At the OP: if you were really the skilled player in the scenarios you describe with bloom and Armor Lock, etc., you’d also be skilled in how those mechanics work and would win after all. For bloom, spam shots to reduce the shield then get precise once it’s 1 shot-headshot time. Armor Lock-just wait and count to about 4 or 5 seconds then throw a grenade to welcome them once they’re out of it. If a teammate of theirs shows up, just retreat, there’s no shame in that because you’re really just helping your team and yourself by not giving the opponents that kill and possible power weapon and so on. I’m sure you can think of strategic solutions for the other combat situations that are ailing you.
> At the OP: if you were really the skilled player in the scenarios you describe with bloom and Armor Lock, etc., you’d also be skilled in how those mechanics work and would win after all. For bloom, spam shots to reduce the shield then get precise once it’s 1 shot-headshot time. Armor Lock-just wait and count to about 4 or 5 seconds then throw a grenade to welcome them once they’re out of it. If a teammate of theirs shows up, just retreat, there’s no shame in that because you’re really just helping your team and yourself by not giving the opponents that kill and possible power weapon and so on. I’m sure you can think of strategic solutions for the other combat situations that are ailing you.
This.
And if their Team mate shows up during an AL, and now you’re outnumbered… why did you separate from your team mate?
AL bashing because you have no skill doesn’t makes sense, just another smoke screen, like bloom hate.
> > > And you see how it left the community jaded and disenchanted.
> >
> > It left some in the community feeling that way, obviously, but I would point out that as “Swan Songs” go… if you don’t like it, you were never really a fan to being with.
> >
> > Bloom is fine.*
> >
> >
> > Unless you’re having some crazed shootout in Halo Reach where neither play can move left, right, forward or back and is stuck at exactly 10 forge units without any team mates AA’s or other weapons when you both spawn at the same and cover/position doesn’t matter because again you’re not allowed to move except for on the 30th of February, or a blue moon whichever comes first in the next 60 days*.
> >
> > **Okay the thing about the February, the moon, and 60 days was all made up.
>
> Ignorance at its finest!
>
> I love the way that you used facts to support this argument! I love the way that this effectively contradicts all of the facts and evidence that I have brought forth! /sarcasm
>
> Don’t you remember the scenario that I depicted for you before? What on earth makes you think that the way bloom itself operates changes due to distance apart or movement? If anything, DMR spamming will continue to have a random outcome until the target fills the inner circle of the weapon’s reticule; only then will a kill be guaranteed.
I’m not saying that bloom is effected by movement, I’m saying that aim is.
And Aim is an indicator of skill.
And your argument against bloom is wrong because it’s based on my quoted scenario, which isn’t apart of Halo gameplay, in Reach or otherwise.
> If both players have an equal chance factor in their DMR’s bloom system, then it is fair.
> If both players have an equal chance to spawn near ammo, then it is fair.
>
> What sort of logic is that? Very disappointing.
Both were terrible examples, my apologies.
> > > Being inconsistent for everybody doesn’t make it consistent.
> >
> > Yeah, it does.
> >
> > To steal an idea posted earlier in this thread. In other games you have what’s called a “critical strike”.
> >
> > Having a larger critical strike chance gives you the edge in a battle. Increasing your chance of making a critical strike helps you and is something skillful players try to do to gain an edge on their opponent.
>
> games that use the ‘critical strike’ mechanic are almost never FPS games, and are almost always games that have higher HP values so if you encounter people, the critical strike is a bit of help, but its not the end of the line for the person who doesnt get the critical strike. when spamming wins against pacing, this is basically like a critical strike. the funny thing about this is, this ‘critical strike’ only comes when players are playing in a way that would make them lose 76% of the time, so when they get the critical strike they are lucking out to ‘crit’ into not dying due to their own stupidity. this is about the most bonkers off the wall concept you could possibly come up with.
Agreed.
So you’re going to win most the time if you’re the more skilled player.
That ends this discussion, the more skilled player does win.
> > > > You probably are better, so?
> > >
> > > So therefore I understand gameplay mechanics better. Bloom is not fine. If you think it is, then you need to read this.
> > > If you wish to continue this discussion, feel free to send me a PM. I’m done with this thread.
> >
> > I’ve been reading that link for months.
