Im getting kinda sick of all the nerfed weapons. It seems like 343s solution to all weapon issues is nerfing. There are people that really like these weapons and don’t want to see them made worse. I stopped playing battlefield 3 because they nerfed my favorite attachment. They nerfed the br to 5sk then they nerfed the carbine over buffing the br now the dmr will dominate(will probably get nerfed) they nerfed the plasma pistol instead of just not letting people spawn with it. They nerfed the sword lunge instead of simply not letting you sprint with it or as fast. Nerfing is not a good way to solve things it mostly just angers people and if people are to dedicated to a weapon they could quit the game when it gets nerfed. I hope 343 thinks of other ways to solve issues other than nerfing.
well if you dont like how they fix the weapon system how do you propose they fix it?
> Im getting kinda sick of all the nerfed weapons. It seems like 343s solution to all weapon issues is nerfing. There are people that really like these weapons and don’t want to see them made worse. I stopped playing battlefield 3 because they nerfed my favorite attachment. They nerfed the br to 5sk then they nerfed the carbine over buffing the br now the dmr will dominate(will probably get nerfed) they nerfed the plasma pistol instead of just not letting people spawn with it. They nerfed the sword lunge instead of simply not letting you sprint with it or as fast. Nerfing is not a good way to solve things it mostly just angers people and if people are to dedicated to a weapon they could quit the game when it gets nerfed. I hope 343 thinks of other ways to solve issues other than nerfing.
-The Carbine nerf was very small and the details haven’t even been shown yet.
-The plasma pistol’s targeting was nerfed so people can’t noob combo as easily since they spawn with it now.
-Isn’t running faster with the sword and having a shorter lunge more or less the same as running slower with the sword but having a larger lunge?
They only nerf things when they’re trying to balance the sandbox. Not piss people like you off.
> well if you dont like how they fix the weapon system how do you propose they fix it?
Buff the weak weapons. The OP said that quite clearly.
Halo 4s weapon system looks fine. they have to advance weapon damage or it will never be fixed and then you will be upset with the state of your game. as you stated OP you said they should consider the people who want it to stay the same. well the have to please the majority of the community and frankly that side is not the majority.
> Halo 4s weapon system looks fine. they have to advance weapon damage or it will never be fixed and then you will be upset with the state of your game. as you stated OP you said they should consider the people who want it to stay the same. well the have to please the majority of the community and frankly that side is not the majority.
Actually, it seems most people are fine with how the DMR and Carbine were. The only weapon people were upset with was the BR.
> > Im getting kinda sick of all the nerfed weapons. It seems like 343s solution to all weapon issues is nerfing. There are people that really like these weapons and don’t want to see them made worse. I stopped playing battlefield 3 because they nerfed my favorite attachment. They nerfed the br to 5sk then they nerfed the carbine over buffing the br now the dmr will dominate(will probably get nerfed) they nerfed the plasma pistol instead of just not letting people spawn with it. They nerfed the sword lunge instead of simply not letting you sprint with it or as fast. Nerfing is not a good way to solve things it mostly just angers people and if people are to dedicated to a weapon they could quit the game when it gets nerfed. I hope 343 thinks of other ways to solve issues other than nerfing.
>
> -The Carbine nerf was very small and the details haven’t even been shown yet.
>
> -The plasma pistol’s targeting was nerfed so people can’t noob combo as easily since they spawn with it now.
>
> -Isn’t running faster with the sword and having a shorter lunge more or less the same as running slower with the sword but having a larger lunge?
>
> They only nerf things when they’re trying to balance the sandbox. Not piss people like you off.
Although I disagree with both of you, I think that OP is right about one thing. In my opinion, I think that 343i should buff other weapons to make balance rather than nerf everything (exaggerated), even if it is something minor or small that it almost doesn’t affect it.
> > Halo 4s weapon system looks fine. they have to advance weapon damage or it will never be fixed and then you will be upset with the state of your game. as you stated OP you said they should consider the people who want it to stay the same. well the have to please the majority of the community and frankly that side is not the majority.
