplay mechanics during the development cycle directly based off of fan feedback.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Halo Wars 2’s release date was delayed to 2017. 343’s changes, if you are talking about Halo 5, from beta to final are not notable. Is there a mechanic that was removed or added from the beta?
> > >
> > >
> > > Yeah the leader powers and the way the tree works were all changed due to fan feedback, according to Dan Ayoub. The game types were even tweaked, a ton of monumental changes were applied after the beta which were a direct result of feedback received from the first open beta… And the game wasn’t delayed because of the beta- far as I know February 2017 was always the target month for launch.
> >
> >
> > The main discussion here is the mechanic. Other than system or U.I. changes (maybe I wasn’t clear enough when I was asking the question), were there any mechanical changes (added or removed) made from beta?
>
>
> Changing leader powers is changing a mechanic of the game… Halo Wars 2 is a RTS which is different than a FPS and leader powers are a game mechanic in that type of game (Not a system or U.I. change)
> 2549359074790154;10988:
> > 2625759425619671;10976:
> > > 2549359074790154;10973:
> > > > 2625759425619671;10972:
> > > > The second Team Beyond poll had all of about 200 responses before it was closed by its OP.
> > >
> > >
> > > 95% of 200 people is 190 people… So you’re telling me 10 people voted pro-sprint… and that’s not saying something?
> >
> >
> > I’m saying it’s inconclusive… If OP makes an anti-sprint post followed with a poll and closes it prematurely when the results favor their POV then it doesn’t mean as much as a poll that was executed properly- that’s what I’m saying.
>
>
> But when the results are overwhelmingly anti-sprint, that should also say something to you. Sure the poll could have been fleshed out more, but… If the poll had only 40 people in it and 38 voted no sprint, I would give that to you. 40 is not nearly enough to test bench a mechanic such as sprint. However, 200 people voted on this. 200 people is the size of some High school classes. That’s more than enough to see that a change needs to be made, especially after 343 said that this game was designed to be competitive… and you know what… it’s not.
Tons of polls have been overwhelmingly pro sprint… What’s your point even? My point was that Team Beyond poll only had ~200 responses because it was closed way early… And that poll’s OP posted anti-sprint stuff which is sure to help their cause when getting anti-sprint results in that poll. 200 people is just an extremely small pool of participants in the first place when millions of people play Halo.
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> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2535451091657464;10869:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You know what’d be great? If we forgot about this thread, and it just - blew away
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This thread is a pillow for the 11%ers to scream into. Granted, they’ve been screaming into it for a year now, but it’s cheaper than therapy.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Stop dismissing Anti-Sprinters as the bottom precentile. If Sprint wasn’t a big deal this thread would not be the massive back and forth that it has become. Understand that your stance is not the end all of this debate and If enough people don’t want to put up with the shotty movement of Halo 5 then they have every -Yoinking!- right to Assert their dismay until they’re catered to. Stop acting like an over irritated soccer Mom and Let Discussions run their course. Sprint’s affect on Map Flow is not Innocent. No matter how hard you try to convince yourself otherwise
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Granted, it’s been a while since the poll, but it showed that 11% were completely against sprint. That’s not me making it up. If there has been a more scientific poll with an appropriately sized sample base I completely missed it. As far as thread size, how many unique users does it have? How many of them are anti-sprint? This is an echo chamber of like-minded people that’s been going on for a while now. Of course it’s big. That proves nothing in the grand scheme of things.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You criticize me for asserting an opinion and then go on to state a couple of your own as absolute truths while lecturing me on not allowing a conversation to run it’s course. Do I need to explain why that is just silly/hypocritical?
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Plenty of people have eloquently explained why they disagree with sprint and it has contributed to the discussion in a meaningful way. Your response to me was anything but.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > By the way, I feel for the 11%ers. I’ve said it since day one. I don’t think their opinion has any less merit than my own, I just think I’m fortunate enough to be in the majority on this one. And that’s what it all comes down to. I think most halo players these days just want to sprint. If 343 want’s to maximize profits (they’re a business, they are not our bros) then they have to cater to the majority. Some times that’s you, sometimes it’s someone else.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway wasn’t trying to trigger you. I mean, I can see how that whole pillow comment can be construed as snide. I just try to be a little colorful when I post. Bored at work.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The majority of people who currently play halo are the minority though. That’s the problem.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry, I don’t follow.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Let’s say there are 100k people who regularly play H5. Even if 90% of those people like sprint it doesn’t really matter because there are millions upon millions upon millions of potential halo players out there who’s preferences are largely unknown.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > A poll was conducted closer to launch when more people were playing. The results were overwhelmingly pro-sprint.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > What was that again?
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > I think the problem here is that you are under the impression that a reddit poll is accurate. It really isn’t, I promise.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Proof speaks louder than words. If I wanted to I could probably go and find all the polls mentioned by the post.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Polls are opinionated in the first place… What’s the point of going down such a rabbit hole? The best way to truly gauge players’ opinions about sprint would be for 343i to let players try the next Halo title in an open beta. 343i can collect feedback after players try playlists with and without sprint.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Sprint is opinionated also, your point?
