Survival mode, back to the drawing board.

I think everyone agrees that ODST had the best Firefight of ODST and Reach. It had limited Ammo, health and grenades and the enemies were actually coming for you. As well as actually increasing in difficulty.

What ODST lacked was Wave customization, to change what came and when.

Reach on the other hand had that, well, it had way too much customization. Things like Spartan and Elite traits. It should only have been wave settings and loadouts. Weapon boxes should only have had a limited amount of ammo in them, regen shield should have been taken out as well. Or they could have made the AA’s as drops and everyone started with sprint, an assault rifle and a magnum.

I understand Bungie’s decision to make firefight MM limited to a few sets because not everyone got time for a full fledged 2 hour game. They could have had a playlist for it though.

So what did ruin Firefight? I would have to say Arcade for the overall experience, and unlimited ammo for the survival.

Survival isn’t jetpacking over everything with a fuel rod knowing that your ammo and lives would never run out. Firefight Limited was all good and fun but it sadly got overrun by Arcade.

Looking at Halo 4 I can’t say that Spartan Ops has taken Firefight’s place since the missions are short and you yet again have unlimited lives.

Yes yes I know that the avarage working man doesn’t have time to restart a mission he was just about to finish when a suicide grunt came around the corner. I also know that the kids who shouldn’t be playing Halo 4 according to the rating doesn’t feel good about themselves when they can’t finish that mission for the tenth time when they die in the various ways they do. So therefore we get unlimited lives so the business man can get his points and get to do other things while the little children get to feel good about themselves knowing they completed a Spartan Ops mission all by themselves, completely ignoring the fact that they died 500 times and only grinded the enemy out one by one. Extreme case I know.

I’m having my speculations about Halo 5 being a release title for the next gen xbox, I’m also sure i343 is working on it this very moment as well. I think that when the console is announced we’ll see a short announcment of Halo 5 as well, but that’s just me.

Back to the topic, survival.

With my speculation about the next gen thing I’d like Halo’s survival to be expanded on, large scale expansion.

> They should be huge, think Forge world or even New Mombasa big. In that case we would only need a few because of the variety we could have in the maps themselves. We could have proper vehicles combat in them, long range firefights, close quarter shootouts.

> Basicly every survival mode uses waves. I say skip this and keep them coming. Put a timer in and a kill counter. There should be pressure on at most times. Breathers are allowed but there should still be some action going on. Players should work together or die alone. Let one person get a new weapon while the others let him catch his breath. For this occasion lesser amounts of enemies should be present.

> It wouldn’t spawn enemies far away from the players to prevent usage of resources but it could calculate where someone is going and then spawn enemies there for them to encounter. If nothing happens the enemies could despawn. Furthermore the smart spawn would also see where the players are at and what they are doing. Incase someone starts sniping, Wraiths could start appearing to bombard the sniper, or other snipers could spawn to lay down sniper fire on the player sniper. If someone is in close quarters, the game starts spawning enemies equipped for close quarters, and so on. The system will try to always outsmart the players

> I can really see ordnances working in this mode, as well as pile up. This could be used to send for weapons, possible marine assistance and vehicles. An example would be that a Scorpion tank would cost five ordnance points, and you only get to use them at specific places on the map, such as open spots for Pelicans or garages large enough to house a Scorpion. Weapon drops could be anywhere on the outside, it would work just like now, and Marine reinforcement only at specific times, or at specific houses or something. Different sorts of AI turrets could also be placed I guess. Air strikes too perhaps or something similair.

> To some extent I could also go as far as to have the maps somewhat forgeable. Before anyone starts shouting that it would be too difficult, hear me out. There are Dynamic Bots that learn the map as they play, I’d hope that something along those lines would work in this environment. How much forge? Not that much, perhaps a little more than the regular multiplayer map but not to the same extent as the designated forge maps.

> It would be nice if the player count could be upgraded to atleast 8 players.

