The Forerunners In Halo 1-3

Community Halo Universe
1

I personally feel 343 doesn’t fully understand the Forerunners.

And, NOT just because you tried to tell us more about them. I’d have been Ok with that.

IF you actually understood what exactly the Forerunners were in Halo 1, 2 and 3.

The Forerunners, in Halo 1, 2 and 3, are not an alien species. They were ancient humans. I know, right now I sound a little crazy, so hold on, allow me to explain.

Lets go back to before Halo 4’s campaign. Our last outing as Cheif was Halo 3, we haven’t seen The Librarian or Didact in game.

We only have mentions of them in Halo 3’s terminals. Now, notice how none, NONE, give mention of a Human Forerunner war or Promeatheans, or even the Speices themselves.
Human-forerunner Wars, taking the mantle and promeatheans were created by 343, and not Bungie.

So back to why Forerunners were ancient Humans.
Well, for a start, it actually fits the Narrative of the Prophet led Covenant. We Know The Prophets hid any knowledge that the Humans were the “Reclaimers” from covenant speices (in game reference being Truth saying to Johnson “that last secret dies with all the rest”)

If the Prophets knew this, it explains why they hide it, as it undermines their whole religion by finding out the creators of the Rings are just Humans, not Gods, and it goes to further explain why the prophets felt Humanity needed to be eradicated

The Gravemind actually refers to Cheif as “child of my enemy”

The Monitor actually refers to all Humans as relclaimers, not just some Humans as we see in 343’s Halo.

How about All Forerunner tech just Happens to recognise Human touch? And is programmed to to Help Humans (again, I mentio that the idea of the Mantle was a 343 addition)

The Monitor’s last major monologue in Halo 3 LITERALLY SAYING “You Are Forerunner”

Thats all exposition based evidence, heres the best part.

Metal Forerunner architecture (In Halo 1, 2 and 3 at least) is very ancient temple and monolithic, and resembles real world ancient Human Temple architecture. Which contrasts Greatly with the distinctly Alien Forerunner architecture of Halo 4 and 5. It also explains the more “traditional” Aztec/Mayan Forerunners temple structures in Halo 2

Furthermore, the natural terrain of All Forerunner installations in Halo 1, 2 and 3 is made to mimic real world, earth like locations. From the trees, to the rocks to the colour pallet, it’s made to feel like earth, the Forerunner home world, because they were Human. You think we started in that Jungle in Africa in Halo 3 for no specific reason? No, that was done to parallel Jungle locations from previous Halo games.

But, sadly, these major points seem to have been missed by 343, and the retconning has made parts of Halo 1, 2 and 3 feel redundant and pointless and hell, the reason for Prophets wanting to destroy Humanity seem lost to. The change from Ancient Human to Alien Species has broken elements of the original trilogies underlying stor that was so excellently subtle in it’s showing of these parts it’s went unnoticed to Many, and the butchering of what the Forerunners were allowed to pass, and that is a sad thought.

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> 2535410901623492;1:
> The Forerunners, in Halo 1, 2 and 3, are not an alien species. They were ancient humans. I know, right now I sound a little crazy, so hold on, allow me to explain.

Actually the Halo 3 terminals do refer to humans and Forerunner as a separate species.

Terminal Six

Did I tell you? I built a garden.
The earth is so rich. A seed falls
and a tree sprouts or a flower
blooms. There’s so much… potential.
We knew this was a special place
because of them, but unless you’ve
been here, you can’t know.

It’s [Eden].

She’s on Earth, which would certainly indicate she is not from that planet and she is referring to the planet’s population as “them” which would also indicate she is of a different species.

3

Nope, Bungo decided to ditch that idea themselves.

4

I feel you dude, but be prepared to get swarmed by people determined to prove that Humans were never meant to be Forerunner offspring.

343 kinda took parts of the Terminals and whatnot and twisted them into a war between Humans and Forerunners rather than the Flood and Forerunners. This is 343’s vision of the Forerunners bro (evident from the fact that nothing artistically lines up with Bungie’s), and while Bungie might have been torn on Humans being Forerunner throughout the original trilogy, I feel like that frenzied exclamation from Guilty Spark was them finally affirming that notion.

