The sprint discussion thread

Games Halo 5: Guardians
10904

Can someone explain, objectively, why we NEED sprint.

What does it add? So far, this is my little list I made on TB. Sprint does not make games faster, sprint does not mean fast paced. I’m convinced most people on this thread are <13 because no one seems to have played Quake or UT (or CE).

> SPRINT PROS
> - Immersion
> - Risk vs reward
> - You move faster (Waypoint’s answer)
>
> SPRINT CONS
> - Maps are stretched to accommodate the different speeds
> - Forced to put gun down to effectively move around the map
> - Death is less penalized, as you are able to return fast to the action
> - Movement outside of sprint is sluggish to justify you sprinting

10905

> 2533274970658419;10904:
> Can someone explain, objectively, why we NEED sprint.
>
> What does it add? So far, this is my little list I made on TB. Sprint does not make games faster, sprint does not mean fast paced. I’m convinced most people on this thread are <13 because no one seems to have played Quake or UT (or CE).
>
>
>
>
> > SPRINT PROS
> > - Immersion
> > - Risk vs reward
> > - You move faster (Waypoint’s answer)
> >
> > SPRINT CONS
> > - Maps are stretched to accommodate the different speeds
> > - Forced to put gun down to effectively move around the map
> > - Death is less penalized, as you are able to return fast to the action
> > - Movement outside of sprint is sluggish to justify you sprinting

I’d also add how it messes up a consistent pace, since there’re multiple movement speeds you can move at, and predictability, (The good kind) just vanishes entirely, since you don’t know enemy movement consistently. That’s amplified by chasing someone, since that’s two players putting their weapons down, rather than one and in those times, no combat goes on.

10906

> 2533274795123910;10881:
> > 2533274825044752;10876:
> > > 2535431550546249;10875:
> > > > 2535451091657464;10869:
> > > > You know what’d be great? If we forgot about this thread, and it just - blew away
> > >
> > >
> > > Deal with it. This Topic isn’t going the -Yoink- anywhere. With THIS many replies in this thread it is safe to claim that this discussion is undeniably necessary. There is not one other topic that has the attention this one has. That speaks volumes on the value of this debate.
> >
> >
> > I think it’s just a way to contain this topic to a single thread in an attempt to mitigate forum clutter and no one at 343i has any plans to ever change sprint.
>
>
> Not for Halo 5 perhaps but Halo 6 is still a possibility for the absense of sprint.
> Seeing as there’s circulating talk about some debate about wether or not to keep sprint during Halo 5’s development.
>
> Unless of course you have sources backing the bolded part up, and that’s for Halo 6.

this thread is a freedom of speech as much as I don’t like some peoples opinion, plus this forum would not exist as big as it is if the moderators did not want it to

10907

I think for Halo 6 343 must make a couple playlists for classic play (aka no sprint) and have the rest of the game with sprint. I respect everyone’s opinion about sprint and I think it is important for 343 to listen to the people against sprint. However, this is 343’s game, not the games Bungie used to make. 343 wants sprint in the game so it is most likely going to be in Halo 6. If this thread changes their mind, props to the anti-sprint group. I would be slightly disappointed with sprint taken away, but it is a big accomplishment by the community if that does happen.

10908

> 2533274970658419;10904:
> Can someone explain, objectively, why we NEED sprint.
>
> What does it add? So far, this is my little list I made on TB. Sprint does not make games faster, sprint does not mean fast paced. I’m convinced most people on this thread are <13 because no one seems to have played Quake or UT (or CE).
>
>
>
>
> > SPRINT PROS
> > - Immersion
> > - Risk vs reward
> > - You move faster (Waypoint’s answer)
> >
> > SPRINT CONS
> > - Maps are stretched to accommodate the different speeds
> > - Forced to put gun down to effectively move around the map
> > - Death is less penalized, as you are able to return fast to the action
> > - Movement outside of sprint is sluggish to justify you sprinting

“Why… Why not?”

10909

> 2533274886529017;10905:
> > 2533274970658419;10904:
> > Can someone explain, objectively, why we NEED sprint.
> >
> > What does it add? So far, this is my little list I made on TB. Sprint does not make games faster, sprint does not mean fast paced. I’m convinced most people on this thread are <13 because no one seems to have played Quake or UT (or CE).
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > > SPRINT PROS
> > > - Immersion
> > > - Risk vs reward
> > > - You move faster (Waypoint’s answer)
> > >
> > > SPRINT CONS
> > > - Maps are stretched to accommodate the different speeds
> > > - Forced to put gun down to effectively move around the map
> > > - Death is less penalized, as you are able to return fast to the action
> > > - Movement outside of sprint is sluggish to justify you sprinting
>
>
> I’d also add how it messes up a consistent pace, since there’re multiple movement speeds you can move at, and predictability, (The good kind) just vanishes entirely, since you don’t know enemy movement consistently. That’s amplified by chasing someone, since that’s two players putting their weapons down, rather than one and in those times, no combat goes on.

