> 2592250499819446;1980:
> > 2535410737759849;1979:
> > Honestly, I’d be down for whatever 343 does, as long as it’s not too slow. Suggestion: increase speed if you go back to classic mechanics.
>
> I agree. I would prefer a faster bsm and fov slider. It would be perfect imo.
in addition to a slightly faster bms and bigger fov there could be tuned down, rebalanced and made physics/momentum based insted of animation based “spartan capabilities”.
sprint: insted of move vs. shoot tradeoff : agility vs. momentum tradeoff ( slowturn and slowstrafe during sprint. residual momentum/slowturn when ending sprint. firing/grenades/melee always possible, but it leads to ending sprint)( only 120% bms during sprint, not 135% (which is roughly the H5 speed))(slowed to near zero shield recharge during sprint ( full shield after 2/3 of valhalla would be crossed) and a ending of sprint when shot at if you are not at max speed yet (like in h5) -> no more running around corners, lower necessity to sprint, reduced horizontal map stretching
clamber: less height and reach, more simmilar to crouchjump: this creates a choicer between thge faster crouchjump and the easier clamber, as well as larger general use for crouchclamber. it also reduces vertical map strechting
thrusters: momentum based like mini mancanon bursts, slightly shorter range. no instant momentum change. downward thrust is possible. no upward thrust
if jump is pressed again and hold during jumps: reduction in falling momentum (by an application of upwards momentum)( can be used to break in the air or slow down falling. it also allows for steering in zero gravity/ minimal gravity)
thrusters add momentum in one direction, but slightly reduce the momentum in all other directions ( for easier to predict movement angles and no reach advantages by using upward thrust on maps(for example: you fall slower, but loose forward momentum))
slight bounciness to the spartan to utilize gained momentum (usefull for tricks and usefull in close quarters( might reduce map stretching))
crouch can be used to reduce momentum quickly when on the ground ( except while sprinting -> triggers slide)
ground pound, spartan charge: removed. extra momentum above bms could increase melee damage/ area of effect (and slightly the damage melee does to you) -> manual spartan hand to hand combat
hover: stays, new button assignment: jump-zoom-crouch
slide: can stay basicly unchanged
all actions that create artificial momentum ( created through spartan capabilities (not the bounciness)( not through moving objects or interactive map elements )) pull from a quasi stamina bar ( positioned like in halo online) ( this is optional to further reduce the map stretching. it should be a custom games setting to toggle this regardless of its main playlist/ campaign integration)
this would add to the sanbox through player cabilities, without damaging the golden triangle or changing map design to much ( maybe 105% to 110% of classic scale insted of 120% to 130%). i would call these mechanics “Evolved Mobility™”
by combining these abilities into one “spartan mobility” button ( press to use thrusters, hold to sprint (called “dash”, because spartans already are always running)) one button would be freed on the controller: can be used to re-implement halo 3 style equipement
( maybe multi use with cooldown to balance these abilities: less usage for power drain for example. inclusion of halo reach, h4, spartan assault, spartan strike, el dewrito and new equipement. groundpound and spartan charge could become equipement to. because of the tuned down nature of the proposed spartan capabilities, the external thruster pack and halo reach sprint module could return as "plug in batteries and enhancers " for the spartan capabilities ( thrusts would be faster and have more reach, but empty the equipement in addition to the bar. the same would be true for dash (sprint). usages and cooldown could be custom game settings. equipement is only to be placed on maps. no loadouts ( reach style loadouts could be a custom game setting non the less).)
> 2533274945422049;1982:
> > 2592250499819446;1980:
> > > 2535410737759849;1979:
> > > Honestly, I’d be down for whatever 343 does, as long as it’s not too slow. Suggestion: increase speed if you go back to classic mechanics.
> >
> > I agree. I would prefer a faster bsm and fov slider. It would be perfect imo.
>
> in addition to a slightly faster bms and bigger fov there could be tuned down, rebalanced and made physics based insted of animation based “spartan capabilities”.
