> 2535454994467056;4116:
> Sprints a fine change, but Spartan charging isn’t halo or realistic.
> Sprint keeps halo fast pace.
> Lowering the weapon fire rates will slow down gameplay if that’s what your looking for.
Fast paced? Ever played CE?
> 2533274891111509;4119:
> > 2533274799045652;4101:
> > Can we please stop replying to this and let it die down? They’re obviously not going to take away sprint so deal with it or play MCC.
>
>
> Well aren’t you just a bundle of hopeful sunshine. To answer your question, no, we can’t just “stop replying to this and let it die down.” I care about this subject, and like many others, believe that its discussion is of the utmost importance to the Halo franchise. I get that it’s probably a long shot to have the current movement system removed; the realist part of me keeps reminding me with every passion-filled message I post. Yet, my inner optimist refuses to let me walk away from what seems like a losing battle. Some may say that it’s not worth arguing over, that it would just be better to let it go. But I don’t care. This is my game. This is your game. This is Halo. We made it what it is today and what it has been over the years. Without the wonderful community we are all apart of, Halo could not have made it this far. That is why I fight, and sacrifice hours and hours of sleep, typing long, thought out essays on the forums when I have work early the next morning. We’re not continuing to reply to keep this thread alive, we keep responding to keep Halo alive.
Chill with the speeches, son. You’re not the hero in some big movie delivering a speech before the big climactic battle, you’re just a person on a forum arguing about a game mechanic in a thread that has long run its course.
> 2533275022416367;4121:
> > 2535454994467056;4116:
> > Sprints a fine change, but Spartan charging isn’t halo or realistic.
> > Sprint keeps halo fast pace.
> > Lowering the weapon fire rates will slow down gameplay if that’s what your looking for.
>
>
> Fast paced? Ever played CE?
Halo 2 and CE were the fast paced non sprint games in Halo. Halo 3 was just slow to me.
> 2533275028722613;4108:
> I’m sorry but Halo 4 had absolutely no legs when it came to launch. The reason it wound up 3-4 million copies short of Halo 3 was because its multiplayer was absolute trash and the campaign, which was really good in my opinion, went over people’s heads. Sprint ruined it. It was unbalanced. Halo 5 didn’t have great sales either. See what sprint does?
So you’re saying that a game where you could spawn with invisibility and a pocket sized shotgun, people left or didn’t buy it because of sprint? That’s about as believable as me having purple poop that smells like rainbow skittles!
> 2533274807537946;4118:
> > 2533274819567236;4117:
> > > 2533274807537946;4115:
> > > > 2533274819567236;4110:
> > > > > 2533274807537946;4107:
> > > > > > 2533274819567236;4094:
> > > > > > > 2533274807658681;4088:
> > > > > > > > 2533274819567236;4084:
> > > > > > > > I’m aware of that survey, but I’m not gonna assume they take all feedback to heart when appropriate. A balance needs to be struck between giving people what they want and what benefits the game. Rather than being creative or just thinking for themselves, 343 included sprint because of the year (a perfect example amateur game development) instead of how it effects the game (which would be a perfect example of competent/normal game development).
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > My point was though, that forum feedback is a normal place for devs to look. It’s also more reassuring because it’s out there for all to see. Considering 343 has a history of wordplay, misrepresentation and lying, I’m not gonna trust every private survey they have, particularly when it’s the one poll that says the opposite of what we’ve seen on every other poll before it (and after it, according to now often linked Reddit thread). It certainly didn’t help when they told us of the 11% and what seemed like every anti-sprinter said, “Wait, what survey?” and some even claiming that they had signed up, but never got the survey (though I’m a little more skeptical of those claims).
