The sprint discussion thread

Games Halo 5: Guardians
5682

> 2535473635314008;5633:
> i couldn’t disagree more about game classification. You really think 343 moved halo further away from a true arena shooter with halo 5 from where they left it with 4. I just cannot agree with that. Can’t even argue that, we are way to far apart to debate. I havnt seen any franchise in the arena genre make steps towards reclaiming the old school arena shooter gameplay in years, except 343. Even doom has stepped away from the genre. Quake (say it isn’t so) is moving away from the genre. Halo seems to be moving back towards that genre, even though 343 did pull them out of it.

How did Doom and Quake step away from the Arena shooter genre? If you’re going to say “Loadouts and classes” let me stop you right there. Contrary to popular belief, “equal starts” is not a criteria for an Arena shooter. It might have been a stalpe of Halo games, but Arena shooters don’t necessarily adhere to that. Games like CellFactor had classes to choose from and even genre legends such as Quake had different models that were easier or harder to spot/shoot. (Sure there were workarounds by using seta cg_forcemodel, but those weren’t intended by the developers.)
So no, I do not consider the abandonment of classes from 4 to 5 as a step towards Arena shooter gameplay.
The game still has the same deviations from Arena shooters as Halo 4 had: Sprint butchers run’n’gun, spread buffs when scoped screw with gunplay, and while powerups on map returned, at the same time certain mechanics have been changed away from their Arena shooter counterpart (such as zoom being replaced by ADS).
Mind you, those are but the most recent changes. Technically not even classic Halo was a true Arena shooter, due to shields, radar, reloading, hitscan instead of projectile, two-weapon-restriction and so forth. But if Halo CE was only half Arena shooter, H5G is merely a quarter or less…

5683

> 2533274846700578;5634:
> > 2535473635314008;5633:
> > The argument that sprint makes the gameplay fast isn’t a very good one. I just like the dynamic flow to halo 5. If that stays without sprint I would be very happy without it. Of the 3 original games I find halo CE to be the fastest gameplay in multiplayer, but the base movement speed is the same for each game 1 to 3. Maps affect the speed of the game way more than sprint does.
>
>
> Wrong.

All three games of the original trilogy had a base movement speed of 7m/s or 15.66mph. It was only reduced for ODST to 5.5m/s (12.3mph) for the player to feel more human and less spartan, and later on for Reach (6.85m/s, 15.3mph) and Halo 4 (6.6m/s, 14.76mph) in order to justify the inclusion of sprint.

5684

> 2533274801176260;5679:
> > 2533274855279867;5607:
> > a poor compromise is still compromise.
> > dismissive hypobole doesnt help.
>
>
> Keeping something that people want gone is not a compromise.
> It’s ignoring a request from a large part of your community.
>
> Repeating a false statement doesn’t make it true.

Correct. Repetition does not make something true. Being true makes something true.

But the implementation of sprint in h5 is a compromise. It is tied to shields to make it harder to escape, per complaints. Is this what people wanted? Not necessarily. Thats sorta the catch with compromising, involved parties rarely get what they want.

I’m sorry if you cannot understand or accept this.

5685

> 2533274801176260;5683:
> > 2533274846700578;5634:
> > > 2535473635314008;5633:
> > > The argument that sprint makes the gameplay fast isn’t a very good one. I just like the dynamic flow to halo 5. If that stays without sprint I would be very happy without it. Of the 3 original games I find halo CE to be the fastest gameplay in multiplayer, but the base movement speed is the same for each game 1 to 3. Maps affect the speed of the game way more than sprint does.
> >
> >
> > Wrong.
>
>
> All three games of the original trilogy had a base movement speed of 7m/s or 15.66mph. It was only reduced for ODST to 5.5m/s (12.3mph) for the player to feel more human and less spartan, and later on for Reach (6.85m/s, 15.3mph) and Halo 4 (6.6m/s, 14.76mph) in order to justify the inclusion of sprint.