The tragic and mysterious story of a grand civilization that fell protecting the galaxy has amounted to nothing more than an evil army of robots, a bunch of generic techno-scapes, and constant shifts in power chasing a flawed ideology known as “The Mantle of Responsibility”.

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> 2533274832335336;4:
> I feel you dude, but be prepared to get swarmed by people determined to prove that Humans were never meant to be Forerunner offspring.

I dont think anyone’s going to argue that humans were never meant to be forerunner descendants. We’re going to argue that halo 3 made it pretty clear that it wasn’t the case.

> 2533274832335336;4:
> 343 kinda took parts of the Terminals and whatnot and twisted them into a war between Humans and Forerunners rather than the Flood and Forerunners.

There is still very much a forerunner and flood war…

> 2533274832335336;4:
> This is 343’s vision of the Forerunners bro (evident from the fact that nothing artistically lines up with Bungie’s), and while Bungie might have been torn on Humans being Forerunner throughout the original trilogy, I feel like that frenzied exclamation from Guilty Spark was them finally affirming that notion.

If they didn’t write the terminals in the exact same game the way they did, there’d have been no doubt that humans were supposed to be forerunners. But instead we have an account of a bunch of level headed people, against that of an AI who’s literally flipping out and killing people and would rather protect the ring than actually do the job the ring is meant for.

> 2533274832335336;4:
> The tragic and mysterious story of a grand civilization that fell protecting the galaxy has amounted to nothing more than an evil army of robots, a bunch of generic techno-scapes, and constant shifts in power chasing a flawed ideology known as “The Mantle of Responsibility”.

Admittedly I’m not really a fan of their aesthetic these days, especially the prometheans. That said, a flawed ideology is more interesting than them being flawless angels who somehow lost to space zombies under bungie’s reign.

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> 2533274832335336;4:
> I feel you dude, but be prepared to get swarmed by people determined to prove that Humans were never meant to be Forerunner offspring.
>
> 343 kinda took parts of the Terminals and whatnot and twisted them into a war between Humans and Forerunners rather than the Flood and Forerunners. This is 343’s vision of the Forerunners bro (evident from the fact that nothing artistically lines up with Bungie’s), and while Bungie might have been torn on Humans being Forerunner throughout the original trilogy, I feel like that frenzied exclamation from Guilty Spark was them finally affirming that notion.
>
> The tragic and mysterious story of a grand civilization that fell protecting the galaxy has amounted to nothing more than an evil army of robots, a bunch of generic techno-scapes, and constant shifts in power chasing a flawed ideology known as “The Mantle of Responsibility”.

What?!? Lol you sound like angry at the story.

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> 2533274912168474;6:
> > 2533274832335336;4:
> > I feel you dude, but be prepared to get swarmed by people determined to prove that Humans were never meant to be Forerunner offspring.
> >
> > 343 kinda took parts of the Terminals and whatnot and twisted them into a war between Humans and Forerunners rather than the Flood and Forerunners. This is 343’s vision of the Forerunners bro (evident from the fact that nothing artistically lines up with Bungie’s), and while Bungie might have been torn on Humans being Forerunner throughout the original trilogy, I feel like that frenzied exclamation from Guilty Spark was them finally affirming that notion.
> >
> > The tragic and mysterious story of a grand civilization that fell protecting the galaxy has amounted to nothing more than an evil army of robots, a bunch of generic techno-scapes, and constant shifts in power chasing a flawed ideology known as “The Mantle of Responsibility”.
>
>
> What?!? Lol you sound like angry at the story.

I am. I think it ruined the Forerunners TBH, but that’s just me. There’s some things I like but most of it, yeah my salt levels are particularly high.

