The return of classic movement mechanics?

Games Halo Infinite
221

To be honest, I like classic Halo mechanics but would probably not enjoy them as much nowadays.

Sprint has become an essential component of most FPS games and Halo is not an exception. Also, sprint in Halo 5 was good because it stops shield recovery as long as you sprint thus not allowing players to run away from fights without a penalty.

What I think sprint affected negatively in Halo is map design as it is clear that maps in Halo 5 are more norrow with less open areas compared to previous games without sprint.

Other spartan abilities, imo, should not be in future Halo games, ESPECIALLY SPARTAN CHARGE, as they alter the use of movements unique to Halo, such as crouch jumping which has less use in Halo 5 than in previous Halo games due to clamber.

222

> 2533274852612179;211:
> If they went back to the old gameplay style, it would be like degrading or making awful tech designs since Spartan 4’s have more advanced movement than previous generations of Spartans. So it wouldn’t really make since to go back to that style.

Not necessarily. Although the Spartan 4s are “more advanced” as you say, 343 should be able to take creative liberties with their abilities. They should be able to do this for the sole purpose of creating an interesting and effective combat sandbox.

In any case, truth to lore in games in terms of abilities is not held to high regard in halo. From halo 3 to halo 4, although Chief never went home or even left the ‘Forward unto dawn’, his armour changed its design and he also was able to suddenly sprint. -not saying it’s bad, just providing examples for a point.

In a nutshell, I don’t thing game-play choices should be limited by lore and the “abilities” that the Spartans should have.

Ty :slight_smile:

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[deleted]

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> 2533274972295362;222:
> > 2533274852612179;211:
> > If they went back to the old gameplay style, it would be like degrading or making awful tech designs since Spartan 4’s have more advanced movement than previous generations of Spartans. So it wouldn’t really make since to go back to that style.
>
> Not necessarily. Although the Spartan 4s are “more advanced” as you say, 343 should be able to take creative liberties with their abilities.

Rolling the Spartans’ abilities backwards does not constitute taking “creative liberties,” and it would further restrict players by hindering them with one boring BMS.

It’s also like putting the gutter rails on during a game of bowling- sure it becomes much easier for players to predict their opponents movements from spawn points and fire back instantly, but the combat itself
becomes much more repetitive. Sprint enables more dynamic, unique, and unpredictable combat scenarios which improves replayability.

Traversing across open spaces becomes incredibly boring; as it feels more like a chore with one BMS. Does anyone recall Avalanche in Halo 3? It was the huge snow level where players would ALWAYS betray each other at the spawn in a mad dash for the vehicles. Some left out of the vehicle dash would even rage quit versus having to walk across those vast open spaces of the map. If players simply had sprint this would not have been an issue, and the larger maps would have become much more enjoyable.

225

> 2533274963936070;221:
> To be honest, I like classic Halo mechanics but would probably not enjoy them as much nowadays.
>
> Sprint has become an essential component of most FPS games and Halo is not an exception. Also, sprint in Halo 5 was good because it stops shield recovery as long as you sprint thus not allowing players to run away from fights without a penalty.

I completely agree. The classic Halo mechanics have come and gone. Halo 2 was (and still is) my all-around favorite game in the franchise, but sprint wasn’t yet introduced at that time. Sprint was actually found in the coding of Halo 2 and, had it been implemented, then I’m sure it would have made that great game even better. Either way Halo 2 played fine as it was because in that era sprint hadn’t yet made its debut into Halo (or really any console FPS titles).

Halo CE, 2, and 3 each thrives off of their well rounded campaigns and multiplayer modes. They all featured campaigns which offered players fantastic story-telling, exciting plot twists, mysterious endings (which left players wanting more), iconic characters (with excellent character development), open and seemingly endless expanses of space to explore and it all added up to near endless replayability.

The MP maps in FPS titles at the time were smaller- 4v4 was considered as a breakthrough development for console gaming during 2001. When XBL finally launched a few years later, Halo 2 again led the way by pushing consoles to their player limit with Big Team battles. But maps were smaller than they are today and technology limited developers with the amount of players that could even fit into MP maps. When Halo 3 came out maps got larger but without sprint players were forced to rely on vehicles to get across the maps which meant one BMS became restrictive and even boring for players (particularly with larger expanses of space).