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > In regards to why there was an inclusion of sprint - perhaps this GDC talk may help you can use the left panel to skip to the relevant mobility section. I think the main thrust of it is that sprint also adds a new level of control context which is really useful when you’re running out of buttons on the pad. Having two different contexts allows them to experiment with adding new abilities - whether you find these new abilities (Spartan Charge?!) all that great is another matter.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I believe I’ve seen that panel. They basically explain that most of their ideas were based around immersion and realism, citing The Dark Knight trilogy as an influence. It’s also where they said they included sprint because of the year, which, again, is not the proper way to make decisions on what’s in the game.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Explaining the benefits would be fine, if the drawbacks it has on the game as a whole were also addressed, which isn’t something they’ll talk about for obvious reasons. I would love for a member of 343 to get involved in a discussion on those issues at some point (though, I know that will never happen). Josh Holmes once made a long post on TeamBeyond about the decision to include sprint and why. The explanation basically amounted to “immersion and expectations”, which is not smart game development.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > So what is “smart game development” to you? Listening to a small subset of community members on a forum as if they’re infallible saints whose every decision assures millions of sales?
> > > > >
> > > > > Immersion and expectations of players are both highly valuable things for a game to have and should not be discounted. Regarding immersion in an FPS title, people don’t want to feel like they’re just a floating pair of hands. They want to feel like whatever they’re playing as. The way I see it, 343i went into Halo 4 wanting to combine that feeling of being a Spartan with meeting modern gamers’ expectations, and that’s why we got all those armor abilities, loadouts, perks and such. That obviously didn’t go over so well, so they dialed it back for Halo 5. They gave players a small universal set of abilities to make them feel like a super-soldier and designed maps and weapon layouts on those maps around said abilities. Halo 5 does a good job of making you feel like a Spartan and leveraging modern game mechanics while re-focusing the gameplay on controlling the map and the weapons that spawn on it. People are just so hung up on their nostalgia that they’re staring red-eyed at one tree while everybody else is busy enjoying themselves in the forest.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Smart game development is making decisions based on how something effects the game. I don’t think 343 has ever given gameplay related reasons as to why sprint benefits the gameplay in ways that can’t be accomplished without the drawbacks. Maybe they have and if anyone has links, that would be nice.
> > >
> > >
> > > If somebody actually provided you with links to such a thing you’d probably stick your fingers in your ears and close your eyes, come back to this thread and ask for the hundredth time “How does it benefit the game though?!?!?!”
> >
> >
> > So, there are no links then?
>
>
> No links, but let’s be honest here: After over 200 pages of people offering up their arguments, would even the most thorough of write-ups or video breakdowns of the Sprint mechanic by a 343i employee convince you? Or do you just want to keep this thread alive until they send a formal written letter to your door telling them that they won’t include Sprint in Halo 6?
It probably wouldn’t “convince” me it benefits the game, but it would shed light on if 343 even thinks it does. That’s why some sort of dialogue would be perfect. We know of the drawbacks and the likely very simple solutions, so if they were to give their reasons for sprint and answer questions we have regarding the drawbacks and alternative methods of player speed, pacing or whatever sprint is suppose to accomplish, then not only would we create an understanding, but it would force 343 to acknowledge the issues.
Until then, the implementation of sprint will reflect amateur game development and highlight why 343 will never be more than an mediocre studio while in their current state of mind. I say that very matter-of-factly, mind you, not with any hate.
> 2533274819567236;4125:
> > 2533274807537946;4118:
> > > 2533274819567236;4117:
> > > > 2533274807537946;4115:
> > > > > 2533274819567236;4110:
> > > > > > 2533274807537946;4107:
> > > > > > > 2533274819567236;4094:
> > > > > > > > 2533274807658681;4088:
> > > > > > > > > 2533274819567236;4084:
> > > > > > > > > I’m aware of that survey, but I’m not gonna assume they take all feedback to heart when appropriate. A balance needs to be struck between giving people what they want and what benefits the game. Rather than being creative or just thinking for themselves, 343 included sprint because of the year (a perfect example amateur game development) instead of how it effects the game (which would be a perfect example of competent/normal game development).