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> 2533274964189700;5:
> > 2533274832335336;4:
> > I feel you dude, but be prepared to get swarmed by people determined to prove that Humans were never meant to be Forerunner offspring.
>
>
> I dont think anyone’s going to argue that humans were never meant to be forerunner descendants. We’re going to argue that halo 3 made it pretty clear that it wasn’t the case.
>
>
>
>
> > 2533274832335336;4:
> > 343 kinda took parts of the Terminals and whatnot and twisted them into a war between Humans and Forerunners rather than the Flood and Forerunners.
>
>
> There is still very much a forerunner and flood war…
>
>
>
>
> > 2533274832335336;4:
> > This is 343’s vision of the Forerunners bro (evident from the fact that nothing artistically lines up with Bungie’s), and while Bungie might have been torn on Humans being Forerunner throughout the original trilogy, I feel like that frenzied exclamation from Guilty Spark was them finally affirming that notion.
>
>
> If they didn’t write the terminals in the exact same game the way they did, there’d have been no doubt that humans were supposed to be forerunners. But instead we have an account of a bunch of level headed people, against that of an AI who’s literally flipping out and killing people and would rather protect the ring than actually do the job the ring is meant for.
>
>
>
>
> > 2533274832335336;4:
> > The tragic and mysterious story of a grand civilization that fell protecting the galaxy has amounted to nothing more than an evil army of robots, a bunch of generic techno-scapes, and constant shifts in power chasing a flawed ideology known as “The Mantle of Responsibility”.
>
>
> Admittedly I’m not really a fan of their aesthetic these days, especially the prometheans. That said, a flawed ideology is more interesting than them being flawless angels who somehow lost to space zombies under bungie’s reign.

There was nothing that inherently stated Humans were seperate from Forerunners in the Terminals, and certainly no reference of a war between the two. There’s a part where Mendicant Bias is saying stuff about resetting a civilization back to the Stone Age, and THAT seems to be the inspiration for the war considering it sounds like something Halo 4 Didact would say.

Guilty Spark showed no signs of instability all throughout the trilogy, and he stated the reason he didn’t want the ring to fire was because a launch at that stage would destroy it, and he was determined for that to not happen again.

The Forerunners could be flawed without being bigoted power whores who made all the wrong decisions and are incompetent in every way.

9

343/Bungie did tie that together, whether by intention or by retcon storytelling, with the Librarian favoring humans as inheritors of the Mantle. Also, with Humans encroaching on Forerunner space to escape the Flood, it wouldn’t be too surprising if some of those “ancient alien” artifacts were in fact of Human construction, but forgotten to our species as a result of the Forerunners.

It’s too bad Halo 5 does almost nothing in regards to the Librarian or what happened in Halo 4, but I really want to know what the Librarian did to MC in Halo 4, and how that all ties into what’s happening in Halo 5 and what will be in Halo 6.

10

Former Bungie employees have made it pretty clear that for most of the trilogy’s development they were never sure themselves which it would be, and so they left it intentionally open ended. When it came to Halo 3 they decided to be a little more clear, apparently settling on the humans and Forerunners being the same (hence the GS line at the end) and so this is how the script was written, lines recorded and cutscenes put together, however, the terminals were most likely written later in development and by that point the writers had changed their minds and the two became different species.

So what did 343i actually do? Well they kind of compromised. They made the ancient human civilisation, as a nod to the original idea, but ultimately stayed true to what the canon said (not just in the terminals, but also in the Bestiary bonus feature that came with the Legendary Edition).

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> 2533274832335336;8:
> There was nothing that inherently stated Humans were seperate from Forerunners in the Terminals, and certainly no reference of a war between the two.

The librarian going and finding ancient humans while cataloguing various races doesn’t point them out as seperate? She never talks about them like they’re some branch of forerunners that got seperated and develolved, she talks about them as a species that fascinates her due to similarity. Which, at least in the Forerunner saga, described them as being immensively physically similar.
But I agree there’s no mention of war, the terminals suggest the librarian encountering cavemen was her first encounter with them.

> 2533274832335336;8:
> Guilty Spark showed no signs of instability all throughout the trilogy, and he stated the reason he didn’t want the ring to fire was because a launch at that stage would destroy it, and he was determined for that to not happen again.

He always seemed a bit off-kilter, enough that Chief even theorized he was rampant in the novels, its also an idea 343 continued in the CEA terminals, and no one’s complained about that portrayal. Not firing it would have doomed them all to infection by the flood. He pretty much prioritized protecting the his ring over saving the galaxy from the flood.

12

Halo 3 made it clear that humans and Forerunner were different. Honestly, looking at the consoles the Chief has to activate in Halo CE, you’ll see an extra finger on the display. That, and the Librarian’s efforts to catalogue humans before the halo firing.