> >
> > CLEARLY the author of that post states that the spammer will ONLY win 24% of the time.
> > Is that too much? Not enough?
> > IT DOESN’T MATTER.
> >
> > That is purely subjective. I have no problem with someone getting a cheap kill on me 24% of the time. You do.
> >
> > That doesn’t mean it’s broken.
> >
> > That doesn’t mean it needs a change.
> >
> > It just doesn’t work the way you want it to.
> >
> > If you’re going to insist on using the logic: “I’m better than you so I know and you don’t” then we’re done here. In this thread and otherwise.
>
> An interesting quote from the man himself! (Especially the bold!)
>
> Not only does this contradict your entire argument thus far of, ‘The better player ALWAYS wins’, it is an admission that it doesn’t bother you.
>
> Unless if, of course, you WANT people to have the chance to get cheap kills 24% of the time.
> But that can’t be the case, because you have been saying that it doesn’t happen (which is then contradicted by the quote above… I’m confused!)
>
> You obviously have a zero care-factor regarding this topic, and are just arguing for the sake of arguing. I think we’re done here.
I think it’s important to understand that I’m fine with it because a slayer game goes more than 1 kill. In MM, it goes more than 24 kills. In objective games the sky is the limit. But at the end of the game, the more skilled player will win, regardless of bloom.
That’s the point I was making there, and here.
> > I will never understand people’s logic that the H3 BR was somehow less random than the DMR. At long range, two thirds of the BR bullets didn’t hit where you aimed. I think most peoples’ biggest beef with Reach whether they realize it or not, is that Reach gave players a visual representation of its randomness on the DMR, where as Halo 3 let the randomness of the BR stay mostly hidden unless you did custom game experiments.
> >
> > Also: Hitscan>Bullet Travel. Halo 3 can die a slow death for its bullet travel BR nonsense.
>
> Yes but that was at extreme range so it wasn’t as big of a deal. Imagine having that inconsistency that H3 had at extreme range but at almost every range, that’s the problem.
It wasn’t “extreme range” if you were used to Halo 2 at the time. It was just a crappy gun. I play Reach a lot and I honestly don’t see where it’s more inconsistent than the H3 BR. Thats just my opinion. Maybe it is the fact that I engage from farther away than most people, but I just think if 343i never changed a thing with the DMR, it would be better than the Halo 3 BR and worse than the H2 BR. I can’t speak for the CE pistol, because I only ever played local MP…never went to LANs. I think you have to throw out the CE pistol anyway because it never had to perform over the internet. That said, if they take out the bloom and make it a killing machine like the H2 BR, I would be ecstatic.
> > At the OP: if you were really the skilled player in the scenarios you describe with bloom and Armor Lock, etc., you’d also be skilled in how those mechanics work and would win after all. For bloom, spam shots to reduce the shield then get precise once it’s 1 shot-headshot time. Armor Lock-just wait and count to about 4 or 5 seconds then throw a grenade to welcome them once they’re out of it. If a teammate of theirs shows up, just retreat, there’s no shame in that because you’re really just helping your team and yourself by not giving the opponents that kill and possible power weapon and so on. I’m sure you can think of strategic solutions for the other combat situations that are ailing you.
>
> This.
>
> And if their Team mate shows up during an AL, and now you’re outnumbered… why did you separate from your team mate?
>
> AL bashing because you have no skill doesn’t makes sense, just another smoke screen, like bloom hate.
Why shouldn’t you separate from your teammate? Sorry, I forgot. Of course you can’t separate from your teammate in Reach because you can’t survive alone because of the lack chances for individual skill. Again one area of skill that is made almost completely irrelevant because of things like bloom and armor abilities.
You know what, the need to have a teammate with you in every single case hinders other areas of teamwork and skill in general. Previous Halo games were better exactly for the reason that team shooting wasn’t the only viable strategy. You could actually utilize other strategies and gameplay styles.
You’re talking about “smoke screen” although you’re the one who doesn’t see the big picture. You need to open your eyes and stop being ignorant. You should even once in your life come out of your small universe where everything is perfect for you and actually try to comprehend something. You could even learn something in the process.
