The perfect progression system: 3 key things

Those who’ve seen me around lately already know that I despise the recent news that Infinite basically will have no progression system at launch. In my view this is a monumental screw up that ignores 14 years of evolution in the genre and I am still baffled to my core about this. I don’t understand how 343 thinks they can launch a F2P multiplayer experience in this day and age with zero progression, besides the paid battle pass. Even that I feel is screwed up, having to complete challenges only and not giving us what MCC already established. It all feels like a joke and I simply will not play Infinite at all until something worthwhile is introduced.

What would be worthwhile? I wanted to lay out 3 key bullet points to give an idea of what Infinite needs to have for a great progression system. Much of what I am going to say may seem like common sense, but apparently common sense isn’t being applied to Infinite so…here we go.

  • Levels: Simple. Infinite needs a progression system with a lot to work towards, especially with this new plan of no sequels, which I highly support. Games in the past, like Call of Duty (I will be comparing to COD a lot because progression was the main thing it nailed back in the day), figured out that giving players a ton of levels to work towards can integral to longevity (even though all the COD games die because of series fatigue). In such a massively crowded field now, I feel that a multiplayer game needs a worthwhile progression system to keep my interest and something as simple as a ton of levels can help that along. Perhaps switch to a numbers system with symbols kind of like COD’s prestige or just go with numbers entirely. Maybe once you hit certain thresholds give the play some new thing that shows their dedication. Anything like this can help and I don’t see how 343 has ignored such a basic concept. I would prefer a game with tons of levels that have reasonable progression through them. There are likely ways you could make the leveling system near endless I bet too. Brainstorm! - Make our actions matter: One thing some other multiplayer focused games are screwing up is this. Having XP earned purely through time played or making most XP trivial beyond challenges, which is something MCC suffers from. A good progression system will reward players for their actions on top of match completion. MCC sorta does this now with medals but sometimes it feels incomplete to me and it still has little impact. So we should have something where every kill, assist, medal, all of them each give you a set amount of XP which adds up. You can balance the leveling up process around that of course but the key is to make our own actions feel like they earned us something. Rogue Company, while also just being a bad game, quickly became beyond boring to me because XP was almost entirely earned through play time and nothing else. That made games feel annoying because I knew that my individual actions didn’t reward me with anything, everything was about wins at that point and that makes everything too competitive. If I wanted that I would play a ranked playlist. Overwatch suffered the same thing. You can still have match completion bonuses as well so everyone wins at that point. - Tons of challenges for the long haul: Similar to levels, we need challenges, boatloads of them. I am not talking about the terrible sounding challenge system that feeds battle pass progression that they are offering. Instead, challenges that are part of the game itself. Get X amount of kills, get X amount of assists, complete X amount of games, get X amount of grenade kills, and whatever else you can think of. Similar to COD again, you can make these challenges multi-tiered and made for the long game. Infinite is going for the long haul approach and again I appreciate that. So we should have a challenge system that reflects that. Give us tons of challenges that we can work towards for a long time. You could even make it to where it shows the date when we complete a tier of a challenge. Wouldn’t that be sweet? Like mini achievements in the multiplayer itself. These can be purely for XP to keep things simple. These do not have to be the sole way of getting a lot of XP, rather a bonus on top of our actions as stated in 2. Far too many games focus too much on “daily and weekly” challenges, which I feel is a limited scope to view all of this through. You can still have those but I think the key is giving us challenges that we can always see, always make progress towards, so then it doesn’t feel like we are “logging in daily” to complete things, instead we are jumping in for fun and for progression. Different mindset.Those to me are 3 key ingredients to make a perfect progression system for Infinite. This would give the game a whole new layer of fun on top of its gameplay. The gameplay already looks top notch and I was very excited to play it, but no real progression at all simply kills it for me. There’s probably more that can be added but these 3 things are the rock solid foundation that I am saddened is being ignored for now. If anyone from 343 even reads anything on this forum, I would like them to take all of this into account. I’ve heard the progression system for launch isn’t being touched at this point which again really bums me out, so I guess all I can do now is wait, like I’ve already been doing. For me, the game is essentially delayed indefinitely until this essential foundation is created.

personally id love to see the H3 exp system make a comeback, 1 exp for winning a match, -1 for quits, 0 for losses, 2ble exp on weekends, really gives an incentive to complete and win games.
also you can have a progression system like reach with an exp amount delivered after each match that counts towards advancing the battlepass and lastly ranks. basically 3 ways of progressing.
might make a post visualizing my perfect system…

MCC has the leveling system you mentioned. Tons of levels and prestiges (tours) to work through. So its weird to me infinite doesnt have something like that

I can say I fully agree with your second point. I think we should do away with earning XP through time played alltogether. It rewards people that shouldn’t be rewarded, i.e AFK people, mass suiciders, shield drainers, you name it. I’d go even further to say that we should take their XP away if these actions are repeated, so they can’t unlock stuff.