>
> - sprint: insted of move vs. shoot tradeoff : agility vs. mobility ( slowturn and slowstrafe during sprint. residual momentum when stoping to sprint. firing always possible, but it leads to ending sprint)( only 120% bms during sprint, not 135% (which is roughly the H5 speed))(slowed to near zero shield recharge during sprint ( full shield after 2/3 of valhalla would be crossed) and a ending of sprint when shot at if you are not at max speed yet (like in h5) -> no more running around corners, lower necessity to sprint, reduced horizontal map stretching
>
> - clamber: less height and reach, more simmilar to crouchjump: this creates a choicer between thge faster crouchjump and the easier clamber, as well as larger general use for crouchclamber. it also reduces vertical map strechting
>
> - thrusters: momentum based like mini mancanon bursts, slightly shorter range. no instant momentum change. downward thrust is possible. no upward thrust
> - if jump is pressed again and hold during jumps: reduction in omnidirectional momentum ( can be used to break in the air or slow down falling, without giving extra reach)
> - slight bounciness to the spartan to utilize gained momentum (usefull for tricks and usefull in close quarters( might reduce map stretching))
> - crouch can be used to reduce momentum quickly when on the ground ( except while sprinting -> triggers slide)
> - ground pound, spartan charge: removed. extra momentum above bms could increase melee damage/ area of effect (and slightly the damage melee does to you) -> manual spartan hand to hand combat
>
> - hover: stays, new button assignment: jump-zoom-crouch
> - slide: can stay basicly unchanged
>
> - all actions that create artificial momentum ( created through spartan capabilities (not the bounciness)( not through moving objects or interactive map elements )) pull from a quasi stamina bar ( positioned like in halo online) ( this is optional to further reduce the map stretching. it should be a custom games setting to toggle this regardless of its main playlist/ campaign integration)
I don’t really know what you mean with all that text, it’s way over my head tbh. I like the Doom style of running and gunning. That’s why I would like an increased bsm and fov slider. I would prefer that to what we have now.
> 2592250499819446;1983:
> > 2533274945422049;1982:
> > > 2592250499819446;1980:
> > > > 2535410737759849;1979:
> > > > Honestly, I’d be down for whatever 343 does, as long as it’s not too slow. Suggestion: increase speed if you go back to classic mechanics.
> > >
> > > I agree. I would prefer a faster bsm and fov slider. It would be perfect imo.
> >
> > in addition to a slightly faster bms and bigger fov there could be tuned down, rebalanced and made physics based insted of animation based “spartan capabilities”.
> >
> > - sprint: insted of move vs. shoot tradeoff : agility vs. mobility ( slowturn and slowstrafe during sprint. residual momentum when stoping to sprint. firing always possible, but it leads to ending sprint)( only 120% bms during sprint, not 135% (which is roughly the H5 speed))(slowed to near zero shield recharge during sprint ( full shield after 2/3 of valhalla would be crossed) and a ending of sprint when shot at if you are not at max speed yet (like in h5) -> no more running around corners, lower necessity to sprint, reduced horizontal map stretching
> >
> > - clamber: less height and reach, more simmilar to crouchjump: this creates a choicer between thge faster crouchjump and the easier clamber, as well as larger general use for crouchclamber. it also reduces vertical map strechting
> >
> > - thrusters: momentum based like mini mancanon bursts, slightly shorter range. no instant momentum change. downward thrust is possible. no upward thrust
> > - if jump is pressed again and hold during jumps: reduction in omnidirectional momentum ( can be used to break in the air or slow down falling, without giving extra reach)
> > - slight bounciness to the spartan to utilize gained momentum (usefull for tricks and usefull in close quarters( might reduce map stretching))
> > - crouch can be used to reduce momentum quickly when on the ground ( except while sprinting -> triggers slide)
> > - ground pound, spartan charge: removed. extra momentum above bms could increase melee damage/ area of effect (and slightly the damage melee does to you) -> manual spartan hand to hand combat
> >
> > - hover: stays, new button assignment: jump-zoom-crouch
> > - slide: can stay basicly unchanged
> >
> > - all actions that create artificial momentum ( created through spartan capabilities (not the bounciness)( not through moving objects or interactive map elements )) pull from a quasi stamina bar ( positioned like in halo online) ( this is optional to further reduce the map stretching. it should be a custom games setting to toggle this regardless of its main playlist/ campaign integration)
>
> I don’t really know what you mean with all that text, it’s way over my head tbh. I like the Doom style of running and gunning. That’s why I would like an increased bsm and fov slider. I would prefer that to what we have now.
a faster bms would be nice indeed.
i think doom style run&gun would be too fast, because halo relies more on powerweapon and static location map control, while doom relies on flowing map control ( colectiong armor, health and ammo, while halo has regenerating shields and health). a too fast bms would hurt long range gameplay and the need for good positioning, as well as timing.
Tl;Dr essence of my text wall:
too fast bms would hurt the map/weapon/health design, so some sort of penality must be included to remove that problem. because of the penality it should be button activated so it is voluntary.
halo 5’s penality is the trade move vs. shoot. this hurts the golden triangle. i propose the trade movement speed vs. aiming speed (slow aim during sprint. weapons are instantly able to fire, ending sprinting) this could work with the classic sandbox.
this way the map positioning is not compromized while still having hightened mobility. otherwise maps would have to be stretched, hurting map design and negating the faster movement ( 110% speed wouldn’t do this, but 120% bms would likely do that). because the weapons are always up, running and gunning is possible. shooting would bring you back to bms and base aiming speed.
the rest of the long list deals with finetuning of this for different movement directions and how this would work with melee.
