Forget fire rates and kill times, the biggest problem with the DMR right now is its Aim assist range. The range of the DMR is stupendous, to such an extent that not only does imbalance loadouts it in my opinion ruins the gameplay of DMR vs DMR games (which is 90% of the games I seem to play in matchmaking). It turns one of my favourite BTB maps Valhalla into the Standoff camp fest we know today as Ragnarok, it stifles map movement, it encourages camping, it allow for easy long distance cheap kill against opponents that have no chance of fighting back.
3x zoom is partly to blame for this but I think the biggest culprit is the DMRs red reticule range/ aim assist range. This is the distance of which the reticule is red when aiming at an enemy player and aim assist such as bullet magnetism and sticky aim have effect. The BR, Carbine and Magnum have 2x zooms and have about 60m ranges, the light Rifle has a 3x zoom and like you would expect is has a 90m range, the DMR also has a 3x zoom, so it has a 90m range right? Oh no, not the DMR, it has near to a 120m range, the range you would expect of a 4x zoom weapon.
If Halo 4 is to have a TU and weapon balancing is to be addressed. For me DMR range is priority one. The problem with the DMR is not that it is the DMR but that 343 took the no bloom DMR from Reach and buffed its ROF and range.
^ the chart at the top represents the current range specs, below that are examples of how it could be fixed. One option could be to simply just to nerf the DMR such that it is only as good as the Light Rifle and all weapons have to zoom in at the same ranges and leave it at that. Or it could be further tweaked and used as a balancing mechanic. I suggest not only nerfing the DMRs range but also buffing the BRs and Carbines ranges, maybe buffing the Carbine more such to give it an advantage over the BR. I also suggest significantly increasing the BRs accuracy, I know there has been a lot of talk about the random inconsistency of the BR in the competitive community caused by bullet spread that became particularly apparent when testing 4 shot BR settings. If Primary weapon balance is to be tweaked any changes I think should be discrete, Accuracy, range and maybe bullet magnetism and sticky aim I think are the best bets.
> 343’s idea of long range of sights and little to no cover did this, not the DMR.
>
> Just buff the other primary weapons.
Well maybe 343 should change their map design philosophy in Halo 5 and never use a remake ever again to accommodate the broken DMR. But what can be done now that could positively change gameplay?
Hitting every shot and killing an enemy player completely fair and square is a…cheap kill? How DARE I be on target and not miss on purpose to give you a “fair chance”!
Just forget it op, while your topic was well presented and astonishing if true, 343’s fanboys are 100% content with this game and will run down any topic that has a controversial issue in the title…
The range of the scope has nothing to with the range of the projectiles. CE’s Magnum didn’t crossmap shoot on Blood Gulch because the bullets disappeared after 250m (I believe it is).
As Halo is known to be a sight-line heavy shooter by many, I am unsure of what the problem is if some maps are built like BG/SW, even like Valhalla, with a spawning weapon that will accurately body-shoot across a large map IF the sight-lines allow it. There are many maps in H4 that allow movement to avoid the DMR battles at long range, it’s doubly unsure of why it’s spoken as if it’s on all maps and every gametype.
As I touched on, “If the sight-lines allow it.” is a main reason the much quicker killing M6D of CE, the 3-shot at 600ms up to 250m where only 2 maps allowed greater ranges weapon was still relatively balanced against such longer killer times with much longer reticle tracking needs like the Needler, PR or AR, of which the Needler and PR were rarely used as starting weapons in CE…
Now for me truly; As we can all spawn with a DMR pretty darn quickly in H4, the DMR is available to all and Halo has always been devolved into a 1 weapon game, I see no problem with a balanced utilitarian weapon that is used the most.
The Carbine, BR and LR all form niches of their own, the DMR covers them all. A DMR must perform perfectly to outshine the other weapons in those weapons niche’s. The DMR much more easily counters those other precisions when used against said other weapons outside of their nice but at no point guarantees a win as mistakes will be capitalised by those that truly know how to use the other 3 “rifles”.
I’m talking more about effective range rather than maximum bullet range.
Previous Halo games were one gun games by design. The BR/ Pistol were either the only primary starting weapon or power weapon pickups. Halo has never needed to be balanced, up until now, loadouts and personal ordinance have changed all that.
I personally think Halo 4 would benefit from weapon balance, it would create more diverse gameplay and I think would be more fun. The top gun of Halo 4 promotes slow paced gameplay and like I said stifles map movement. I only suggest these changes because I think it would make things more fun and competitively balanced.
> Now for me truly; As we can all spawn with a DMR pretty darn quickly in H4, the DMR is available to all and Halo has always been devolved into a <mark>1 weapon game</mark>, I see no problem with a balanced utilitarian weapon that is used the most.
> The Carbine, BR and LR all form niches of their own, the DMR covers them all. A DMR must perform perfectly to outshine the other weapons in those weapons niche’s. The DMR much more easily counters those other precisions when used against said other weapons outside of their nice but at no point guarantees a win as mistakes will be capitalised by those that truly know how to use the other 3 “rifles”.
The game was not made to be a one weapon game though. Otherwise the AR would still be dreadful, but it is half decent now. I still wouldn’t use it a primary weapon mind you.
Also, the DMR was superseded by the BR. In terms of canon, the DMR being better than the BR is stupid.
The DMR shouldn’t even be in this game.
> Hitting every shot and killing an enemy player completely fair and square is a…cheap kill? How DARE I be on target and not miss on purpose to give you a “fair chance”!
>
> This is why DMR whiners can’t be taken seriously.
