SPRINT IS USELESS [Version 1]

> I can’t get a kill with a man cannon or a teleporter or a grav-lift or a mongoose or

A direct kill with one of those? That could be difficult. But let’s see how these things can be used to directly alter the tactical situation.

A man cannon is something that will catapult any moveable object in the Halo sandbox. Normally used for flinging players across a good-sized chunk of the map in a matter of seconds, these stationary objects can actually be useful if loaded with other objects. Heavy crates and vehicles [occupied or not] are accelerated across the map, and woe betide any player who does fails to see the flying pig before it hits. Loading the man-cannon with explosive objects such as grenades or fusion coils can, if timed correctly, directly kill an enemy via explosion, rather than impact. Essentially, a man-cannon can propel useful assets–grenades, vehicles or Spartans, to an area, whilst simultaneously functioning as a form of area denial. Once a man-cannon is used by a Spartan, the control a player has over their landing location is minimal. If the landing zone is hazardous–then the Spartan may well die. An amusing situation occurs every so often on the Halo 3 map Narrows, where two players are propelled into eachother by the opposing man-cannons, and plunge into the abyss. Grav-lifts are smaller, portable versions of man-cannons–use with grenades.

A teleporter is something that can transport a player from one location to another on a map instantly. Typically, the other location is not visible from the starting location. Teleporting into a hazardous situation will get you killed. With teamwork, one player can force an enemy into a teleporter, and the other player can finish the enemy off at the exit point. True, you can rarely get a kill with a teleporter, but it does alter the tactical situation significantly, as when an enemy is chased into a teleporter, you do not know how they are preparing for your arrival at the other end. Most of the time, teleporters are dangerous, especially in custom games. So, no, it can’t be directly used to get kills, but it does alter the tactical situation significantly by itself.

The mongoose–once again the mongoose speeds players across the map at speeds much greater than Sprint. You can technically splatter people with it, but most of the time it’s used to transport the flag carrier back to base at high speed, once again altering the tactical situation.

I kind of wish that Bungie had gone along with keeping the ability to raise and lower the forklift’s arms–it could have actually been used to move things around the maps. At top speed, you can splatter an Elite with this, and its explosive potential is quite high.

A traffic cone…I don’t know how people managed to get killed by one of those, but they do. Beware the high-speed traffic cone. It will kill you.

Anyway, man-cannons, vehicles [mongoose included] and teleporters all serve to transport you great distances across the map at high speed–much higher speeds than sprint. I get that Spartans will do anything to survive in combat–even go past what they can endure–but constantly bypassing the safety limiters of the Mjolnir power armour [Halo Reach game manual on Sprint] isn’t really a strategy for long term survival. Spartans should travel at high speeds they can maintain–or just use an alternative method of transport–this infinite Sprint in Halo 5 just doesn’t work canonically, and my OP already goes over how Sprint doesn’t work in gameplay.

> “Gunplay is obviously paramount, and we focus a crazy amount of time on nailing the feel of firing the weapons in our game to make sure that they have weight and impact. In addition to rock-solid gunplay, with H5G we are striving to provide a focused suite of mobility-based actions that reinforce the experience of fighting as a Spartan. We specifically chose to focus on mobility because it was the part of the Spartan experience that we felt was the most under-developed and had the most promise to deliver a fresh and exciting new play experience for Halo. It’s something that we started talking about midway through Halo 4 and it became a foundational part of the design intention for Halo 5.”

It seems 343 disagrees, and believes it works canonically.

Get over it

Spartans now sprint…your enemy sprints and you can also sprint
Have a better strategy now…

Stop crying like little babies…

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> It seems 343 disagrees, and believes [Sprint] works canonically.

Yep. They believe that. They’re wrong.
Thruster Pack, Ground Pound, Charge, Slide, and Clamber–yes, they work canonically.
Smart-Scope works canonically. We had Smart-Scope up until and including Halo 4. What we have in Halo 5…is A.D.S, and as I’ve mentioned, that’s a technological and canonical downgrade.
Sprint…a temporary sprint mechanic works canonically. An infinite sprint mechanic makes no practical, logical, or canonical sense, and does not fit the dictionary definition of “Sprinting.” Gameplay-wise, we have several temporary sprint mechanics–like thruster pack, so there is no need for another one. Essentially, in this instance, the dictionary tells me that 343 industries is wrong, They can go ahead and argue with the dictionary if they want to.