> Now and then the game could spawn an objective, perhaps have a ship crash and the players get the objective to retrieve something from it, or perhaps the enemy is setting up a base camp and the objective is to destroy it otherwise they get stronger, guard an area to help marines repair something, taking out VIP targets, escorting VIPs, you get the what I’m going at. Tasks that help the player if they complete it, and strengthen the enemy if they fail or doesn’t bother doing them.

> I really hope that new Forerunner enemies show up, three different types was kind of a let down. Anyhow, Forerunners and the Coventant, a bonus would be the flood. That would make for awesome gameplay, and for epic threeway and even fourway battles.

> One thing I think this mode could really use instead of lives is a system where the player goes down into a last stand. Friendly players could revive their ally. If the player dies in last stand he won’t respawn. To get back into the game he/she needs to be bought back through ordnance points at the same places the marines can be bought. The penalty of dying is losing all ordnance points and equipment the player had.

> The settings would be simple. First off you would have all the different factions, human, forerunner, covenant and the flood. Here you can ally any faction with the other as well as enable or disable them to use in the game. So you could have a Human Covenant alliance against the Flood or a massive free for all between Humans, Covenant, Forerunners and the Flood, or perhaps a Human Covenant Forerunner alliance against the flood, mind you that the enemy faction will always have the upper hand.
>
> Second setting would of course be difficulty (difficulty wouldn’t change how much damage an enemy can take and how much it deals, but how smart they are)
>
> Third setting would be difficulty setting on the spawn system itself, how brutal it would be towards you.
>
> Fourth would then be what map to play.
>
> Fifth could be skulls, if needed.
>
> Then I don’t think more settings are needed.

> No, no winning, the game is over when everyone is dead. No one wins except the enemy. The Spawn system will try to outsmart you, the enemies it spawns will also try to outsmart you. Make a mistake and the system will use it to its advantage like focused fire or splitting the group up.

Let’s come up with more ideas on how to improve survival for Halo and make it unique and groundbreaking. I’ll reserve a post or two so I can edit and put in more ideas.

Keep in mind that I’m thinking of Halo 5 for a next gen console here.

-reserved-

-reserved-

Unfortunately 343 will completely ignore this thread along with every other thread on this forum made to assist 343. They have made it perfectly clear that they don’t care for our opinion or our ideas.

> Unfortunately 343 will completely ignore this thread along with every other thread on this forum made to assist 343. They have made it perfectly clear that they don’t care for our opinion or our ideas.

Well I don’t see the problem in trying. It’s not like a complaint thread or something.

If not for Halo 5 then perhaps for Halo 6, and if they do not use it I could snatch it later on for use of my own, if I get that far.

We could atleast try to catch their attention, if we never tried we would never know.

So please, try to keep this thread alive over the re-post threads that are surfacing all the time. Post constructive critisism, your own ideas and improvements, or just thank the thread and then type what you liked and aproved of. You get a lot further with positive thining and proper layouts for ideas and critisism than negativity and cursing the company, which I think is the reason 343 doesn’t respond here, the immaturity and lack of common sense, ignore such threads, just let them die and post in proper threads instead.

Perhaps maps large enough could feature a gamemode where it’s FFA with 16 players, everyone gets one life, everyone spawns in the middle with nothing but a magnum with no ammo. There’s weapons and ammo in the middle of spawn that you can risk your life getting but there’s also weapons around the map aswell.

The objective is to kill all the other non-AI players and be the last remaining while not being killed by other players or AI on the map. There could be a day and night cycle, after the second day the enemies start to spawn. The AI enemies consist of flood combat forms with no firearms they also grow in numbers over time and the map becomes more and more flood infested.

> Perhaps maps large enough could feature a gamemode where it’s FFA with 16 players, everyone gets one life, everyone spawns in the middle with nothing but a magnum with no ammo. There’s weapons and ammo in the middle of spawn that you can risk your life getting but there’s also weapons around the map aswell.
>
> The objective is to kill all the other non-AI players and be the last remaining while not being killed by other players or AI on the map. There could be a day and night cycle, after the second day the enemies start to spawn. The AI enemies consist of flood combat forms with no firearms they also grow in numbers over time and the map becomes more and more flood infested.