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > An open beta wont give the developers enough time to make the gameplay decisions needed by the time of release. These type of decisions need to be made very early into the development process.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > My “point,” was that showing proof of a poll that’s opinionated in the first place is really mute to begins with. And games can be tweaked a tremendous amount during the development cycle; especially via betas.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Then Halo 6 or future Halo game’s public testing should be on very early stage of development, earlier than alpha, to remove or add mechanics to the game. Simply removing or adding after the feedback doesn’t work.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > You’re basing that assumption off of what? Your own expert opinion that we should all just believe? How about I help you with this one by citing the multiple open betas for Halo Wars 2 and the fact that 343i has made multiple changes to its gameplay mechanics during the development cycle directly based off of fan feedback.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Halo Wars 2’s release date was delayed to 2017. 343’s changes, if you are talking about Halo 5, from beta to final are not notable. Is there a mechanic that was removed or added from the beta?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Yeah the leader powers and the way the tree works were all changed due to fan feedback, according to Dan Ayoub. The game types were even tweaked, a ton of monumental changes were applied after the beta which were a direct result of feedback received from the first open beta… And the game wasn’t delayed because of the beta- far as I know February 2017 was always the target month for launch.
> > >
> > >
> > > The main discussion here is the mechanic. Other than system or U.I. changes (maybe I wasn’t clear enough when I was asking the question), were there any mechanical changes (added or removed) made from beta?
> >
> >
> > Changing leader powers is changing a mechanic of the game… Halo Wars 2 is a RTS which is different than a FPS and leader powers are a game mechanic in that type of game (Not a system or U.I. change)
>
>
> I am talking about Halo 5, a FPS title…
And I’m talking about how that same developer just utilized an open beta for its most recent game to collect fan feedback which was used to make multiple changes during the game’s development… No reason to think they can’t do the same for their next game when it comes to developing Halo 6.
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> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2535450703392903;10888:
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> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2535431550546249;10877:
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> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2535451091657464;10869:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You know what’d be great? If we forgot about this thread, and it just - blew away
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This thread is a pillow for the 11%ers to scream into. Granted, they’ve been screaming into it for a year now, but it’s cheaper than therapy.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Stop dismissing Anti-Sprinters as the bottom precentile. If Sprint wasn’t a big deal this thread would not be the massive back and forth that it has become. Understand that your stance is not the end all of this debate and If enough people don’t want to put up with the shotty movement of Halo 5 then they have every -Yoinking!- right to Assert their dismay until they’re catered to. Stop acting like an over irritated soccer Mom and Let Discussions run their course. Sprint’s affect on Map Flow is not Innocent. No matter how hard you try to convince yourself otherwise
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Granted, it’s been a while since the poll, but it showed that 11% were completely against sprint. That’s not me making it up. If there has been a more scientific poll with an appropriately sized sample base I completely missed it. As far as thread size, how many unique users does it have? How many of them are anti-sprint? This is an echo chamber of like-minded people that’s been going on for a while now. Of course it’s big. That proves nothing in the grand scheme of things.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You criticize me for asserting an opinion and then go on to state a couple of your own as absolute truths while lecturing me on not allowing a conversation to run it’s course. Do I need to explain why that is just silly/hypocritical?
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Plenty of people have eloquently explained why they disagree with sprint and it has contributed to the discussion in a meaningful way. Your response to me was anything but.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > By the way, I feel for the 11%ers. I’ve said it since day one. I don’t think their opinion has any less merit than my own, I just think I’m fortunate enough to be in the majority on this one. And that’s what it all comes down to. I think most halo players these days just want to sprint. If 343 want’s to maximize profits (they’re a business, they are not our bros) then they have to cater to the majority. Some times that’s you, sometimes it’s someone else.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway wasn’t trying to trigger you. I mean, I can see how that whole pillow comment can be construed as snide. I just try to be a little colorful when I post. Bored at work.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The majority of people who currently play halo are the minority though. That’s the problem.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry, I don’t follow.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Let’s say there are 100k people who regularly play H5. Even if 90% of those people like sprint it doesn’t really matter because there are millions upon millions upon millions of potential halo players out there who’s preferences are largely unknown.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A poll was conducted closer to launch when more people were playing. The results were overwhelmingly pro-sprint.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > What was that again?
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > I think the problem here is that you are under the impression that a reddit poll is accurate. It really isn’t, I promise.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > Proof speaks louder than words. If I wanted to I could probably go and find all the polls mentioned by the post.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Polls are opinionated in the first place… What’s the point of going down such a rabbit hole? The best way to truly gauge players’ opinions about sprint would be for 343i to let players try the next Halo title in an open beta. 343i can collect feedback after players try playlists with and without sprint.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Sprint is opinionated also, your point?
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > An open beta wont give the developers enough time to make the gameplay decisions needed by the time of release. These type of decisions need to be made very early into the development process.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > My “point,” was that showing proof of a poll that’s opinionated in the first place is really mute to begins with. And games can be tweaked a tremendous amount during the development cycle; especially via betas.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Polls are supposed to be opinions on debatable topics. They show a consensus of the general public on the topic being discussed (In this case Halo and sprint). I dont see how thousands of peoples opinions can just be disregarded, I bet if the polls favored differently you wouldnt be saying the same thing.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Again, if you think a beta can solve all the problems then you are gravely mistaken. Sprint is not a minor change, it needs to be adjusted within the game accordingly. You remove sprint and a huge dynamic of the game changes. Removing sprint is not something you can adjust to within a year. Sprint is something that must be decided upon early in development.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Polls only show a census if properly executed. There have been a plethora of polls executed incorrectly such as the Reddit poll which tried to combine flinch/sprint and people later referenced the poll by trying to skew results out of the flinch/sprint poll to support their anti sprint stance… Furthermore those polls have have anywhere from a few dozen to a maximum of a few thousand participants. Halo titles sell units in the millions so that’s hardly acceptable as a sample size of the population- especially since such a large amount of gamers wouldn’t take the time to go onto forums looking for polls like that in the first place… And the ones that would have a problem with something are more likely to go looking for mediums to express their discontent than those who are satisfied with something like sprint.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Why does flinch matter? The people voting still stated they did not want sprint, with or without flinch.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The people on the forums are the ones who truly care about the game, these are the people companies should be listening to. If we were to ask the general gaming community then they would vote for sprint without a doubt, however these aren’t the people buying the games so why do their opinions have a big say in what goes on? They have other games to accommodate their needs, why do they need to change Halo to their liking?