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > My point was though, that forum feedback is a normal place for devs to look. It’s also more reassuring because it’s out there for all to see. Considering 343 has a history of wordplay, misrepresentation and lying, I’m not gonna trust every private survey they have, particularly when it’s the one poll that says the opposite of what we’ve seen on every other poll before it (and after it, according to now often linked Reddit thread). It certainly didn’t help when they told us of the 11% and what seemed like every anti-sprinter said, “Wait, what survey?” and some even claiming that they had signed up, but never got the survey (though I’m a little more skeptical of those claims).
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > In regards to why there was an inclusion of sprint - perhaps this GDC talk may help you can use the left panel to skip to the relevant mobility section. I think the main thrust of it is that sprint also adds a new level of control context which is really useful when you’re running out of buttons on the pad. Having two different contexts allows them to experiment with adding new abilities - whether you find these new abilities (Spartan Charge?!) all that great is another matter.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I believe I’ve seen that panel. They basically explain that most of their ideas were based around immersion and realism, citing The Dark Knight trilogy as an influence. It’s also where they said they included sprint because of the year, which, again, is not the proper way to make decisions on what’s in the game.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Explaining the benefits would be fine, if the drawbacks it has on the game as a whole were also addressed, which isn’t something they’ll talk about for obvious reasons. I would love for a member of 343 to get involved in a discussion on those issues at some point (though, I know that will never happen). Josh Holmes once made a long post on TeamBeyond about the decision to include sprint and why. The explanation basically amounted to “immersion and expectations”, which is not smart game development.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > So what is “smart game development” to you? Listening to a small subset of community members on a forum as if they’re infallible saints whose every decision assures millions of sales?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Immersion and expectations of players are both highly valuable things for a game to have and should not be discounted. Regarding immersion in an FPS title, people don’t want to feel like they’re just a floating pair of hands. They want to feel like whatever they’re playing as. The way I see it, 343i went into Halo 4 wanting to combine that feeling of being a Spartan with meeting modern gamers’ expectations, and that’s why we got all those armor abilities, loadouts, perks and such. That obviously didn’t go over so well, so they dialed it back for Halo 5. They gave players a small universal set of abilities to make them feel like a super-soldier and designed maps and weapon layouts on those maps around said abilities. Halo 5 does a good job of making you feel like a Spartan and leveraging modern game mechanics while re-focusing the gameplay on controlling the map and the weapons that spawn on it. People are just so hung up on their nostalgia that they’re staring red-eyed at one tree while everybody else is busy enjoying themselves in the forest.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Smart game development is making decisions based on how something effects the game. I don’t think 343 has ever given gameplay related reasons as to why sprint benefits the gameplay in ways that can’t be accomplished without the drawbacks. Maybe they have and if anyone has links, that would be nice.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > If somebody actually provided you with links to such a thing you’d probably stick your fingers in your ears and close your eyes, come back to this thread and ask for the hundredth time “How does it benefit the game though?!?!?!”
> > >
> > >
> > > So, there are no links then?
> >
> >
> > No links, but let’s be honest here: After over 200 pages of people offering up their arguments, would even the most thorough of write-ups or video breakdowns of the Sprint mechanic by a 343i employee convince you? Or do you just want to keep this thread alive until they send a formal written letter to your door telling them that they won’t include Sprint in Halo 6?
>
>
> It probably wouldn’t “convince” me it benefits the game, but it would shed light on if 343 even thinks it does. That’s why some sort of dialogue would be perfect. We know of the drawbacks and the likely very simple solutions, so if they were to give their reasons for sprint and answer questions we have regarding the drawbacks and alternative methods of player speed, pacing or whatever sprint is suppose to accomplish, then not only would we create an understanding, but it would force 343 to acknowledge the issues.
>
> Until then, the implementation of sprint will reflect amateur game development and highlight why 343 will never be more than an mediocre studio while in their current state of mind. I say that very matter-of-factly, mind you, not with any hate.
I too would love some interaction between 343 and the community on sprint and other controversial issues of the like. Also, great post man.