> 2533274945422049;1984:
> - too fast bms would hurt the map/weapon/health design, so some sort of penality must be included to remove that problem. because of the penality it should be button activated so it is voluntary.halo 5’s penality is the trade move vs. shoot. this hurts the golden triangle. i propose the trade movement speed vs. aiming speed (slow aim during sprint. weapons are instantly able to fire, ending sprinting) this could work with the classic sandbox.
>
> this way the map positioning is not compromized while still having hightened mobility. otherwise maps would have to be stretched, hurting map design and negating the faster movement ( 110% speed wouldn’t do this, but 120% bms would likely do that). because the weapons are always up, running and gunning is possible. shooting would bring you back to bms and base aiming speed.
Why do you want to bend over backwards just to shoe horn sprint into the game?
If you understand you correctly, you would simple remove the armwobble and make the transition from sprint to shooting faster?
How does that prevent map stretching? And you would still have a gameplay that seperates combat speed and movement speed.
Does anyone else agree that they should keep the ability to hop from the driver’s seat of a Warthog to the gunner’s with the press of a button? It’s so useful when my gunner gets killed and I need to defend myself.
> 2535418288909351;1986:
> Does anyone else agree that they should keep the ability to hop from the driver’s seat of a Warthog to the gunner’s with the press of a button? It’s so useful when my gunner gets killed and I need to defend myself.
yes. in fact i never have heared of anybody disliking this mechanic.
> 2533274801973487;1985:
> > 2533274945422049;1984:
> > - too fast bms would hurt the map/weapon/health design, so some sort of penality must be included to remove that problem. because of the penality it should be button activated so it is voluntary.halo 5’s penality is the trade move vs. shoot. this hurts the golden triangle. i propose the trade movement speed vs. aiming speed (slow aim during sprint. weapons are instantly able to fire, ending sprinting) this could work with the classic sandbox.
> >
> > this way the map positioning is not compromized while still having hightened mobility. otherwise maps would have to be stretched, hurting map design and negating the faster movement ( 110% speed wouldn’t do this, but 120% bms would likely do that). because the weapons are always up, running and gunning is possible. shooting would bring you back to bms and base aiming speed.
>
> Why do you want to bend over backwards just to shoe horn sprint into the game?
> If you understand you correctly, you would simple remove the armwobble and make the transition from sprint to shooting faster?
> How does that prevent map stretching? And you would still have a gameplay that seperates combat speed and movement speed.
transition from sprint to shooting/punching/throwing grenades is instant. only a bit of the momentum is kept (like after a mancanon jump) and the aiming speed takes a short time to get back to full speed ( to avoid zipping around corners and giving rushed players time to reacted)
sprint is only 10% to 20% faster than bms in my proposition. this reduces map stretching while still making sprint usefull ( in halo, every second pof descissions counts)
sprint gives slow aim and reduced strafe acceleration ( similiar to the ghost speed boost). this makes it less usefull in small areas and direct combat. to the point that those things would not have to be designed with sprint in mind. sprint would only be usefull in long corridors or on open fields (like sprint behaves irl).
120% or more bms would result in map stretching, shorter ttk and/or more aim assist to compensate for the increased range of movement.
the slowturn/slowstrafe sprint i propose is easy to predict and therefor does not need higher aim assist.
the sprint i propose is not usefull in small areas, therefor map stretching can be reduced ( much like not every weapon spwns on every map)
due to the relatively small speed increase (while keeping the no/very slow shield recharge and drop out when hit at sub max speed mechanics from halo 5 and adding the slowturn) cover to cover movement would not be harmed ( you may be a little bit faster, but when you are you can’t fight back as much). higher bms would need covers to be placed further apart. the proposed mechanic needs it less so.
the mechanics i propose could speed up the gameplay while keeping the sandbox largely unchanged. a significantly faster bms would not.
a slightly faster bms (105% to 110%) would be nice though.
i think the changes i propose would add opportunity to the sandbox.
> 2535418288909351;1986:
> Does anyone else agree that they should keep the ability to hop from the driver’s seat of a Warthog to the gunner’s with the press of a button? It’s so useful when my gunner gets killed and I need to defend myself.