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Flinch and sprint are two separate game mechanics. Convoluting the two into one poll dilutes the results. The Reddit user should have cited the poll the way it was conducted because the results could have been completely different if the original poll didn’t include anything about flinch. Flinch was a mechanic that could have been removed and was it hated by a lot of people.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > The people voting still stated they did not want sprint, with or without flinch.
> > > > Its not like they would just magically change their mind and vote for keeping sprint if the flinch part of the text was removed.
> >
> >
> > Then why couldn’t the Reddit user just cite the poll the way it was conducted. A poll about just sprint is indeed different from a poll about flinch and sprint- with every question tying back into flinch somehow. And that poll wasn’t even something that was cited correctly. It was less than a day old at the time of the video which was linked- so that poll ended a lot
> > differently than those inconclusive results at the time
> > of that video. No way that poll can be referenced the way that Reddit user tried to referenced- especially when omitted the fact that it was less than a day old.
>
>
> That was a mistake on his part however its reasonable to suggest he did this to avoid confusion as the topic being discussed was about sprint not flinch. Besides you cant just dismiss his whole argument because of one minor variable such as flinch.
I didn’t dismiss his whole argument. His argument is still his own highly bias opinion against sprint. All I’m pointing out is the poll was referenced incorrectly and its results were inconclusive.
> 2625759425619671;10986:
> > 2535450703392903;10982:
> > SHOOT2KILL gets all upset that ignored his points. So I respond to them. And he ignores it.
> >
> > Oh waypoint
>
>
> Says the person who asked me for a point that was already given to you yet you literally ignored it a couple hours earlier… smh
>
> Don’t get mad at me if you have trouble reading when the points you want have already been provided. Just open your eyes, I guess.
I went back through your 18 layered hyperlinks and replied to your points.
Well, i’ll address a few of your points then
Immersion
Immersion is 100% subjective. I’m supposed to be the augmented epitome of killing from the future and yet I have to slow down to a crawl in order to fire a weapon? That’s not immersive to me at all.
Lore
It’s already been proven that according to the lore Spartans can maintain the ability to move and shoot well past the speed at which sprint is depicted in the games. Sprint actually goes against the Lore.
3-Sprint providing choices
This is not a good thing. Halo gameplay is built upon the premise of empowering the player through the limiting of binary either/or decisions in it’s gameplay systems. Look through all of Halo’s central gameplay systems and you will see this. You don’t have to choose between strafing and accuracy because you don’t bloom when you strafe like in most games. Hell, you don’t bloom from movement at all. Not from Jumping, walking or strafing. On precision weapons you don’t even bloom from ROF. Unlike practically all of HCE’s predecessors the game limits binary weapon choices by limiting the player to two weapons that are almost always fairly utilitarian instead of having the player carry 10+ incredibly niche weapons. Players are given hotkey grenades to limit the binary choice between nades and shooting. You only lose the ability to shoot for a fraction of a second instead of having to slowly open a menu, switch to nades, throw it and then switch back. Rebounding health limits the binary choices players have to make regarding health. In games with health pick ups you switch between defensively searching for health and offensively attacking when you have a health advantage. Rebounding health muddies the water between this decision to the point of essentially eliminating it.
All the key pillars of Halo gameplay focus on the idea of making the player not have to choose between two things. It tries really hard to ensure that the player feels empowered by being able to do multiple things at once instead of having to make either/or decisions. The only system in Halo that doesn’t do this is sprint(and now some of the other movement mechanics in H5). Why would you make a game in which every single one of it’s core systems are trying to accomplish one thing and then stick in one system that tries to do the exact opposite? That makes no sense. This is a huge reason why sprint causes such a problem for so many people. It’s also the reason why literally every single other mechanic that has been introduced to Halo that brings about binary decisions(dual wielding, bloom, AAs) has been scraped from the franchise.
> 2625759425619671;10991:
> > 2535456165221911;10989:
> > > 2625759425619671;10985:
> > > > 2535456165221911;10984:
> > > > > 2625759425619671;10981:
> > > > > > 2535456165221911;10977:
> > > > > > > 2625759425619671;10974:
> > > > > > > > 2535456165221911;10961:
> > > > > > > > > 2625759425619671;10959:
> > > > > > > > > > 2533274867266391;10958:
> > > > > > > > > > > 2625759425619671;10957:
> > > > > > > > > > > > 2533274867266391;10955:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > 2533274825044752;10918:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2533274867266391;10900:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2533274825044752;10891:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2535450703392903;10890:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2533274825044752;10889:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2535450703392903;10888:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2533274825044752;10883:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2535431550546249;10877:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2533274825044752;10874:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2535451091657464;10869:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You know what’d be great? If we forgot about this thread, and it just - blew away
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This thread is a pillow for the 11%ers to scream into. Granted, they’ve been screaming into it for a year now, but it’s cheaper than therapy.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Stop dismissing Anti-Sprinters as the bottom precentile. If Sprint wasn’t a big deal this thread would not be the massive back and forth that it has become. Understand that your stance is not the end all of this debate and If enough people don’t want to put up with the shotty movement of Halo 5 then they have every -Yoinking!- right to Assert their dismay until they’re catered to. Stop acting like an over irritated soccer Mom and Let Discussions run their course. Sprint’s affect on Map Flow is not Innocent. No matter how hard you try to convince yourself otherwise
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Granted, it’s been a while since the poll, but it showed that 11% were completely against sprint. That’s not me making it up. If there has been a more scientific poll with an appropriately sized sample base I completely missed it. As far as thread size, how many unique users does it have? How many of them are anti-sprint? This is an echo chamber of like-minded people that’s been going on for a while now. Of course it’s big. That proves nothing in the grand scheme of things.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You criticize me for asserting an opinion and then go on to state a couple of your own as absolute truths while lecturing me on not allowing a conversation to run it’s course. Do I need to explain why that is just silly/hypocritical?