> 2535409489305717;4106:
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> > > > > > > 2533275035781111;4062:
> > > > > > > > 2533274806285584;4033:
> > > > > > > > get this thread out of here… we love sprint, deal with it
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > For anyone who is misinformed in what most people want
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Because online polls should totally dictate the core gameplay of a franchise that’s attempting to attract millions of consumers, right? Because online polls on sites like TeamBeyond and the Halo Subreddit, full of super die-hard fans, should always be taken as the undisputed will of what “most people” want, right? Gimme a break.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > You’re right, we should look how well the game does, what kind of population plays it on a short term/ long term basis and how well it is reviewed among game reviewers and everyday gamers. You can see how well the franchise has done when Reach added armor abilities, Halo 4 made loadouts and Halo 5 added Spartan abilities. Also all of these games had some sort of a sprint mechanism changing how the arena shooter played. You can clearly see the games did great, population only keep on growing and Halo is still to this day, a console seller like Halo 1-3 were.
> > > > >
> > > > > Oh, wait…
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Apparently, in order to determine what people want, the devs shouldn’t look at sales, population numbers or player feedback.
> > > >
> > > > So what’s left?
> > > >
> > > > It’s funny how he thinks it’s weird to get player feedback from forums. Pretty sure that’s where most devs look for feedback.
> > >
> > >
> > > He’s actually saying how skewed the polls are because only diehard fans will search for anything of the likes. Despite being a hard-core Halo fan, I and a lot of other fans did not get to participate in these polls, and not only that, who’s to say that Halo haters just didn’t go and mess with the results or if complainers who have multiple accounts voted multiple times or had their friends vote in their favor.
> > >
> > > There are too many factors and variables that effect the overall validity of online poll is what he was aiming at, of course though you will only see the surface and take it out of context because it differs from your opinion. Talk about blindly arguing.
> >
> >
> > So you think anti-sprinters went and sabotaged every sprint poll on the Internet? Ok bud, you keep thinking that.
>
>
> It MIGHT be possible. I’m not saying that anti sprinters did sabotage the results but it can be possible.
Exactly I’m not saying on all of them, but it’s a possibility that cannot be ignored.
Honestly you it would make it more of a hassle to have sprint be included in some modes and not others it is a game-play option that should either exist in everything or shouldn’t exist at all and to be honest it is a lot more interesting when there is sprint.
Josh Holmes actually touched on the inclusion of sprint and the reasons behind it over at TeamBeyond a while back. He basically just repeated what most people have already said here (immersion, modern gamers expect it, etc). Not very convincing reasons, but meh.
> 2533274794648158;4129:
> Josh Holmes actually touched on the inclusion of sprint and the reasons behind it over at TeamBeyond a while back. He basically just repeated what most people have already said here (immersion, modern gamers expect it, etc). Not very convincing reasons, but meh.
Thanks for finding that man. I had never seen that before, and I’m really glad you shared it. I wish there were more interactions like this during development before they put their stubborn pants on and refuse to change anything they already decided on.
> 2535466914543129;4124:
> > 2533275028722613;4108:
> > I’m sorry but Halo 4 had absolutely no legs when it came to launch. The reason it wound up 3-4 million copies short of Halo 3 was because its multiplayer was absolute trash and the campaign, which was really good in my opinion, went over people’s heads. Sprint ruined it. It was unbalanced. Halo 5 didn’t have great sales either. See what sprint does?
>
>
> So you’re saying that a game where you could spawn with invisibility and a pocket sized shotgun, people left or didn’t buy it because of sprint? That’s about as believable as me having purple poop that smells like rainbow skittles!
As believable as when it’s said that sprint keeps Halo afloat, people wouldn’t buy and play Halo if there was no sprint and all other comments regarding sprint which are like that.
Sprint should just be another armour ability like in HALO Reach that would be best for matchmaking and custom games
> 2533274966375404;4128:
> Honestly you it would make it more of a hassle to have sprint be included in some modes and not others it is a game-play option that should either exist in everything or shouldn’t exist at all and to be honest it is a lot more interesting when there is sprint.