I agree bro couldnt have said it better myself… nubs think its cool because it hasnt been there before and it makes it “faster paced” lime cod… You did forget to mention the part where it makes no sense for getting around the map faster because they have to make the maps BIGGER!! Also Master Chief is a 7’8" machine weighing a ton… Is sprinting something he would be able to do for very long probably not… No motors only thrusters yea right…

@GabrielMM3
Please refer to Halo Waypoint’s forum rules, and edit your post appropriately. Attempting to insult other people on these forums is not constructive for you, or for anyone else.

I must conclude that you did not read my OP to any great extent. Sprint is useless at altering the tactical situation. Sprint does not require any new strategies in order to use it–it is a useless gameplay mechanic in Halo. It could remain in Halo, or it could vanish forever with zero alterations to the actual gameplay. Nobody needs to get over anything, because the existence or absence of sprint as a base player trait, quite literally, does not matter. That’s the point I’m making.

> 2533274840749992;121:
> I agree bro couldnt have said it better myself… nubs think its cool because it hasnt been there before and it makes it “faster paced” lime cod… You did forget to mention the part where it makes no sense for getting around the map faster because they have to make the maps BIGGER!! Also Master Chief is a 7’8" machine weighing a ton… Is sprinting something he would be able to do for very long probably not… No motors only thrusters yea right…

Sprint in Halo Reach was an armour ability which “bypassed the safety limiters” of the Mjolnir armour. It’s there in the manual–the operator has to be kept cool as well whilst using sprint. I’m assuming that means that if they use it for too long they’ll roast, and possibly tear their own leg muscles apart, too. The dictionary definition of sprint is also “run at top speed over a short distance.” Yeah, infinite sprint makes no sense.
The new sizes of the maps and the faster speed of the gameplay ensure that Sprint remains useless. As to “faster paced”–that’s pretty much a separate issue–twitch vs. tactics. I like tactics [Halo], and I just plain do not like twitch shooters–hence why I play Halo.

Of course it does alter…

In every situation you think of robots playing and doing the same stuff…
But ppl sometimes do’t see other people,
Others prefer not to run while others are running…

As long as we are dealing with people thinking different and acting different, and also taking different routes, it does affect the gameplay…

> 2533274967577579;124:
> Of course it does alter…
> In every situation you think of robots playing and doing the same stuff…
> But ppl sometimes do’t see other people,
> Others prefer not to run while others are running…
> As long as we are dealing with people thinking different and acting different, and also taking different routes, it does affect the gameplay…

The scenarios I’ve presented in the OP test the effectiveness of Sprint. Nothing else. Just Sprint, as it exists in the Halo 5 Beta. Does it offer a tactical advantage? No. It actually puts you in a disadvantageous postion if you use it, in most instances, and is simply a delaying tactic at best. It is not useful in any given situation, especially when you compare it to what else there is available.

Sure, if people don’t see you, you can use Sprint to catch up to them and kill them from behind. The trouble with that scenario, is that you’ve instantly gained an advantage over them because they don’t see you. Before Sprint existed in Halo and after, if such a situation occurs, you can melee that player from behind anyway. You don’t need Sprint.

Before Sprint existed in Halo, some people ran away, some people didn’t. Now Sprint exists in Halo, some people run away, some people don’t. There’s been no change in that area at all. Sprint doesn’t add to or detract from the gameplay in the form it currently exists.

I’ve taken a look at scenario 1) again, and actually, I think it needs some rethinking. This is what I had as the original scenario:

> 1) Let’s first consider a hypothetical scenario–a 1v1 match with, where players start off with only infinite sprint, and melee. No weapons. No other Spartan abilites. Just the ability–or option–to sprint for an infinite period of time, and melee, in addition to the standard movement mechanics. I should also note that the map they are playing on has no cover, and that you are unable to use ranged weapons whilst sprinting. One more thing, until stated otherwise, Sprint does not affect shields.