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Plenty of people have eloquently explained why they disagree with sprint and it has contributed to the discussion in a meaningful way. Your response to me was anything but.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > By the way, I feel for the 11%ers. I’ve said it since day one. I don’t think their opinion has any less merit than my own, I just think I’m fortunate enough to be in the majority on this one. And that’s what it all comes down to. I think most halo players these days just want to sprint. If 343 want’s to maximize profits (they’re a business, they are not our bros) then they have to cater to the majority. Some times that’s you, sometimes it’s someone else.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway wasn’t trying to trigger you. I mean, I can see how that whole pillow comment can be construed as snide. I just try to be a little colorful when I post. Bored at work.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The majority of people who currently play halo are the minority though. That’s the problem.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry, I don’t follow.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Let’s say there are 100k people who regularly play H5. Even if 90% of those people like sprint it doesn’t really matter because there are millions upon millions upon millions of potential halo players out there who’s preferences are largely unknown.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A poll was conducted closer to launch when more people were playing. The results were overwhelmingly pro-sprint.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > What was that again?
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > I think the problem here is that you are under the impression that a reddit poll is accurate. It really isn’t, I promise.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > Proof speaks louder than words. If I wanted to I could probably go and find all the polls mentioned by the post.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Polls are opinionated in the first place… What’s the point of going down such a rabbit hole? The best way to truly gauge players’ opinions about sprint would be for 343i to let players try the next Halo title in an open beta. 343i can collect feedback after players try playlists with and without sprint.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Sprint is opinionated also, your point?
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > An open beta wont give the developers enough time to make the gameplay decisions needed by the time of release. These type of decisions need to be made very early into the development process.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > My “point,” was that showing proof of a poll that’s opinionated in the first place is really mute to begins with. And games can be tweaked a tremendous amount during the development cycle; especially via betas.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Then Halo 6 or future Halo game’s public testing should be on very early stage of development, earlier than alpha, to remove or add mechanics to the game. Simply removing or adding after the feedback doesn’t work.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > You’re basing that assumption off of what? Your own expert opinion that we should all just believe? How about I help you with this one by citing the multiple open betas for Halo Wars 2 and the fact that 343i has made multiple changes to its gameplay mechanics during the development cycle directly based off of fan feedback.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Halo Wars 2’s release date was delayed to 2017. 343’s changes, if you are talking about Halo 5, from beta to final are not notable. Is there a mechanic that was removed or added from the beta?
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Yeah the leader powers and the way the tree works were all changed due to fan feedback, according to Dan Ayoub. The game types were even tweaked, a ton of monumental changes were applied after the beta which were a direct result of feedback received from the first open beta… And the game wasn’t delayed because of the beta- far as I know February 2017 was always the target month for launch.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > The main discussion here is the mechanic. Other than system or U.I. changes (maybe I wasn’t clear enough when I was asking the question), were there any mechanical changes (added or removed) made from beta?
> > >
> > >
> > > Changing leader powers is changing a mechanic of the game… Halo Wars 2 is a RTS which is different than a FPS and leader powers are a game mechanic in that type of game (Not a system or U.I. change)
> >
> >
> > I am talking about Halo 5, a FPS title…
>
>
> And I’m talking about how that same developer just utilized an open beta for its most recent game to collect fan feedback which was used to make multiple changes during the game’s development… No reason to think they can’t do the same for their next game when it comes to developing Halo 6.
I was told that Halo Wars 2 is going to release second open beta, if I am remembering correctly. If that’s the case, your idea would work after significant changes made into game with most video games.
Alright SiN, how about this… Why do you specifically want to be able to Sprint in Halo?
Serious question. I want to try to understand your side of the argument as to why you think the mechanic works. Obviously I’m a anti-sprint person, even though there are times that I enjoyed being able to sprint, but 90% of the time forget that it’s even there because I’m used to playing without it. 10 placement matches, having never used sprint once I managed to pick up Silver rank 3 or something. I guess that’s decent. I want to hear your side of it. Why does it matter to you to have it in the game?
> 2535456165221911;10994:
> > 2625759425619671;10991:
> > > 2535456165221911;10989:
> > > > 2625759425619671;10985:
> > > > > 2535456165221911;10984:
> > > > > > 2625759425619671;10981:
> > > > > > > 2535456165221911;10977:
> > > > > > > > 2625759425619671;10974:
> > > > > > > > > 2535456165221911;10961:
> > > > > > > > > > 2625759425619671;10959:
> > > > > > > > > > > 2533274867266391;10958:
> > > > > > > > > > > > 2625759425619671;10957:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > 2533274867266391;10955:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2533274825044752;10918:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2533274867266391;10900:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2533274825044752;10891:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2535450703392903;10890:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2533274825044752;10889:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2535450703392903;10888:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2533274825044752;10883:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2535431550546249;10877:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2533274825044752;10874:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2535451091657464;10869:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You know what’d be great? If we forgot about this thread, and it just - blew away
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This thread is a pillow for the 11%ers to scream into. Granted, they’ve been screaming into it for a year now, but it’s cheaper than therapy.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Stop dismissing Anti-Sprinters as the bottom precentile. If Sprint wasn’t a big deal this thread would not be the massive back and forth that it has become. Understand that your stance is not the end all of this debate and If enough people don’t want to put up with the shotty movement of Halo 5 then they have every -Yoinking!- right to Assert their dismay until they’re catered to. Stop acting like an over irritated soccer Mom and Let Discussions run their course. Sprint’s affect on Map Flow is not Innocent. No matter how hard you try to convince yourself otherwise
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Granted, it’s been a while since the poll, but it showed that 11% were completely against sprint. That’s not me making it up. If there has been a more scientific poll with an appropriately sized sample base I completely missed it. As far as thread size, how many unique users does it have? How many of them are anti-sprint? This is an echo chamber of like-minded people that’s been going on for a while now. Of course it’s big. That proves nothing in the grand scheme of things.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You criticize me for asserting an opinion and then go on to state a couple of your own as absolute truths while lecturing me on not allowing a conversation to run it’s course. Do I need to explain why that is just silly/hypocritical?