It’s absolutely ridiculous for anyone to suggest that sprint somehow contributed to declining sales in future Halo titles. Anti sprinters present that idea as a self-serving bias; relying on deductive reasoning which cannot be proven in any way because (ultimately) it’s untrue. To be more successful 343i should just focus their efforts on better story telling, more open (less linear, restrictive) worlds to explore, improving character development (they did alright with this in Halo 4 but wet the bed on this in Halo 5), and all around better writing in the story to improve replayability.

226

> 2535464451695009;223:
> > 2533274963936070;221:
> > To be honest, I like classic Halo mechanics but would probably not enjoy them as much nowadays.
> >
> > Sprint has become an essential component of most FPS games and Halo is not an exception. Also, sprint in Halo 5 was good because it stops shield recovery as long as you sprint thus not allowing players to run away from fights without a penalty.
> >
> > What I think sprint affected negatively in Halo is map design as it is clear that maps in Halo 5 are more norrow with less open areas compared to previous games without sprint.
> >
> > Other spartan abilities, imo, should not be in future Halo games, ESPECIALLY SPARTAN CHARGE, as they alter the use of movements unique to Halo, such as crouch jumping which has less use in Halo 5 than in previous Halo games due to clamber.
>
> What about Counter-Strike and Overwatch, two of the most popular FPS games for eSports? I’d add Rainbow Six: Siege since sprint is rarely used competitively, but sprint is a part of the game. As for overall popularity, Crossfire (a free to play CS clone) is up there due to the Chinese and Korean market. Hell, even the Doom remake did pretty well, considering the idea of Doom 4 being dead for almost a decade and multiplayer being messed up. I’m not sure about Quake, but people seem to still be interested judging off of Bethesda’s admittedly cringey E3 Conference.
>
> I’d argue most people don’t really care about sprint, as long as the game makes sense with or without it.

Honestly I don’t think you can compare Halo to games like Overwatch or Counter-Strike. They are very different game types. Also Halo has the disadvantage of being a longstanding franchise with many games under its belt so it has expectations and has to keep innovating in order to keep the franchise fresh are relevant to the modern market.
I’d argue that generally people expect a form or sprint in most FPS games that are non arena shooters.

227

Halo needs the original no-sprint formula to return with new innovations. I know 343 is creative enough to make it happen.

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> 2535444702990491;224:
> Traversing across open spaces becomes incredibly boring; as it feels more like a chore with one BMS.

You’ve yet to give a reason as to how having to lower one’s weapon in order to run at maximum speed makes traversal less boring than being able to shoot while running at maximum speed.

> 2535444702990491;224:
> Does anyone recall Avalanche in Halo 3? It was the huge snow level where players would ALWAYS betray each other at the spawn in a mad dash for the vehicles. Some left out of the vehicle dash would even rage quit versus having to walk across those vast open spaces of the map. If players simply had sprint this would not have been an issue, and the larger maps would have become much more enjoyable.

You mean the map where there was literally a tunnel between the bases base to base? The map where it took a few seconds to run up the ramp, and there was always action waiting?

You never had to take the long way around. If you were on foot, there was really no reason to take the long way around. Sure, you could take it, but if you didn’t want to spend a significant amount of time running, you never had to. And it’s not like Avalanche is even an example of a BTB map that does good job of balancing infantry and vehicle combat. Any issue you have with it is an issue with the map design, not an issue with the game mechanics.

Yes, having sprint would’ve meant that it had taken less time to take the long way around, so would have having a higher base movement speed. However, these are fixes after the fact to a problem that should not have existed in the first place. They are workarounds that do not address the fundamental issue, which is that the map was not designed to support infantry play properly to begin with. Perhaps the interior of the wall separating the bases should’ve been more complex to facilitate infantry combat better, while avoiding the bottleneck created by the direct base-to-base view. Perhaps there should’ve been more man cannons from the bases to the sides, and vice versa. Perhaps there should’ve been a Mongoose stash at the cliff side of the map. Perhaps the U-shape is fundamentally not good for infantry combat.

Sprint is neither a necessary, nor a good solution to your problems. At most all it does is let the map designers get away with sloppy design by making the player feel faster than they are. It does not address the underlying issue, which is that it takes X seconds to get from A to B, because the map designer made it take X seconds.

