The squad command functionality in H5 felt kind of lame, almost like it was an interesting idea they had had early on which just ended up getting thrown in as a token near the end of development. There was some teaser content leading up to the release of H5 and I remember being super pumped about the fact that they got the same guy who worked on SW: Republic Commando. That game was legendary and incorporated squad commands (for '05 standards) extremely well. I was expecting Blue Team to function similarly to Delta Squad, so you can imagine my disappointment when that was not the case. I’m not sure I ever used a squad command in H5.
But, much like other good ideas that have failed execution, there is no reason to throw the baby out with the bathwater. I do think, if properly managed, squad commands could make a permanent home in Halo campaigns. Don’t build the campaign from the ground up around it, build it like a typical Halo game. But in sequences when you find yourself fighting alongside your AI marine buddies, or perhaps you link up with Blue Team for a mission, that’s when having the ability to tactically direct NPCs to coordinate with your overall attack plan will be super helpful. Squad Commands should be a background utility system, not a shiny gimmick or a genre-changing gameplay element.
So in this sense I am defining Squad Commands as the ability to communicate with the AI. This is a very useful thing for the player. Now, obviously dialogue options would be a bridge too far for Halo at this point, but the only traditional squad command is swap weapons. I would propose the following system to be implemented perhaps through d-pad - the commands would be issued to all friendlies within a relative vicinity to you. Just very simple and quick commands that can be issued instantly and wouldn’t take away from the FPS gunplay. The idea would be that if you neglected any squad commands, the game would not be altered from the typical Halo experience, the AI would still perform intelligently under their own initiative.
- Hold X Position/Focus Fire on X Enemy: would basically drop a totem on the map wherever you aimed. If targeting an enemy, simply assign VIP status to that enemy. If targeting ground, a visible proximity boarder would appear and the AI would have to maintain a position within that area - Search & Destroy: set Ai to actively aggro enemies in the vicinity, patrol map around you - Form Up/Defensive Stance: the AI will rally to your current position, and take up defensive positions - Cancel: wipes the current squad command. Perhaps the command would expire after 30 seconds in any case.
I prefer the solo hero journey. Mass effect usually saw me order my squad to stay and i just ran off with out them. IMO it could be done very well, but it’s not a feature i’m partial to at all.
AI in Halo is the one thing that has stayed fairly stagnant. You have all of these new and advanced features and graphics and what not, but AI seems to be no better than it was 10 years ago. I could talk about the enemy AI, but for this comment, I’ll be talking about the friendly AI and what they should be for Infinite.
Firstly, Marine AI in specific have been very lackluster. The extent of their usefulness is essentially just either a gunner on your warthog or on the passenger seat with a power weapon. You essentially have to hold their hands for them to be useful. But outside of that, you fully expect them to die and may be surprised if they manage to kill more than 2 grunts before dying. The marines do not make much of an effort to think tactically in any sense of the word. Far too often have I seen Marines get hammered by Covenant weaponry, and they stand there as they were with no attempt to even get in cover, and then they die. This needs to change, and I believe that friendly AI should play a more important role in helping Chief attempt to take back the ring.
Saving a certain amount of marines could form a platoon of sorts, and maybe commanded by a Spartan IV that you save. These platoons could be vital to making it easier to manage the Banished forces. They could scout the area for you and give you points of contention or even weaponry and items they find, coordinate attacks, and you have the ability to either assist them or see how things play out, take over bases, expand their territory, scout and save other marines on their own, have cycles of guard duty for bases they control, scavenge for extra vehicles and weaponry, and so much more. I feel it’s essentially redundant for marines to just act as what they’ve always acted as. This kind of squad system can make the world feel more alive and useful and gives incentive to explore and do side missions and help these marines, and in return, they’ll help you and can hold their own.
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> I prefer the solo hero journey. Mass effect usually saw me order my squad to stay and i just ran off with out them. IMO it could be done very well, but it’s not a feature i’m partial to at all.
Yeah but at the same time Mass Effect built its entire game around the party system similar to KOTOR. This would be a much lighter touch. I wouldn’t even recommend you have a permanent squad with you akin to H5. It would be a return to the classic solo journey, but when you happened to be around friendly AI, it would allow you to successfully coordinate with them.
> 2535426804647384;3:
> AI in Halo is the one thing that has stayed fairly stagnant. You have all of these new and advanced features and graphics and what not, but AI seems to be no better than it was 10 years ago. I could talk about the enemy AI, but for this comment, I’ll be talking about the friendly AI and what they should be for Infinite.
>
> Firstly, Marine AI in specific have been very lackluster. The extent of their usefulness is essentially just either a gunner on your warthog or on the passenger seat with a power weapon. You essentially have to hold their hands for them to be useful. But outside of that, you fully expect them to die and may be surprised if they manage to kill more than 2 grunts before dying. The marines do not make much of an effort to think tactically in any sense of the word. Far too often have I seen Marines get hammered by Covenant weaponry, and they stand there as they were with no attempt to even get in cover, and then they die. This needs to change, and I believe that friendly AI should play a more important role in helping Chief attempt to take back the ring.