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Plenty of people have eloquently explained why they disagree with sprint and it has contributed to the discussion in a meaningful way. Your response to me was anything but.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > By the way, I feel for the 11%ers. I’ve said it since day one. I don’t think their opinion has any less merit than my own, I just think I’m fortunate enough to be in the majority on this one. And that’s what it all comes down to. I think most halo players these days just want to sprint. If 343 want’s to maximize profits (they’re a business, they are not our bros) then they have to cater to the majority. Some times that’s you, sometimes it’s someone else.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway wasn’t trying to trigger you. I mean, I can see how that whole pillow comment can be construed as snide. I just try to be a little colorful when I post. Bored at work.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The majority of people who currently play halo are the minority though. That’s the problem.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry, I don’t follow.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Let’s say there are 100k people who regularly play H5. Even if 90% of those people like sprint it doesn’t really matter because there are millions upon millions upon millions of potential halo players out there who’s preferences are largely unknown.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A poll was conducted closer to launch when more people were playing. The results were overwhelmingly pro-sprint.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What was that again?
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think the problem here is that you are under the impression that a reddit poll is accurate. It really isn’t, I promise.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Proof speaks louder than words. If I wanted to I could probably go and find all the polls mentioned by the post.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > Polls are opinionated in the first place… What’s the point of going down such a rabbit hole? The best way to truly gauge players’ opinions about sprint would be for 343i to let players try the next Halo title in an open beta. 343i can collect feedback after players try playlists with and without sprint.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Sprint is opinionated also, your point?
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > An open beta wont give the developers enough time to make the gameplay decisions needed by the time of release. These type of decisions need to be made very early into the development process.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > My “point,” was that showing proof of a poll that’s opinionated in the first place is really mute to begins with. And games can be tweaked a tremendous amount during the development cycle; especially via betas.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Then Halo 6 or future Halo game’s public testing should be on very early stage of development, earlier than alpha, to remove or add mechanics to the game. Simply removing or adding after the feedback doesn’t work.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > You’re basing that assumption off of what? Your own expert opinion that we should all just believe? How about I help you with this one by citing the multiple open betas for Halo Wars 2 and the fact that 343i has made multiple changes to its gameplay mechanics during the development cycle directly based off of fan feedback.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Halo Wars 2’s release date was delayed to 2017. 343’s changes, if you are talking about Halo 5, from beta to final are not notable. Is there a mechanic that was removed or added from the beta?
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Yeah the leader powers and the way the tree works were all changed due to fan feedback, according to Dan Ayoub. The game types were even tweaked, a ton of monumental changes were applied after the beta which were a direct result of feedback received from the first open beta… And the game wasn’t delayed because of the beta- far as I know February 2017 was always the target month for launch.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > The main discussion here is the mechanic. Other than system or U.I. changes (maybe I wasn’t clear enough when I was asking the question), were there any mechanical changes (added or removed) made from beta?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Changing leader powers is changing a mechanic of the game… Halo Wars 2 is a RTS which is different than a FPS and leader powers are a game mechanic in that type of game (Not a system or U.I. change)
> > >
> > >
> > > I am talking about Halo 5, a FPS title…
> >
> >
> > And I’m talking about how that same developer just utilized an open beta for its most recent game to collect fan feedback which was used to make multiple changes during the game’s development… No reason to think they can’t do the same for their next game when it comes to developing Halo 6.
>
>
> I was told that Halo Wars 2 is going to release second open beta, if I am remembering correctly. If that’s the case, your idea would work after significant changes made into game with most video games.
>
> 343 is not the one who developing Halo Wars 2.
Dan Ayoub is in charge of it and he’s 343i… No reason to think that 343i can’t accomplish the same thing with Halo 6.
> 2625759425619671;10992:
> > 2533274867266391;10987:
> > That was a mistake on his part however its reasonable to suggest he did this to avoid confusion as the topic being discussed was about sprint not flinch. Besides you cant just dismiss his whole argument because of one minor variable such as flinch.
>
>
> I didn’t dismiss his whole argument. His argument is still his own highly bias opinion against sprint. All I’m pointing out is the poll was referenced incorrectly and its results were inconclusive.
I tried to go back and look for the final results however for whatever reason the poll no longer exists on the website. However I did find this post. And from looking at the first few pages its very clear that the majority of people were against sprint, don’t believe me then look for yourself.
> 2535450703392903;10993:
> > 2625759425619671;10986:
> > > 2535450703392903;10982:
> > > SHOOT2KILL gets all upset that ignored his points. So I respond to them. And he ignores it.
> > >
> > > Oh waypoint
> >
> >
> > Says the person who asked me for a point that was already given to you yet you literally ignored it a couple hours earlier… smh
> >
> > Don’t get mad at me if you have trouble reading when the points you want have already been provided. Just open your eyes, I guess.
