It created randomness in both Reach and Halo 4. All the Halos before these two did NOT suck because they didn’t involve gimmicks/advantages of using some abilities over another.
Loadouts is another thing that was introduced. Brilliant for custom games, but horrible for multiplayer. Being able to spawn with a plasma pistol in BTB should not be allowed. It causes unnecessary nerfing to some guns in the game. If the light rifle wasn’t a loadout weapon it could have been a 3 hit killer. It’s got the size and look to make it seem like it can do some damage but it doesn’t do anything due to these stupid balancing restrictions.
In the end…Halo needs classic multiplayer.
The Definition of Halo Multiplayer:
Two teams enter under the same circumstances. Two teams enter, one team leaves. Simple as that.
There is no need for AA’s. There are no need for loadouts. If it’s not broken, then DON’t Fix it. Halo multiplayer balancing becomes difficult when these extra gimmicks are included in the game.
I Hope the guys at 343i see this…I’m really not asking for much, and I’m looking forward to the new Spartan Abilities and Halo 5 Guardians.
If you didn’t spawn with them, I imagine that there would have been nothing wrong with armor abilities. If they didn’t allow you to spawn with power weapons and perks, I imagine that personal loadouts would have been far less harmful to gameplay.
Pinning those two elements right there on ALL of the problems with Halo’s multiplayer is about as incorrect as it gets.
> If you didn’t spawn with them, I imagine that there would have been nothing wrong with armor abilities. If they didn’t allow you to spawn with power weapons and perks, I imagine that personal loadouts would have been far less harmful to gameplay.
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> Pinning those two elements right there on ALL of the problems with Halo’s multiplayer is about as incorrect as it gets.
Load outs still break gameplay even without power weapons. It has to be identical starts in order to be fair. I agree w the armor abilities though, most of them would probably work well as equipment on map with a bit of tweaking.
The best that 343 industries should make the multiplayer of halo as was always thought of controlling the map, know where the weapons were, knowing that time came out, know what the best position on the map, make balanced maps and top valances between weapons .
> The Definition of Halo Multiplayer:
>
> Two teams enter under the same circumstances. Two teams enter, one team leaves. Simple as that.
What if I only play FFA?
And I don’t think that AAs and loadouts are the root of ALL the problems in Halo. But I do agree that they, along with sprint, are a very, very big reason why Halo is dying.
It’s actually the community that’s the problem. That aside it’s already been confirmed that AA’s are out which you would’ve seen from a few minutes of searching. This thread has no constructive perpose and needs a lock.
> If you didn’t spawn with them, I imagine that there would have been nothing wrong with armor abilities.
They might not have harmed gameplay, but they certainly wouldn’t have added to it.
> If they didn’t allow you to spawn with power weapons and perks, I imagine that personal loadouts would have been far less harmful to gameplay.
Note the use of the words “far less” rather than “not.”
> It’s actually the community that’s the problem.
I’m pretty sure developers design games, not players.
> By this logic, Halo 3 and Halo 2 were perfect.
They were at least much better than Halo: Reach and Halo 4. The point of this topic is to point out those things that made Halo: Reach and Halo 4 of less quality than Halo 2 and Halo 3.
> It’s actually the community that’s the problem. That aside it’s already been confirmed that AA’s are out which you would’ve seen from a few minutes of searching. This thread has no constructive perpose and needs a lock.
I think the OP is forgetting the worst part of H4. It wasn’t loadouts. It wasn’t AAs. It wasn’t sprint. It wasn’t flinch.
It was POD.
That element was worse than all of the others combined. It is random and completely antithetical to an arena shooter. If H5 only removes that one element entirely, it will already be a much better game than H4.
> I think the OP is forgetting the worst part of H4. It wasn’t loadouts. It wasn’t AAs. It wasn’t sprint. It wasn’t flinch.
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> It was POD.
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> That element was worse than all of the others combined. It is random and completely antithetical to an arena shooter. If H5 only removes that one element entirely, it will already be a much better game than H4.
Exactly. Add to it that they only clutter the map with an overabundance of power weapons and it would feel like your shields simply don’t matter.
Nothing brings more pain than a person who can have a power weapon/up almost all the time. A guy with Overshields that is almost readily available using PODs and map pickups is effectively a Juggernaut that finally learned to use a gun and have friends to back him up.
Last time I check, the Juggernaut is a jerk, an X-man with his own gametype, and stays out of Team Slayer.
> > If you didn’t spawn with them, I imagine that there would have been nothing wrong with armor abilities.
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> They might not have harmed gameplay, but they certainly wouldn’t have added to it.