I’ve always liked this video to illustrate. I wish h4 and 5 were included.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFPg8jC3eEQ&app=desktop

5686

> 2533274855279867;5684:
> Correct. Repetition does not make something true. Being true makes something true.
> But the implementation of sprint in h5 is a compromise. It is tied to shields to make it harder to escape, per complaints. Is this what people wanted? Not necessarily. Thats sorta the catch with compromising, involved parties rarely get what they want.
> I’m sorry if you cannot understand or accept this.

I’m sorry if you live in a fairy tale world in which keeping something is a compromise for removing it, but reality does not work that way. A compromise would be if both parties get what they want, not if one party gets thrown overboard in favor of the other. H5G’s nerf for sprint is not a compromise, regardless which definition of that word you use. You can repeat the same claim ad nauseam but it will not make it true, even after the millionth iteration…

5687

sprinting makes the game a bit more competitive and challenging, taking it away tones down the speed of the game

5688

> 2533274801176260;5682:
> > 2535473635314008;5633:
> > i couldn’t disagree more about game classification. You really think 343 moved halo further away from a true arena shooter with halo 5 from where they left it with 4. I just cannot agree with that. Can’t even argue that, we are way to far apart to debate. I havnt seen any franchise in the arena genre make steps towards reclaiming the old school arena shooter gameplay in years, except 343. Even doom has stepped away from the genre. Quake (say it isn’t so) is moving away from the genre. Halo seems to be moving back towards that genre, even though 343 did pull them out of it.
>
>
> Technically not even classic Halo was a true Arena shooter, due to shields, radar, reloading, hitscan instead of projectile, two-weapon-restriction and so forth. But if Halo CE was only half Arena shooter, H5G is merely a quarter or less…

Correct, and addition to those, Halo introduced health regen instead of picking it up. It’s one of the things that keeps the game play quicker paced in the likes of Doom, you need to pick health up.

5689

> 2533274925229487;5687:
> sprinting makes the game a bit more competitive and challenging, taking it away tones down the speed of the game

Absolutely, It makes the game, less casual, has alot more adrenaline then Halo 1-3. It’s kind of turning into a CoD game, by the fact of the sensitivity, and sprint, soon, there may be jetpacks capable of shooting you into the air 50 ft or more in less then a second.

5690

Would you say it will “Make Halo Great Again”?

5691

> 2533274813551244;5619:
> How about this? We raise the BMS so that when you push the stick all the way you move around at about sprinting speed, BUT this way you can also shoot your gun and throw nades. And if you don’t like this freedom of option, you don’t have to shoot or throw nades, simple as that. You can just move at sprinting speed in one direction if you like. What are you saying? This will give you a huge disadvantage? Well I’ll be -Yoink!-, weird how not using a mechanic that is out there but it totally “optional” will somehow put you in some kind of a disadvantage.
>
> Why am I sensing some kind of a dejavu?

I wrote this on page 281 and you pro-sprinters completely ignored it. It was trying to show how the arguments sounds to us when you say we don’t need to use sprint. Also, some of you say sprint makes the game feel fast and example Halo 3 feels slow now. It’s because of FOV.

Ill give you an example. Has any of you played Minecraft? There you have two speeds, running and sprinting. Running feels slow, but when you sprint in that game it feels like Mach 1 speed. Funny enough if you look at two player doing this side by side, you’ll notice that the sprinting player isn’t going that much faster. The reason why sprinting feels so much faster is because of change in field of view (FOV). Same can be achieved in a non-sprinting players view. There are lots of videos in the Internet demonstrating this wide/narrow FOV effect in Halo.

Edit. Our evolution to humans has had very little effect on out eyesight in the sense of speed and our brains comprehend this information very simply. If our surrounding moves fast by our preferal vision, we comprehend this as us going very fast. This is what wide FOV does. It makes you see wider around your surroundings and center of your screen seems further away. When you move forward, the center of the screen moves ever so slightly towards you BUT the items and surrounding walls/floor speed by you and your preferal vision, thus creating an illiusion of speed.

5692

If Sprint was in CE and in every game afterwards, nobody would be complaining.