>
>
> I went back through your 18 layered hyperlinks and replied to your points.
>
> Well, i’ll address a few of your points then
> 1. Immersion
> Immersion is 100% subjective. I’m supposed to be the augmented epitome of killing from the future and yet I have to slow down to a crawl in order to fire a weapon? That’s not immersive to me at all.
>
> 2. Lore
> It’s already been proven that according to the lore Spartans can maintain the ability to move and shoot well past the speed at which sprint is depicted in the games. Sprint actually goes against the Lore.
>
> 3-Sprint providing choices
> This is not a good thing. Halo gameplay is built upon the premise of empowering the player through the limiting of binary either/or decisions in it’s gameplay systems. Look through all of Halo’s central gameplay systems and you will see this. You don’t have to choose between strafing and accuracy because you don’t bloom when you strafe like in most games. Hell, you don’t bloom from movement at all. Not from Jumping, walking or strafing. On precision weapons you don’t even bloom from ROF. Unlike practically all of HCE’s predecessors the game limits binary weapon choices by limiting the player to two weapons that are almost always fairly utilitarian instead of having the player carry 10+ incredibly niche weapons. Players are given hotkey grenades to limit the binary choice between nades and shooting. You only lose the ability to shoot for a fraction of a second instead of having to slowly open a menu, switch to nades, throw it and then switch back. Rebounding health limits the binary choices players have to make regarding health. In games with health pick ups you switch between defensively searching for health and offensively attacking when you have a health advantage. Rebounding health muddies the water between this decision to the point of essentially eliminating it.
>
> All the key pillars of Halo gameplay focus on the idea of making the player not have to choose between two things. It tries really hard to ensure that the player feels empowered by being able to do multiple things at once instead of having to make either/or decisions. The only system in Halo that doesn’t do this is sprint(and now some of the other movement mechanics in H5). Why would you make a game in which every single one of it’s core systems are trying to accomplish one thing and then stick in one system that tries to do the exact opposite? That makes no sense. This is a huge reason why sprint causes such a problem for so many people. It’s also the reason why literally every single other mechanic that has been introduced to Halo that brings about binary decisions(dual wielding, bloom, AAs) has been scraped from the franchise.
You trying to twist this back into something that it isn’t? Okay… Good job adding a couple opinions into a few of the points that I provided indicating why sprint should stay… Those weren’t even what you asked for, what you asked for was for something, no you wanted just to see “anything convincing,” as to why one BMS wouldn’t work for Halo and that’s why I provided those reasons to you. You didn’t even respond to that, nor any of the other 24 points that I’ve raised defending why sprint should stay, or the multiple reasons that 343i’s Executive Producer gave defending why sprint should stay… Nope, instead you just cruised through and pulled out 3 things out to focus on and added your opinions to the discussion… Oh Waypoint
> 2533274867266391;10997:
> > 2625759425619671;10992:
> > > 2533274867266391;10987:
> > > That was a mistake on his part however its reasonable to suggest he did this to avoid confusion as the topic being discussed was about sprint not flinch. Besides you cant just dismiss his whole argument because of one minor variable such as flinch.
> >
> >
> > I didn’t dismiss his whole argument. His argument is still his own highly bias opinion against sprint. All I’m pointing out is the poll was referenced incorrectly and its results were inconclusive.
>
>
> I tried to go back and look for the final results however for whatever reason the poll no longer exists on the website. However I did find this post. And from looking at the first few pages its very clear that the majority of people were against sprint, don’t believe me then look for yourself.
Clear results are clear results (Not needed to be inferred by posts)… There have been multiple polls that showed players want to keep sprint. Someone on Reddit incorrectly citing 2 or 3 polls about it hardly constitutes what the majority of gamers want in the next Halo game regarding sprint (1 of them being ~200 people on Team Beyond and the other being less than a day old and cited incorrectly)
> 2625759425619671;10998:
> > 2535450703392903;10993:
> > > 2625759425619671;10986:
> > > > 2535450703392903;10982:
> > > > SHOOT2KILL gets all upset that ignored his points. So I respond to them. And he ignores it.
> > > > Oh waypoint
> > >
> > >
> > > Says the person who asked me for a point that was already given to you yet you literally ignored it a couple hours earlier… smh
> > > Don’t get mad at me if you have trouble reading when the points you want have already been provided. Just open your eyes, I guess.
> >
> >
> > I went back through your 18 layered hyperlinks and replied to your points.
> > Well, i’ll address a few of your points then
> > 1. Immersion
> > Immersion is 100% subjective. I’m supposed to be the augmented epitome of killing from the future and yet I have to slow down to a crawl in order to fire a weapon? That’s not immersive to me at all.
> > 2. Lore
> > It’s already been proven that according to the lore Spartans can maintain the ability to move and shoot well past the speed at which sprint is depicted in the games. Sprint actually goes against the Lore.
> > 3-Sprint providing choices
> > This is not a good thing. Halo gameplay is built upon the premise of empowering the player through the limiting of binary either/or decisions in it’s gameplay systems. Look through all of Halo’s central gameplay systems and you will see this. You don’t have to choose between strafing and accuracy because you don’t bloom when you strafe like in most games. Hell, you don’t bloom from movement at all. Not from Jumping, walking or strafing. On precision weapons you don’t even bloom from ROF. Unlike practically all of HCE’s predecessors the game limits binary weapon choices by limiting the player to two weapons that are almost always fairly utilitarian instead of having the player carry 10+ incredibly niche weapons. Players are given hotkey grenades to limit the binary choice between nades and shooting. You only lose the ability to shoot for a fraction of a second instead of having to slowly open a menu, switch to nades, throw it and then switch back. Rebounding health limits the binary choices players have to make regarding health. In games with health pick ups you switch between defensively searching for health and offensively attacking when you have a health advantage. Rebounding health muddies the water between this decision to the point of essentially eliminating it.