Also remember that Frank O’connor used to work at Bungie when Halo was developed. He’s one of a few people who has the Halo Bible (all the lore of the Halo universe). I believe it was always the plan to have humans be different than Forerunner.

What may have changed with some of the lore is having an advanced Human race (and the Human-Forerunner war). Personally, I always felt that was cheesy and the whole “forerunner devolved humanity” storyline to belittle the magnitude of importance of the Forerunner and cheapened our struggle to combat the Covenant and Flood.

13

What I like about Forerunners in the original trilogy is that they are left a general mystery - we don’t know if they were another alien species, or what they looked like, and for all we know, they all died with the last activation of the Array. Only their technology and architecture is left as a reminder of what their culture might have been like. I loved how they were left mysterious. Don’t get me wrong, I am interested in reading the Forerunner books, but I think that 343i having the Didact and Librarian be alive just…defeats the purpose of the original trilogy. They tried to kill the Flood by activating the Halo Array, killing themselves in the process, and now only ghosts are left. But with survivors walking about…they aren’t so mysterious anymore. I saw their deaths as being a warning/cautionary tale to the galaxy by the time we get to Combat Evolved.

That’s my biggest gripe about the direction the series has been taking lately. I don’t mind whether or not Humans were or were not the same as the Forerunners, though. But I’m not sure I like how the Forerunners seem to have “created” Humans, then blasted them back to the Stone Age (more or less literally). I like the feel of the original games where you definitely get the sense that Humans are newcomers to this bigger conflict and history, as opposed to them having been involved from the beginning even if they don’t know it.

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> 2533274887950450;13:
> What I like about Forerunners in the original trilogy is that they are left a general mystery - we don’t know if they were another alien species, or what they looked like, and for all we know, they all died with the last activation of the Array. Only their technology and architecture is left as a reminder of what their culture might have been like. I loved how they were left mysterious. Don’t get me wrong, I am interested in reading the Forerunner books, but I think that 343i having the Didact and Librarian be alive just…defeats the purpose of the original trilogy. They tried to kill the Flood by activating the Halo Array, killing themselves in the process, and now only ghosts are left. But with survivors walking about…they aren’t so mysterious anymore. I saw their deaths as being a warning/cautionary tale to the galaxy by the time we get to Combat Evolved.
>
> That’s my biggest gripe about the direction the series has been taking lately. I don’t mind whether or not Humans were or were not the same as the Forerunners, though. But I’m not sure I like how the Forerunners seem to have “created” Humans, then blasted them back to the Stone Age (more or less literally). I like the feel of the original games where you definitely get the sense that Humans are newcomers to this bigger conflict and history, as opposed to them having been involved from the beginning even if they don’t know it.

This is a good point. 343i needed a new enemy aside from the Covenant, and since Forerunners were so mysterious and ambiguous, there was room to turn them into an actual enemy. I was personally ok with the Didact, even if his involvement in the story involved a whole lot of retconning. I kind of liked the idea that this radical Forerunner was trying to keep Humans from assuming the position of top dogs in the universe. I’m less ok with how that has been sidelined in favor of Cortana suddenly decided that she is not ok with conflict and has to forcibly disarm the universe.

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> 2533274964189700;11:
> > 2533274832335336;8:
> > There was nothing that inherently stated Humans were seperate from Forerunners in the Terminals, and certainly no reference of a war between the two.
>
>
> The librarian going and finding ancient humans while cataloguing various races doesn’t point them out as seperate? She never talks about them like they’re some branch of forerunners that got seperated and develolved, she talks about them as a species that fascinates her due to similarity. Which, at least in the Forerunner saga, described them as being immensively physically similar.
> But I agree there’s no mention of war, the terminals suggest the librarian encountering cavemen was her first encounter with them.
>
>
> > 2533274832335336;8:
> > Guilty Spark showed no signs of instability all throughout the trilogy, and he stated the reason he didn’t want the ring to fire was because a launch at that stage would destroy it, and he was determined for that to not happen again.
>
>
> He always seemed a bit off-kilter, enough that Chief even theorized he was rampant in the novels, its also an idea 343 continued in the CEA terminals, and no one’s complained about that portrayal. Not firing it would have doomed them all to infection by the flood. He pretty much prioritized protecting the his ring over saving the galaxy from the flood.