And this is what I had as the original result:

> Clearly, anybody who does NOT always use sprint in this scenario will be at a severe disadvantage. So both players will use infinite sprint all the time, and that makes the base movement speed redundant–not required at all. In other words, sprint becomes the new base movement speed.

After some rethinking, I’ve come up with this: if the player who uses Sprint in this scenario uses Sprint, whilst the other does not, then the player that uses Sprint can control when the battle takes place. Player A–the player who decides to use sprint can run away and delay the battle. If Player B does not use Sprint, then they will be unable to catch up to Player A, or damage Player A in any way.
If Player A chooses NOT to run away, then they can sprint towards and melee Player B. But Sprint doesn’t increase Player A’s offensive capabilities, Player B is aware of Player A’s movements [no cover], so Player B can and will always counter Player A’s melee with a melee of their own. Both players receive equal amounts of damage. As soon as Player A melees player B, Sprint stops working anyway.
If Player A did try to Sprint away after meleeing, they would be at a disadvantage because they are still in Player B’s melee range, and choosing to use Sprint would prevent them from meleeing for a brief period of time–time in which Player B can kill Player A.
If both players use sprint, then both players are restricted in their lateral movements, and both players have increased speed, and neither player gains an advantage.over the other.

You know, I think I need to rework my scenarios. Scientifically, I need a hypothesis, a control, one variable to alter, and a whole bunch of constants. I haven’t provided that clearly enough, and I think a lot of my scenarios are redundant. Hmm…I’ll have to rethink and rewrite the whole thing, and consider each scenario a lot more carefully. I’m pretty sure the results won’t change, though…but “pretty sure” just isn’t good enough.

> 2533274840749992;121:
> I agree bro couldnt have said it better myself… nubs think its cool because it hasnt been there before and it makes it “faster paced” lime cod… You did forget to mention the part where it makes no sense for getting around the map faster because they have to make the maps BIGGER!! Also Master Chief is a 7’8" machine weighing a ton… Is sprinting something he would be able to do for very long probably not… No motors only thrusters yea right…

If anyone thinks that Sprint is a new thing to Halo, they are sadly mistaken. In the game files of Halo CE, it exists as a power-up like Overshield.

It’s likely that Sprint would have been useful for getting around the map quickly if they hadn’t made the maps bigger to compensate.

Sprinting is not something that anyone can do for very long. That’s pretty much the definition of sprinting.

I don’t know about Spartans not being able to move very fast. Top speed for Kelly–the fastest Spartan–is 62 KPH. For comparison, top speed for a Warthog is 125 KPH.

You are looking at it in a controlled environment type of scenario. When do I use sprint? To flank my opponent, to get to power weapons and to come to a team mates aid when he/she is requesting help. So yes , sprint does have its advantages because all the scenarios I’ve mentioned allows me to help my team better than just jogging and hopping around the map.

> 2533274802746424;128:
> You are looking at it in a controlled environment type of scenario. When do I use sprint? To flank my opponent, to get to power weapons and to come to a team mates aid when he/she is requesting help. So yes , sprint does have its advantages because all the scenarios I’ve mentioned allows me to help my team better than just jogging and hopping around the map.

Of course I’m looking at it in a controlled environment. How else am I going to figure out if Sprint is useful or not? You flank opponents by staying out of their sight. That does not require Sprint–that requires cover. You help your teammates by ensuring that teammates stay within range–it doesn’t matter how fast you move, as long as they stay within range of the speed you use. You acquire power-weapons by denying the enemy access to them. Either kill the enemy, or toss a grenade to deny access to the area. None of those scenarios require sprint as a base trait.

> 2533274880692195;129:
> > 2533274802746424;128:
> > You are looking at it in a controlled environment type of scenario. When do I use sprint? To flank my opponent, to get to power weapons and to come to a team mates aid when he/she is requesting help. So yes , sprint does have its advantages because all the scenarios I’ve mentioned allows me to help my team better than just jogging and hopping around the map.
>
>
> Of course I’m looking at it in a controlled environment. How else am I going to figure out if Sprint is useful or not? You flank opponents by staying out of their sight. That does not require Sprint–that requires cover. You help your teammates by ensuring that teammates stay within range–it doesn’t matter how fast you move, as long as they stay within range of the speed you use. You acquire power-weapons by denying the enemy access to them. Either kill the enemy, or toss a grenade to deny access to the area. None of those scenarios require sprint as a base trait.