Um I played the original Halos beat them on legendary I also played Doom, elder scrolls arena and daggarfall, so Id say I’ve seen a lot of the progression in games and I must say I’m kinda sad the way I’ve seen games going

10910

> 2533274973685362;4:
> didn’t even bother reading it because it is the dumbest topic out there right now. Just because it has sprint doesn’t mean its not Halo. It’s one whole mechanic, that’s it. If you don’t like sprint, don’t sprint. Problem solved.

I love it. Thank you!

10911

> 2533274913350232;10910:
> > 2533274973685362;4:
> > didn’t even bother reading it because it is the dumbest topic out there right now. Just because it has sprint doesn’t mean its not Halo. It’s one whole mechanic, that’s it. If you don’t like sprint, don’t sprint. Problem solved.
>
>
> I love it. Thank you!

Can’t fix stupid ↑

10912

> 2533274825044752;10884:
> > 2533274795123910;10881:
> > > 2533274825044752;10876:
> > > > 2535431550546249;10875:
> > > > > 2535451091657464;10869:
> > > > > You know what’d be great? If we forgot about this thread, and it just - blew away
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Deal with it. This Topic isn’t going the -Yoink- anywhere. With THIS many replies in this thread it is safe to claim that this discussion is undeniably necessary. There is not one other topic that has the attention this one has. That speaks volumes on the value of this debate.
> > >
> > >
> > > I think it’s just a way to contain this topic to a single thread in an attempt to mitigate forum clutter and no one at 343i has any plans to ever change sprint.
> >
> >
> > Not for Halo 5 perhaps but Halo 6 is still a possibility for the absense of sprint.
> > Seeing as there’s circulating talk about some debate about wether or not to keep sprint during Halo 5’s development.
> >
> > Unless of course you have sources backing the bolded part up, and that’s for Halo 6.
>
>
> Nope, as I said I just think there are no plans to change sprint. But that applies to Halo 6 too. I think sprint will be there.

Misinterpretation on my side. I saw the “I think” part for the first “clutter” related section of your sentence and the then “no plans” section as a standalone claim.

10913

> 2533274990620516;10894:
> For me flow means the exact same thing to me as it does to you, but I suppose we just have different opinions on what are considered tasks. I get the impression most tasks for you revolve around killing your opponents, which is perfectly logical and I understand completely given the fact that the goal of multiplayer matches is to win which almost always means killing the enemy team. But for me, I also believe that sprinting serves another purpose entirely. Sprint will let you traverse the map faster than a player that chooses to have their gun up and ready to fire at all times. So flow is never interrupted because these differing tasks are always swapped between therefore providing an endless and continuous flow of “tasks.”

But then there is the fact that a sprinting player can’t be in combat. There’s this clear disconnection between combat and transit that wasn’t there before. The player is less able to fight and travel without interruptions, hence the flow has become less continuous. As far as I’m concerned fighting and traveling are both base level tasks, and any interruptions in either one will introduce discontinuities in the flow.

> 2533274990620516;10894:
> My definition of balance is that all aspects of the game have an advantage and a disadvantage. So in terms of sprinting vs shooting, I think sprinting is balanced because the advantage for sprint is maximizing your movement speed, allowing you to get behind cover as fast as possible to avoid death. The disadvantage is that you can’t fire your weapon while doing so, sacrificing your chance to kill your opponent, (not to mention that your shields don’t recharge). The advantage of shooting is that you have an opportunity to kill the enemy, while your disadvantage is that you cannot reach your maximum movement speed while firing therefore preventing you from keeping up with your fleeing enemy. In my opinion this provides for a balance of gameplay because players have the ability to choose which strategy’s advantages and disadvantages will give them the highest chance of survival.

Does turning around have a disadvantage?

The basic actions of the game that the player is able to perform at any moment do not need to have an advantage and a disadvantage. The basic actions are actions that the player can just perform, and there are no problems to be had from allowing the player to perform them simultaneously as every player can perform them. The ability of the player to perform these actions freely allows them to concentrate on the environment around them and the actions of the opponents. You don’t need to force the player to make choices between the most basic of actions as the world around them will introduce enough meaningful choices by itself. Forcing the player to make choices between basic actions merely limits the player overall while only introducing one trivial choice into the game. There is nothing to be gained from such absolute design guidelines as “all aspects of the game have an advantage and a disadvantage”. Some aspects should, but not all.