And were Equipment any better?
They were literately the exact same concept. Last I checked, Bungie replaced Equipment with AA’s because, apparently, Equipment was heavily underused and often ignored by players.
Hologram and Thrusters are definitely things that added to gameplay. Hell, it took a lot of skill to be able to fool someone into a beatdown/assassination with the hologram. And pour a bucket of lava on my head as you will, but the only thing about Halo 5 that has disappointing me so far is the complete removal of AA’s. IMO that was completely unnecessary.
> > If they didn’t allow you to spawn with power weapons and perks, I imagine that personal loadouts would have been far less harmful to gameplay.
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> Note the use of the words “far less” rather than “not.”
> And were Equipment any better?
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> They were literately the exact same concept. Last I checked, Bungie replaced Equipment with AA’s because, apparently, Equipment was heavily underused and often ignored by players.
Equipment and powerups were limited to one use only, and so they were more powerful. AAs can be used an infinite number of times, so they must be balanced by not being as powerful. If they’re not as powerful, then they’re not really worth being picked up. Jet Pack, one of the most powerful of Halo: Reach’s AAs, was made a map pickup in Halo: Reach’s MLG playlist. Almost every time someone picked it up, they died before they got to make good use out of it, and so it was rarely picked up.
Power weapons are not only picked up, but fought over because they directly and substantially increase the amount of damage you can deal. Any map pickup needs to provide a worthwhile advantage or it is just fluff.
> > And were Equipment any better?
> >
> > They were literately the exact same concept. Last I checked, Bungie replaced Equipment with AA’s because, apparently, Equipment was heavily underused and often ignored by players.
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> Equipment and powerups were limited to one use only, and so they were more powerful. AAs can be used an infinite number of times, so they must be balanced by not being as powerful. If they’re not as powerful, then they’re not really worth being picked up. Jet Pack, one of the most powerful of Halo: Reach’s AAs, was made a map pickup in Halo: Reach’s MLG playlist. Almost every time someone picked it up, they died before they got to make good use out of it, and so it was rarely picked up.
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> Power weapons are not only picked up, but fought over because they directly and substantially increase the amount of damage you can deal. Any map pickup needs to provide a worthwhile advantage or it is just fluff.
To add on, not all “variety” or “choice” is good variety. Many times, it is just confusing and gives the game a cluttered feel. H4 has over 1,000 possible combinations of perks/AAs and almost three complete sets of weapons (human, covie, forerunner). The vast majority of those . . . would most of us even bother to go pick them up in-game and risk being killed trying to obtain them? Would you risk that for autosentry when you could be going after rockets?
If there are virtually no scenarios where a player would risk dying to obtain the item, then it probably shouldn’t be in the game in the first place. It shouldn’t simply be moved to an armor ability, which has no risk associated with obtaining it.
Halo used to be an arena shooter. I would like to have Halo return to that in H5. Anything you had that was different from what the other players had was something you took a risk to obtain. The reason people ignored them before was because they weren’t worth the risk in-game to obtain them. If so, they should either be removed, or reworked to be worth the risk.
I agree… but you forgot no BR/DMR starts… that should have it’s own playlist.
long range weapon starts breaks gameplay, it all started in Reach with the introduction of the DMR.
It’s not worth my time tackling this topic. In any other community players have no problem adapting to the “randomness” that loadouts “create”.
> I agree… but you forgot no BR/DMR starts… that should have it’s own playlist.
> long range weapon starts breaks gameplay, it all started in Reach with the introduction of the DMR.
We’ve had long-range weapon starts since Halo CE, and online long-range weapon starts since Halo 2.
The reason we have them is because it was decided that CQC starts break gameplay by leaving the player too disadvantaged upon spawn in most situations.
Sure, the developers can go ahead and make a CQC playlist. Though no one will play it, see Legendary Slayer v1.
yeah that was mostly my opinion. i prefer CQC over br/dmr starts. Im hopeing they bring back dual wielding with a competitive focus on CQC. Spartan abilities gives me hope lol.
But yeah i agree 100% about AA’s and loadouts. Halo 5 most likely won’t be like that, 343 said they wanted to go back to arena style gameplay so every player starts off equal.
> In any other community players have no problem adapting to the “randomness” that loadouts “create”.
Every other popular game that has custom loadouts (not preset “class loadouts” like TF2) has fast kill times, which makes the randomness from the loadouts inconsequential. In Destiny’s competitive multiplayer, all class-specific attributes are equalized and the ideal kill time is less than a second. Just because something works in one environment does not mean it will work in all environments.