The DMR is king long ranged primary weapon. However, in short range maps, you’ll find advantages for the BR or Light Rifle. If you are the Spartan that runs in the open, and gets mad when you get 5 capped by a DMR from a respectable distance away, I think you need to reevaluate your play style. I’m not making excuses, if a person manages to hit all 5 shots (and no, it doesn’t always happen, even for the best) at any range, generally they get the kill, but if there is a talented player on the receiving end of those shots, there are ways to avoid it.
I agree that the DMR may be a touch over-powered but the OP is a bit extreme- this is coming from a player who is, and always will be, horrible with the DMR and vastly prefers the BR.
Experiment with your Load Outs. Have small map and large map load outs. Use a plasma pistol as a secondary on a vehicle map, these types of things will give you the advantage, rather than complaining about a disadvantage when you are only using the same load out over and over and over again.
> > Now for me truly; As we can all spawn with a DMR pretty darn quickly in H4, the DMR is available to all and Halo has always been devolved into a <mark>1 weapon game</mark>, I see no problem with a balanced utilitarian weapon that is used the most.
> > The Carbine, BR and LR all form niches of their own, the DMR covers them all. A DMR must perform perfectly to outshine the other weapons in those weapons niche’s. The DMR much more easily counters those other precisions when used against said other weapons outside of their nice but at no point guarantees a win as mistakes will be capitalised by those that truly know how to use the other 3 “rifles”.
>
> The game was not made to be a one weapon game though. Otherwise the AR would still be dreadful, but it is half decent now. I still wouldn’t use it a primary weapon mind you.
> Also, the DMR was superseded by the BR. In terms of canon, the DMR being better than the BR is stupid.
> The DMR shouldn’t even be in this game.
The DMR doesn’t rule the sandbox as all precisions WILL be beat in very short range by the fullautos by equally/relatively compared skilled opponents if the other has a precision “rifle”.
The DMR does not rule the player’s use as the BR is nearly used just as much in the general populous and as with ALL competitive able shooters, 1 weapon is preferred, if not used exclusively at the highest levels of play.
At no point is H4 a 1 weapon game like CE through H3 was and the DMR and BR in H4 share the same balance the NR and DMR had in Reach. There is balance (not perfect as one cannot have in asymmetry) and there is choice…
Oh and let’s not forget that the Boltshot is “OP’d” and if that is the case and it’s used very often in short-ranged and CQB, the DMR definitely doesn’t have a 1-weapon game going on.
> > Hitting every shot and killing an enemy player completely fair and square is a…cheap kill? How DARE I be on target and not miss on purpose to give you a “fair chance”!
> >
> > This is why DMR whiners can’t be taken seriously.
>
> Everyone hits every shot.
Do you have a Youtube video showing that range doesn’t matter, red-reticle doesn’t matter and pacing doesn’t matter due to bloom?
This post has been edited by a moderator. Please do not flame or attack other members.
*Original post. Click at your own discretion.
You really suck at this game if all you use is the DMR. I finished the commendation for it and immediately took it out of my loadouts. All I use now is the carbine, BR, and for big maps, the light rifle. All of you defending the DMR suck, and you know it.
> > Now for me truly; As we can all spawn with a DMR pretty darn quickly in H4, the DMR is available to all and Halo has always been devolved into a <mark>1 weapon game</mark>, I see no problem with a balanced utilitarian weapon that is used the most.
> > The Carbine, BR and LR all form niches of their own, the DMR covers them all. A DMR must perform perfectly to outshine the other weapons in those weapons niche’s. The DMR much more easily counters those other precisions when used against said other weapons outside of their nice but at no point guarantees a win as mistakes will be capitalised by those that truly know how to use the other 3 “rifles”.
>
> The game was not made to be a one weapon game though. Otherwise the AR would still be dreadful, but it is half decent now. I still wouldn’t use it a primary weapon mind you.
> Also, the DMR was superseded by the BR. In terms of canon, the DMR being better than the BR is stupid.
> The DMR shouldn’t even be in this game.
Noo, even in Canon… the DMR was superior. So superior that the Army decided to keep it around in their arsenal. It is the Navy that chose to mainly field the BR. Yes?
> Hitting every shot and killing an enemy player completely fair and square is a…cheap kill? How DARE I be on target and not miss on purpose to give you a “fair chance”!
>
> This is why DMR whiners can’t be taken seriously.
If you think the DMR isn’t broken, you will after this
> Noo, even in Canon… the DMR was superior. So superior that the Army decided to keep it around in their arsenal. It is the Navy that chose to mainly field the BR. Yes?
What? Are you being sarcastic?
If not, the DMR was superseded by the BR. Why would the UNSC take anything less than the best?
> > Noo, even in Canon… the DMR was superior. So superior that the Army decided to keep it around in their arsenal. It is the Navy that chose to mainly field the BR. Yes?
>
> What? Are you being sarcastic?
> If not, the DMR was superseded by the BR. Why would the UNSC take anything less than the best?
> > Noo, even in Canon… the DMR was superior. So superior that the Army decided to keep it around in their arsenal. It is the Navy that chose to mainly field the BR. Yes?
>
> What? Are you being sarcastic?
> If not, the DMR was superseded by the BR. Why would the UNSC take anything less than the best?
How often does an Navy situation require a long range weapon? When threatened by covie boarding parties and dealing with combat situations that are inside the ship, BR would be the more effective weapon at reducing covie shields with its burst fire. Army chose to keep the DMR because they were more involed in ground engagments. So technically you are right. They went with the best weapons for their job descriptions. Navy with BR, Army with DMR. (UNSC covers Navy and Army but each branch has different roles, it would make sense that they would have different tools for different roles)