5693

> 2533274925229487;5687:
> sprinting makes the game a bit more competitive and challenging, taking it away tones down the speed of the game

The pace of the game is in no way increased by sprint, a high BMS lets you travel just as fast in any direction while shooting, that makes the game faster

5694

If u dont like sprint dont use it, simple

5695

> 2535438252454634;5694:
> If u dont like sprint dont use it, simple

How many of these fake accounts are out there? Is this what it has come down to? Making fake accounts to make it seems there are more pro-sprinters? I just made a post about this, just by not using a game mechanic doesn’t mean you’ll not feel the negative effects it has on the game.

5696

This isn’t a fake account I just said my opinion. Sorry if it offended you or pissed you off. I was also trying to take both sides of the conversation but I realise now that I went straight to one side. Hopefully that made sense.

5697

> 2533274975587773;5692:
> If Sprint was in CE and in every game afterwards, nobody would be complaining.

How is this hypothetical scenario of any relevance to the situation we currently find ourselves in.

“If insert cut debated mechanic in CE and every game afterwards nobody would be complaining”.

5698

> 2535438252454634;5696:
> This isn’t a fake account I just said my opinion. Sorry if it offended you or pissed you off. I was also trying to take both sides of the conversation but I realise now that I went straight to one side. Hopefully that made sense.

I felt it was a fake account when you haven’t posted anything before and I couldn’t see any played games in that account before. Don’t worry, you didn’t offend or piss me off. I just hope more people would realize what we are trying to say here. Just because a game offers a mechanic, it doesn’t make it so that said mechanic is optional without harm. Just because I don’t use it doesn’t fix its effect on the entire game. The maps accommodate sprint speed, my teamwork and defense would suffer if I didn’t use sprint. Also I hate how you’re so slow when firing your weapon. That’s why I’m rooting for higher BMS. That way game stays faster all the time and our shields don’t have to be nerfed beyond belief to try to make it “work” with sprint.

5699

> 2533274975587773;5692:
> If Sprint was in CE and in every game afterwards, nobody would be complaining.

The gameplay also would not have been anywhere near the same. What an incredibly ignorant statement…

> 2535438252454634;5694:
> If u dont like sprint dont use it, simple

Try not sprinting for an entire match and tell me how that goes for you. You’ll get torn apart before you can reach any cover since this game seems to hate the very concept of it and you’ll get flanked constantly because of how many disgusting ways there are of traversing some maps. I tried playing yesterday and I got killed so many times in arena because an enemy would spawn behind me or to a blindside of me, sprint and reach me in seconds. The spawns and map design are nowhere near acceptable enough to justify not sprinting. I was on Regret yesterday and got Spartan charged from 3 different directions…at the same time.

> 2533275035781111;5693:
> > 2533274925229487;5687:
> > sprinting makes the game a bit more competitive and challenging, taking it away tones down the speed of the game
>
>
> The pace of the game is in no way increased by sprint, a high BMS lets you travel just as fast in any direction while shooting, that makes the game faster

Seriously, has anyone in this thread pro sprint played DOOM? Not even the MP the campaign. Blistering freaking pace. No sprint.

> 2533274925229487;5687:
> sprinting makes the game a bit more competitive and challenging, taking it away tones down the speed of the game

Not if you up base movement speed like we’ve been saying for the past I don’t know 100 pages? I get not everyone has seen the thread yet, but at least read some of the more recent responses.

> 2533274795992636;5689:
> > 2533274925229487;5687:
> > sprinting makes the game a bit more competitive and challenging, taking it away tones down the speed of the game
>
>
> Absolutely, It makes the game, less casual, has alot more adrenaline then Halo 1-3. It’s kind of turning into a CoD game, by the fact of the sensitivity, and sprint, soon, there may be jetpacks capable of shooting you into the air 50 ft or more in less then a second.