> 2533274990620516;10894:
> And I began my Halo experience with Halo Reach, so yeah I’m going to be biased on its inclusion in the game, but it’s apparent that you started Halo long before Reach so you’re biased in it’s exclusion. They’re simply two different opinions, and neither one is necessarily the ‘correct opinion.’ We might just have to agree to disagree because I don’t see either of our minds being changed anytime soon. And I just wanted to add thank you for keeping this civil and not banning me for speaking against the opinion of a Monitor :stuck_out_tongue:

We don’t have to agree to disagree. The debate is the fun part. It would be incredibly boring if everybody just agreed with each other. And why would I ever ban you for disagreeing with my opinion? It’d just be a jerk move even if I was allowed to do it.

> 2533274990620516;10894:
> Also, how do I break up the quotes like you did? This is the best I could do because I don’t know how to just quote part of a post.

When you write a post, the box has a button [/] titled “Source code” in the top right corner. I usually spend most of my time writing a post there, copying and pasting around the quote tags as I want to partition the post. The only problem is that you either have to type in other formatting tags by hand, or return to the other view to do other formatting.

10914

> 2533274825830455;10913:
> But then there is the fact that a sprinting player can’t be in combat. There’s this clear disconnection between combat and transit that wasn’t there before. The player is less able to fight and travel without interruptions, hence the flow has become less continuous. As far as I’m concerned fighting and traveling are both base level tasks, and any interruptions in either one will introduce discontinuities in the flow.

But what I’m trying to say is that flow isn’t interrupted just because someone incorporates sprint into their fighting style. Players constantly alternate between combat and travel so the game flow never stops, it just flows in a different direction sometimes. To visualize what I’m saying, picture this:

You’re playing CTF. You’re currently shooting an enemy player that’s trying to advance on your team’s flag. After landing the headshot you sprint over to a cliffside where you saw the other team’s sniper only a minute ago, and luckily he wasn’t paying attention so he never had a chance once you got close enough to assassinate him. From your new vantage point you see that your team is pushing for the enemy flag; they’ve got the flag outside the enemy base but your carrier was killed before he could get away, so now everyone’s in a firefight around the flag. You see the flag timer is reaching its end and no one on your team is able to reach it. You sprint down the hill, spartan charge an unaware player, grab the flag, and use your thruster pack to lunge towards your base.

I see no discontinuity here, yet you used sprint twice to get the job done. Just because you could not have your weapon up and at the ready does not necessarily mean that your combat ability was impaired or flow was interrupted.

> 2533274825830455;10913:
> Does turning around have a disadvantage?
>
> The basic actions of the game that the player is able to perform at any moment do not need to have an advantage and a disadvantage. The basic actions are actions that the player can just perform, and there are no problems to be had from allowing the player to perform them simultaneously as every player can perform them. The ability of the player to perform these actions freely allows them to concentrate on the environment around them and the actions of the opponents. You don’t need to force the player to make choices between the most basic of actions as the world around them will introduce enough meaningful choices by itself. Forcing the player to make choices between basic actions merely limits the player overall while only introducing one trivial choice into the game. There is nothing to be gained from such absolute design guidelines as “all aspects of the game have an advantage and a disadvantage”. Some aspects should, but not all.

No, turning around should not have a disadvantage because like you said it’s a basic action. However, Halo 5 technically has seven Spartan Abilities, and one of them is Sprint. And even though all players have these abilities I do not consider them “basic” actions. They are advanced and situational combat techniques, therefore they must be balanced in order to guarantee that players don’t abuse a single Spartan Ability without repercussions. So that’s why I feel that sprint is a game feature with the capability of being balanced.

> 2533274825830455;10913:
> We don’t have to agree to disagree. The debate is the fun part. It would be incredibly boring if everybody just agreed with each other. And why would I ever ban you for disagreeing with my opinion? It’d just be a jerk move even if I was allowed to do it.

I suppose that’s true, debate is important. And I only said thanks for not banning me because the Forum Ranks say that you can handle bans, and it’s not unheard of for admins to ban people that speak their mind. Not necessarily on Waypoint, but there are plenty of forums out there.

> 2533274825830455;10913:
> When you write a post, the box has a button [/] titled “Source code” in the top right corner. I usually spend most of my time writing a post there, copying and pasting around the quote tags as I want to partition the post. The only problem is that you either have to type in other formatting tags by hand, or return to the other view to do other formatting.

Thanks!