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> 2535444702990491;225:
> But maps were smaller than they are today and technology limited developers with the amount of players that could even fit into MP maps. When Halo 3 came out maps got larger but without sprint players were forced to rely on vehicles to get across the maps which meant one BMS became restrictive and even boring for players (particularly with larger expanses of space).

Do you happen to have any data to support this claim? If not, then it’s just meaningless speculation not founded in reality.

> 2535444702990491;225:
> It’s absolutely ridiculous for anyone to suggest that sprint somehow contributed to declining sales in future Halo titles. Anti sprinters present that idea as a self-serving bias; relying on deductive reasoning which cannot be proven in any way because (ultimately) it’s untrue…

I can’t take you any more seriously than someone claiming that sprint is the sole reason for the decline in sales. Both represent highly emotionally biased views that don’t have any factual basis. One believes that because they like sprint, so must everyone else, apart from a small minority, while the other believes that everyone dislikes sprint with the same intesity as they do, apart from a small minority.

The truth is that there is no way to determine how significant the impact of sprint has been on the declien in sales. There never will be, because one can always attribute changes in popularity to other differences.

You’re free to try to drag anti-sprinters through the mud, but it doesn’t give any credence to your arguments. At most it makes you look like the kind of person who likes to drag others through the mud.

230

The main thing SA’s and sprint did to Halo was make map design harder. Here’s a question for people who’ve played all the Halo’s: Rate your top 5 maps. Are any of them from Halo 4 or 5? By and Large, I think you’ll find the list of Halo 1, 2, and 3 maps to far outweigh Reach, 4 and 5.

At the end of the day, I think Halo 6 needs to have a Movement speed that is constant, and a Stable gun sandbox. Maps should be designed based off these factors. BUT, things like sprint, SA’s, tweaking of guns damage, Gun bullet spread or Rate of Fire, etc. Should be included in the game as options available for creators to use. If we design simply and classically, it’s easy to add/tweak things to make fun customs. But if maps are designed around Sprint and SA’s, you can’t scale back without breaking the map.

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[deleted]

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> 2533274825830455;229:
> You’re free to try to drag anti-sprinters through the mud, but it doesn’t give any credence to your arguments. At most it makes you look like the kind of person who likes to drag others through the mud.

Sorry I wasn’t trying to actually fight with anyone over the issue or drag anybody through any mud. I was just trying to respectfully offer up reasons why sprint fits into modern gaming is therefore good for future Halo games. I wasn’t assuming those reasons would automatically trigger an argument with people.

I respect both sides’ opinions and understand why some people prefer the classic mechanics of Halo. I personally wouldn’t want to play a newer Halo game without sprint- it’s not something that would make me angry but if they decided to revert the franchise backwards to an older style without sprint it just wouldn’t appeal to me (as with others that have stated the same thing in this thread). I would not buy, play, or enjoy an attempt at reviving an antiquated style of movement in Halo.

I do, however, enjoy the older Halos for what they were and I still enjoy playing them. Personally I think they all would’ve been better with sprint but it feels okay playing them without it because they were older games from a different era that’s come and gone.

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> 2535444702990491;224:
> > 2533274972295362;222:
> > > 2533274852612179;211:
> > > If they went back to the old gameplay style, it would be like degrading or making awful tech designs since Spartan 4’s have more advanced movement than previous generations of Spartans. So it wouldn’t really make since to go back to that style.
> >
> > Not necessarily. Although the Spartan 4s are “more advanced” as you say, 343 should be able to take creative liberties with their abilities.
>
> Rolling the Spartans’ abilities backwards does not constitute taking “creative liberties,” and it would further restrict players by hindering them with one boring BMS.
>
> It’s also like putting the gutter rails on during a game of bowling- sure it becomes much easier for players to predict their opponents movements from spawn points and fire back instantly, but the combat itself
> becomes much more repetitive. Sprint enables more dynamic, unique, and unpredictable combat scenarios which improves replayability.
>
> Traversing across open spaces becomes incredibly boring; as it feels more like a chore with one BMS. Does anyone recall Avalanche in Halo 3? It was the huge snow level where players would ALWAYS betray each other at the spawn in a mad dash for the vehicles. Some left out of the vehicle dash would even rage quit versus having to walk across those vast open spaces of the map. If players simply had sprint this would not have been an issue, and the larger maps would have become much more enjoyable.