While nothing explicitly states that Humans and Forerunners are separate, it’s far easier to draw that conclusion based on the Librarian’s comments (as you said), and also I just found out about a “secret” comic strip that acknowledges that, so I’ll give on the “Human=Forerunner” thing.

Not sure what it says about him in the novels, but I’m sure Guilty Spark was concerned about the ring because if it was destroyed, it wouldn’t be able to perform it’s primary function, which was the eradication of all sentient life (which obviously didn’t happen), not just blowing the hell up and killing the Flood in the vicinity.

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> 2533274832335336;15:
> Not sure what it says about him in the novels, but I’m sure Guilty Spark was concerned about the ring because if it was destroyed, it wouldn’t be able to perform it’s primary function, which was the eradication of all sentient life (which obviously didn’t happen), not just blowing the hell up and killing the Flood in the vicinity.

A ring’s primary purpose is to stop the flood by wiping out all sentient life in its effective radius. The forerunners didn’t make the rings wipe out sentient life for giggles. Spark was even the one who suggested using a tactical pulse from the ring to wipe out the local infestation.

However, with the flood already rebuilding the gravemind on the ring, it’s extremely unlikely that the ring would have been finished and able to perform its function as Spark wanted it. Instead it’d have become the nest of a new gravemind. And instead of using his great intelligence to come up with alternate solutions, he goes full murder mode. Heck, if he succeeded in killing Chief as well, he wouldn’t even have a human to activate it.

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> 2533274887950450;13:
> What I like about Forerunners in the original trilogy is that they are left a general mystery - we don’t know if they were another alien species, or what they looked like, and for all we know, they all died with the last activation of the Array. Only their technology and architecture is left as a reminder of what their culture might have been like. I loved how they were left mysterious. Don’t get me wrong, I am interested in reading the Forerunner books, but I think that 343i having the Didact and Librarian be alive just…defeats the purpose of the original trilogy. They tried to kill the Flood by activating the Halo Array, killing themselves in the process, and now only ghosts are left. But with survivors walking about…they aren’t so mysterious anymore. I saw their deaths as being a warning/cautionary tale to the galaxy by the time we get to Combat Evolved.
>
> That’s my biggest gripe about the direction the series has been taking lately. I don’t mind whether or not Humans were or were not the same as the Forerunners, though. But I’m not sure I like how the Forerunners seem to have “created” Humans, then blasted them back to the Stone Age (more or less literally). I like the feel of the original games where you definitely get the sense that Humans are newcomers to this bigger conflict and history, as opposed to them having been involved from the beginning even if they don’t know it.

Very well said. The Forerunners were supposed to be extinct. As much as I love Halo, I think 343 contradicted the original story a bit to attempt to expand the halo history and universe. I honestly feel they should, or could had come up with a better continuation of the trilogy but I’m still intrigued with the way they are taking it so I’m going to keep playing for now.

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> 2533274851141500;17:
> > 2533274887950450;13:
> > What I like about Forerunners in the original trilogy is that they are left a general mystery - we don’t know if they were another alien species, or what they looked like, and for all we know, they all died with the last activation of the Array. Only their technology and architecture is left as a reminder of what their culture might have been like. I loved how they were left mysterious. Don’t get me wrong, I am interested in reading the Forerunner books, but I think that 343i having the Didact and Librarian be alive just…defeats the purpose of the original trilogy. They tried to kill the Flood by activating the Halo Array, killing themselves in the process, and now only ghosts are left. But with survivors walking about…they aren’t so mysterious anymore. I saw their deaths as being a warning/cautionary tale to the galaxy by the time we get to Combat Evolved.
> >
> > That’s my biggest gripe about the direction the series has been taking lately. I don’t mind whether or not Humans were or were not the same as the Forerunners, though. But I’m not sure I like how the Forerunners seem to have “created” Humans, then blasted them back to the Stone Age (more or less literally). I like the feel of the original games where you definitely get the sense that Humans are newcomers to this bigger conflict and history, as opposed to them having been involved from the beginning even if they don’t know it.
>
>
> Very well said. The Forerunners were supposed to be extinct. As much as I love Halo, I think 343 contradicted the original story a bit to attempt to expand the halo history and universe. I honestly feel they should, or could had come up with a better continuation of the trilogy but I’m still intrigued with the way they are taking it so I’m going to keep playing for now.