>
> Actually, it seems most people are fine with how the DMR and Carbine were. The only weapon people were upset with was the BR.
I’ve read plenty of posts about the Carbine saying how it destroyed the BR at most ranges.
The only people with the true numbers from their testing (343i’s) decided it was a big enough difference between effectiveness. The Carbine was far too effective and needed a slight nerf to help balance.
I’m tired of seeing all of these wannabe game designers on here… Just buffing weapons or making all the kill times identical is not the answer. There are dozens upon dozens of variables to consider.
No, buffing every gun to try and make it balanced wouldn’t work.
And if you want that short of kill times, play SWAT or Customs with damage buffed across the board.
The game is still 4 months away, and there will be A LOT of changes. Overanalyzing these things now isn’t helping anyone, especially 343i’s. None of us have had any serious time with the game.
No matter what kind of testing they do, there will need to be some changes post-release. It’s just how it’s going to work.
> > > Halo 4s weapon system looks fine. they have to advance weapon damage or it will never be fixed and then you will be upset with the state of your game. as you stated OP you said they should consider the people who want it to stay the same. well the have to please the majority of the community and frankly that side is not the majority.
> >
> > Actually, it seems most people are fine with how the DMR and Carbine were. The only weapon people were upset with was the BR.
>
> I’ve read plenty of posts about the Carbine saying how it destroyed the BR at most ranges.
>
> The only people with the true numbers from their testing (343i’s) decided it was a big enough difference between effectiveness. The Carbine was far too effective and needed a slight nerf to help balance.
>
> <mark>I’m tired of seeing all of these wannabe game designers on here…</mark> Just buffing weapons or making all the kill times identical is not the answer. There are dozens upon dozens of variables to consider.
>
> No, buffing every gun to try and make it balanced wouldn’t work.
>
> And if you want that short of kill times, play SWAT or Customs with damage buffed across the board.
>
> The game is still 4 months away, and there will be A LOT of changes. Overanalyzing these things now isn’t helping anyone, especially 343i’s. None of us have had any serious time with the game.
>
> No matter what kind of testing they do, there will need to be some changes post-release. It’s just how it’s going to work.
See, this is where you loose credibility. It doesn’t take a game designer to understand balance. In fact, I’m sure a 5 year old could provide a decent method of balancing a weapon sandbox. The fact that game designers can code a game doesn’t mean they will make a balanced sandbox. Look at Halo 2.
Now, moving on, you proved my point. The DMR and the Carbine both destroyed the BR, but those two weapons were very well balanced against each other. The DMR won long range battles; the Carbine won short range battles. People only had issues with the power of the BR, not the DMR or Carbine.
The only I want is a 4sk BR, a 5sk is underpowered, the DMR cannot be the most dominant weapon in the game.
> The only I want is a 4sk BR, a 5sk is underpowered, the DMR cannot be the most dominant weapon in the game.
It can be. A single shot weapon in theory should take more skill to wield, as it is hit or miss, no in between. If we want the sandbox to be balanced though, the BR should be a 4sk.
It’d be all fine and dandy if H4 was offline mp only.
Then there wouldn’t be any of this niche range dominating (DMR, Carbine, BR) + sidearms (pistol) + specialized (often anti-vehicle) weapons + your average power weapons (sniper, rocket launcher) bs.
Every weapon would be versatile and/or useful like in CE. It’d be really simple: weapons and power weapons
The CE pistol was indeed op but it wasn’t easy to get the 3sk.
Anyways, 1) H4 is online mp and 2) it’d be a major risk to revert to CE times
Personally, I just want the above (weapons are nerfed) to stay out of the campaign. But I can sympathize with the mp players who want to return to those times of sweet domination.
Make buffs, not nerfs.
So something you must realize is that development nerfing is much different than patch nerfing. In patch nerfing one weapon is reduced specifically. In development all weapons are adjusted accordingly. Meaning one isn’t blatently nerfed like it would seem in a patch.
