The AR needs a nerf

Halo is not balanced around effective range; effective range is balanced around Halo.
Halo is picking the right tool for the right job and playing strategically with it.
Halo does not reward precision alone. The assault rifle does not need to be hard to use.

Halo weapons primarily come in several varieties: Long range skill rewarding weapons, medium range shield strippers, short range instant killers.

Approaching a short range instant killer is a bad idea no matter what you have. In return for the power it has, you give your enemy more time to kill you as you approach them.

Approaching a medium range shield -Yoink!- is dangerous because it can drop your shields. You usually have enough time to take cover after having made this mistake. It’s not a guarantee.

Directly approaching a skilled shooter who has a skill reward weapon gets you killed. Approaching indirectly should put you in a position where they are at a disadvantage.

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For reference, I can’t complete rumble pit matches because they’re so annoying due to the absolutely toxic AR starts insistence

update: Just left the 3rd game in a row because this is unplayably bad

Ideally, yes. Like I’ve said before, the BR is too easy. Vertical recoil makes 4 shots on body common because the recoil reaches the head, you don’t need to adjust your aim for headshots. The AR on shooting alone shouldn’t beat a gun that is harder to use. You beat an AR user by combining melee and grenades. AR ttk with a melee is much faster than a beatdown with the BR. That’s because the AR incentivizes peppering a target while getting closer to clean up with a melee. That’s how it’s always worked.

Halo has never been about what gun is best at what range. If that were the case, the sniper wouldn’t be accurate from the hip. Its about guns creating playstyles. What’s the playstyle with the AR? Currently, its shoot; if they’re too far away, fan the trigger. There’s no incentive to get close with it because it’s entirely capable outside of close range in infinite. Forcing weapons into range roles where they become drastically less effective outside of that niche results in players sticking to positions that favor the gun. Before Infinite, this was basically limited to the shotgun alone, which really only ever happened after Halo 2 introduced the Sword.

TTK ignored, should a gun that is already easier to use up close win against a gun that is harder to use? What does that mean for the sandbox as a whole? Why are a large majority of kills in social modes only the AR? It outperforms the Mangler, because missing a single shot with the mangler will lose the fight vs missing a few shots on the AR. It outperforms the Bulldog for the exact same reasons. If you play to the range and strengths of the AR you can win against BRs consistently.

Favyn tested this in a livestream, the only time he lost against anyone was against an extremely skilled player. He allowed players to use whatever gun they wanted outside of power weapons. By simply keeping people at a specific range and not giving them a chance to get outside of the AR’s range, he won. By his own words, he’s not very good. It’s entirely on the balance of the AR alone. Generous TTK paired with bloom giving the AR accurate shots outside of a more normative range allows the gun to beat every wall pickup in the game. Is that a good balance?

I don’t think so.

I think if you pick up the Mangler, you should have a decent fight against the AR, however because of the projectile velocity and drop of the mangler, its not nearly as consistent as the AR. Missing hurts on every gun outside of the AR. It will lose the fight. There’s no pressure to learn the weapons and gain mechanical skill with them, because the AR is simply better based on consistency alone.

The entire sandbox of infinite needs a rehaul, this issue isn’t limited to the AR alone. However, the AR highlights how preferencing effective range over ease of use can make a sandbox that ultimately doesn’t work well. There’s a reason several wall weapons are ignored, especially in social modes where you spawn with the AR.

That’s intended behavior. Plus, the vertical recoil isn’t that hard to control. If they wanted it hard, they’d make it hard. Like the commando. Nevertheless, I always aim for the head when using the BR. Probably should be aiming for the body to make it easier to hit perfs, but aiming for the head is a habit of mine.

Umm, you are incentivised to get closer. You want your shots to be effective, right? Well, shooting at medium range may not be the best move all the time. You’re already missing shots at close range due to its inaccurate nature. You risk even more shots if you try shooting at longer ranges, increasing the TTK even futher.

It does not outgun the bulldog.

Of course. This sounded like Favyn talking. That guy seems a bit ambitious in his ideas.

Not as consistent??? Have you used the mangler? I can get consistent perfects with ease against AR users.

Well, that’s what happens when you learn how to use a weapon. You consistently win with it.

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I don’t see how you don’t understand that the AR is far too good for how easy it is to use, there is no point in picking up many other weapons because it is not worth the risk in picking up a more difficult weapon if the AR does the same or more damage with less skill. Just cut back its range or give it damage falloff at range and let it win close range engagements, hell even just make it require more shots on unshielded players to promote more people going for the precision weapon headshot. You act as if the AR is perfectly balanced when it’s far from it.