10915

Sorry i dont see how going into sprint and out of sprint and into sprint doesn’t interupt the flow of the game, its the anithesis of flow imo, especially when locking the player in animations from guns down to up and vice versa which now can be the difference between winning a gun fight and losing, fine for other shooters but not for halo imo. It brings the element of twitch shooters into play, whereas smart play good movement and a solid aim would usually win out over some one who reacted faster now reaction times and who sees who first play a bigger role, some like to say its more tactical choosing when and when not to sprint but i just don’t see it, for me it brings a bigger element of chance and luck into play

10916

> 2533274990620516;10914:
> > 2533274825830455;10913:
> > But then there is the fact that a sprinting player can’t be in combat. There’s this clear disconnection between combat and transit that wasn’t there before. The player is less able to fight and travel without interruptions, hence the flow has become less continuous. As far as I’m concerned fighting and traveling are both base level tasks, and any interruptions in either one will introduce discontinuities in the flow.
>
>
> But what I’m trying to say is that flow isn’t interrupted just because someone incorporates sprint into their fighting style. Players constantly alternate between combat and travel so the game flow never stops, it just flows in a different direction sometimes. To visualize what I’m saying, picture this:
>
> You’re playing CTF. You’re currently shooting an enemy player that’s trying to advance on your team’s flag.

What was that player doing? running or sprinting? Was he shooting back?

If he was moving at maximum speed towards your flag, then he was clearly sprinting. It also means he wasn’t shooting at you and most likely not looking at you either. If he wasn’t sprinting. If he was shooting back then he wasn’t maximising his speed towards the flag. This player had to choose between fighting you and advancing on the flag.

> You see the flag timer is reaching its end and no one on your team is able to reach it. You sprint down the hill, spartan charge an unaware player

Those players aren’t always unaware. You should have been advancing on that flag and shooting the enemy team. Now you are faced with a few options, shoot the enemy team and help out your team, or sprint at the flag and not shoot at all. Suppose you didn’t get the perfect situation you described. That player is now looking at you. You sprint at him and he’s going to shoot you down. You shoot back and you can’t sprint to grab the flag. Without a weapons down sprint you could have pushed for that flag, instead you have to hope that the other team isn’t looking at you or forfeit the flag.

Offense/Defense vs Both.

10917

> 2535450703392903;10892:
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> > > > 2533274825044752;10889:
> > > > > 2535450703392903;10888:
> > > > > > 2533274825044752;10883:
> > > > > > > 2535431550546249;10877:
> > > > > > > > 2533274825044752;10874:
> > > > > > > > > 2535451091657464;10869:
> > > > > > > > > You know what’d be great? If we forgot about this thread, and it just - blew away
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > This thread is a pillow for the 11%ers to scream into. Granted, they’ve been screaming into it for a year now, but it’s cheaper than therapy.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Stop dismissing Anti-Sprinters as the bottom precentile. If Sprint wasn’t a big deal this thread would not be the massive back and forth that it has become. Understand that your stance is not the end all of this debate and If enough people don’t want to put up with the shotty movement of Halo 5 then they have every -Yoinking!- right to Assert their dismay until they’re catered to. Stop acting like an over irritated soccer Mom and Let Discussions run their course. Sprint’s affect on Map Flow is not Innocent. No matter how hard you try to convince yourself otherwise
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Granted, it’s been a while since the poll, but it showed that 11% were completely against sprint. That’s not me making it up. If there has been a more scientific poll with an appropriately sized sample base I completely missed it. As far as thread size, how many unique users does it have? How many of them are anti-sprint? This is an echo chamber of like-minded people that’s been going on for a while now. Of course it’s big. That proves nothing in the grand scheme of things.
> > > > > > You criticize me for asserting an opinion and then go on to state a couple of your own as absolute truths while lecturing me on not allowing a conversation to run it’s course. Do I need to explain why that is just silly/hypocritical?
> > > > > > Plenty of people have eloquently explained why they disagree with sprint and it has contributed to the discussion in a meaningful way. Your response to me was anything but.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > By the way, I feel for the 11%ers. I’ve said it since day one. I don’t think their opinion has any less merit than my own, I just think I’m fortunate enough to be in the majority on this one. And that’s what it all comes down to. I think most halo players these days just want to sprint. If 343 want’s to maximize profits (they’re a business, they are not our bros) then they have to cater to the majority. Some times that’s you, sometimes it’s someone else.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Anyway wasn’t trying to trigger you. I mean, I can see how that whole pillow comment can be construed as snide. I just try to be a little colorful when I post. Bored at work.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > The majority of people who currently play halo are the minority though. That’s the problem.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Sorry, I don’t follow.
> > >
> > >
> > > Let’s say there are 100k people who regularly play H5. Even if 90% of those people like sprint it doesn’t really matter because there are millions upon millions upon millions of potential halo players out there who’s preferences are largely unknown.
> >
> >
> > A poll was conducted closer to launch when more people were playing. The results were overwhelmingly pro-sprint.
>
>
> It doesn’t matter. 40k, 100k, 250, 500, makes little difference. The franchise is in rapid decline and the opinions of the minority that are happy with what’s going isn’t going to help you figure out why or how to fix it.