Again you are trying to explain how sprint is useless and I gave reason as to why it can be useful. The counter argument you have in your reply are very good tactics to use and I agree with them but you shouldn’t just disregard how sprint could be used tactically as well. Its showing a bias just because you “don’t think its halo”.

> Again you are trying to explain how sprint is useless and I gave reason as to why it can be useful. The counter argument you have in your reply are very good tactics to use and I agree with them but you shouldn’t just disregard how sprint could be used tactically as well. Its showing a bias just because you “don’t think its halo”.

Please do not use that argument against me. I have a grudge against Sprint as an armour abilitiy in Halo Reach, because I don’t like how the armour abilities function. I like “Speed Boost” as a Power-Up and I like Thruster Pack, Lunge, and various other Sprint-like mechanics, because they do work and they are useful. I do not like this useless Sprint ability in Halo 5.

I don’t like Sprint in Halo 5 or Halo 4 because they add nothing to the gameplay as they are. At least in Halo Reach Sprint could be useful–because other players had different armour abilities. If it was useful, I would like it. It’s not useful, so I don’t like it.

> 2533274880692195;131:
> > Again you are trying to explain how sprint is useless and I gave reason as to why it can be useful. The counter argument you have in your reply are very good tactics to use and I agree with them but you shouldn’t just disregard how sprint could be used tactically as well. Its showing a bias just because you “don’t think its halo”.
>
>
> Please do not use that argument against me. I have a grudge against Sprint in Halo Reach, because it doesn’t quite fit. I like “Speed Boost” as a Power-Up and I like Thruster Pack, Lunge, and various other Sprint-like mechanics, because they do work and they are useful. I do not like this useless Sprint ability in Halo 5.

Useless to YOU. I have shown multiple scenarios where sprint can be useful but you refuse to see that. So no point in me continuing this convo honestly. Good night/morning.

> Useless to YOU. I have shown multiple scenarios where sprint can be useful but you refuse to see that. So no point in me continuing this convo honestly. Good night/morning.

No, you have not shown me how Sprint ability can be useful as it currently exists in Halo 4 and Halo 5.

“Speed Boost,” “Thruster Pack,” “Lunge,” “Slide,” and Sprint as a power-up/armour ability are all useful sprint mechanics which add to the gameplay. Currently Sprint itself exists as an infinite base player trait for all players and is not useful.

In all the scenarios in which any player uses Sprint in H4/H5, they already have an advantage over the enemy. All of the other abilities create an advantage when used. Sprint doesn’t. In Halo 5, it even puts the player who uses it at a disadvantage.

Sprint needs to be unbalanced to provide an advantage to the player. Sprint is balanced in Halo 4/5. Sprint is, therefore, currently useless.

So…you are saying it is useless because everyone have and can use unlimited…

So are the AR or BR that you start with…everyone have and can use it…and that doesn’t make them useless

What makes something awesome or useless is the way u use it and when to use it…

I don’t like the kill times of Halo 5. I don’t like the fact that Halo is just not standing out anymore compared to contemporary shooters. I don’t like twitch shooters. I have nothing against Sprint or Sprint-like mechanics. However, I don’t think that entire maps should be redesigned in order to accomodate a gameplay mechanic which provides no advantage to the player using it. Good multiplayer maps are hard enough to come by in recent Halo games as it is.

> 2533274967577579;134:
> So…you are saying it is useless because everyone have and can use unlimited…
>
> So are the AR or BR that you start with…everyone have and can use it…and that doesn’t make them useless
>
> What makes something awesome or useless is the way u use it and when to use it…

Yea, ppl have given him plenty scenarios where sprint can be useful. It just seems like he started a post to make ppl agree with him any counter argument gets disregarded.