>
> Saving a certain amount of marines could form a platoon of sorts, and maybe commanded by a Spartan IV that you save. These platoons could be vital to making it easier to manage the Banished forces. They could scout the area for you and give you points of contention or even weaponry and items they find, coordinate attacks, and you have the ability to either assist them or see how things play out, take over bases, expand their territory, scout and save other marines on their own, have cycles of guard duty for bases they control, scavenge for extra vehicles and weaponry, and so much more. I feel it’s essentially redundant for marines to just act as what they’ve always acted as. This kind of squad system can make the world feel more alive and useful and gives incentive to explore and do side missions and help these marines, and in return, they’ll help you and can hold their own.
Yeah Marines in Halo have become so ubiquitous with campy AI that after all of the improvements to the Covenant OS, I can’t see how it’s not deliberate at this point. And don’t even get me started about manning the 50 cal when the marine is driving. About the only useful thing you can do with them is equip them with a power weapon and then get them to ride shotty. But even then, it’s still just a manifestation of broken AI mechanics because they have aim bot & unlimited ammo.
My thought is that you might finally be able to leverage your marine allies as an actual force multiplier, you know an additional tactical option for the player (should they choose to pay attention to it and manage it). Instead of having marines just get in your way and become blue-on-blue statistics, you could actually lead them as you would expect Chief to lead his men.
Squad commands are a yes. Im so tired of marines doing nothing. And 343 gave us screenshots of a map with a side mission to save some marines ,but if they’re like all the other marines its pointless. But dont make them op. They should be better than unggoy, 50/50 against a kig’yar, and no chance against an elite. But at there current state its no wonder that they lost. And spartans to. H4 spartans where stupid. I killed several with by accidentally running them over with the SCORPION. THE SLOWEST VEHICLE IN THE GAME!!!
> 2535436567438198;6:
> Squad commands are a yes. Im so tired of marines doing nothing. And 343 gave us screenshots of a map with a side mission to save some marines ,but if they’re like all the other marines its pointless. But dont make them op. They should be better than unggoy, 50/50 against a kig’yar, and no chance against an elite. But at there current state its no wonder that they lost. And spartans to. H4 spartans where stupid. I killed several with by accidentally running them over with the SCORPION. THE SLOWEST VEHICLE IN THE GAME!!!
Omg yes, Spartans in H4 were honestly just reskinned marines with shields. So bad. UNSC AI no doubt needs a major makeover, but I think one way to provide a handicap for so-so AI is to give the player some control over the AI, in essence making them an extension of the players own abilities. I agree with your strength comparison though in terms of marines vs. various enemy AI. I agree that a mono e mono marine vs elite would be no contest, but perhaps a platoon of marines working together could make quick work of an elite - Which would play into being able to direct the marines around the map.
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> > 2535436567438198;6:
> > Squad commands are a yes. Im so tired of marines doing nothing. And 343 gave us screenshots of a map with a side mission to save some marines ,but if they’re like all the other marines its pointless. But dont make them op. They should be better than unggoy, 50/50 against a kig’yar, and no chance against an elite. But at there current state its no wonder that they lost. And spartans to. H4 spartans where stupid. I killed several with by accidentally running them over with the SCORPION. THE SLOWEST VEHICLE IN THE GAME!!!
>
> Omg yes, Spartans in H4 were honestly just reskinned marines with shields. So bad. UNSC AI no doubt needs a major makeover, but I think one way to provide a handicap for so-so AI is to give the player some control over the AI, in essence making them an extension of the players own abilities. I agree with your strength comparison though in terms of marines vs. various enemy AI. I agree that a mono e mono marine vs elite would be no contest, but perhaps a platoon of marines working together could make quick work of an elite - Which would play into being able to direct the marines around the map.
I like the idea of squad commands, but not an independent platoon because halo isnt an army command space war sim. Its an fps. But they do need to be able to fight independently. In the july demo imagine being able to send a team of marines to take down one of the aa guns while you get another and then team up for the hardest one. It would just make the world feel even more alive. And i will say this to wether a spartan should be able to command them. No. Even if they get way smarter i still dont want an ai telling my marine what to do. “Go into that banished meat grinder.” “Go assinate that guy and steal all the fun from the player.” But they should be a serious force that the player can command and be able to at least kill one elite.
Although I can’t wait to fight alongside marines again and have them in my warthog I would not
like the return of squad commands. I rarely used those during Halo 5.