That doesn’t make sense. Maybe you don’t understand what I’m saying or have never taken a statistics class, not sure.

10918

> 2533274867266391;10900:
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> > > > 2533274825044752;10889:
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> > > > > > > 2535431550546249;10877:
> > > > > > > > 2533274825044752;10874:
> > > > > > > > > 2535451091657464;10869:
> > > > > > > > > You know what’d be great? If we forgot about this thread, and it just - blew away
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > This thread is a pillow for the 11%ers to scream into. Granted, they’ve been screaming into it for a year now, but it’s cheaper than therapy.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Stop dismissing Anti-Sprinters as the bottom precentile. If Sprint wasn’t a big deal this thread would not be the massive back and forth that it has become. Understand that your stance is not the end all of this debate and If enough people don’t want to put up with the shotty movement of Halo 5 then they have every -Yoinking!- right to Assert their dismay until they’re catered to. Stop acting like an over irritated soccer Mom and Let Discussions run their course. Sprint’s affect on Map Flow is not Innocent. No matter how hard you try to convince yourself otherwise
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Granted, it’s been a while since the poll, but it showed that 11% were completely against sprint. That’s not me making it up. If there has been a more scientific poll with an appropriately sized sample base I completely missed it. As far as thread size, how many unique users does it have? How many of them are anti-sprint? This is an echo chamber of like-minded people that’s been going on for a while now. Of course it’s big. That proves nothing in the grand scheme of things.
> > > > > > You criticize me for asserting an opinion and then go on to state a couple of your own as absolute truths while lecturing me on not allowing a conversation to run it’s course. Do I need to explain why that is just silly/hypocritical?
> > > > > > Plenty of people have eloquently explained why they disagree with sprint and it has contributed to the discussion in a meaningful way. Your response to me was anything but.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > By the way, I feel for the 11%ers. I’ve said it since day one. I don’t think their opinion has any less merit than my own, I just think I’m fortunate enough to be in the majority on this one. And that’s what it all comes down to. I think most halo players these days just want to sprint. If 343 want’s to maximize profits (they’re a business, they are not our bros) then they have to cater to the majority. Some times that’s you, sometimes it’s someone else.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Anyway wasn’t trying to trigger you. I mean, I can see how that whole pillow comment can be construed as snide. I just try to be a little colorful when I post. Bored at work.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > The majority of people who currently play halo are the minority though. That’s the problem.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Sorry, I don’t follow.
> > >
> > >
> > > Let’s say there are 100k people who regularly play H5. Even if 90% of those people like sprint it doesn’t really matter because there are millions upon millions upon millions of potential halo players out there who’s preferences are largely unknown.
> >
> >
> > A poll was conducted closer to launch when more people were playing. The results were overwhelmingly pro-sprint.
>
>
> What was that again?

I think the problem here is that you are under the impression that a reddit poll is accurate. It really isn’t, I promise.

10919

> 2547348539238747;10916:
> What was that player doing? running or sprinting? Was he shooting back?

This is irrelevant. It’s just part of a made up story where you were in combat with an enemy player. What he was doing at the time doesn’t matter.

> 2547348539238747;10916:
> If he was moving at maximum speed towards your flag, then he was clearly sprinting. It also means he wasn’t shooting at you and most likely not looking at you either. If he wasn’t sprinting. If he was shooting back then he wasn’t maximising his speed towards the flag. This player had to choose between fighting you and advancing on the flag.

That whole story is a hypothetical that represents how a player is always moving and changing their tasks/objectives. It was meant to show that there is no break in the gameplay because you do not need to be constantly shooting for it to be considered continuous flow. And choosing between fighting me and advancing on the flag is what I was referring to in a previous post about strategic choices. It’s not a negative that he had to choose how to react to incoming fire, it’s a positive because it gives the player more options in regards to what they want to do next: run or retaliate.

