the gaming industry is a strange beast

The gaming industry really is terrible to consumers in this generation, the reason is down to modern technology. The ability for games companies to patch and update their games through online connectivity means they can be very lazy when it comes to testing and shipping a working game. If we went back 10 years the MCC would of never of been released as it was, because back then if a game was released that didn’t work or had severe bugs it couldn’t be patched and it would be a disaster for the company and even bankruptcy. Now though, they are rushed, sold and fixed later. How many recent big games can you mention that have had terrible releases that don’t work on launch? How many big games can you remember from your childhood that had terrible releases that didn’t work on launch? and don’t use the argument that “games are a lot more complicated now” that’s no excuse, the games get patched and work eventually so it’s not impossible for them to work but that should all be done pre-release, with proper games testing and server load testing before being put on sale. What other industry in the world has common business practice like this?

Another issue is DLC and season passes. This is a difficult issue because i don’t begrudge game companies making some extra money off their investment. However its at the stage now where companies will develop DLC and the main game at the same time, no longer is it after the game is released they work on making DLC. DLC is now released on day one and with season passes for many updates sometimes costing more than the actual game itself. With content clearly taken out of the main game and sold again. star wars battlefront is the current glaring example of this.

Halo 5. i’m pretty confident that halo 5 will work on release because after the MCC it would be an absolute disaster for the company and i’m sure Microsoft cracked the whip on that.

however next anti consumer thing that’s happening is “released post launch” why has this become a thing? Why has it become a thing for a game to have a release date and not be finished? It’s not good on a consumer level or for the game franchise as a whole. Gamers are a fickle bunch and generally move on very easily for proper retention and game enjoyment a game such be released with as much variety, options and features as possible. Big chunks of the game should not be left out on launch also multiplayer playlists should not be left out on launch. It’s only hurting the population base, everyone on these forums is most likely willing to wait it out and will be reading and following the progress of the new features. That isn’t the case of the majority of the fan base who won’t even know that forge is coming out in december or BTB and other playlists will be released soon. They will just buy the game and what they see is what they think there is.

At this point it probably not possible to release forge on day 1 but 343 please at least add atleast 5 more playlists to multiplayer to give a good variety of experience don’t funnel people. I never play snipers or infection but they should be in and doubles and BTB should definitely be in

EDIT after seeing that halo 5 is now 11th most played xbox game and has been slowly slipping and losing player base. I thought i would resurrect my opinion i had way before the game released about the lack of playlists/content and features would kill the playerbase. I hate to say i told you so but i saw this coming, halo 5 is a great muliplayer game, its smooth, balanced and plays great but you killed it by releasing next to no variety in gameplay.

It is also clear that maps and forge were intentionally left out of the release so that there could be a constant stream of content “to keep people interested and playing” this does not work people get bored and leave. If you watch “the sprint” video series you can see forge working and was used to make the BTB maps wayyy before release, there are also other maps that have been made but not released (a lava rig remake pretend to be surprised when its released). This is a terrible community tactic i write this in hopes someone at 343 will see and maybe just release everything they held back.

there needs to be more social playlists, more maps, possibly dip into community forge made ones, GAMETYPES! oddball, king of the hill why the hell were these left out anyway? i’m not a casual but there needs to be fun wacky gamemodes like action sack, grifball, infection, rocketrace. another thing why finally add double team after 2 1/2 months and then plan to remove it after 4th jan.

thanks

To me, its ok that things are being released post launch. Gametypes, Forge, Maps, Weapons, Vehicles. Its not that game isnt finished, its just to damn big for us to get the 100% completed game at launch. They seem to be very dedicated to this game in adding a lot of new Free DLC and all kinds of other Toys for us to use. So i wouldnt really complain about it because it is a big game and we are getting a lot anyway on launch. Also the only reason why games were finished back then was because there wasnt much to them (if you compare them to now)

Another one complaining. Yay :slight_smile:

> 2533274912702922;2:
> To me, its ok that things are being released post launch. Gametypes, Forge, Maps, Weapons, Vehicles. Its not that game isnt finished, its just to damn big for us to get the 100% completed game at launch. They seem to be very dedicated to this game in adding a lot of new Free DLC and all kinds of other Toys for us to use. So i wouldnt really complain about it because it is a big game and we are getting a lot anyway on launch. Also the only reason why games were finished back then was because there wasnt much to them (if you compare them to now)

you are part of the problem my friend

oh forgot about one thing as well…TL;DR

There’s only so much testing you can do in a lab, some of the problems aren’t going to come to light until you’ve got thousands of people trying to play all at once. The ability to patch/fix games afterwards in that regard is a good thing; as long as developers act quickly. I don’t think companies intentionally release broken games and they’re not able to get away with it so much now, I think that’s why we’re seeing more games being delayed.

Content after the game is no bad thing. I know you don’t accept the “games are more complicated now” but I see it as a valid reason especially in the AAA space. Games are just so much more expensive to make and part of that is the complexity. 343i got burned with MCC so releasing things in stages makes complete sense. It’s up to the consumer to be informed on what they’re getting for their money and if they don’t, then I have no sympathy for them.

DLC I agree with you on, especially when the content in the DLC has blatantly been removed from the main game so they can charge you more for it. Destiny is another great example

I know he’s not everyones favourite but Danny O’Dwyer has done a few videos on these and I think he makes some interestig points

Buggy, rushed games and annualized franchises
How content is killing AAA games
DLC still sucks

@oneseventyout nice reply. yea i didn’t say patching/fixing is a bad thing but it makes companies lazy, if it wasn’t available they would go out there way to test it. The rumors i heard was that originally 343 was going to make the MCC on different discs but Microsoft told them to make it all integrated in one UI which obviously caused problems. Both parties knew the game was not fit for launch and proper patching would of taken well into the new year missing the Christmas period and a console seller that it was meant to be for Christmas so Microsoft told them to release anyway and patch on the go. It took about 3 months to be in a kinda working state

As long as its NOTHING like the PC edition of Arkham Knight. We dont talk of that in my house.

> 2533274849023789;3:
> Another one complaining. Yay :slight_smile:

Yay another person who will take anything thrown at us as long as it has Halo on the cover.

There’s always a possibility of those gametypes being in custom games, just because there isn’t a playlist for them right when the game comes out doesn’t mean they’re not in the game at all.

And don’t forget that they’re ready to respond to criticism by calling you whiny, entitled children! I’m imagining anyone else attempting that in any other business and the scenario doesn’t end in anything short of contract termination.

343 is in this most peculiar position with Halo 5 in that anything they do is a step up. Our standards have been absolutely demolished by the MCC, so much so that any complaint we have comes with this nagging doubt of “hey, at least it’s working as intended this time”.