> > All the key pillars of Halo gameplay focus on the idea of making the player not have to choose between two things. It tries really hard to ensure that the player feels empowered by being able to do multiple things at once instead of having to make either/or decisions. The only system in Halo that doesn’t do this is sprint(and now some of the other movement mechanics in H5). Why would you make a game in which every single one of it’s core systems are trying to accomplish one thing and then stick in one system that tries to do the exact opposite? That makes no sense. This is a huge reason why sprint causes such a problem for so many people. It’s also the reason why literally every single other mechanic that has been introduced to Halo that brings about binary decisions(dual wielding, bloom, AAs) has been scraped from the franchise.
>
>
> You trying to twist this back into something that it isn’t? Okay… Good job adding a couple opinions into a few of the points that I provided indicating why sprint should stay… Those weren’t even what you asked for, what you asked for was for something, no you wanted just to see “anything convincing,” as to why one BMS wouldn’t work for Halo and that’s why I provided those reasons to you. You didn’t even respond to that, nor any of the other 24 points that I’ve raised defending why sprint should stay, or the multiple reasons that 343i’s Executive Producer gave defending why sprint should stay… Nope, instead you just cruised through and pulled out 3 things out to focus on and added your opinions to the discussion… Oh Waypoint
Those were the only 3 of your “24” points that were worth responding to. Like all the other pro sprint posters, once confronted about how awful these points truly are you just back down.
> 2625759425619671;10999:
> > 2533274867266391;10997:
> > > 2625759425619671;10992:
> > > > 2533274867266391;10987:
> > > > That was a mistake on his part however its reasonable to suggest he did this to avoid confusion as the topic being discussed was about sprint not flinch. Besides you cant just dismiss his whole argument because of one minor variable such as flinch.
> > >
> > >
> > > I didn’t dismiss his whole argument. His argument is still his own highly bias opinion against sprint. All I’m pointing out is the poll was referenced incorrectly and its results were inconclusive.
> >
> >
> > I tried to go back and look for the final results however for whatever reason the poll no longer exists on the website. However I did find this post. And from looking at the first few pages its very clear that the majority of people were against sprint, don’t believe me then look for yourself.
>
>
> Clear results are clear results… There have been multiple polls ended that favor sprint. Someone on Reddit incorrectly citing 2 or 3 polls about it hardly constitutes what the majority of gamers want in the next Halo game regarding sprint (1 of them being ~200 people on Team Beyond and the other being less than a day old and cited incorrectly)
Yeah they have ended in favor of sprint AFTER Halo 5 had been released(once everyone had already left). Before its release there is no way you would ever find a poll in favor of sprint. As you said clear results are clear results so how about you go and look through the link I sent you and see what the fans were saying. There are 40 pages worth of clear results
> 2535450703392903;11000:
> > 2625759425619671;10998:
> > > 2535450703392903;10993:
> > > > 2625759425619671;10986:
> > > > > 2535450703392903;10982:
> > > > > SHOOT2KILL gets all upset that ignored his points. So I respond to them. And he ignores it.
> > > > > Oh waypoint
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Says the person who asked me for a point that was already given to you yet you literally ignored it a couple hours earlier… smh
> > > > Don’t get mad at me if you have trouble reading when the points you want have already been provided. Just open your eyes, I guess.
> > >
> > >
> > > I went back through your 18 layered hyperlinks and replied to your points.
> > > Well, i’ll address a few of your points then
> > > 1. Immersion
> > > Immersion is 100% subjective. I’m supposed to be the augmented epitome of killing from the future and yet I have to slow down to a crawl in order to fire a weapon? That’s not immersive to me at all.
> > > 2. Lore
> > > It’s already been proven that according to the lore Spartans can maintain the ability to move and shoot well past the speed at which sprint is depicted in the games. Sprint actually goes against the Lore.
> > > 3-Sprint providing choices
> > > This is not a good thing. Halo gameplay is built upon the premise of empowering the player through the limiting of binary either/or decisions in it’s gameplay systems. Look through all of Halo’s central gameplay systems and you will see this. You don’t have to choose between strafing and accuracy because you don’t bloom when you strafe like in most games. Hell, you don’t bloom from movement at all. Not from Jumping, walking or strafing. On precision weapons you don’t even bloom from ROF. Unlike practically all of HCE’s predecessors the game limits binary weapon choices by limiting the player to two weapons that are almost always fairly utilitarian instead of having the player carry 10+ incredibly niche weapons. Players are given hotkey grenades to limit the binary choice between nades and shooting. You only lose the ability to shoot for a fraction of a second instead of having to slowly open a menu, switch to nades, throw it and then switch back. Rebounding health limits the binary choices players have to make regarding health. In games with health pick ups you switch between defensively searching for health and offensively attacking when you have a health advantage. Rebounding health muddies the water between this decision to the point of essentially eliminating it.
> > > All the key pillars of Halo gameplay focus on the idea of making the player not have to choose between two things. It tries really hard to ensure that the player feels empowered by being able to do multiple things at once instead of having to make either/or decisions. The only system in Halo that doesn’t do this is sprint(and now some of the other movement mechanics in H5). Why would you make a game in which every single one of it’s core systems are trying to accomplish one thing and then stick in one system that tries to do the exact opposite? That makes no sense. This is a huge reason why sprint causes such a problem for so many people. It’s also the reason why literally every single other mechanic that has been introduced to Halo that brings about binary decisions(dual wielding, bloom, AAs) has been scraped from the franchise.