> 2547348539238747;10916:
> Those players aren’t always unaware. You should have been advancing on that flag and shooting the enemy team. Now you are faced with a few options, shoot the enemy team and help out your team, or sprint at the flag and not shoot at all. Suppose you didn’t get the perfect situation you described. That player is now looking at you. You sprint at him and he’s going to shoot you down. You shoot back and you can’t sprint to grab the flag. Without a weapons down sprint you could have pushed for that flag, instead you have to hope that the other team isn’t looking at you or forfeit the flag.
>
> Offense/Defense vs Both.

To be honest the first thing I did when I woke up this morning was write that response so the story might not be 100% realistic, but in my head I didn’t figure that it was a perfect situation. You would most likely die shortly after grabbing the flag. The reason why I opted for sprinting, instead of shooting and advancing toward the flag at base speed, was because the flag timer was nearly at its end so you had to get there quickly to reset the timer at least.

@tsassi

10920

> 2533274825044752;10918:
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> > > > > > > > > > 2535451091657464;10869:
> > > > > > > > > > You know what’d be great? If we forgot about this thread, and it just - blew away
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > This thread is a pillow for the 11%ers to scream into. Granted, they’ve been screaming into it for a year now, but it’s cheaper than therapy.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Stop dismissing Anti-Sprinters as the bottom precentile. If Sprint wasn’t a big deal this thread would not be the massive back and forth that it has become. Understand that your stance is not the end all of this debate and If enough people don’t want to put up with the shotty movement of Halo 5 then they have every -Yoinking!- right to Assert their dismay until they’re catered to. Stop acting like an over irritated soccer Mom and Let Discussions run their course. Sprint’s affect on Map Flow is not Innocent. No matter how hard you try to convince yourself otherwise
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Granted, it’s been a while since the poll, but it showed that 11% were completely against sprint. That’s not me making it up. If there has been a more scientific poll with an appropriately sized sample base I completely missed it. As far as thread size, how many unique users does it have? How many of them are anti-sprint? This is an echo chamber of like-minded people that’s been going on for a while now. Of course it’s big. That proves nothing in the grand scheme of things.
> > > > > > > You criticize me for asserting an opinion and then go on to state a couple of your own as absolute truths while lecturing me on not allowing a conversation to run it’s course. Do I need to explain why that is just silly/hypocritical?
> > > > > > > Plenty of people have eloquently explained why they disagree with sprint and it has contributed to the discussion in a meaningful way. Your response to me was anything but.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > By the way, I feel for the 11%ers. I’ve said it since day one. I don’t think their opinion has any less merit than my own, I just think I’m fortunate enough to be in the majority on this one. And that’s what it all comes down to. I think most halo players these days just want to sprint. If 343 want’s to maximize profits (they’re a business, they are not our bros) then they have to cater to the majority. Some times that’s you, sometimes it’s someone else.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Anyway wasn’t trying to trigger you. I mean, I can see how that whole pillow comment can be construed as snide. I just try to be a little colorful when I post. Bored at work.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The majority of people who currently play halo are the minority though. That’s the problem.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Sorry, I don’t follow.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Let’s say there are 100k people who regularly play H5. Even if 90% of those people like sprint it doesn’t really matter because there are millions upon millions upon millions of potential halo players out there who’s preferences are largely unknown.
> > >
> > >
> > > A poll was conducted closer to launch when more people were playing. The results were overwhelmingly pro-sprint.
> >
> >
> > What was that again?
>
>
> I think the problem here is that you are under the impression that a reddit poll is accurate. It really isn’t, I promise.

What about a Team Beyond poll or a Halo Waypoint poll conducted by 343i themselves?.

Truth is 343i kept conducting the poll until they got the result they wanted.

10921

> 2533274990620516;10919:
> > 2547348539238747;10916:
> > What was that player doing? running or sprinting? Was he shooting back?
>
>
> This is irrelevant. It’s just part of a made up story where you were in combat with an enemy player. What he was doing at the time doesn’t matter.
>
>
>
>
> > 2547348539238747;10916:
> > If he was moving at maximum speed towards your flag, then he was clearly sprinting. It also means he wasn’t shooting at you and most likely not looking at you either. If he wasn’t sprinting. If he was shooting back then he wasn’t maximising his speed towards the flag. This player had to choose between fighting you and advancing on the flag.
>
>
> That whole story is a hypothetical that represents how a player is always moving and changing their tasks/objectives. It was meant to show that there is no break in the gameplay because you do not need to be constantly shooting for it to be considered continuous flow. And choosing between fighting me and advancing on the flag is what I was referring to in a previous post about strategic choices. It’s not a negative that he had to choose how to react to incoming fire, it’s a positive because it gives the player more options in regards to what they want to do next: run or retaliate.
>
>
>
>
> > 2547348539238747;10916:
> > Those players aren’t always unaware. You should have been advancing on that flag and shooting the enemy team. Now you are faced with a few options, shoot the enemy team and help out your team, or sprint at the flag and not shoot at all. Suppose you didn’t get the perfect situation you described. That player is now looking at you. You sprint at him and he’s going to shoot you down. You shoot back and you can’t sprint to grab the flag. Without a weapons down sprint you could have pushed for that flag, instead you have to hope that the other team isn’t looking at you or forfeit the flag.
> >
> > Offense/Defense vs Both.
>
>
> To be honest the first thing I did when I woke up this morning was write that response so the story might not be 100% realistic, but in my head I didn’t figure that it was a perfect situation. You would most likely die shortly after grabbing the flag. The reason why I opted for sprinting, instead of shooting and advancing toward the flag at base speed, was because the flag timer was nearly at its end so you had to get there quickly to reset the timer at least.
>
> @tsassi