> 2586218893182442;1:
> The gaming industry really is terrible to consumers in this generation, the reason is down to modern technology. The ability for games companies to patch and update their games through online connectivity means they can be very lazy when it comes to testing and shipping a working game. If we went back 10 years the MCC would of never of been released as it was, because back then if a game was released that didn’t work or had severe bugs it couldn’t be patched and it would be a disaster for the company and even bankruptcy. Now though, they are rushed, sold and fixed later. How many recent big games can you mention that have had terrible releases that don’t work on launch? How many big games can you remember from your childhood that had terrible releases that didn’t work on launch? and don’t use the argument that “games are a lot more complicated now” that’s no excuse, the games get patched and work eventually so it’s not impossible for them to work but that should all be done pre-release, with proper games testing and server load testing before being put on sale. What other industry in the world has common business practice like this?
>
> Another issue is DLC and season passes. This is a difficult issue because i don’t begrudge game companies making some extra money off their investment. However its at the stage now where companies will develop DLC and the main game at the same time, no longer is it after the game is released they work on making DLC. DLC is now released on day one and with season passes for many updates sometimes costing more than the actual game itself. With content clearly taken out of the main game and sold again. star wars battlefront is the current glaring example of this.
>
> Halo 5. i’m pretty confident that halo 5 will work on release because after the MCC it would be an absolute disaster for the company and i’m sure Microsoft cracked the whip on that.
>
> however next anti consumer thing that’s happening is “released post launch” why has this become a thing? Why has it become a thing for a game to have a release date and not be finished? It’s not good on a consumer level or for the game franchise as a whole. Gamers are a fickle bunch and generally move on very easily for proper retention and game enjoyment a game such be released with as much variety, options and features as possible. Big chunks of the game should not be left out on launch also multiplayer playlists should not be left out on launch. It’s only hurting the population base, everyone on these forums is most likely willing to wait it out and will be reading and following the progress of the new features. That isn’t the case of the majority of the fan base who won’t even know that forge is coming out in december or BTB and other playlists will be released soon. They will just buy the game and what they see is what they think there is.
>
> At this point it probably not possible to release forge on day 1 but 343 please at least add atleast 5 more playlists to multiplayer to give a good variety of experience don’t funnel people. I never play snipers or infection but they should be in and doubles and BTB should definitely be in

Completely agree, and everyone telling us to stop crying and just wait, have no clue what unfinished products and “coming soon” does to an online community, it destroys the population, yes the die hard will most likely stick around. Look at what happened to Halo 4, everyone left a few months after launch. 343 needs to make huge changes within weeks or they will lose the launch week population.

There are numerous reasons for the steady move to post-release functionality additions. From “didn’t all fit on the disc” to “staged releasing allows for better server stability”.

I honestly do not think lazy developers is a realistic assumption for post-release content. That sort of comment seems, to me at least, to be a catch all for the underlying desire/demand to have everything immediately - and then complain bitterly because it doesn’t work as you want it to/expect it to.

I guess it shouldn’t be surprising when people are so limited to their tiny perspective that opinions like the OP’s are held, but I still have to scratch my head at it.

First off, revisionist history is hilarious. The OP seems to think that pre-Internet gaming utopia exists, where games launched bug free with tons of features! That utopia doesn’t exist. Bugs still existed, but would persist throughout the entirety of the game’s life. And the amount of content back then compared to what’s now is laughable.

I love that the assumption for things the OP feels should be included at launch but aren’t is that the developers are simply lazy, or rushed. I’d be willing to bet they work a helluva lot harder (and smarter) at their craft than whatever it is you get paid a meager pittance to do. The investment going into games now, both in dollars and man-hours, has outpaced the cost to consumer by a mile.

Again, go beyond your perspective. They’re working hard to deliver a core of features critical to what the audience at large wants, not just what you want. They’re doing it on a schedule defined by the people funding the endeavor. They’re prioritizing and delivering.

> 2533274906745123;6:
> There’s only so much testing you can do in a lab, some of the problems aren’t going to come to light until you’ve got thousands of people trying to play all at once. The ability to patch/fix games afterwards in that regard is a good thing; as long as developers act quickly. I don’t think companies intentionally release broken games and they’re not able to get away with it so much now, I think that’s why we’re seeing more games being delayed.
>
> Content after the game is no bad thing. I know you don’t accept the “games are more complicated now” but I see it as a valid reason especially in the AAA space. Games are just so much more expensive to make and part of that is the complexity. 343i got burned with MCC so releasing things in stages makes complete sense. It’s up to the consumer to be informed on what they’re getting for their money and if they don’t, then I have no sympathy for them.
>
> DLC I agree with you on, especially when the content in the DLC has blatantly been removed from the main game so they can charge you more for it. Destiny is another great example
>
> I know he’s not everyones favourite but Danny O’Dwyer has done a few videos on these and I think he makes some interestig points
>
> Buggy, rushed games and annualized franchises
> How content is killing AAA games
> DLC still sucks