Not true. Fan-favorite Big Team Battle maps like Blood Gulch, Waterworks & Standoff all used creative map design that made the map more accessible through man-cannons, teleports and intricate map design.

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> 2535464451695009;231:
> > 2533275013370605;226:
> > > 2535464451695009;223:
> > > > 2533274963936070;221:
> > > > To be honest, I like classic Halo mechanics but would probably not enjoy them as much nowadays.
> > > >
> > > > Sprint has become an essential component of most FPS games and Halo is not an exception. Also, sprint in Halo 5 was good because it stops shield recovery as long as you sprint thus not allowing players to run away from fights without a penalty.
> > > >
> > > > What I think sprint affected negatively in Halo is map design as it is clear that maps in Halo 5 are more norrow with less open areas compared to previous games without sprint.
> > > >
> > > > Other spartan abilities, imo, should not be in future Halo games, ESPECIALLY SPARTAN CHARGE, as they alter the use of movements unique to Halo, such as crouch jumping which has less use in Halo 5 than in previous Halo games due to clamber.
> > >
> > > What about Counter-Strike and Overwatch, two of the most popular FPS games for eSports? I’d add Rainbow Six: Siege since sprint is rarely used competitively, but sprint is a part of the game. As for overall popularity, Crossfire (a free to play CS clone) is up there due to the Chinese and Korean market. Hell, even the Doom remake did pretty well, considering the idea of Doom 4 being dead for almost a decade and multiplayer being messed up. I’m not sure about Quake, but people seem to still be interested judging off of Bethesda’s admittedly cringey E3 Conference.
> > >
> > > I’d argue most people don’t really care about sprint, as long as the game makes sense with or without it.
> >
> > Honestly I don’t think you can compare Halo to games like Overwatch or Counter-Strike. They are very different game types. Also Halo has the disadvantage of being a longstanding franchise with many games under its belt so it has expectations and has to keep innovating in order to keep the franchise fresh are relevant to the modern market.
> > I’d argue that generally people expect a form or sprint in most FPS games that are non arena shooters.
>
> Obviously you can’t, but in general, people don’t really care about the inclusion of sprint or not in FPS games, otherwise CSGO would have had it in. CS is in the same predicament as Halo, being a longstanding franchise with numerous games under its belt.
>
> I’m mostly against sprint in Halo, but I’m just stating facts. A vast majority of people don’t really care about it being in a game or not, which was the point of my previous post. They only care if the next game in a franchise is similar to older titles, and if an entirely new game works with its mechanics or not. Every competitive game from Starcraft to Tekken to Halo is treated the same by all their fans. If it’s not familiar, it’s not good. Hell, even singleplayer games get treated the same.
>
> I personally don’t care about the inclusion of sprint in Infinite, but in how it’s implemented. Halo 4 and 5 were trash (as Halo titles) in their implementations of sprint and the other abilities. I give Reach a pass, just based on the fact that sprint wasn’t tied into the controls 24/7.

Even if CSGO is a longstanding franchise it still isn’t comparable to Halo. CSGO and Overwatch is pretty much single game mode type of games, while Halo has a multitude of game modes on top of a campaign and compelling story.
I cannot claim to know if the majority of players worldwide care about sprint being in an FPS, but generally people prefer when their games have mechanics that allow them more freedom and immersion in a game. You can sprint in real life why shouldn’t you in a game? You can clamber over obstacles why shouldn’t you in a game? Older games couldn’t implement these mechanics due to the technological limitation at the time, but nowadays more options are brought to the table which allow game developers to freshen up gameplay for new audiences. However the question of whether these changes are good or well implemented is another matter entirely.