Even in a hypothetical it matters.

If he was shooting at you then you aren’t full shield after the combat. You have to wait for your shield to recharge before you sprint. That’s a break in the flow.

If he wasn’t shooting at you then in order to have an example of seemless Halo 5 combat you engaged 3 combatants who weren’t looking at you.

10922

> 2547348539238747;10920:
> > 2533274825044752;10918:
> > > 2533274867266391;10900:
> > > > 2533274825044752;10891:
> > > > > 2535450703392903;10890:
> > > > > > 2533274825044752;10889:
> > > > > > > 2535450703392903;10888:
> > > > > > > > 2533274825044752;10883:
> > > > > > > > > 2535431550546249;10877:
> > > > > > > > > > 2533274825044752;10874:
> > > > > > > > > > > 2535451091657464;10869:
> > > > > > > > > > > You know what’d be great? If we forgot about this thread, and it just - blew away
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > This thread is a pillow for the 11%ers to scream into. Granted, they’ve been screaming into it for a year now, but it’s cheaper than therapy.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Stop dismissing Anti-Sprinters as the bottom precentile. If Sprint wasn’t a big deal this thread would not be the massive back and forth that it has become. Understand that your stance is not the end all of this debate and If enough people don’t want to put up with the shotty movement of Halo 5 then they have every -Yoinking!- right to Assert their dismay until they’re catered to. Stop acting like an over irritated soccer Mom and Let Discussions run their course. Sprint’s affect on Map Flow is not Innocent. No matter how hard you try to convince yourself otherwise
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Granted, it’s been a while since the poll, but it showed that 11% were completely against sprint. That’s not me making it up. If there has been a more scientific poll with an appropriately sized sample base I completely missed it. As far as thread size, how many unique users does it have? How many of them are anti-sprint? This is an echo chamber of like-minded people that’s been going on for a while now. Of course it’s big. That proves nothing in the grand scheme of things.
> > > > > > > > You criticize me for asserting an opinion and then go on to state a couple of your own as absolute truths while lecturing me on not allowing a conversation to run it’s course. Do I need to explain why that is just silly/hypocritical?
> > > > > > > > Plenty of people have eloquently explained why they disagree with sprint and it has contributed to the discussion in a meaningful way. Your response to me was anything but.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > By the way, I feel for the 11%ers. I’ve said it since day one. I don’t think their opinion has any less merit than my own, I just think I’m fortunate enough to be in the majority on this one. And that’s what it all comes down to. I think most halo players these days just want to sprint. If 343 want’s to maximize profits (they’re a business, they are not our bros) then they have to cater to the majority. Some times that’s you, sometimes it’s someone else.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Anyway wasn’t trying to trigger you. I mean, I can see how that whole pillow comment can be construed as snide. I just try to be a little colorful when I post. Bored at work.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > The majority of people who currently play halo are the minority though. That’s the problem.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Sorry, I don’t follow.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Let’s say there are 100k people who regularly play H5. Even if 90% of those people like sprint it doesn’t really matter because there are millions upon millions upon millions of potential halo players out there who’s preferences are largely unknown.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > A poll was conducted closer to launch when more people were playing. The results were overwhelmingly pro-sprint.
> > >
> > >
> > > What was that again?
> >
> >
> > I think the problem here is that you are under the impression that a reddit poll is accurate. It really isn’t, I promise.
>
>
> What about a Team Beyond poll or a Halo Waypoint poll conducted by 343i themselves?.
>
> Truth is 343i kept conducting the poll until they got the result they wanted.