In response to your first paragraph: There is a reason OLD Bungie did Beta’s months and months before launch. The Halo Reach beta is one of the best examples of this because they had over a million people try downloading and playing the Beta the minute it was released to the public and we crashed their servers for a bit. Anyone who remembers trying to play the Reach beta the first day remembers the download taking forever followed by down servers for hours and hours. This let Bungie know that they underestimated the load that would be on their servers come launch so they made adjustments and fixed that. They made note of how OP the plasma launcher was and fixed that. They also had a wealth of game modes and playlists at launch as well as fully functioning campaign, forge, firefight, custom games, ranks, theater mode, EVERYTHING!

> 2533274819939761;15:
> > 2533274906745123;6:
> > There’s only so much testing you can do in a lab, some of the problems aren’t going to come to light until you’ve got thousands of people trying to play all at once. The ability to patch/fix games afterwards in that regard is a good thing; as long as developers act quickly. I don’t think companies intentionally release broken games and they’re not able to get away with it so much now, I think that’s why we’re seeing more games being delayed.
> >
> > Content after the game is no bad thing. I know you don’t accept the “games are more complicated now” but I see it as a valid reason especially in the AAA space. Games are just so much more expensive to make and part of that is the complexity. 343i got burned with MCC so releasing things in stages makes complete sense. It’s up to the consumer to be informed on what they’re getting for their money and if they don’t, then I have no sympathy for them.
> >
> > DLC I agree with you on, especially when the content in the DLC has blatantly been removed from the main game so they can charge you more for it. Destiny is another great example
> >
> > I know he’s not everyones favourite but Danny O’Dwyer has done a few videos on these and I think he makes some interestig points
> >
> > Buggy, rushed games and annualized franchises
> > How content is killing AAA games
> > DLC still sucks
>
>
> In response to your first paragraph: There is a reason OLD Bungie did Beta’s months and months before launch. The Halo Reach beta is one of the best examples of this because they had over a million people try downloading and playing the Beta the minute it was released to the public and we crashed their servers for a bit. Anyone who remembers trying to play the Reach beta the first day remembers the download taking forever followed by down servers for hours and hours. This let Bungie know that they underestimated the load that would be on their servers come launch so they made adjustments and fixed that. They made note of how OP the plasma launcher was and fixed that. They also had a wealth of game modes and playlists at launch as well as fully functioning campaign, forge, firefight, custom games, ranks, theater mode, EVERYTHING!

Yes yes… but now look at bungie im sorry bungievision… lets not do.the whole compare and contrast thing

Nintendo tho…

> 2533274837348390;17:
> Nintendo tho…

Real talk: I don’t know what people who don’t own Nintendo systems have been playing for these past few years. 2013 was salvaged by the 3DS, 2014 was salvaged by the Wii U, but if you didn’t own these then I cannot even conceive of what you were playing.

> 2533274837348390;17:
> Nintendo tho…

What about Nintendo? I have zero experience of Nintendo games and hardware, so I’m unclear to what you are referring.

Most the games that released so badly where the games that were developed during the new gen transition. Halo MCC, BF4, etc…where all essentially first releases on the new gen. Doesn’t necessary excuse the fact that they were really bad launches…but launches like that won’t be happening again this generation.

I agree with you on the season pass and DLC and playlists and such. You don’t want to fragment the player base too much with playlists though…but ya, team snipers, doubles, and other clambered for classics should be in there. BTB I think is somewhat debatable I think though…because that’s essentially what Warzone is.

But 343 understanding that releasing a bunch of map packs fragments the crap out of the player base makes me scream and shout for joy! What 343 is doing with Halo 5 DLC is quite possibly the greatest thing in the multiplayer FPSer history to date. It’s about time a dev realized or at least did something about that.