You are correct about the fact that fans hate change. New games and IPs have no expectations about them so the developers have the green light to make their games as outrageously complex or immersive as they desire which also allows them to bring to the market new gameplay styles and mechanics that have the potential to be extremely popular. The problem with games like Halo, and as we have experienced, when the developers try to introduce new aspects of the game in an effort to update, evolve or bring in new fans and audience their older fans usually have a negative reaction to this change. This however is entirely understandable, nor do I blame anyone in particular especially considering Halo’s unique case. No game can ever truly stay the same when it switched developers hands, hence change was already inevitable. As 343 was a very new team they simply followed Bungie’s direction for Halo 4 which is why its gameplay is very similar to Halo Reach. Seeing that people where not happy with state of things and with the advanced movement craze that swept the game industry for a few years, 343 decided to change things around as we got Halo 5 which has been on whole fairly polarising as you have those who absolutely love it and those who absolutely hate it. That said I am not defending 343, as I do believe they have made many mistakes and change far more than was necessary and yet I still enjoyed their games and find many of their contributions to Halo’s universe engaging.
Regardless all of this doesn’t change the fact that we have no idea what 343 has planned regarding Halo Infinite. I would be extremely surprised if they went back to a classic style and I anticipate more of a hybrid system with only some Abilities making a return in one form or another.

I am curious what would you think of a sprint that was limited like Reach and also couldn’t regenerate shields like Halo 5?

235

> 2535444702990491;232:
> Sorry I wasn’t trying to actually fight with anyone over the issue or drag anybody through any mud. I was just trying to respectfully offer up reasons why sprint is good for Halo. I wasn’t assuming those reasons would automatically trigger an argument with people.
>
> I respect both sides’ opinions and understand why some people prefer the classic mechanics of Halo. I personally wouldn’t want to play a newer Halo game without sprint- it’s not something that would make me angry but if they decided to revert the franchise backwards to an older style without sprint it just wouldn’t appeal to me. I would not buy, play, or enjoy an attempt at reviving an antiquated style of movement in Halo.
>
> I do, however, enjoy the older Halos for what they were and I still enjoy playing them. Personally I think they all would’ve been better with sprint but it feels okay playing them without it because they were older games from a different era that’s come and gone.

Well, if that’s the case, I accept your apology and extend my own. I interpreted the tone of your post as a bit spiteful towards anti-sprinters.

If you want to present strong opinions about game mechanics, and sprint in particular, it’s pretty good practice to expect that people will want to debate those opinions. If you don’t want to take part in that debate, it’s best to try to avoid falsifiable statements that can’t be backed up, and keep it as obviously subjective as possible. It also helps to use more neutral language than “antiquated” if you don’t want controversy.

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> 2533274866906624;227:
> Halo needs the original no-sprint formula to return with new innovations. I know 343 is creative enough to make it happen.

That’s right, only 343 have answer only. No one’s there are proposing a mid-term between old-modern mechanics.