Yeah, at this point we can only just wait and see what 343i does with the Forerunners. At the very least, I hope that the Precursers remain mysterious. I also hope that we see more of the Arbiter’s Covenant fighting against the Forerunner AI alongside Humanity, and that the Flood get taken care of in some fashion.

But…yeah, the Forerunners, if anything, were more like set pieces in the original games, and we could only speculate about what they were.

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> 2533274964189700;16:
> > 2533274832335336;15:
> > Not sure what it says about him in the novels, but I’m sure Guilty Spark was concerned about the ring because if it was destroyed, it wouldn’t be able to perform it’s primary function, which was the eradication of all sentient life (which obviously didn’t happen), not just blowing the hell up and killing the Flood in the vicinity.
>
>
> A ring’s primary purpose is to stop the flood by wiping out all sentient life in its effective radius. The forerunners didn’t make the rings wipe out sentient life for giggles. Spark was even the one who suggested using a tactical pulse from the ring to wipe out the local infestation.
>
> However, with the flood already rebuilding the gravemind on the ring, it’s extremely unlikely that the ring would have been finished and able to perform its function as Spark wanted it. Instead it’d have become the nest of a new gravemind. And instead of using his great intelligence to come up with alternate solutions, he goes full murder mode. Heck, if he succeeded in killing Chief as well, he wouldn’t even have a human to activate it.

He may have been irrationally angry about the fact that the thing he was charged with protecting and caring for was about to be blown up…again, but I still don’t feel like that automatically makes everything he says idiotic babbling. His light turning back to blue when he said it even insinuates he had calmed back to his normal state after…what he did to Johnson.

It’s whatever though, as I said I can come to terms with the separation, but the unnecessary “Ancient War” angle, the over-explanation of Halo’s mysterious pre-historic era, and the demonization of the Didact and Forerunners in general are my biggest issues with the story.

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> 2533274832335336;19:
> > 2533274964189700;16:
> > > 2533274832335336;15:
> > > Not sure what it says about him in the novels, but I’m sure Guilty Spark was concerned about the ring because if it was destroyed, it wouldn’t be able to perform it’s primary function, which was the eradication of all sentient life (which obviously didn’t happen), not just blowing the hell up and killing the Flood in the vicinity.
> >
> >
> > A ring’s primary purpose is to stop the flood by wiping out all sentient life in its effective radius. The forerunners didn’t make the rings wipe out sentient life for giggles. Spark was even the one who suggested using a tactical pulse from the ring to wipe out the local infestation.
> >
> > However, with the flood already rebuilding the gravemind on the ring, it’s extremely unlikely that the ring would have been finished and able to perform its function as Spark wanted it. Instead it’d have become the nest of a new gravemind. And instead of using his great intelligence to come up with alternate solutions, he goes full murder mode. Heck, if he succeeded in killing Chief as well, he wouldn’t even have a human to activate it.
>
>
> He may have been irrationally angry about the fact that the thing he was charged with protecting and caring for was about to be blown up…again, but I still don’t feel like that automatically makes everything he says idiotic babbling. His light turning back to blue when he said it even insinuates he had calmed back to his normal state after…what he did to Johnson.
>
> It’s whatever though, as I said I can come to terms with the separation, but the unnecessary “Ancient War” angle, the over-explanation of Halo’s mysterious pre-historic era, and the demonization of the Didact and Forerunners in general are my biggest issues with the story.

(Just chiming in to this discussion!) I’ve never really seen 343 Guilty Spark’s dialogue as “idiotic babbling”, just like you point out; he’s kind of a…gifted madman, I suppose. He may go off into tangents and shoot people and so forth, but there is a level of logic and reason behind everything he does and says, Rampancy or not. And that’s what made him a potent threat in the games.

Yep, less is more, in this case. I like some mystery to the story/universe, and don’t think every single thing needs explanation. Still going to read the Forerunner saga books, though, for the fun of it.