> 2535436567438198;8:
> > 2533274838687111;7:
> > > 2535436567438198;6:
> > > Squad commands are a yes. Im so tired of marines doing nothing. And 343 gave us screenshots of a map with a side mission to save some marines ,but if they’re like all the other marines its pointless. But dont make them op. They should be better than unggoy, 50/50 against a kig’yar, and no chance against an elite. But at there current state its no wonder that they lost. And spartans to. H4 spartans where stupid. I killed several with by accidentally running them over with the SCORPION. THE SLOWEST VEHICLE IN THE GAME!!!
> >
> > Omg yes, Spartans in H4 were honestly just reskinned marines with shields. So bad. UNSC AI no doubt needs a major makeover, but I think one way to provide a handicap for so-so AI is to give the player some control over the AI, in essence making them an extension of the players own abilities. I agree with your strength comparison though in terms of marines vs. various enemy AI. I agree that a mono e mono marine vs elite would be no contest, but perhaps a platoon of marines working together could make quick work of an elite - Which would play into being able to direct the marines around the map.
>
> I like the idea of squad commands, but not an independent platoon because halo isnt an army command space war sim. Its an fps. But they do need to be able to fight independently. In the july demo imagine being able to send a team of marines to take down one of the aa guns while you get another and then team up for the hardest one. It would just make the world feel even more alive. And i will say this to wether a spartan should be able to command them. No. Even if they get way smarter i still dont want an ai telling my marine what to do. “Go into that banished meat grinder.” “Go assinate that guy and steal all the fun from the player.” But they should be a serious force that the player can command and be able to at least kill one elite.
Yeah completely agreed. I didn’t mean platoon as a literal gameplay mechanism. Just in the sense of a group of marines. So yeah my ideal would be to absolutely keep marines the exact same as they’ve always been in Halo. Remove the perma-squad mechanism from H5. But do layer in a control scheme for issuing general commands to friendly AI in the immediate vicinity. Think we’re on the same page here.
> 2533275015357155;9:
> Although I can’t wait to fight alongside marines again and have them in my warthog I would not
> like the return of squad commands. I rarely used those during Halo 5.
I completely agree that the H5 squad commands felt unnecessary, underdeveloped and generally just tacked on. They really messed that up. But I don’t think we need to throw the baby out with the bathwater just because it failed in H5. Plenty of games prove that a non-invasive squad command background system could complement core FPS gameplay nicely. My ultimate goal would be to have it so that if you went the entire game without ever issuing a command, you wouldn’t even notice. But for replay value or like New Game +, it would be an added layer of complexity that could really extend the campaign lifespan.
> 2533274838687111;11:
> > 2533275015357155;9:
> > Although I can’t wait to fight alongside marines again and have them in my warthog I would not
> > like the return of squad commands. I rarely used those during Halo 5.
>
> I completely agree that the H5 squad commands felt unnecessary, underdeveloped and generally just tacked on. They really messed that up. But I don’t think we need to throw the baby out with the bathwater just because it failed in H5. Plenty of games prove that a non-invasive squad command background system could complement core FPS gameplay nicely. My ultimate goal would be to have it so that if you went the entire game without ever issuing a command, you wouldn’t even notice. But for replay value or like New Game +, it would be an added layer of complexity that could really extend the campaign lifespan.
True I hope that if 343 implement the squadron commands they really need to flesh it out more.
> 2533275015357155;12:
> > 2533274838687111;11:
> > > 2533275015357155;9:
> > > Although I can’t wait to fight alongside marines again and have them in my warthog I would not
> > > like the return of squad commands. I rarely used those during Halo 5.
> >
> > I completely agree that the H5 squad commands felt unnecessary, underdeveloped and generally just tacked on. They really messed that up. But I don’t think we need to throw the baby out with the bathwater just because it failed in H5. Plenty of games prove that a non-invasive squad command background system could complement core FPS gameplay nicely. My ultimate goal would be to have it so that if you went the entire game without ever issuing a command, you wouldn’t even notice. But for replay value or like New Game +, it would be an added layer of complexity that could really extend the campaign lifespan.
>
> True I hope that if 343 implement the squadron commands they really need to flesh it out more.
I guess we’ll hopefully see soon enough at E3!
> 2533274838687111;13:
> > 2533275015357155;12:
> > > 2533274838687111;11:
> > > > 2533275015357155;9:
> > > > Although I can’t wait to fight alongside marines again and have them in my warthog I would not
> > > > like the return of squad commands. I rarely used those during Halo 5.
> > >
> > > I completely agree that the H5 squad commands felt unnecessary, underdeveloped and generally just tacked on. They really messed that up. But I don’t think we need to throw the baby out with the bathwater just because it failed in H5. Plenty of games prove that a non-invasive squad command background system could complement core FPS gameplay nicely. My ultimate goal would be to have it so that if you went the entire game without ever issuing a command, you wouldn’t even notice. But for replay value or like New Game +, it would be an added layer of complexity that could really extend the campaign lifespan.
> >
> > True I hope that if 343 implement the squadron commands they really need to flesh it out more.
>
> I guess we’ll hopefully see soon enough at E3!
True that!!