It is perfectly balanced.

Do you realize I still play Halo Infinite? It’s fine. You just got to get used to it being the ranger this go around instead of the magnum.

It is not overpowered. Like do y’all still play Halo? Someone in this thread said the AR is more consistent than the Mangler which I have a HUGE problem with.

For one, that’s highly debatable as the Mangler has TONS of aim assist and 3 taps usually aren’t an issue.

The sword situation is so bad that the PRO TEAMS have a gentleman’s agreement not to use it. That should say volumes about how utterly broken it is.

I’m sure some bozo will come in here and say, “But if the bulldog could one shot kill, we wouldn’t have this problem! Or the classic shotty!”

Not realizing the problem of course, with having two one shot kill weapons that work at beyond melee, close range. lol.

wtf yes BR players move around constantly are you even watching the HCS stream???

Oh, you know my thoughts on the AR. I think it needs a retuning.

1: Increase damage per shot.
2: Remove headshot bonus entirely.
3: Reduce rate of fire.
4: Reduce magazine size.
5: Decrease base accuracy.
6: Reduce maximum spread.

We’re gonna to disagree on that topic.

I think it’s perfect as is. Maybe we could have the classic AR enter sometime after the magnum enters the fray.

Can’t have two great range options starting out otherwise the BR might get outshined.

My proposed change doesn’t really make it worse though, just makes it less of an RNG cannon.

But, I’d rather both exist. Mine as a starting weapon, yours as a pickup. What do you think of that?

I think the AR you are talking about wanting would be a great new Spiker. Slow projectiles, more damage, and a slower rate of fire. Make it bigger thant the H3 spiker too. I think that could be fun.

I do think the current AR we have feels just about perfect though.

The spiker is garbage. It can be better than the Halo 3 version. But not what I want for this.

There isn’t a single player I’ve played against that gets perfects on the regular and I’ve played numerous players in the top 1000 in ranked, so you’re completely full of ****. The AR has zero downside as it is insanely powerful, has a stupid amount of range, and takes zero skill to use. Something has to be nerfed on it or average players will never take the risk of using a more skillful weapon.

In halo 3 ar have enough ammo to get two kills if you never miss a round.

I feel ar slightly op but I think all weapons outside power weapons all have slower TTK about .5

Plus’s AR should only have enough ammo two kills if u can land every shot.

This is the same alarmist argument you’ve been using the entire time. People pick up other weapons all the time.

I’ve told you plenty of times before about the downsides of using an AR. For instance, it can’t outrange a BR. This means that skilled players who play to the BR’s strengths should have no issue winning against an AR user.

The problem isn’t the AR. It’s you.

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like maybe make the starting weapon an smg and make an AR a pickup weapon?

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They’d need to bring back the magnum though. It’s always been a close range paired with medium range sort of deal.

Oh, Gods, no. That would be even worse.

An even shorter range weapon?

so you want something with the range of the AR but without the ability to kill someone?

Like much of the sandbox the AR needs less of a nerf and more of an adjusting. High spread bullet hoses should not get headshot multipliers, period. If the AR needs some sort of DPS adjustment to compensate for that then fine.

Headshots on high spread auto weapons are bad for the exact same reason bloom is bad on precision weapons. It simply increases the impact of random chance over skill. A bullet hose has a place in the sandbox, it just has no business doing headshots.

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What hahahaha are you joking?

1: Increase damage per shot.
2: Remove headshot bonus entirely.
3: Reduce rate of fire.
4: Reduce magazine size.
5: Decrease base accuracy.
6: Reduce maximum spread.

I am LITERALLY asking for a higher base damage AR that’s more consistent! Get real!

The entire point! Is to have a MORE CONSISTENT AR. Reducing the magazine size and RoF does NOT mean reducing the damage output. Throwing it back to 32 rounds means it has to do more to compensate. But keeping the RoF and increasing the damage will just raise the TTK too far, and we do not need that.

My method provides a slightly lower TTK than the base body shot kill TTK we have now, but doesn’t go as high as a perfect TTK AR with headshot bonus. This is good, because it allows the current AR to be a separate weapon that occupies a Tier 2 slot.

reducing the BASE accuracy means you aren’t gonna’ cross map with it. But reducing the maximum spread means you will be more consistent at longer ranges when at max RoF anyway. MEANING you get a really consistent gun that absolutely rewards time on target.

See, this one?

This one gets it.

BINGO.