I agree that it should be an all or nothing kind of thing. I think that no sprint Halo has so much more depth than sprint Halo though. Being able to move at full speed and fight at the same time on maps that are designed to be played like that is faster, more engaging, and more skill based.
It’s fine if you like sprint, but the things that I just said are facts. Sprint comes with drawbacks that can’t be fixed. No-sprint’s “slowness” can be fixed by the addition of man cannons, teleporters, and light vehicles. All of those things don’t take away from the golden triangle (it’s impossible to do any of the golden triangle while sprinting) making gameplay more dynamic and gives it depth.
> 2533275007449996;3982:
> > 2533274836316810;3980:
> > Oh and removing sprint would mean adjusting the maps to a smaller scale or something
>
>
> dude have you played the maps…they didnt stretch them for sprint at all…the only thing the maps are designed around is clamber
Good point. Come to think of it, the 18m radar would actually work again with no sprint
Halo 6 will have killstreaks , halo rip 
> 2533274836316810;4134:
> > 2533275007449996;3982:
> > > 2533274836316810;3980:
> > > Oh and removing sprint would mean adjusting the maps to a smaller scale or something
> >
> >
> > dude have you played the maps…they didnt stretch them for sprint at all…the only thing the maps are designed around is clamber
>
>
> Good point. Come to think of it, the 18m radar would actually work again with no sprint
18 meters would work for no sprint as 25 works for with sprint.
I play Halo since the first game and I must say that I really like the sprint-mode.
> 2533274795123910;4131:
> > 2535466914543129;4124:
> > > 2533275028722613;4108:
> > > I’m sorry but Halo 4 had absolutely no legs when it came to launch. The reason it wound up 3-4 million copies short of Halo 3 was because its multiplayer was absolute trash and the campaign, which was really good in my opinion, went over people’s heads. Sprint ruined it. It was unbalanced. Halo 5 didn’t have great sales either. See what sprint does?
> >
> >
> > So you’re saying that a game where you could spawn with invisibility and a pocket sized shotgun, people left or didn’t buy it because of sprint? That’s about as believable as me having purple poop that smells like rainbow skittles!
>
>
> As believable as when it’s said that sprint keeps Halo afloat, people wouldn’t buy and play Halo if there was no sprint and all other comments regarding sprint which are like that.
The significance of sprint to Halo’s popularity is wildly exaggerated on both sides of the argument. The most likely outcome of removing sprint would probably be that nothing would change aside from the forum argument being finally laid to rest.
> 2533274825830455;3986:
> > 2533274845986648;3984:
> > It adds increased maneuverability, variable jump distances,
>
>
> In what way, exactly, does sprint add maneuverability and variable jump distances? Aside from being able to make longer jumps—which would also be possible by simply increasing base movement speed—you have always been able to make arbitrarily short jumps. And in terms of general maneuverability, is there anything about sprint that isn’t simply an effect of a higher movement speed to begin with?
>
>
>
>
> > 2533274845986648;3984:
> > and of course step number one of a spartan charge…say what you will about this ability but it’s not a gimme kill. Ever seen somebody miss use it…they get punished. Sprint is also a key part of slide jumps which allow Spartans to not only cover ground quickly but change elevation making them a harder target in open spaces. In my mind sprint stays.
>
>
> The implementation of both of these mechanics doesn’t require sprint. They are implemented through sprint in Halo 5, but they could equally well be implemented without sprint. Nothing you mentioned requires sprint and simply a higher base movement speed would suffice.
The entire point is to be able to change speeds and yes sprint is a required part of everything I mentioned in current game play…you know reality. Every game I have ever played with the implementation of sprint makes the game better. The entire point is to have different speeds to use during game play. It gives more variables in the game and in several cases can be used to manipulate the games physics.
> 2533274851350468;4135:
> Halo 6 will have killstreaks , halo rip
Ok now you’re just pulling stuff out of your -Yoink-!