The Downfall of Halo: Being Too Complex?

Hear me out here; I think 343i tried too hard in their maps. Maps like Solace, Abandoned and Vortex. A lot of them seem to have too much clutter, specifically Solace and to some extent Abandoned.

What I’m talking about is there are either too many things around, meant to restrict sight-lines but either feel ungainly whether by restricting movement (you running and you end up getting caught on something and you can’t move.)

In Halo 3, I can’t remember a single map I had this issue with. All pathways were generally very smooth, nothing to catch your feet, nothing too… Unnatural. It was all very open-world concept. Allowing freedom of movement. Very player friendly. We ended up building our own hot-spots rather them being engineered into the maps with many choke points.

I also miss the superb map design in H3. Most maps had awesome jump spots designed to make getting places faster to those who are willing to spend 5 minutes practicing the jumps. Now in these maps in H4 they barely have any good jump locations. Why bother when you can have Jet Pack I guess eh?

So what do you all think?

I agree. One thing I used to appreciate about Halo was its simplicity.

> I agree. One thing I used to appreciate about Halo was its simplicity.

Bungie started it with Reach, look back at the maps. CE, H2 and H3 had basic layouts with minimal clutter. This even relates to doorways and walls. Why on earth can my player get stuck in a doorway because they felt the need to make the doorway have edges and object protruding out of it instead of a straight cutout like all opens have?

CE and H2 had a square cut into the way, THAT WORKED PERFECT! It’s more about gameplay then how a game looks and has always been this way.

I’ve been specifically playing Abandoned and Solace (Monolith too) to get used to all the clutter and poor sight lines. So yes I get where you’re coming from, and I partially agree. The wonky sight lines can be irritating, but it’s something that you can work around if you have good positioning. Problem is, positioning is a lot harder to learn than just being a good shot - but neither one can replace the other at higher levels of play. So if you have the tactics, positioning and etc down, but you’re only average at aiming you won’t do well. Same goes for if you’re a crack shot, but are tactically limited and always get caught out of position. Problem is that at lower levels of play the expert marksmanship kind of overshadows the lack of tactics -in a 1v1 scenario someone that always lands a DMR 5-shot or a sniper headshot is going to wreck someone who takes 6 shots 50% of the time but is more knowledgeable about map control/teamwork.

It’s kind of a double edged sword in that regard as well, for keeping the “casuals” interested in the game. Recently my squad dipped out of PT to hang out in my barracks room, and we took turns playing some H4 online. All of them were guys who play CoD - a lot in one guys case. They walked away from my room with a net of a whopping 0 kills and probably 45 deaths.

Why? Because they had absolutely zero tactics - all of them just ran forward. One of the three actually even stopped moving every time he’d zoom in and start firing, ala CoD. They also couldn’t hit people consistently. They almost immediately moved away from my BR loadout because it wasn’t automatic, and couldn’t sustain fire on people for long enough to kill them using the AR. They’d hit them a few times, miss, then die. Then -Yoink- that it was -Yoink- that no one was dying - because CoD has trained them that 3 rounds from an automatic should drop people instantly. Where they get rewarded for just rushing forward and spamming an automatic or a shotgun, or snap-to ADS’ing.

A game where they /have/ to move and fire at the same time, at a target that’s also strafing/jumping/dodging, land multiple shots on said target, use grenades as more than a spamming insta-kill, and deal with things like AA’s… it’s too complex for them. Having to know when to hold position or fall back rather than advance, know when and how to cover your teammates, know how to control a map… it’s too complex for them. So the average “casual”, and a lot of the wanna-be “e-pros” (the kind that make CoD frag montages, and think they’re the best thing since sliced bread, but have never been to a single pro event, had more than 5 viewers in their stream, or played against any actual pros) all run off from it because they do poorly for not being able to master one or both of the essentials for success.