> >
> >
> > You trying to twist this back into something that it isn’t? Okay… Good job adding a couple opinions into a few of the points that I provided indicating why sprint should stay… Those weren’t even what you asked for, what you asked for was for something, no you wanted just to see “anything convincing,” as to why one BMS wouldn’t work for Halo and that’s why I provided those reasons to you. You didn’t even respond to that, nor any of the other 24 points that I’ve raised defending why sprint should stay, or the multiple reasons that 343i’s Executive Producer gave defending why sprint should stay… Nope, instead you just cruised through and pulled out 3 things out to focus on and added your opinions to the discussion… Oh Waypoint
>
>
> Those were the only 3 of your “24” points that were worth responding to. Like all the other pro sprint posters, once confronted about how awful these points truly are you just back down.
I don’t care honestly what you consider being “worth responding to.” Fact is you’re so diluted you lost sight of your original point. You originally said that you haven’t seen anything indicating why one BMS wouldn’t work. I’ve given multiple points, which I provided back to you arguing why one BMS probably wouldn’t work in the next Halo title. Everything else that I’ve stated which you either care or don’t care about is really irrelevant to me. Especially if you’re just going to surf through them like fodder and pick out your top 3/27 to even respond to. That’s a really brash statement to think that “all pro sprinters back down,” where the heck have you even been? You must be new to the thread- it’s been ongoing because this has been a contested issue.
> 2625759425619671;11002:
> > 2535450703392903;11000:
> > > 2625759425619671;10998:
> > > > 2535450703392903;10993:
> > > > > 2625759425619671;10986:
> > > > > > 2535450703392903;10982:
> > > > > > SHOOT2KILL gets all upset that ignored his points. So I respond to them. And he ignores it.
> > > > > > Oh waypoint
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Says the person who asked me for a point that was already given to you yet you literally ignored it a couple hours earlier… smh
> > > > > Don’t get mad at me if you have trouble reading when the points you want have already been provided. Just open your eyes, I guess.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > I went back through your 18 layered hyperlinks and replied to your points.
> > > > Well, i’ll address a few of your points then
> > > > 1. Immersion
> > > > Immersion is 100% subjective. I’m supposed to be the augmented epitome of killing from the future and yet I have to slow down to a crawl in order to fire a weapon? That’s not immersive to me at all.
> > > > 2. Lore
> > > > It’s already been proven that according to the lore Spartans can maintain the ability to move and shoot well past the speed at which sprint is depicted in the games. Sprint actually goes against the Lore.
> > > > 3-Sprint providing choices
> > > > This is not a good thing. Halo gameplay is built upon the premise of empowering the player through the limiting of binary either/or decisions in it’s gameplay systems. Look through all of Halo’s central gameplay systems and you will see this. You don’t have to choose between strafing and accuracy because you don’t bloom when you strafe like in most games. Hell, you don’t bloom from movement at all. Not from Jumping, walking or strafing. On precision weapons you don’t even bloom from ROF. Unlike practically all of HCE’s predecessors the game limits binary weapon choices by limiting the player to two weapons that are almost always fairly utilitarian instead of having the player carry 10+ incredibly niche weapons. Players are given hotkey grenades to limit the binary choice between nades and shooting. You only lose the ability to shoot for a fraction of a second instead of having to slowly open a menu, switch to nades, throw it and then switch back. Rebounding health limits the binary choices players have to make regarding health. In games with health pick ups you switch between defensively searching for health and offensively attacking when you have a health advantage. Rebounding health muddies the water between this decision to the point of essentially eliminating it.
> > > > All the key pillars of Halo gameplay focus on the idea of making the player not have to choose between two things. It tries really hard to ensure that the player feels empowered by being able to do multiple things at once instead of having to make either/or decisions. The only system in Halo that doesn’t do this is sprint(and now some of the other movement mechanics in H5). Why would you make a game in which every single one of it’s core systems are trying to accomplish one thing and then stick in one system that tries to do the exact opposite? That makes no sense. This is a huge reason why sprint causes such a problem for so many people. It’s also the reason why literally every single other mechanic that has been introduced to Halo that brings about binary decisions(dual wielding, bloom, AAs) has been scraped from the franchise.
> > >
> > >
> > > You trying to twist this back into something that it isn’t? Okay… Good job adding a couple opinions into a few of the points that I provided indicating why sprint should stay… Those weren’t even what you asked for, what you asked for was for something, no you wanted just to see “anything convincing,” as to why one BMS wouldn’t work for Halo and that’s why I provided those reasons to you. You didn’t even respond to that, nor any of the other 24 points that I’ve raised defending why sprint should stay, or the multiple reasons that 343i’s Executive Producer gave defending why sprint should stay… Nope, instead you just cruised through and pulled out 3 things out to focus on and added your opinions to the discussion… Oh Waypoint
> >
> >
> > Those were the only 3 of your “24” points that were worth responding to. Like all the other pro sprint posters, once confronted about how awful these points truly are you just back down.
>
>
> I don’t care honestly what you consider being “worth responding to.” Fact is you’re so diluted you lost sight of your original point. You originally said that you haven’t seen anything indicating why one BMS wouldn’t work. I’ve given multiple points, which I provided back to you arguing why one BMS probably wouldn’t work in the next Halo title. Everything else that I’ve stated which you either care or don’t care about is really irrelevant to me.
Whatever these points you think you’ve made are, I cannot find them. Every link you provide simply leads to more and more links without them ever containing any points. The only points I actually ever saw you make were immersion, lore, and sprint adding decisions. To which I responded.