> 2533275013370605;234:
> > 2535464451695009;231:
> > > 2533275013370605;226:
> > > > 2535464451695009;223:
> > > > > 2533274963936070;221:
> > > > > To be honest, I like classic Halo mechanics but would probably not enjoy them as much nowadays.
> > > > >
> > > > > Sprint has become an essential component of most FPS games and Halo is not an exception. Also, sprint in Halo 5 was good because it stops shield recovery as long as you sprint thus not allowing players to run away from fights without a penalty.
> > > > >
> > > > > What I think sprint affected negatively in Halo is map design as it is clear that maps in Halo 5 are more norrow with less open areas compared to previous games without sprint.
> > > > >
> > > > > Other spartan abilities, imo, should not be in future Halo games, ESPECIALLY SPARTAN CHARGE, as they alter the use of movements unique to Halo, such as crouch jumping which has less use in Halo 5 than in previous Halo games due to clamber.
> > > >
> > > > What about Counter-Strike and Overwatch, two of the most popular FPS games for eSports? I’d add Rainbow Six: Siege since sprint is rarely used competitively, but sprint is a part of the game. As for overall popularity, Crossfire (a free to play CS clone) is up there due to the Chinese and Korean market. Hell, even the Doom remake did pretty well, considering the idea of Doom 4 being dead for almost a decade and multiplayer being messed up. I’m not sure about Quake, but people seem to still be interested judging off of Bethesda’s admittedly cringey E3 Conference.
> > > >
> > > > I’d argue most people don’t really care about sprint, as long as the game makes sense with or without it.
> > >
> > > Honestly I don’t think you can compare Halo to games like Overwatch or Counter-Strike. They are very different game types. Also Halo has the disadvantage of being a longstanding franchise with many games under its belt so it has expectations and has to keep innovating in order to keep the franchise fresh are relevant to the modern market.
> > > I’d argue that generally people expect a form or sprint in most FPS games that are non arena shooters.
> >
> > Obviously you can’t, but in general, people don’t really care about the inclusion of sprint or not in FPS games, otherwise CSGO would have had it in. CS is in the same predicament as Halo, being a longstanding franchise with numerous games under its belt.
> >
> > I’m mostly against sprint in Halo, but I’m just stating facts. A vast majority of people don’t really care about it being in a game or not, which was the point of my previous post. They only care if the next game in a franchise is similar to older titles, and if an entirely new game works with its mechanics or not. Every competitive game from Starcraft to Tekken to Halo is treated the same by all their fans. If it’s not familiar, it’s not good. Hell, even singleplayer games get treated the same.
> >
> > I personally don’t care about the inclusion of sprint in Infinite, but in how it’s implemented. Halo 4 and 5 were trash (as Halo titles) in their implementations of sprint and the other abilities. I give Reach a pass, just based on the fact that sprint wasn’t tied into the controls 24/7.
>
> Even if CSGO is a longstanding franchise it still isn’t comparable to Halo. CSGO and Overwatch is pretty much single game mode type of games, while Halo has a multitude of game modes on top of a campaign and compelling story.
> I cannot claim to know if the majority of players worldwide care about sprint being in an FPS, but generally people prefer when their games have mechanics that allow them more freedom and immersion in a game. You can sprint in real life why shouldn’t you in a game? You can clamber over obstacles why shouldn’t you in a game? Older games couldn’t implement these mechanics due to the technological limitation at the time, but nowadays more options are brought to the table which allow game developers to freshen up gameplay for new audiences. However the question of whether these changes are good or well implemented is another matter entirely.
>
> You are correct about the fact that fans hate change. New games and IPs have no expectations about them so the developers have the green light to make their games as outrageously complex or immersive as they desire which also allows them to bring to the market new gameplay styles and mechanics that have the potential to be extremely popular. The problem with games like Halo, and as we have experienced, when the developers try to introduce new aspects of the game in an effort to update, evolve or bring in new fans and audience their older fans usually have a negative reaction to this change. This however is entirely understandable, nor do I blame anyone in particular especially considering Halo’s unique case. No game can ever truly stay the same when it switched developers hands, hence change was already inevitable. As 343 was a very new team they simply followed Bungie’s direction for Halo 4 which is why its gameplay is very similar to Halo Reach. Seeing that people where not happy with state of things and with the advanced movement craze that swept the game industry for a few years, 343 decided to change things around as we got Halo 5 which has been on whole fairly polarising as you have those who absolutely love it and those who absolutely hate it. That said I am not defending 343, as I do believe they have made many mistakes and change far more than was necessary and yet I still enjoyed their games and find many of their contributions to Halo’s universe engaging.
> Regardless all of this doesn’t change the fact that we have no idea what 343 has planned regarding Halo Infinite. I would be extremely surprised if they went back to a classic style and I anticipate more of a hybrid system with only some Abilities making a return in one form or another.
>
> I am curious what would you think of a sprint that was limited like Reach and also couldn’t regenerate shields like Halo 5?

Yeah. They’re trying to evolve the game. The same thing over and over again would be boring. Only old fans would buy, but the new ones maybe won’t buy. Who knows?
Only 343 have the answer to get new and old fans to the game, if someone have a better ideia.

237

> 2533274825830455;235:
> > 2535444702990491;232:
> > Sorry I wasn’t trying to actually fight with anyone over the issue or drag anybody through any mud. I was just trying to respectfully offer up reasons why sprint is good for Halo. I wasn’t assuming those reasons would automatically trigger an argument with people.
> >
> > I respect both sides’ opinions and understand why some people prefer the classic mechanics of Halo. I personally wouldn’t want to play a newer Halo game without sprint- it’s not something that would make me angry but if they decided to revert the franchise backwards to an older style without sprint it just wouldn’t appeal to me. I would not buy, play, or enjoy an attempt at reviving an antiquated style of movement in Halo.
> >
> > I do, however, enjoy the older Halos for what they were and I still enjoy playing them. Personally I think they all would’ve been better with sprint but it feels okay playing them without it because they were older games from a different era that’s come and gone.
>
> Well, if that’s the case, I accept your apology and extend my own. I interpreted the tone of your post as a bit spiteful towards anti-sprinters.
>
> If you want to present strong opinions about game mechanics, and sprint in particular, it’s pretty good practice to expect that people will want to debate those opinions. If you don’t want to take part in that debate, it’s best to try to avoid falsifiable statements that can’t be backed up, and keep it as obviously subjective as possible. It also helps to use more neutral language than “antiquated” if you don’t want controversy.