> 2533274843630494;2:
> personally id love to see the H3 exp system make a comeback, 1 exp for winning a match, -1 for quits, 0 for losses, 2ble exp on weekends, really gives an incentive to complete and win games.
> also you can have a progression system like reach with an exp amount delivered after each match that counts towards advancing the battlepass and lastly ranks. basically 3 ways of progressing.
> might make a post visualizing my perfect system…

I also liked the per playlist social rank you could get up. You could work towards levelling up individual playlists.

Getting experience per kill and per medal or assist or vehicle kill, was something that even the original Modern Warfares were great at. If you performed well, you ranked up faster than those who didn’t, and it felt good. Challenges should just be an additional bonus on top of the base XP income you gain from playing. You should be able to comfortably skip a challenge you just can’t be bothered with, and not feel like you are totally hamstringing yourself. As for having levels, I wholeheartedly agree. Being able to see your player rank increase after a solid play session is just plainly satisfying, and tickles that good part of our brain that cares about that stuff.

They need to stop reinventing the wheel and use what works. Innovation and change is great and all, but there are some things that don’t need to be messed with entirely.

> 2533274843630494;2:
> personally id love to see the H3 exp system make a comeback, 1 exp for winning a match, -1 for quits, 0 for losses, 2ble exp on weekends, really gives an incentive to complete and win games.
> also you can have a progression system like reach with an exp amount delivered after each match that counts towards advancing the battlepass and lastly ranks. basically 3 ways of progressing.
> might make a post visualizing my perfect system…

double XP on ___ day is silly

However they do it, I hope it’s similar to H3.

Reach was cool just because it was different. Grinding for Inheritor was fun… But that didn’t show actual skill other than you played a lot.

> 2533274922398372;1:
> Those who’ve seen me around lately already know that I despise the recent news that Infinite basically will have no progression system at launch. In my view this is a monumental screw up that ignores 14 years of evolution in the genre and I am still baffled to my core about this. I don’t understand how 343 thinks they can launch a F2P multiplayer experience in this day and age with zero progression, besides the paid battle pass. Even that I feel is screwed up, having to complete challenges only and not giving us what MCC already established. It all feels like a joke and I simply will not play Infinite at all until something worthwhile is introduced.
>
> What would be worthwhile? I wanted to lay out 3 key bullet points to give an idea of what Infinite needs to have for a great progression system. Much of what I am going to say may seem like common sense, but apparently common sense isn’t being applied to Infinite so…here we go.
> - Levels: Simple. Infinite needs a progression system with a lot to work towards, especially with this new plan of no sequels, which I highly support. Games in the past, like Call of Duty (I will be comparing to COD a lot because progression was the main thing it nailed back in the day), figured out that giving players a ton of levels to work towards can integral to longevity (even though all the COD games die because of series fatigue). In such a massively crowded field now, I feel that a multiplayer game needs a worthwhile progression system to keep my interest and something as simple as a ton of levels can help that along. Perhaps switch to a numbers system with symbols kind of like COD’s prestige or just go with numbers entirely. Maybe once you hit certain thresholds give the play some new thing that shows their dedication. Anything like this can help and I don’t see how 343 has ignored such a basic concept. I would prefer a game with tons of levels that have reasonable progression through them. There are likely ways you could make the leveling system near endless I bet too. Brainstorm! - Make our actions matter: One thing some other multiplayer focused games are screwing up is this. Having XP earned purely through time played or making most XP trivial beyond challenges, which is something MCC suffers from. A good progression system will reward players for their actions on top of match completion. MCC sorta does this now with medals but sometimes it feels incomplete to me and it still has little impact. So we should have something where every kill, assist, medal, all of them each give you a set amount of XP which adds up. You can balance the leveling up process around that of course but the key is to make our own actions feel like they earned us something. Rogue Company, while also just being a bad game, quickly became beyond boring to me because XP was almost entirely earned through play time and nothing else. That made games feel annoying because I knew that my individual actions didn’t reward me with anything, everything was about wins at that point and that makes everything too competitive. If I wanted that I would play a ranked playlist. Overwatch suffered the same thing. You can still have match completion bonuses as well so everyone wins at that point. - Tons of challenges for the long haul: Similar to levels, we need challenges, boatloads of them. I am not talking about the terrible sounding challenge system that feeds battle pass progression that they are offering. Instead, challenges that are part of the game itself. Get X amount of kills, get X amount of assists, complete X amount of games, get X amount of grenade kills, and whatever else you can think of. Similar to COD again, you can make these challenges multi-tiered and made for the long game. Infinite is going for the long haul approach and again I appreciate that. So we should have a challenge system that reflects that. Give us tons of challenges that we can work towards for a long time. You could even make it to where it shows the date when we complete a tier of a challenge. Wouldn’t that be sweet? Like mini achievements in the multiplayer itself. These can be purely for XP to keep things simple. These do not have to be the sole way of getting a lot of XP, rather a bonus on top of our actions as stated in 2. Far too many games focus too much on “daily and weekly” challenges, which I feel is a limited scope to view all of this through. You can still have those but I think the key is giving us challenges that we can always see, always make progress towards, so then it doesn’t feel like we are “logging in daily” to complete things, instead we are jumping in for fun and for progression. Different mindset.Those to me are 3 key ingredients to make a perfect progression system for Infinite. This would give the game a whole new layer of fun on top of its gameplay. The gameplay already looks top notch and I was very excited to play it, but no real progression at all simply kills it for me. There’s probably more that can be added but these 3 things are the rock solid foundation that I am saddened is being ignored for now. If anyone from 343 even reads anything on this forum, I would like them to take all of this into account. I’ve heard the progression system for launch isn’t being touched at this point which again really bums me out, so I guess all I can do now is wait, like I’ve already been doing. For me, the game is essentially delayed indefinitely until this essential foundation is created.