> A change of heart from your previous professing of the lesser skilled player ‘never’ winning, and it is good to see. Now, that you have FINALLY realised (or at least decided to admit), can you see why we would want it so that the more skilled player ALWAYS wins? It wouldn’t change anything about the DMR other than reduce the effectiveness of spamming up until ranges where the inner circle is completely filled by the target. It wouldn’t turn it into a BR, it wouldn’t make Reach into a one gun game or anything like that, it just wouldn’t reward spammers by chance.
See, even if I concede all of that (and I’m not)…
you still have a game that’s been released for nearly a year where…
you still have to balance FF with the change…
you still have to balance campaign with the change…
you still are going to have a HUGE population wondering why you changed a key mechanic when they saw nothing wrong with it to begin with.
Which is why I’m all for giving you guys a playlist (or two) for these things.
But even if you get that… on the normal Reach playlist the fact remains that the better player will still win, WAY more than 74% of the time because:
games don’t end in one kill.
Skill is not determined by one kill.
games aren’t determined by a single.
Aim is not determined by bloom.
Bloom is the same for everyone.The DMR is not a weapon for EVERY range (except on your playlist now).
1v1 at 10 forge units and not moving is not a Halo game.
> > > At the OP: if you were really the skilled player in the scenarios you describe with bloom and Armor Lock, etc., you’d also be skilled in how those mechanics work and would win after all. For bloom, spam shots to reduce the shield then get precise once it’s 1 shot-headshot time. Armor Lock-just wait and count to about 4 or 5 seconds then throw a grenade to welcome them once they’re out of it. If a teammate of theirs shows up, just retreat, there’s no shame in that because you’re really just helping your team and yourself by not giving the opponents that kill and possible power weapon and so on. I’m sure you can think of strategic solutions for the other combat situations that are ailing you.
> >
> > This.
> >
> > And if their Team mate shows up during an AL, and now you’re outnumbered… why did you separate from your team mate?
> >
> > AL bashing because you have no skill doesn’t makes sense, just another smoke screen, like bloom hate.
>
> Why shouldn’t you separate from your teammate? Sorry, I forgot. Of course you can’t separate from your teammate in Reach because you can’t survive alone because of the lack chances for individual skill. Again one area of skill that is made almost completely irrelevant because of things like bloom and armor abilities.
>
> You know what, the need to have a teammate with you in every single case hinders other areas of teamwork and skill in general. Previous Halo games were better exactly for the reason that team shooting wasn’t the only viable strategy. You could actually utilize other strategies and gameplay styles.
>
> You’re talking about “smoke screen” although you’re the one who doesn’t see the big picture. You need to open your eyes and stop being ignorant. You should even once in your life come out of your small universe where everything is perfect for you and actually try to comprehend something. You could even learn something in the process.
You’re the same guys since H2 who bash on people for not team shooting, and now Reach comes along, and just to make the point that it’s NOT H2 or H3, you guys are turning around and bashing on the concept of Team shooting because it doesn’t fit your argument?!?
Ludicrous!
> Why are you arguing against making it impossible to get cheap kills then? If it is something that doesn’t bother you, then surely you would be impartial. What I don’t understand is why you have been arguing with me when all that I have been saying all along is that the system can be improved, so that there isn’t a cheap kill achieved on you that ruins your killing spree, or makes you lose the power weapon etc.
>
> So really then, a good question to pose would be, don’t you care if you died unfairly and lost your perfection? Your Rocket Launcher? Your powerful position on the map? Your multikill? I’m sure that would annoy any player, excluding the most casual of casuals.
I think the larger expense is than losing all those things to a bloom kill (which is a rarity) is changing bloom per your request and losing the rest of the sandbox.
As Josh said in his Tweet… though the DMR does most things best, to balance the sandbox, and force tough decisions on players using the 2-gun system, it can’t be best at all things, otherwise you would just use it.
You’re talking about changing the sandbox in a way that would devalue EVERYTHING else. Why even pick up the RL if you’re going to be killed from across the map before you can get to it?
> The real funny thing is that, you STILL haven’t brought any facts to the table, OR responded to mine yet.
>
> Anyway, I’m going to bed. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE read everything that I have said and register it before you respond again!
You know… I told you how it is, don’t believe me, that’s your loss.
I even gave a little this morning, and instead of getting a little bit in return, you’ve been emboldened, more obstinent than ever.
I’m out.
Bloom adds more skill. The reason being that you have to think whether to Pace or spam in different situations.