That’s not how polls work, though. If a majority is in favor of something you can’t keep the polls open until enough people who aren’t in favor vote to change the results.
343 sent the poll out to a representative sample gamers. Those gamers voted and we have the results. It wasn’t even possible for them to say “let’s let more people come and vote.”
You really have a poor understanding of how poll and statistics work, and I don’t say that to be condescending–really, I don’t.
I think disapproving of sprint is a completely valid opinion, I just don’t understand why 11%ers think it’s so bad to have a minority opinion all of a sudden. Why people have to defend a completely acceptable opinion by claiming polls are wrong, or conspiracy abounds. It’s silly.

10923

> 2533274825044752;10922:
> > 2547348539238747;10920:
> > > 2533274825044752;10918:
> > > > 2533274867266391;10900:
> > > > > 2533274825044752;10891:
> > > > > > 2535450703392903;10890:
> > > > > > > 2533274825044752;10889:
> > > > > > > > 2535450703392903;10888:
> > > > > > > > > 2533274825044752;10883:
> > > > > > > > > > 2535431550546249;10877:
> > > > > > > > > > > 2533274825044752;10874:
> > > > > > > > > > > > 2535451091657464;10869:
> > > > > > > > > > > > You know what’d be great? If we forgot about this thread, and it just - blew away
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > This thread is a pillow for the 11%ers to scream into. Granted, they’ve been screaming into it for a year now, but it’s cheaper than therapy.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Stop dismissing Anti-Sprinters as the bottom precentile. If Sprint wasn’t a big deal this thread would not be the massive back and forth that it has become. Understand that your stance is not the end all of this debate and If enough people don’t want to put up with the shotty movement of Halo 5 then they have every -Yoinking!- right to Assert their dismay until they’re catered to. Stop acting like an over irritated soccer Mom and Let Discussions run their course. Sprint’s affect on Map Flow is not Innocent. No matter how hard you try to convince yourself otherwise
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Granted, it’s been a while since the poll, but it showed that 11% were completely against sprint. That’s not me making it up. If there has been a more scientific poll with an appropriately sized sample base I completely missed it. As far as thread size, how many unique users does it have? How many of them are anti-sprint? This is an echo chamber of like-minded people that’s been going on for a while now. Of course it’s big. That proves nothing in the grand scheme of things.
> > > > > > > > > You criticize me for asserting an opinion and then go on to state a couple of your own as absolute truths while lecturing me on not allowing a conversation to run it’s course. Do I need to explain why that is just silly/hypocritical?
> > > > > > > > > Plenty of people have eloquently explained why they disagree with sprint and it has contributed to the discussion in a meaningful way. Your response to me was anything but.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > By the way, I feel for the 11%ers. I’ve said it since day one. I don’t think their opinion has any less merit than my own, I just think I’m fortunate enough to be in the majority on this one. And that’s what it all comes down to. I think most halo players these days just want to sprint. If 343 want’s to maximize profits (they’re a business, they are not our bros) then they have to cater to the majority. Some times that’s you, sometimes it’s someone else.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Anyway wasn’t trying to trigger you. I mean, I can see how that whole pillow comment can be construed as snide. I just try to be a little colorful when I post. Bored at work.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > The majority of people who currently play halo are the minority though. That’s the problem.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Sorry, I don’t follow.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Let’s say there are 100k people who regularly play H5. Even if 90% of those people like sprint it doesn’t really matter because there are millions upon millions upon millions of potential halo players out there who’s preferences are largely unknown.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > A poll was conducted closer to launch when more people were playing. The results were overwhelmingly pro-sprint.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > What was that again?
> > >
> > >
> > > I think the problem here is that you are under the impression that a reddit poll is accurate. It really isn’t, I promise.
> >
> >
> > What about a Team Beyond poll or a Halo Waypoint poll conducted by 343i themselves?.
> >
> > Truth is 343i kept conducting the poll until they got the result they wanted.
>
>
> That’s not how polls work, though. If a majority is in favor of something you can’t keep the polls open until enough people who aren’t in favor vote to change the results.
> 343 sent the poll out to a representative sample gamers. Those gamers voted and we have the results. It wasn’t even possible for them to say “let’s let more people come and vote.”
> You really have a poor understanding of how poll and statistics work, and I don’t say that to be condescending–really, I don’t.
> I think disapproving of sprint is a completely valid opinion, I just don’t understand why 11%ers think it’s so bad to have a minority opinion all of a sudden. Why people have to defend a completely acceptable opinion by claiming polls are wrong, or conspiracy abounds. It’s silly.

Right, but I’m telling you it was 343i who kept conducting the polls over and over. Not that I think later polls or more votes are needed.

I feel like you didn’t even click the link.