I wanted this soo badly for Halo 2 as well, although teams, and then flood pouring in on the map.

Interesting idea nontheless.

FF Arcade was a terrible idea. As if unlimited lives wasn’t bad enough, infinite ammo was what killed this game type. The only thing that FF Limited suffered were the -Yoinks!- who exhausted all the lives, and having unlimited ammo containers.

The best FF experience would be to merge the Halo 4 story and missions, with ODST limited lives and limited ammo.

> The best FF experience would be to merge the Halo 4 story and missions, with ODST limited lives and limited ammo.

Sooo, kind of like I described it? Or did you have something else in mind?

Then again you’d have one life in my version and your buddies would have to buy you back.

I agree with what you are saying, but I felt that Reach had the best Firefight because of its customization. If you just wanted Limited Firefight vs a horde of Jetpacking Elites, you could do that. If you felt like killing Hunter, CE style, you could do that. If you just wanted to mow down an army of suicide grunts with a Mongoose, you could do that.

I understand that Firefight Matchmaking could have been better, but Reach’s Firefight was the better iteration.

The limited ammo was a crutch for ODST. I generally found my self out of ammo even though i was doing perfectly fine until so.

> The limited ammo was a crutch for ODST. I generally found my self out of ammo even though i was doing perfectly fine until so.

No, limited ammo was fun, I love the frantic gameplay that comes when you have a couple of Mauler rounds and a plasma pistol.

> I agree with what you are saying, but I felt that Reach had the best Firefight because of its customization. If you just wanted Limited Firefight vs a horde of Jetpacking Elites, you could do that. If you felt like killing Hunter, CE style, you could do that. If you just wanted to mow down an army of suicide grunts with a Mongoose, you could do that.
>
> I understand that Firefight Matchmaking could have been better, but Reach’s Firefight was the better iteration.

Well perhaps customization is good, but in Reach’s case it felt “over the top”, especially when that customization allowed game modes just like the Arcade mode. What happened? Firefight survival became, just not survival.

How is it survival if I have unlimited lives? Or unlimited Ammo?

> The limited ammo was a crutch for ODST. I generally found my self out of ammo even though i was doing perfectly fine until so.

Is there anything wrong with that? Surviving isn’t supposed to be easy, it’s not a shooting range, it’s a “firefight”, you fight for your life. I enjoyed ODST firefight a lot more because I knew I had to use my ammo in a special way, use other weapons when my ammo ran out, get the said weapons without dying.

Do you get unlimited ammo in CoD Zombie? Or unlimited lives? Atleast not in the first version I played, and I don’t imagine they’ve changed that.

GoW didn’t have unlimited lives and ammo either from what I recall.

Survival is, at it’s core, impossible, you either make a mistake and die, or you run out of resources and can therefore not survive anymore because of it.

Firefight started out as survival, but ended up as an Action Sack gamemode where you only grinded points and xp.

I loved everything that I have read on this thread so far, Spartan Ops sadly did not live up to all it’s hype when It got announced as the Mode didn’t have any difficulty and good map designs on it.

Though I do not agree with you on some things. To me Reach firefight customization still felt limited as I cannot place the Trait I specifically wanted to a certain Loadout. But I would gladly replace all the customization for better Ai and feel of intensity.

8 players is simply too much/too many IMO. Xone is a next gen console yes, but I do not see how the console can handle 8 spartans and 80+ smart ai’s on screen all at once without the game’s connection and screen tearing constantly getting worse. Too many players would also decrease the strategies and feeling of cooperation as the number of players would make the game much more easier.

Wow, you put a TON of work into this, it was a good read. I agree with most of your ideas, although I don’t really like the idea of reviving, since that would kind of put a de-emphasis on protecting your and your partners’ lives.

This probably belongs in Halo Xbox One, btw.