Okay thanks. Apologies again for coming across that way.

I don’t really like fighting with people, especially about stuff like Halo where everyone here basically (more or less) has a passion for the same thing.

Also maybe the older Halos just feel antiquated to me because I was a little kid when the first Halos came out. It feels like so long ago to me when Halo didn’t have sprint. I didn’t like sprint in Reach either because of the way it was done- as an armor ability that allowed players to run away without the pause in shields recharging. When the newer Halos (4 and 5) tuned and balanced sprint it was such a refreshing and enjoyable experience to me to have that option to either walk or sprint to get to places. It seemed a lot more balanced in combat when everybody had sprint (not just some people who equipped it as a loadout such as in Reach). It also leveled the playing field when shields don’t recharge either when players are running away after being hit.

Well I guess one things for sure- one side of this whole thing will be really happy once the movement mechanics are announced for Halo Infinite.

238

I doubt they will go back all the way. Tjey may remove some abilities though. I think they should remove at least sprint, spartan charge and ground pound.

Nte can you try disabling some of the spartan abilities in the custom games?

239

I’d like to see a few playlists with classic movement, but not the whole game being classic movement only.

240

> 2533275013370605;226:
> > 2535464451695009;223:
> > > 2533274963936070;221:
> > > To be honest, I like classic Halo mechanics but would probably not enjoy them as much nowadays.
> > >
> > > Sprint has become an essential component of most FPS games and Halo is not an exception. Also, sprint in Halo 5 was good because it stops shield recovery as long as you sprint thus not allowing players to run away from fights without a penalty.
> > >
> > > What I think sprint affected negatively in Halo is map design as it is clear that maps in Halo 5 are more norrow with less open areas compared to previous games without sprint.
> > >
> > > Other spartan abilities, imo, should not be in future Halo games, ESPECIALLY SPARTAN CHARGE, as they alter the use of movements unique to Halo, such as crouch jumping which has less use in Halo 5 than in previous Halo games due to clamber.
> >
> > What about Counter-Strike and Overwatch, two of the most popular FPS games for eSports? I’d add Rainbow Six: Siege since sprint is rarely used competitively, but sprint is a part of the game. As for overall popularity, Crossfire (a free to play CS clone) is up there due to the Chinese and Korean market. Hell, even the Doom remake did pretty well, considering the idea of Doom 4 being dead for almost a decade and multiplayer being messed up. I’m not sure about Quake, but people seem to still be interested judging off of Bethesda’s admittedly cringey E3 Conference.
> >
> > I’d argue most people don’t really care about sprint, as long as the game makes sense with or without it.
>
> Honestly I don’t think you can compare Halo to games like Overwatch or Counter-Strike. They are very different game types. Also Halo has the disadvantage of being a longstanding franchise with many games under its belt so it has expectations and has to keep innovating in order to keep the franchise fresh are relevant to the modern market.
> I’d argue that generally people expect a form or sprint in most FPS games that are non arena shooters.

Bold - why not? Your not comparing the overall game of Halo to say Overwatch, Doom, Counter Strike, etc. Just the sprint mechanic. You said,

> Sprint has become an essential component of most FPS games

Well, people have named HIGHLY successful games, not only in sales but in popularity as well to say sprint isn’t an essential component for an FPS to do well or be popular. So in my opinion, your point has been proven wrong because people have proved that it isn’t essential with games they have named.

> I’d argue that generally people expect a form or sprint in most FPS games that are non arena shooters.

I pretty much agree with you there, but again Overwatch is far from an arena shooter and there’s no sprint animation in that, so…