They should definitely keep that. One of the better mechanics in Halo 5.
flights for Infinite could just be used to see which one is more popular classic gameplay/movements or Modern gameplay/movements. Or if 343i wants they make it classic and add modern halo mechanics in 1 playlist or CG options, but this of course would be just like I01.
> 2533274936074323;1990:
> flights for Infinite could just be used to see which one is more popular classic gameplay/movements or Modern gameplay/movements. Or if 343i wants they make it classic and add modern halo mechanics in 1 playlist or CG options, but this of course would be just like I01.
or what balance between classic and modern might work.
> 2533274945422049;1984:
> - too fast bms would hurt the map/weapon/health design, so some sort of penality must be included to remove that problem. because of the penality it should be button activated so it is voluntary.
That depends on how fast is too fast. To an extent, DOOM’s BMS isn’t all that fast compared to Halo CE-3.
If anything, Halo 5’s BMS is the fastest we’ve had to date, and is potentially already faster than DOOM 2016’s.
> 2533274833081329;1992:
> > 2533274945422049;1984:
> > - too fast bms would hurt the map/weapon/health design, so some sort of penality must be included to remove that problem. because of the penality it should be button activated so it is voluntary.
>
> That depends on how fast is too fast. To an extent, DOOM’s BMS isn’t all that fast compared to Halo CE-3.
>
> If anything, Halo 5’s BMS is the fastest we’ve had to date, and is potentially already faster than DOOM 2016’s.
doom 216 is much faster than halo.
video proof:
this is definetly to fast for halos gameplay and map design ( custom games are exempt from this analysis)
the doom 2016 multiplayer speed is closer to acceptable:
but doom has health and armor pickups, leading to flowing map control, while halo is based on more static map control, which would be hurt by this movement speed.
the middle between classic halo and doom 2016 multiplayer movement speed could be feasable. around 110% speed compared to classic halo with a wider fov.
so i still propose the aformentioned evolved mobility mechanics.
a higher FoV (currently 78°) would be nice. it should be around 100° this makes the game feel much faster.
> 2533274945422049;1993:
> > 2533274833081329;1992:
> > > 2533274945422049;1984:
> > > - too fast bms would hurt the map/weapon/health design, so some sort of penality must be included to remove that problem. because of the penality it should be button activated so it is voluntary.
> >
> > That depends on how fast is too fast. To an extent, DOOM’s BMS isn’t all that fast compared to Halo CE-3.
> >
> > If anything, Halo 5’s BMS is the fastest we’ve had to date, and is potentially already faster than DOOM 2016’s.
>
> doom 216 is much faster than halo.
>
> video proof:
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ot657NZVfxE
This is just showing his acceleration, since he’s moving haphazardly (because he’s fighting) and not some measured distance from Point A to Point B. Also the little steps he takes aren’t…even realistic to how fast he’s moving. At times he’s actually sliding across the screen.
It’s not really showing his velocity, because he’s changing directions so much.
It also depends on how the game converts a map unit to a real world unit. Otherwise Doomguy would be 5’8 compared to John-117’s 7’2.
And then we have the FoV which really distorts how once sees speed in first person.
> 2535449076192416;1:
> In my opinion, this game has a really high chance of bringing back the classic gameplay so many old Halo fans have adored! I am so pumped for this!
>
> EDIT: Wow, I didn’t expect such diverse opinions on this subject. The Halo community really is split in half. I’m sorry you have to deal with us, 343
>
> EDIT: 1100comments. __What have I done?__FINAL EDIT: I’m just going to stop counting at this point. The level of which this thread has grown is simply ridiculous.
> 2533274833081329;1994:
> > 2533274945422049;1993:
> > > 2533274833081329;1992:
> > > > 2533274945422049;1984:
> > > > - too fast bms would hurt the map/weapon/health design, so some sort of penality must be included to remove that problem. because of the penality it should be button activated so it is voluntary.
> > >
> > > That depends on how fast is too fast. To an extent, DOOM’s BMS isn’t all that fast compared to Halo CE-3.
> > >
> > > If anything, Halo 5’s BMS is the fastest we’ve had to date, and is potentially already faster than DOOM 2016’s.
> >
> > doom 216 is much faster than halo.
> >
> > video proof:
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ot657NZVfxE
>
> This is just showing his acceleration, since he’s moving haphazardly (because he’s fighting) and not some measured distance from Point A to Point B. Also the little steps he takes aren’t…even realistic to how fast he’s moving. At times he’s actually sliding across the screen.
>
> It’s not really showing his velocity, because he’s changing directions so much.
>
> It also depends on how the game converts a map unit to a real world unit. Otherwise Doomguy would be 5’8 compared to John-117’s 7’2.