Are you being sarcastic? I hope you are because CoD is the epitome of a casual game. Also you must have started with Halo 5 if you aren’t because there were jetpacks in Reach and 4 and they were taken out because they royally -Yoinked!- the gameplay. We’re arguing the concept that sprint does this same thing, at least in Halo.

5700

> 2533274831961512;5699:
> > 2533274975587773;5692:
> > If Sprint was in CE and in every game afterwards, nobody would be complaining.
>
>
> The gameplay also would not have been anywhere near the same. What an incredibly ignorant statement…
>
>
> > 2535438252454634;5694:
> > If u dont like sprint dont use it, simple
>
>
> Try not sprinting for an entire match and tell me how that goes for you. You’ll get torn apart before you can reach any cover since this game seems to hate the very concept of it and you’ll get flanked constantly because of how many disgusting ways there are of traversing some maps. I tried playing yesterday and I got killed so many times in arena because an enemy would spawn behind me or to a blindside of me, sprint and reach me in seconds. The spawns and map design are nowhere near acceptable enough to justify not sprinting. I was on Regret yesterday and got Spartan charged from 3 different directions…
>
>
> > 2533275035781111;5693:
> > > 2533274925229487;5687:
> > > sprinting makes the game a bit more competitive and challenging, taking it away tones down the speed of the game
> >
> >
> > The pace of the game is in no way increased by sprint, a high BMS lets you travel just as fast in any direction while shooting, that makes the game faster
>
>
> Seriously, has anyone in this thread pro sprint played DOOM? Not even the MP the campaign. Blistering freaking pace. No sprint.
>
>
> > 2533274925229487;5687:
> > sprinting makes the game a bit more competitive and challenging, taking it away tones down the speed of the game
>
>
> Not if you up base movement speed like we’ve been saying for the past I don’t know 100 pages? I get not everyone has seen the thread yet, but at least read some of the more recent responses.
>
>
> > 2533274795992636;5689:
> > > 2533274925229487;5687:
> > > sprinting makes the game a bit more competitive and challenging, taking it away tones down the speed of the game
> >
> >
> > Absolutely, It makes the game, less casual, has alot more adrenaline then Halo 1-3. It’s kind of turning into a CoD game, by the fact of the sensitivity, and sprint, soon, there may be jetpacks capable of shooting you into the air 50 ft or more in less then a second.
>
>
> Are you being sarcastic? I hope you are because CoD is the epitome of a casual game. Also you must have started with Halo 5 if you aren’t because there were jetpacks in Reach and 4 and they were taken out because they royally -Yoinked!- the gameplay. We’re arguing the concept that sprint does this same thing, at least in Halo.

A jetpack implemented into the spartan,(343 WILL do something stupid about that.) not some armor ability. And no, I totally am NOT being Sarcastic… Or am I… Anyways, it’s not as enjoyable as Halo 1-Reach( I was pretty tired at the time, so I didn’t know what I was talking about)

5701

> 2533274801176260;5683:
> > 2533274846700578;5634:
> > > 2535473635314008;5633:
> > > The argument that sprint makes the gameplay fast isn’t a very good one. I just like the dynamic flow to halo 5. If that stays without sprint I would be very happy without it. Of the 3 original games I find halo CE to be the fastest gameplay in multiplayer, but the base movement speed is the same for each game 1 to 3. Maps affect the speed of the game way more than sprint does.
> >
> >
> > Wrong.
>
>
> All three games of the original trilogy had a base movement speed of 7m/s or 15.66mph. It was only reduced for ODST to 5.5m/s (12.3mph) for the player to feel more human and less spartan, and later on for Reach (6.85m/s, 15.3mph) and Halo 4 (6.6m/s, 14.76mph) in order to justify the inclusion of sprint.

Halo 4 has a similar move speed to Halo 3, not Reach.

A while ago, this base speed argument was a big deal on Waypoint, and the easiest comparisons were made between Valhalla and Ragnarok, or Pitfall and The Pit. I confirmed through twitter they are straight remakes, not “inspired” like Truth or Regret. Many Waypointers (like ThyReaperMC) did video comparisons walking across each map. They are completed in the same time.