That and CoD being across all platforms is the reason I could almost guarantee that Halo will never be the “King” of the console FPS again. Though to me, no matter how much stuff they try to stick in that was inspired by CoD, it’s still going to be a completely different gaming paradigm. The way the game plays and feels is totally different, regardless of it having custom loadouts and ordnance call ins now. Which is why I’d still consider Halo the more “competitive” friendly franchise. No matter how much magnetism, aim assist, randomness and etc that there is (even though the last bit is always weeded out with competitive game modes), it’s still a much more complex game than CoD… Because tactics actually mean something, and being a God-tier sharp shooter won’t get you crap in Halo if you’re getting 2v1’d or 3v2’d because the other team has better organization, awareness and map control.

On a side note more appropriate to your original point; some of my favorite Halo maps are from CE, and had a little clutter - but a lot of open spaces with some cover that usually doubled as a way to move from one place to another. Hang 'em High, Wizard, Derelict, Damnation. However, none of them had anything quite like the level of clutter on the previously mentioned H4 maps. Getting caught on a stupid piece of clutter or a door frame while trying to strafe or retreat is annoying as crap.

That’s much more of a wall of text than originally intended…

> That’s much more of a wall of text than originally intended…

I’ll be honest, I started skimming but I read most of it.

And the thing is, the problems are somewhat negligible. It’s the sort of thing that will only mess with people occasionally, which is why I think they might let it slip , but I really don’t like that. Halo needs AAA+ map design, it has to flow perfect.

Halo is a very complex dish and it needs perfect seasoning or else it will taste off real fast.

H4’s maps are a massive step ahead of Reach but they are a few good paces behind H3. And all that makes a big difference.

As I previously stated, all the maps are missing proper trick jumps.

Almost all H3 maps had soecific jumps to get to special areas faster. In the Pit you could get to camo faster off spawn jumping the gap, you could also jump from bottom flag room to the top outside. And there was even another jump spot near the ramp to sword room that gave you height advantage.

There were jumps in Guardian, Epitaph , Construct… So many intricate map design for special areas you can get with some in most cases relativity easy jumps.

But in 4? Barely none that are really note-worthy, and for the ones that do exist they aren’t balances, potentially accidental like the jump in Solace to get to snipe spawn from the bottom outside on one side but not the other.

There are a couple in Abandoned, Adrift and… That’s about it. The ones in Ragnarok are potentially map exploits IMO for atleast a few of them which I found.

I’m not a fan of making surfaces slippery either. There are a few spots on Haven that I feel you should be able to jump on near Railgun spawn/sniper depending on what pro gametype you are playing.

I have thought the same thing at times. The map should provide all the geometry and it should look believable. I know 343i tried to make it believable, but I think that there comes a point where too much is too believable to be believable.

I sort of felt Reflection was like that in Reach, too many walls that seemed to go no where. But it seemed to be the only Reach map with this issue.

Perhaps Countdown as well…

I sort of think it may be their DMR issues that lead them to think that they needed clutter in Halo 4.

How I miss Sandtrap…

An old Army saying K.I.S.S. (Keep It Simple Stupid) Simple means less things that can go wrong.

> An old Army saying K.I.S.S. (Keep It Simple Stupid) Simple means less things that can go wrong.

That is a very good motto!

> I have thought the same thing at times. The map should provide all the geometry and it should look believable. I know 343i tried to make it believable, but I think that there comes a point where too much is too believable to be believable.
>
> I sort of felt Reflection was like that in Reach, too many walls that seemed to go no where. But it seemed to be the only Reach map with this issue.
>
> Perhaps Countdown as well…
>
> I sort of think it may be their DMR issues that lead them to think that they needed clutter in Halo 4.
>
> How I miss Sandtrap…

I never really felt like any of the Reach’s maps were good. The best Reach map was worse than the worst Halo 3 maps IMO…

In reach they basically made all the maps to support the Jetpack. In 4 they’re less focused on AA’s but seem a little off occasionally.

And I do miss sand trap, avalanche and standoff!