>
> And then we have the FoV which really distorts how once sees speed in first person.
i edited my post, adding doom 2016 multiplayer footage and modded halo 3 with a giant foV
> 2533274945422049;1996:
> > 2533274833081329;1994:
> > > 2533274945422049;1993:
> > > > 2533274833081329;1992:
> > > > > 2533274945422049;1984:
> > > > > - too fast bms would hurt the map/weapon/health design, so some sort of penality must be included to remove that problem. because of the penality it should be button activated so it is voluntary.
> > > >
> > > > That depends on how fast is too fast. To an extent, DOOM’s BMS isn’t all that fast compared to Halo CE-3.
> > > >
> > > > If anything, Halo 5’s BMS is the fastest we’ve had to date, and is potentially already faster than DOOM 2016’s.
> > >
> > > doom 216 is much faster than halo.
> > >
> > > video proof:
> > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ot657NZVfxE
> >
> > This is just showing his acceleration, since he’s moving haphazardly (because he’s fighting) and not some measured distance from Point A to Point B. Also the little steps he takes aren’t…even realistic to how fast he’s moving. At times he’s actually sliding across the screen.
> >
> > It’s not really showing his velocity, because he’s changing directions so much.
> >
> > It also depends on how the game converts a map unit to a real world unit. Otherwise Doomguy would be 5’8 compared to John-117’s 7’2.
> >
> > And then we have the FoV which really distorts how once sees speed in first person.
>
> i edited my post, adding doom 2016 multiplayer footage and modded halo 3 with a giant foV
The movement I saw in that multiplayer trailer doesn’t look any faster than Halo 5 except for the “twitchier” controls, most likely due to the fact that this is scripted and probably on mouse and keyboard. It actually looked a bit slower than the modded Halo 3, especially at 37 seconds in.
> 2533274833081329;1997:
> > 2533274945422049;1996:
> > > 2533274833081329;1994:
> > > > 2533274945422049;1993:
> > > > > 2533274833081329;1992:
> > > > > > 2533274945422049;1984:
> > > > > > - too fast bms would hurt the map/weapon/health design, so some sort of penality must be included to remove that problem. because of the penality it should be button activated so it is voluntary.
> > > > >
> > > > > That depends on how fast is too fast. To an extent, DOOM’s BMS isn’t all that fast compared to Halo CE-3.
> > > > >
> > > > > If anything, Halo 5’s BMS is the fastest we’ve had to date, and is potentially already faster than DOOM 2016’s.
> > > >
> > > > doom 216 is much faster than halo.
> > > >
> > > > video proof:
> > > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ot657NZVfxE
> > >
> > > This is just showing his acceleration, since he’s moving haphazardly (because he’s fighting) and not some measured distance from Point A to Point B. Also the little steps he takes aren’t…even realistic to how fast he’s moving. At times he’s actually sliding across the screen.
> > >
> > > It’s not really showing his velocity, because he’s changing directions so much.
> > >
> > > It also depends on how the game converts a map unit to a real world unit. Otherwise Doomguy would be 5’8 compared to John-117’s 7’2.
> > >
> > > And then we have the FoV which really distorts how once sees speed in first person.
> >
> > i edited my post, adding doom 2016 multiplayer footage and modded halo 3 with a giant foV
>
> The movement I saw in that multiplayer trailer doesn’t look any faster than Halo 5 except for the “twitchier” controls, most likely due to the fact that this is scripted and probably on mouse and keyboard. It actually looked a bit slower than the modded Halo 3, especially at 37 seconds in.
the modded halo has a 150° field of view. i don’t know if the character speed is also modded.
a bigger fov (100° insted of 78° (117° would be exactly 50% bigger than the current fov) combined with 110% bms and the proposed movement capabilities would make halo feel quite fast.
Echo p q, you’ve got it down to science and I highly respect that. I could, and would not do what you do man. Now… moving on. If Infinite has big maps( Which it looks like it does) then they should definitely keep sprint IMO, but if not the only modern mechanic I actually care about is the slide, idk I just do. But I would love for that to stay (though now that I think about it, idk how it would work without sprint) I think it adds a good amount of variety, but you know I wouldn’t be heart broken if they didn’t add it. it would just be like an “oh well” sort of thing.
> 2779900484279609;2000:
> > 2535410737759849;1999:
> > If Infinite has big maps( Which it looks like it does) then they should definitely keep sprint IMO.
>
> Why? Why not just increase the base movement speed, so we will be able to have our gun up at all times like Halo was originally designed?
the sprint i propose in an aforementioned post keeps your weapon up while removing the problems of to fast omnidirectional movement. current sprint does neither.