> <mark>See, this is where you loose credibility. It doesn’t take a game designer to understand balance.</mark> In fact, I’m sure a 5 year old could provide a decent method of balancing a weapon sandbox. The fact that game designers can code a game doesn’t mean they will make a balanced sandbox. Look at Halo 2.
>
> Now, moving on, you proved my point. The DMR and the Carbine both destroyed the BR, but those two weapons were very well balanced against each other. The DMR won long range battles; the Carbine won short range battles. People only had issues with the power of the BR, not the DMR or Carbine.
And this is where you lose credibility.
It doesn’t take a professional game designer, but it sure as hell takes someone who has at least played the game to understand its mechanics.
I get it, people are worried, and they see “nerf” and panic that the game is going to be slow.
But it just doesn’t work like that.
Let these guys do their work with the actual numbers and statistics, not the armchair designers who watch a few videos and start claiming they know how to fix the game.
Once the game actually comes out, I will definitely be supporting the constructive criticisms that actually have a basis (Clear dominance by a certain weapon/loadout, map design being flawed due to bad spawns, etc.) but right now this is pure, unfounded conjecture that has little meaning nor logic behind it.
Since Bungie left, and I’ve been a fan of them for well over a decade (Possibly interning there), I am going to be extra critical of 343i’s and what they come up with. I’ll still be calling out bogus claims like this thread, and 90% of the other ones that pop up, but if there are actual issues I’ll be right there with the community.
Do you even understand the point of nerfing?
> Do you even understand the point of nerfing?
To make a once-balanced Carbine worse.
What 343i and Bungie never understood is that by making every weapon overpowered it brings a natural balance to the game.
BR is in no way underpowered. From all the gameplay I’ve seen people have been doing much better with the BR than all the other weapons. Just because it may have longer kill times than the DMR or Carbine doesn’t mean it’s less powerful because those weapons are harder to use effectively and the BR is much easier so therefore it has a slower kill time to compensate. This why there are different precision weapons. Some can kill quicker than others at the cost of being hard to use or vice versa.
> > > > Halo 4s weapon system looks fine. they have to advance weapon damage or it will never be fixed and then you will be upset with the state of your game. as you stated OP you said they should consider the people who want it to stay the same. well the have to please the majority of the community and frankly that side is not the majority.
> > >
> > > Actually, it seems most people are fine with how the DMR and Carbine were. The only weapon people were upset with was the BR.
> >
> > I’ve read plenty of posts about the Carbine saying how it destroyed the BR at most ranges.
> >
> > The only people with the true numbers from their testing (343i’s) decided it was a big enough difference between effectiveness. The Carbine was far too effective and needed a slight nerf to help balance.
> >
> > <mark>I’m tired of seeing all of these wannabe game designers on here…</mark> Just buffing weapons or making all the kill times identical is not the answer. There are dozens upon dozens of variables to consider.
> >
> > No, buffing every gun to try and make it balanced wouldn’t work.
> >
> > And if you want that short of kill times, play SWAT or Customs with damage buffed across the board.
> >
> > The game is still 4 months away, and there will be A LOT of changes. Overanalyzing these things now isn’t helping anyone, especially 343i’s. None of us have had any serious time with the game.
> >
> > No matter what kind of testing they do, there will need to be some changes post-release. It’s just how it’s going to work.
>
> See, this is where you loose credibility. It doesn’t take a game designer to understand balance. In fact, I’m sure a 5 year old could provide a decent method of balancing a weapon sandbox. The fact that game designers can code a game doesn’t mean they will make a balanced sandbox. Look at Halo 2.
>
> Now, moving on, you proved my point. The DMR and the Carbine both destroyed the BR, but those two weapons were very well balanced against each other. The DMR won long range battles; the Carbine won short range battles. People only had issues with the power of the BR, not the DMR or Carbine.
The difference is that it’s still easier to kill someone with the BR than the DMR. It may not be faster but it is easier.