Hugely agreed! I’ve heard a lot of people calling for the Halo 3 system, but clearly they’ve never experienced an intermittent internet connection. It also doesn’t encourage individual prowess, just teamwork. This can be sort of cool, but I really think that having all of our actions matter i.e. in the Halo Reach progression system with xp/credits is really key.

> 2533274953195665;8:
> doible xp on _ b
>
>
> > 2533274843630494;2:
> >
>
> double XP on ___ day is silly

why?

> 2533274953195665;8:
> doible xp on _ b
>
>
> > 2533274843630494;2:
> > personally id love to see the H3 exp system make a comeback, 1 exp for winning a match, -1 for quits, 0 for losses, 2ble exp on weekends, really gives an incentive to complete and win games.
> > also you can have a progression system like reach with an exp amount delivered after each match that counts towards advancing the battlepass and lastly ranks. basically 3 ways of progressing.
> > might make a post visualizing my perfect system…
>
> double XP on ___ day is silly

Double XP was always awesome - especially when stuff like Infection/griffball just felt really special.

They need to be careful about challenges; each challenge has implications for gameplay. If a challenge says to play competitive playlists but you’re a casual, then you’re making the experience worse for actual comp players. If a challenge says to get 10 rocket kills, many will go tunnel-visioned and hog the rocket, then use it at inopportune moments to simply maximize the kills they get with it rather than the strategic/tactical importance of each shot.

Challenges can easily undermine their design pillars regarding tactical decision-making by encouraging specific actions.

> 2533274907207100;13:
> They need to be careful about challenges; each challenge has implications for gameplay. If a challenge says to play competitive playlists but you’re a casual, then you’re making the experience worse for actual comp players. If a challenge says to get 10 rocket kills, many will go tunnel-visioned and hog the rocket, then use it at inopportune moments to simply maximize the kills they get with it rather than the strategic/tactical importance of each shot.
>
> Challenges can easily undermine their design pillars regarding tactical decision-making by encouraging specific actions.

That is a valid concern. For a game focused on a weapon sandbox and emphasis on people finding weapons, it could promote too much attention on needing certain things. I was thinking the same things about the grenade kills I mentioned after the fact, it could promote even bigger grenade spammy spamness. So there would have to be some kind of balance, or even just even more bog standard stuff. I do think it needs to be explored within Halo, just balanced for Halo’s core.